Muslims are not minorities, Parsis are: Najma Heptullah

Discussion in 'Politics & Society' started by AVERAGE INDIAN, May 28, 2014.

  1. AVERAGE INDIAN

    AVERAGE INDIAN EXORCIST Senior Member

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    NEW DELHI: Minority affairs minister Najma Heptullah on Tuesday said Muslims were not minorities by any stretch of the imagination and instead Parsis with their dwindling population qualified for the tag.

    On her first day in office, Heptullah appeared determined to reorient the ministry by playing down its role in welfare of Muslims and dismissing the policies espoused by the UPA government.

    "Muslims are not minorities. Parsis are. We have to see how we can help them so that their numbers don't diminish," she told reporters when asked how her government proposed to take Muslim welfare forward.

    With more questions about the community being lobbed at her, Heptullah snapped back, "This is not the ministry for Muslim affairs, this is the ministry for minority affairs."

    The remarks from the experienced politician, who is the grand-niece of freedom fighter Abul Kalam Azad and has played the major part of her political innings in Congress, appeared in line with BJP's point of view. There was speculation in the run-up to government formation that Prime Minister Narendra Modi may disband the minority affairs ministry or merge it with a bigger ministry like social justice, a reason why the appointment of a minister came as a surprise.

    However, a change of approach may be in store. Given that most of the ministry's policies are specifically targeted at Muslims, Heptullah steered clear of giving her views on the policies or what she planned to do. "Till I get guidance from the PM, I will not draw a roadmap for my ministry," she said.

    Muslims are not minorities, Parsis are: Najma Heptullah - The Times of India
     
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  3. AVERAGE INDIAN

    AVERAGE INDIAN EXORCIST Senior Member

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    ‘Muslims too many to be called minority, it’s Parsis who need special attention’

    Minority Affairs Minister Najma Heptulla has said Muslims are too large in number to call themselves a minority and that it is the Parsis who need special attention, for they are a “minuscule minority”.

    Talking to The Indian Express on the day she took charge of the ministry Tuesday, Heptulla also said she would have to consult Narendra Modi on whether he wants to “inherit” the Prime Minister’s 15-point programme for minorities.

    Referring to the issue of Muslim reservation in jobs, she said “there is no provision in the Constitution for religion-based reservation”. The matter is in the Supreme Court.

    “If you have six children it is always important to see what you can do for the weakest of them. So far as my ministry is concerned, of the six minority communities the weakest is clearly the Parsis. They are a minuscule minority that is so ‘ Muslims too many to be called minority, it’s Parsis who need special attention’ precariously placed that one needs to take care of their survival. Muslims really are too large in number to be called a minority community,” the minister told The Indian Express.

    She said the very concept of minority and majority is relative and when talking about minorities it is imperative to understand that it is a term that encompasses many parameters, including language, apart from religion. Neither is there a ‘one-size-fits-all’ formula for the welfare of minorities.

    The Ministry of Minority Affairs was set up in 2006 in the wake of the appointment of the Sachar Committee by the then prime minister Manmohan Singh to look into social, educational and economic conditions of Muslims in India. Though it caters to all six minority communities — the latest addition being Jains — Muslims have, since its inception, been a special focus area for the ministry.

    Heptulla is yet to get a full lowdown on the ministry’s programmes and schemes, but one scheme that she is not inclined towards is the Prime Minister’s 15-point programme for minority concentration areas. “It was started by Indira Gandhi in 1980 and in these 34 years all that has happened is that successive prime ministers have merely ‘inherited’ it without any real thrust on implementation. I will have to discuss with Narendra Modiji whether he really wants to inherit it. It is striking that it has remained at 15 points all this while without one addition or deletion which should have happened if there was application of mind,” she said.

    Asked about the non-implementation by the Gujarat government of a scholarship scheme for minority girls, she said: “It is all misinformation. The scheme has been implemented.” This matter too is currently in the apex court after the Gujarat government refused to pay its 25 per cent share in the scheme.

    Heptulla made no bones about her aversion to the idea of reservation, maintaining that it cannot be a solution for anything. “I am not in favour of reservation. I have come this far without reservation. What is important is positive action to provide level playing field. Once we do that politically, socially and educationally they will be able to compete with the rest.”

    Dispelling apprehension among Muslims about a government under the stewardship of Narendra Modi, she said such fears had been manufactured politically over the years and has survived because there is little information about the status of Muslims in Gujarat.
    According to data from 2001 census, Muslims constitute about 13 per cent of India’s population.

    http://defenceforumindia.com/forum/...rities-parsis-najma-heptullah.html#post904615
     
  4. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    The idea of reservations has gone past the expiry day.

    What should be done is to uplift the masses of economically handicapped irrespective of any special distinctions.

