Pakistan: a client of more than one state

Discussion in 'Pakistan' started by LETHALFORCE, Jul 18, 2010.

  1. LETHALFORCE

    LETHALFORCE Moderator Moderator

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    http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2010/jul/18/pakistan-client-state-china-western-influence

    China has been Pakistan's firmest ally for 60 years – and it is to Beijing that Islamabad looks to counterbalance the influence of western largesse

    Pakistan's special relationship with the United States may have taken centre stage since the attacks of 11 September 2001, but in China it has another enduring great power ally. With Pakistan's President Zardari returning from a visit of several days to China last week, it is worth considering the country's other asymmetrical alliance.

    China has been Pakistan's most reliable ally for six decades. Pakistan was quick to recognise China's communist regime a mere two years after it first came to power in 1949. Ever since, it has looked to the east Asian power to counterbalance its historical reliance on western geopolitical largesse.

    After the 1962 war between China and India, the US supplied India for the first time with substantial arms, creating profound disenchantment among the Pakistani military leadership. That disenchantment led Pakistan to seek Chinese military aid.

    In the last two decades the economic component of the alliance has taken centre stage. Pakistan has the potential to give China a land link to Middle Eastern energy reserves. A central reason for US involvement in the region is to maintain its global influence at a time when rivals are steadily if slowly emerging. None is larger than China. For China, an added element is developing a regional coalition against an increasingly pro-US India.

    Today, the relationship is not so culturally infused. As with so many other countries, China has been happy to develop defence and economic ties with Pakistan while avoiding criticism of its political situation. Perhaps the biggest friction of recent times has been over alleged Pakistan-based Islamist infiltration into China's restive Xinjiang province, home to the indigenous Uighur Muslim population. That friction prompted a visit by Pakistan's most powerful Islamist politicians to assure Beijing that they would not stoke Islamist insurgency in China.

    Those concerns, however, have proved shortlived. Pakistan has been busy integrating its economy into China, although it has generally been slow going. The much-vaunted deep sea port built in restive Balochistan with the apparent aim of giving a Chinese presence at the mouth of the Persian Gulf has barely scratched its full potential. Expansion of the Karakoram Highway that links northern Pakistan to China seems to have been in development for decades.

    Less incremental was the recent announcement that China will sell nuclear reactors to Pakistan. A $2.4bn deal hopes to quench Pakistan's thirst for energy, and recognition as a responsible nuclear citizen on the world stage.

    There are thinly veiled concerns that the agreement could be in breach of the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty. Despite this, the US, on whose words and action so much of western policy in our region is determined, has offered only limited criticisms. This may have something to do with theUS and India deal that would see the former reprocess spent nuclear fuel for the latter, although India got an exemption from the Nuclear Suppliers Group for that purpose.

    In Balochistan, Pakistan's largest and most resource-rich province, China has been busy trying to exploit coal, copper, and zinc deposits and gas and oil reserves. The indigenous Baloch population says these ventures systematically disenfranchise them. Pakistan authorities counter claim that, emboldened by countrywide instability and foreign support, Baloch feudal leaders have petulantly demanded ever more royalties. An increasingly brutal insurgency and counterinsurgency has developed around this resource politics. After some sobering experiences involving the kidnapping and murder of its nationals, China has learned to accept the bribery culture that keeps both Pakistani and Baloch tribal leaders happy.

    China's relationship to our region stretches back at least 2,000 to the period when scholars and traders introduced Buddhism from what is now Pakistan to the Middle Kingdom, an episode of history celebrated in Chinese literature and the Monkey TV series. Yet in the intervening centuries, the relationship has not had any major cultural or ideological impact on Pakistan, as noted in a satirical poem by the great dissident poet Habib Jalib.

    Like Pakistan's current robust relations with the US, this is because China-Pakistan relations have largely been dictated by elite notions of the national interest and prestige. China may still be happy to play second fiddle to the US here. But with polls revealing Pakistan's overwhelmingly favourable view of its northern neighbour and continued western missteps in Afghanistan, the dispiriting reality is that our country is a client of more than one state.
     
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  3. ajtr

    ajtr Veteran Member Veteran Member

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    What???????????But i thought pakistanis are arabs/turks/mongol/greeks.Pakistanis are doing blasphemy by relating themselves to Buddhism.hope not they make their land impure by this relation to Buddhism for which they try to clean off the land from infidel to make it Pak(pious).
     
  4. ajtr

    ajtr Veteran Member Veteran Member

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    BTW one of the master of Pak is UK since 1947.And this being UK paper it cleverly left out his country's name.
     
  5. LETHALFORCE

    LETHALFORCE Moderator Moderator

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    If they can be a client to all these countries as the reporter admits why not be a client to one more India???
     
