Nobel winner V Ramakrishnan refuses to attend Indian Science Congress, calls it a 'circus'

Discussion in 'Science and Technology' started by Indx TechStyle, Jan 6, 2016.

  1. Indx TechStyle

    Indx TechStyle Perfaarmance Naarmal Senior Member

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    Nobel winner V Ramakrishnan refuses to attend Indian Science Congress, calls it a 'circus'
    [​IMG]
    Chandigarh: India-born Nobel laureate Venkatraman Ramakrishnan has refused to attend the Indian Science Congress ever in future and called it a 'circus', it was reported on Wednesday.
    As per a ToI report, the Nobel laureate Venkatraman, who had attended a day long session of a previous Congress, finds it unworthy of attending the event as very little science is
    discussed in that.
    ''It was a circus. I find that it's an organization where very little science is discussed. I will never attend a science congress again in my life," he was quoted as saying.
    Venkatraman Ramakrishnan had, last year, objected to politics and religious ideology being mixed with science.
    The ongoing annual Science Congress is currently being held in Mysuru.
    Tamil Nadu-born Venkatraman is a structural biologist at Cambridge University. He was awarded the Nobel Prize in 2009.
    @Scarface @Bornubus @SREEKAR @Srinivas_K @rock127 @guru-dutt @sabari @cobra commando @Vishwarupa
    Well, he must be saying right.
    I've watched this Congress many times. We discuss better in our school's quiz than this. o_O
     
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  3. Scarface

    Scarface Regular Member

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    He could've been more specific as to why.

    Sad state of affairs though.
     
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  4. maomao

    maomao Veteran Hunter of Maleecha Senior Member

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    Will he return his Award? :D

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  5. Bornubus

    Bornubus Senior Member Senior Member

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    This ugly NRI Noble laureate has already made it clear when he was said he was so disgusted to see to see the large no of congratulaty emils by Indians.

    He is a self hating so called Indian just like Bobby Jindal,ashamed of his Indian Roots.
     
  6. Anupu

    Anupu Regular Member

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    He is against discussing non science as, homeopathy astronomy in a science conference and frankly I agree with him.
     
  7. Indx TechStyle

    Indx TechStyle Perfaarmance Naarmal Senior Member

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    In that case you both are wrong. This statement wasn't for any social problem.
    Actually, a science congress occurs every year in New Delhi. He was invited to this Congress but found nothing scientific in it. Although we have to discuss Science, Technology, Environment and Space etc. people were talking of politics and religious things here which is completely off topic. Suppose you are a doctor and called to a physiological conference.
    But people are discussing literature there. Same thing happened here.
    It could leave bad effect on students mind.
    Instead of cursing him, we should make sure that next time only science talks occur. And it is not deviated to Religion and politics.
    These issues can be discussed elsewhere. Then, why spoil county's biggest science conference? o_O
     
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  8. Sylex21

    Sylex21 Regular Member

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    While I understand he might have some valid complaints, it would have been better if he choose his words better. When high profile people say these sorts of things, it makes the whole nation seem bad, especially by the time foreign press is done spinning it.
     
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  9. Anupu

    Anupu Regular Member

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    I think he chose the right words, see I support this government in a lot, but we need to keep any kind of religious agenda out of science and scientific education in our country even if we have be harsh for that.
     
  10. DingDong

    DingDong Senior Member Senior Member

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    Some people simply cannot digest their success, This Nobel winner is one of those self-loathing beings.

    Discussions on Pseudo-science has been a norm all across the world, and Science doesn't know everything. There is nothing wrong and bizarre in listening to diverse opinion.
     
  11. Anupu

    Anupu Regular Member

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    Science doesn't work on opinion, it works on proof, reproducible results and peer reviewed theories to eliminate bias, if you have evidence anyone is more than welcome to write a article in a scientific journal, if not then sorry but scientist can't take you seriously. Do you think we should accept the "opinion" of people who claim that earth is 5000 yr old?
     
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  12. DingDong

    DingDong Senior Member Senior Member

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    Really? Have you heard about Axioms? Can Science define a Straight Line? Can Science prove axioms about Parallel Lines?

    Newton's second law itself is not provable, it is an Axiom (It basically defines mass and force in terms of one another). In fact the classical mechanics is now completely broken.

    Science as we know it has got several limitations, pseudo-scientific discussions are important in their own way as long as such discussions do not drown the Scientific discussions and many institutions of advanced learning tolerate such discussions because those discussions have been found to encourage discussions amongst the audience.

    Inventors, unlike Scientists need to strongly believe in their ideas some of the ideas sounded extremely bizarre and impossible to the best minds, before those were turned into reality by the people who "believed".
     
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  13. saty

    saty Tihar Jail Banned

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    I'm very allergic to the name 'CONGRESS' either change the name or close this circus.

    Now come to the point

    he said Homeopathy&Astrology are fake......... yes 100%
    2.Science is like Maths,Mathematicians/Scientists may be religious but religion has no place in Science or Maths. :)
     
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  14. Anupu

    Anupu Regular Member

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    Axioms are abstract ideas in mathematics, there in no need for science to prove them because, they don't need to be they are just true[I define them that way for eg 1+1 = 2, a triangle has 3 sides, two parallel lines are lines which shall never touch each other if they ran infinitely].