    One has to uplift the poor so that India can progress and tap the talent which is denied owing to economic deprivation wherein education and health is lacking leading to physically and mentally debilitation of otherwise intelligent minds and bodies of Indians.
     
  5. anoop_mig25

    anoop_mig25 Senior Member Senior Member

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    :frusty::frusty::frusty::frusty::frusty:

    This is no way to start your day in office

    Mrs Najma Heptullah wants to please whom Modi or RSS......


    She can please nation by doing some work ...

    Doesnt BJP wants to make inroad into muslims minds or not .if yes then they should get some one who can connect with muslims ....

    And this is no way to make connection

    Seriously now there will be editorials in India as well as foregin newspaper from jhollwaalas "that we told you So "
     
  6. A chauhan

    A chauhan "अहिंसा परमो धर्मः धर्म हिंसा तथैव च: l" Senior Member

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    If you look at UN definition of 'minority' she is right.
     
  7. pmaitra

    pmaitra Moderator Moderator

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    What does it say?
     
  8. anoop_mig25

    anoop_mig25 Senior Member Senior Member

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    Whatever may be definition fact is they are not doing well . this may be because of their inertia and 10000 rulers attitude problem but then there is new generations who want to succeded .BJP must tap into this section and for that rquires taking care of their problems and removing bottlenecks which affects them.

    then only this new section going to support bjp
     
  9. Ajesh

    Ajesh Regular Member

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    She has said right.

    We should stop being obsessed about Muslims. Muslims are just a part of India... ALl the focus should be on India as a whole and not on a particular community.
     
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  10. AVERAGE INDIAN

    AVERAGE INDIAN EXORCIST Senior Member

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    Reservation: At the time of election, “Secular” parties promises Reservation for all Muslims. Aren’t Muslims receiving caste based reservation? If yes, then why go for religion based reservation which is impractible & unconstitutional?

    Muslims should ask themselves: Is this demand feasible? Does our Constitution permit religion based reservation? If yes, then please also demand religion based demand for Hindus too? Why should Hindus as community be left out, if Constitution is to be amended only for Muslims? Defies logic. Impractical. By demanding religion based reservation, we are only strengthen the hands of fascist forces.

    If there is good governance Muslims can survive in India with out any reservation. From sixty years congress is making fool of Muslims by giving false promises, at least BJP is not giving the false assurances.
     
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  11. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    I think the days of the Vote Bank raj style of politics is over just as the Licence Raj has seen its demise.

    People want jobs and opportunities and not mere handouts and promises.

    Distinction in categories and mere lip service does not fill hungry stomach or the rid one of the scary spectre of never ending unemployment.

    Give jobs open up avenues of opportunity for employment and one will forget what is one's special distinction that had required sops, handouts and reduced people to yearn for panhandling ecstasies.
     
    Last edited: May 28, 2014
  12. kseeker

    kseeker Retired

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    Who are minorities under international law?
    Adopted by consensus in 1992, the United Nations Minorities Declaration in its article 1 refers to minorities as based on national or ethnic, cultural, religious and linguistic identity, and provides that States should protect their existence. There is no internationally agreed definition as to which groups constitute minorities. It is often stressed that the existence of a minority is a question of fact and that any definition must include both objective factors (such as the existence of a shared ethnicity, language or religion) and subjective factors (including that individuals must identify themselves as members of a minority).

    The difficulty in arriving at a widely acceptable definition lies in the variety of situations in which minorities live. Some live together in well-defined areas, separated from the dominant part of the population. Others are scattered throughout the country. Some minorities have a strong sense of collective identity and recorded history; others retain only a fragmented notion of their common heritage.

    The term minority as used in the United Nations human rights system usually refers to national or ethnic, religious and linguistic minorities, pursuant to the United Nations Minorities Declaration. All States have one or more minority groups within their national territories, characterized by their own national, ethnic, linguistic or religious identity, which differs from that of the majority population.

    According to a definition offered in 1977 by Francesco Capotorti, Special Rapporteur of the United Nations Sub-Commission on Prevention of Discrimination and Protection of Minorities, a minority is: A group numerically inferior to the rest of the population of a State, in a non-dominant position, whose members - being nationals of the State - possess ethnic, religious or linguistic characteristics differing from those of the rest of the population and show, if only implicitly, a sense of solidarity, directed towards preserving their culture, traditions, religion or language.1/

    While the nationality criterion included in the above definition has often been challenged, the requirement to be in a non-dominant position remains important. In most instances a minority group will be a numerical minority, but in others a numerical majority may also find itself in a minority-like or non-dominant position, such as Blacks under the apartheid regime in South Africa. In some situations, a group which constitutes a majority in a State as a whole may be in a non-dominant position within a particular region of the State in question.

