Nirbhay Cruise Missile Development

[sayareakd]

90cr is too small a amount on developing a cruise missile of given specification...

They are going to charge that much for single imported cruise missile.

 

[sthf]

90cr is too small a amount on developing a cruise missile of given specification...

Maybe. DRDO thinks it can make do with this budget. As I said, no one has claimed that problems persists because of lack of money. It's the technological challenges that is holding the project back.

 

[Akshay_Fenix]

90crore is the cost of imported components and assembly, I do not think it includes the salaries of people working in that project for fking 12 years.

 

[Neil]

I think this needs to be reposted.


A grand total of Rs 90 crores are being spent on the Nirbhay project and full rate production will result in $0.5 million per unit.

Either throw money at a problem like China does or look for creative solutions.

90 cr tweet is from Dec 2014, much more amount has been spent on the project.

 

[S.J]

I think this needs to be reposted.


A grand total of Rs 90 crores are being spent on the Nirbhay project and full rate production will result in $0.5 million per unit.

Either throw money at a problem like China does or look for creative solutions.

Rs. 90 crores for development of a cruise missile ????? . We expect it to be the best in the world and we expect DRDO to do it fast?????
I Know it's not impossible, I know ISRO has done phenomenal work at shoe string budget and I know our defense budget is not the same as US.
But common, why go this route increase the budget tap the pool of indian scientist working or studying in the US, even if we can get a fraction of them it won't just help this project it would be helpful for the future projects as well.

 

[sthf]

@Akshay_Fenix Quite possible. But I don't think India has been working for 12 years on this project.

@Neil You maybe right.

@S.J Nope, not the world's best cruise missile. Just the one that works reliably and fulfills the roles specified for it.

 

[Prayash]

What is a CFD computer?

I just meant to say about the computer used for cfd analysis

 

[Pulkit]

Ground testing of any component and flight testing of the same are two different things. Any component which pass out with flying colors in ground or arrested testing doesn't mean that it would act same or give same result in flight.

But we cannot test the complete body to test only one component , its not economical and neither logical.

As per Sourav Jha, 90 crore is till date expenditure in the project. Now it may sound too much, but for any such project I think this sum is quiet reasonable.

Its about wasting money.

GoI doesn't give extension on face value. Any project director or manager would have to fight hard to keep any project alive. Now after fighting for it and getting the much sought extension, project manager would be the last on earth to commit suicide.

they do have that tendency and symptom and I did mention If one of the articles i read is true.

But this hasty step could be possibly for two reasons:
Reason 1: Team wants to tests components and want to do it fast, so that in case of failure they do get ample time before the extension period end to carry out further tests.

To do it fast do component testing not test of entire product.

Reason 2: Team simply wants to junk the project with faulty component.

Now for me reason 1 seems more logical. Instead of waiting for all tests to happen under controlled environment and then taking up the test at last time they are playing a gamble. If it passes, they have valid reason to ask for timeline and if it fails, they would get enough time to go through results and rectify. On the bright side, I am seeing a win win situation for DRDO and ARDE as of now.

Yes they might be aiming for that junk the project.

 

[mayfair]

Nirbhay is crucial for us in more ways than one. We need this one up and firing quickly, just like there vested interests out there who are doing everything they can to stall and stymie this project.

 

[Chinmoy]

But we cannot test the complete body to test only one component , its not economical and neither logical.

I didn't said component. Its about components.

Its about wasting money.

Oh that's great. By that logic, how much money have we wasted in test failure of Agni?

they do have that tendency and symptom and I did mention If one of the articles i read is true.

Every engineer or developer wants to achieve what they have started. Nirbhay is not something which is on paper like many other missile project. It is a project which has been kick started and had seen its period of success. Being an outsider we could always whim on and cry on the failures, but being on receiving end, I do know how it feels for any engineer involved in any project to see its completion. So I would request you to get down into field and try spend some time with people who are really involved in R&D of these products instead of reading journals of our MSM defence experts.

To do it fast do component testing not test of entire product.
Yes they might be aiming for that junk the project.

Now this is where most of us do think differently. Perfect ground testing of any of the critical component doesn't mean that it would function exactly same in flight (I am repeating myself). Any component which does act perfect now may start deviating during flight time. Now lets assume that instead of taking out this test now, we do wait for few more months and and by the end of year the test committee after getting satisfied gives the go ahead for test. What if then too the test fails because of one reason or another?
Its not like Nirbhay had failed every single test. If we do remember clearly, it did took 800 odd km flight. But in the next test itself its flight mechanism, which worked flawlessly another day, failed. So you simply can't take things for granted unless and until you have not perfected it.

So, as I have told earlier, by taking this test in haste they are just trying to carve out a chance to survive. If it fails, they would have ample time to take another test. If it succeeds, they would get another lease of life in form of extension. No one asked to stop working on its sub components with this test. If the engineers working on it knows that its not yet ready then they should keep working on it. If the test fails, they would get another chance in next test to complete it.

 

[Pulkit]

I didn't said component. Its about components.

Its product testing . Not Component or components.

Oh that's great. By that logic, how much money have we wasted in test failure of Agni?