  6. ajtr

    ajtr Veteran Member Veteran Member

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    They cant be client to india...
    1.Coz their existence depends on perpetual hostility with bharat(that what they love to call).
    2. If they can be client of india there is no need for other masters.coz ultimately they themselves will be india.
    3. the myth related to project pakistan of UK has already been broken by india.only left is the remnants wild wild west.

    only thing remains is of management.
     
  7. LETHALFORCE

    LETHALFORCE Moderator Moderator

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    your points are valid that their creation and governance dictate a client state existence, but there will come a point in the future maybe not soon but one day when they will find that being a client state to India will be most beneficial in many ways.
     
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2010
  8. ajtr

    ajtr Veteran Member Veteran Member

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    There is no middle way.There is either extreme hostility(which has been going on for past 6 decades) or extreme love(thats the amalgamation in bharat).And that point is still has to be reached.You can take for example bangladesh goes from extreme hostility to mild one but it was never be a client of india. Amalgamation will happen with time but slowly.
     
  9. LETHALFORCE

    LETHALFORCE Moderator Moderator

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    maybe this can be described as a flaw in Indian foreign policy or genius?? That some countries choose to make other countries client states and we never pursued this degenerate view.
     
  10. Neil

    Neil Senior Member Senior Member

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    they are our client....they send terrorist into our country and we sent our foreign minister to them....
     
  11. ajtr

    ajtr Veteran Member Veteran Member

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    Nope.Countries dont make new country born out of it as their client.rather its impossible task to do.So in such case countries try either hostility or the merger.
     
  12. ajtr

    ajtr Veteran Member Veteran Member

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    What is this logic???care to elaborate???
     
  13. karra

    karra New Member

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    india and pakistan its client ?Its like asking japanese to be clients of chinese,never gonna happen.

    india may be big but so is pakistan with its 180 million ppl on world stage.we need good governance and we can be a big power.We don't lack space unlike india which is a overcrowded country with not so many resourcess other than billion plus ppl.

    no offence to you ppl but India is africa of asia which is hyped by west becuz they need you to contain china
     
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2010
  14. 171K

    171K Tihar Jail Banned

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    Pakistan is the shining diamond of asia :)
    Pakistan is nothing but a cheap prostitute for USA & China due to its strategic location.
     
  15. ajtr

    ajtr Veteran Member Veteran Member

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    Esssssssssssh you didnt get him.Africa is the only contitent left with its natural resources intact thats why today everybody is scrambling for africa.;;D
     
  16. 171K

    171K Tihar Jail Banned

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    "no offence to you ppl but India is africa of asia which is hyped by west becuz they need you to contain china"

    Yes ajtr, your comment is exactly what he is saying :-/
     
  17. ajtr

    ajtr Veteran Member Veteran Member

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    Today africa is one continent where every one wanna go for its resources as every one wana do business with india coz of its economy.
     
  18. Rage

    Rage DFI TEAM Stars and Ambassadors

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    It'd take the combined economies of all African nations to even approach India's $1.5 trillion economy.

    None of which, with the notable exception of Botswana, have been growing anywhere close to India's average 9% over the last several years. And that is because of severe resource exploitation in that country, that has crippled local industry and left it bereft for the future.

    But if you're comparing us to a whole entire continent then thank you.

    India's resources are plentiful and abundant. Not only does it have the largest tillable land area of any country on the continent, it has one of the most extensive maritime zones, some of the lengthiest rivers, vast swathes of forest and is home to some of the world's most abundant quantities of iron ore, manganese, copper, chromite and other mineral resources.

    Resources have rarely been a 'limiting factor' in economic growth. As some of the most abundant examples of Japan, the United Kingdom, Switzerland and Norway have proved. Demographics and organization are key. We have the demographics, and now increasingly the organization. What do you have?

    Pakistan's problems are endemic and always have been so. You are too keen to let down and disparage others, whether it be your false theories of racial extravagance, your uppityness at blaming your problems on others, your thorough incompetence or your inability to even recognize yourselves for who you are. You are, in every measure of the world, a failed state. Which is why you will always stay true to being a client of one state or another, and will limit yourselves to optimizing within that state.
     
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2010
  19. ajtr

    ajtr Veteran Member Veteran Member

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    Hey comeon Rage pakistan has got FODP(friends of democratic pakistan).Can india or any other country in the world boast this achievement?????
     
  20. ajtr

    ajtr Veteran Member Veteran Member

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    [​IMG]

    At least pakistanis have to beg indian-american is Rajiv Shah (of USAID) who accompanied Hilary clinton on recent pakistani trip.:emot15:
     
  21. Indianrabbit

    Indianrabbit Regular Member

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    Are you serious, do you know what Pakistan has to do for those loans, ask Pakistani's their army is on heir. I do not want to be in that condition. If India starts to do that kind of deal they get get much bigger returns. Are you ready to be hired by USA?
     

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