    In addition, it has been argued that the use of subjective criteria, such as the will on the part of the members of the groups in question to preserve their own characteristics and the wish of the individuals concerned to be considered part of that group, combined with certain specific objective requirements, such as those listed in the Capotorti definition, should be taken into account. It is now commonly accepted that recognition of minority status is not solely for the State to decide, but should be based on both objective and subjective criteria.

    The question often arises as to whether, for example, persons with disabilities, persons belonging to certain political groups or persons with a particular sexual orientation or identity (lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender or intersexual persons) constitute minorities. While the United Nations Minorities Declaration is devoted to national, ethnic, religious and linguistic minorities, it is also important to combat multiple discrimination and to address situations where a person belonging to a national or ethnic, religious and linguistic minority is also discriminated against on other grounds such as gender, disability or sexual orientation. Similarly, it is important to keep in mind that, in many countries, minorities are often found to be among the most marginalized groups in society and severely affected by, for example, pandemic diseases, such as HIV/AIDS, and in general have limited access to health services.

    Minorities under international law

    Also...

    United Nations Guide for Minorities
     
  13. Ajesh

    Ajesh Regular Member

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    Instead of crying all the time "We are minority, We need help, We need help" Why dont they go and actually do something for the Nation that people will respect.
     
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  14. SHURIDH

    SHURIDH Senior Member Senior Member

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    Then why you mrs.najma heptaulla and syed shanewaj hussian has post in bjp minority morcha.
    why badsha alam has post in west bengal bjp minority morcha.

    almost all state president of bjp's minority morcha's are muslim.

    so first you and all muslim mebers of bjp should quit from bjp minority morcha.

    make it very clear no muslim will be eligable for bjp minority morcha's membership then speak you hypocrate.

    muslims are notified religious minority according to national commission for minorities act 1994.
    so you can't deny this legal status of india's muslim minority.
     
  15. SHURIDH

    SHURIDH Senior Member Senior Member

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    According to un definition tamils of srilanka is also not minority but our bjp leader are often express their concern about srilankan tamil minority.

    indian national commission for minority act 1994 clearly mention who is minority and who is not in india.

    14.5% of a country population can't be call as majority.
     
  16. rock127

    rock127 Maulana Rockullah Senior Member

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    Interesting points Najma made.

    If we compare Indian population as a whole below is a comparison(2001! ) but interestingly Congress didn't disclose the latest data and we got 2001 data. :shocked:

    [​IMG]

    Below is a interesting article on this subject.
    ===============================================================================

    Demographic danger! Why Muslim population growth is alarming | Niti Central
    Recently, I had a discussion on the religious demographics in India. One obvious question that came up was why the UPA Government hasn’t made the religious demographics data from 2011 census public yet? :shocked:

    [​IMG]

    It’s been three years since 2011 census data is available with the Government. Is three years’ time not long enough for any Government to make public; one of the most crucial part of the census? The religious demographics data shows religious populations by proportion. There are lots of theories around as to why this key data is not made public.


    This made me curious about reviewing the prior census data more carefully.

    This, below, is the only Hindu-Muslim demographics data from 2001 census that I could gather from India’s census website.


    Demographic danger! Why Muslim population growth is alarming!

    The two things which need to be highlighted are:-

    » In 2001, 18.7 per cent of the Muslim population was in the 0-6 age-group. By 2014, they will be in their 13-19 age-group. For Hindus, it is 15.6 per cent which means that Muslims, on an average, have three more teenagers than the Hindus for every 100 people in their community. Within a few years, this group will be into their reproductive age.

    » Female literacy rate in the Hindus was just 3.1 per cent more than that in the Muslims.

    When talking about the number of children in a family, the female literacy rate is very important factor. There is not much difference between female literacy rates in the Hindus and in the Muslims. Then why the Total Fertility Rate (TFR), which is a universal scale to measure growth/decline rate of a particular community, is more in the Muslims than in the Hindus? 2001 census says that the Muslims had a TFR of 4.1, while the Hindus had 3.1. It means that in 2001, an average Muslim woman gave birth to four children and an average Hindu woman gave birth to three. One child more per family means; the Muslims on an average produced 32.26 per cent more children than the Hindus. To keep this article purely based on data, I am not including Sachhar Committee report, Uniform Civil Code, conversions, reservations, food habits and other such topics.

    While studying this data, I came across a few more key questions. All data tend to indicate that, clearly, there is a religious reason for the Muslims to produce more children than other religious communities. This is a strong conclusion, but I couldn’t find anything else that can explain such significantly high population growth rate.

    Why is Census 2011 silent on religious data?