When In advance you know that some of the parts are gonna fail . you will first rectify them and then test. If you understand the word integeration then you will know that behavior of one component has impact on other so If even one if one component is failing then you cannot assure anything

Every engineer or developer wants to achieve what they have started. Nirbhay is not something which is on paper like many other missile project. It is a project which has been kick started and had seen its period of success. Being an outsider we could always whim on and cry on the failures, but being on receiving end, I do know how it feels for any engineer involved in any project to see its completion. So I would request you to get down into field and try spend some time with people who are really involved in R&D of these products instead of reading journals of our MSM defence experts.

FYI i worked in Aero Domain and did see the bird I worked on fly.So i very well know that feeling . They people who started it and had the zeal to complete it successfully have already left or retired.

Now this is where most of us do think differently. Perfect ground testing of any of the critical component doesn't mean that it would function exactly same in flight (I am repeating myself). Any component which does act perfect now may start deviating during flight time. Now lets assume that instead of taking out this test now, we do wait for few more months and and by the end of year the test committee after getting satisfied gives the go ahead for test. What if then too the test fails because of one reason or another?

you cannot say a component is successful if any of the other component is failing .

Its not like Nirbhay had failed every single test. If we do remember clearly, it did took 800 odd km flight. But in the next test itself its flight mechanism, which worked flawlessly another day, failed. So you simply can't take things for granted unless and until you have not perfected it.

yes 3 out of 4 ..........75% Failure. had you been a little more realistic i would not have stated this. As these failure are acceptable to me.

So, as I have told earlier, by taking this test in haste they are just trying to carve out a chance to survive.

No

If it fails, they would have ample time to take another test.

project will loose its credibility

If it succeeds, they would get another lease of life in form of extension.

Its destined to fail if they have not resolved all issues. Partial Success is also partial failure

No one asked to stop working on its sub components with this test.


If the engineers working on it knows that its not yet ready then they should keep working on it. If the test fails, they would get another chance in next test to complete it.

As I said I am repeating Myself the project will loose its credibility.

 

[Chinmoy]

Its product testing . Not Component or components. When In advance you know that some of the parts are gonna fail . you will first rectify them and then test. If you understand the word integeration then you will know that behavior of one component has impact on other so If even one if one component is failing then you cannot assure anything FYI i worked in Aero Domain and did see the bird I worked on fly.So i very well know that feeling . They people who started it and had the zeal to complete it successfully have already left or retired. you cannot say a component is successful if any of the other component is failing . yes 3 out of 4 ..........75% Failure. had you been a little more realistic i would not have stated this. As these failure are acceptable to me. No project will loose its credibility Its destined to fail if they have not resolved all issues. Partial Success is also partial failure As I said I am repeating Myself the project will loose its credibility.

Ok...... So going by your thought process, lets wait for couple of more months. We are already halfway 2017 and then test it by end of this year.
Could anyone guarantee its success then?
Could anyone guarantee 100% efficiency of all its components and sub components?
Could someone guarantee success in its integration then?
Could someone say what would be its future if it fails at that time?
Could there be another extension then or time for immediate test?

 

[sayareakd]

extension was given, which has faded my hopes, another failure coming.

Looks like those who making it also feel the same.

Even as the committee refused to give a go-ahead for the test, the top brass of DRDO is adamant on going for fresh trial. They are expecting a miracle to happen but with defects in the system, failure is a foregone conclusion,'' said a defence scientist on condition of anonymity.

http://www.indiandefensenews.in/2017/05/after-three-failures-miracle-awaits.html?m=1

 

[SATISH]

CFD simulations have showed that the missile will be a success...but i still have my doubts. The technical team for evaluation has not given the go ahead and the funding for the Nirbhay will be cut if the test is not going to be a success..this is a gamble for DRDO and the Nirbhay team.

 

[sayareakd]

CFD simulations have showed that the missile will be a success...but i still have my doubts. The technical team for evaluation has not given the go ahead and the funding for the Nirbhay will be cut if the test is not going to be a success..this is a gamble for DRDO and the Nirbhay team.

Satish you know the big game being at play. Missile is not ready but Chief want to test it, he is pressurising team. End result, we will end up buying Russian Kalibr Cruise Missile recently being tested in Syria.

 

[SATISH]

Satish you know the big game being at play. Missile is not ready but Chief want to test it, he is pressurising team. End result, we will end up buying Russian Kalibr Cruise Missile recently being tested in Syria.

The evaluation committee is going to close down the program. They want to have a last shot at it. Or else they will be reassigned.

 

[xeaaex]

The evaluation committee is going to close down the program. They want to have a last shot at it. Or else they will be reassigned.

So that means we are never ever going to have our own cruise missile?
If we end up buying kalibr cruise missile then it is for sure that something is fishy.

 

[SATISH]

So that means we are never ever going to have our own cruise missile?
If we end up buying kalibr cruise missile then it is for sure that something is fishy.

Well believe me or not...I want to have the nirbhay program to succeed. The project management is so bad that it is better to ditch it and restart it.

 

[captscooby81]

Well may be off topic or may be my ignorance why don t the govt get some consultants to handle to project management part especially ones who can interlink all the departments working with better utilisation of funds and also the resources ..Private companies will screw your life for every penny gets wasted ..

Edit : When are we really going to screw these bloody IITs and IIScs doing nothing from pushing 1st day campus placements for MNC companies where are the young engineers for research ..Bloody the chinese are going ahead not because of carbon copying they are investing more in research

Well believe me or not...I want to have the nirbhay program to succeed. The project management is so bad that it is better to ditch it and restart it.

 

[Kay]

This project is too big to fail...I don't think this will be scrapped...but people may get replaced