    Newton's second law is not an axiom, it can be treated as one, as in since it's been proven to be true you can consider it true, and it has been shown experimentally that it is true, take a car and double it's speed and ram it into a wall, you will exert twice as much force on the wall. you can measure it sir.

    Astrology is not an abstract idea, it's a physical practice which is described by those who adhere to it as scientific. It makes claim that there is a connection between movement in heavens and our fates. Don't marry a manglik girl that is astrology, wear this gemstone for success in business. Don't confuse it with astronomy and the work done by the likes of aryabhatta.

    So is homeopathy. And both of them don't give a single shred of evidence.

    And there is nothing as romantic as an Inventors passion about either of them. They don't have a place in modern science where proof is needed that's it.
     
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2016
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  15. Sridhar

    Sridhar House keeper Moderator

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    Homeopathy is bogus, harmful: Nobel laureate Venkatraman Ramakrishna
    • Bhartesh Singh Thakur, Hindustan Times, Chandigarh
      |
    • Updated: Jan 06, 2016 10:22 IST
    [​IMG]
    India-born Nobel laureate Venkatraman Ramakrishnan has refused to attend the Indian Science Congress ever in future (royalsociety.org)

    Calling homeopathy and astrology useless and harmful practices, Nobel laureate Venkatraman Ramakrishnan came down heavily on the two, saying real science is far more interesting than “bogus” fields.

    Pointing out that India is the only country where a constitution asks for promoting scientific temper, the chemistry scientist said India needs a more rational outlook on such practices.

    Explaining that astrology evolved from the human tendency to look for “patterns, generalise and believe”, Ramakrishnan said, “There is no scientific basis for how movement of planets and stars can influence our fate. There is no reason for time of birth to influence events years later. The predictions made are either obvious or shown to be random.”

    “Once beliefs take root, they are hard to eradicate,” he commented, adding, “A culture based on superstitions will do worse than one based on scientific knowledge and rational thoughts.”

    Contrary to the general notion that homeopathy originated in India, the scientist also clarified that it was a practice started by a German.

    “They (homoeopaths) take arsenic compounds and dilute it to such an extent that just a molecule is left. It will not make any effect on you. Your tap water has more arsenic. No one in chemistry believes in homoeopathy. It works because of placebo effect.”

    Ramakrishna was however appreciative of modern day astrology considering the more specific scientific advancements made.

    “Alchemy is based on beliefs but accumulated huge amount of data about properties of substances and led to modern chemistry. Astrology was struck in past but modern astronomy has made huge exciting discoveries like the black hole, pulsars etc.”

    The onus ultimately lies on humans, for science to be accurate. “Scientists are humans. We have egos, superstitions etc. What is required is to test our ideas by experiments which protect us from false beliefs.”

    To elaborate, he cited the cold fusion theory. Initially claimed by Martin Fleischmann and Stanley Pons, the much-hyped theory was later proved to be unfounded. “In 2011, it was claimed from CERN experiments that neutrinos travel faster than light. Later, it came out that it was a measurement error,” Ramakrishnan said and added that sometimes scientists propose ideas well outside their area of expertise and make mistakes.

    So did planes really exist in ancient India, as claimed at the Indian Science Congress in Mumbai last year?

    “It was surprising for me that Indian science academies did not condemn it. Science has to be based on data. You have to show that you did it and others should be able to verify it. It is impossible that India had plane technology 2000 years ago.”

    Science in India has nevertheless become more exact over time. “In the last century alone, life expectancy has doubled. It is because medicine has become scientific and evidence based. There is better understanding of physiology and biochemistry and many diseases have been eradicated.”

    Ramakrishnan, who was awarded the Nobel Prize in chemistry in 2009, was speaking at the Panjab University at Chandigarh to deliver the Har Gobind Khorana lecture on ‘On Nobody’s Word: Evidence and Modern Science’.

    http://www.hindustantimes.com/india...ramakrishna/story-oNNzWBnosMFiLnrnmfkdxI.html
     
  16. Agnostic_Indian

    Agnostic_Indian Regular Member

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    I agree with you in astrology part but i think homeopathy is a genuine branch of medical science..much like ayurveda. As i observed ayudveda has medicines for many illnesses but it also has wrong assumptions and treatments...i belive it's a mixed bag..so i think ayurveda and homeopathi should be reserched and studied scientifically and we should take what's good and right and drope the things which doesn't work based on clinical trials.
     
  17. Anupu

    Anupu Regular Member

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    Ayurveda is genuine but not homeopathy, In Ayurveda your herbs have medicinal compounds in them, while in case of homeopathy what you are getting is just pure water, no medicine.
     
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  18. Indx TechStyle

    Indx TechStyle Perfaarmance Naarmal Senior Member

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    Nope, he should not have said at least, "I won't come again."
    That's a permanent offense.
    But this conference was made just for science not all opinions. So, there should be no religious or political discussion.
     
  19. Agnostic_Indian

    Agnostic_Indian Regular Member

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    I just made a quick read and it seems like overwhelming majority of the professional think that it's a pseudo science..so may be it is.
     
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  20. Anupu

    Anupu Regular Member

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    Look at Richard Dawkings take on it. I don't agree with him on everything but this is true
     
  21. Anupu

    Anupu Regular Member

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    But if the congress acts in this way why should he? Plus he is a scientist not a diplomat, he is not supposed to politically correct.
     

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