    If you don’t agree with me, and still believe that there is not much of a difference between the Muslim population growth rate and the Hindu population growth rate or if some committees made you believe that this difference is due to their educational or economic reasons, then the following questions are for you.

    Key questions on the Hindu-Muslim population growth rate in India:

    Q1: Between 1991 and 2001, India’s Muslim population grew at around 36 per cent and that of the Hindus at around 20 per cent. When there is not much difference between literacy rates and per capita incomes of the Hindus and the Muslims, then why there is this big difference in their respective population growth rate?

    Q2: What can be the reason as to why the UPA Government has not released religious census details since 2011? Is it mainly because the psychological point of the Hindus constituting 80 per cent of our country’s population would have disappeared?

    Q3: Azam Khan with Mulayam Singh Yadav called for a separate Muslim Pradesh in India’s largest State (UP), a few years back. Why do you think he is so confident of even calling for something as unconstitutional as this? Imam Bukhari, Akbaruddin Owaisi and many others keep talking about 20, 25 and 30 crore Muslims. Do they know something that a common man doesn’t know? By the way, the Samajwady Party and the MIM are still considered secular by Indian standards.

    Owaisi clan’s provocative speeches

    Q4: Two well-known professional demographers, late PN Mari Bhat and AJ Francis Zavier, had concluded that the fertility of the Muslims, which was about 10 per cent higher than that of the Hindus before independence, became 25 to 30 per cent higher than the Hindu rate by the end of 20th century. Taking the analysis further, the current Muslim population could be growing at a rate nearly 35 to 45 percent higher than that of the Hindus. The exact percentage can be contested; but the fact that it is a huge differential compared to the Hindu rate, can’t be snubbed. Why is this big difference?

    Q5: Many claim that the higher Muslim fertility rate has been because of their poverty and illiteracy. But, close to 36 per cent of Indian Muslims live in urban areas; while only 26 per cent of Hindus do so. Also, the Muslims have a higher life expectancy at birth than the Hindus. Life expectancy is 68 years for the Muslims as against only 65 years for the Hindus, as revealed by National Family Health Survey (NFHS) of 2005-2006. But despite all this, the fertility rate of the Muslims continues to be higher than that of the Hindus. Why?

    Q6: Take Kerala, for example, which is India’s most literate State. According to the National Family Health Survey 2 of 1998-99, the literacy level of the Hindus and the Muslims in Kerala was almost equal. The Muslims, there, are better off than the Hindus economically because of big remittances from Gulf countries. Still, the population growth rate of the Muslims has remained higher than that of the Hindus by 45 per cent. Why?

    Q7: In Kerala, in 2001, the TFR for the Hindus was at 1.64 which is below the replacement level of 2.1. The State of Kerala has witnessed a massive increase in the Muslim population which rose from approximately 2375000 in 1951 to 7864000 in 2001. During the same period, the population of the Hindus grew from 8348000 to 1792000, and that of the Christians increased from 2826000 to 6057000. During the same period, the Hindus percentage in Kerala‘s population declined from 61.61 to 56.28, while that of the Muslims increased from 17.53 to 24.70. Interestingly the Christians, another minority group, saw their population percentage decline from 20.86 in 1951 to 19.02 in 2001. There’s a very good chance that in 2014, the population of Kerala’s Hindus (including HINOs – Hindus in Name only) would be below 50 per cent. Why?

    Q8: A simple analysis of census 2001 shows that on an average, every Muslim woman is giving birth to at least one more child than a Hindu woman. The NFHS-3 (2005- 06) data shows that the prevalence of modern contraception like sterilisation, pills, IUD and condom is low among the Muslims at 36 per cent usage rate, compared to that in the Hindus at 50 per cent. So, growth rate in the Muslim population, in the next few decades, is likely to increase unless they start family planning. Is there any other reason to explain this significant one child difference between the two communities, other than religious?

    Q9: An analysis of the 0-6 year age-group data from 2001 census reveals that out of 35 States and Union Territories, the percentage of the Muslims in that age-group was higher than that of the Hindus in as many as 31 States and Union Territories. While the percentage of the Hindus in that age-group was marginally higher than the Muslims only in two States of Sikkim, Madhya Pradesh and two Union Territories of Daman & Diu, Andaman & Nicobar Islands. It proves that in the coming decades, the Muslim population will grow at a higher rate than that of the Hindus in 31 States and Union Territories of India. Maybe, already it is happening as the data is 14-15 years old. Why there is such alarming difference in 31 out of the 35 States and Union Territories?

    Q10: In India, in 2001, 15.6 per cent of the Hindus’ population was in 0-6 age group, while for the Muslims it was much higher at 18.7 per cent. There is a possibility that population of the Muslims in 0-6 age-group can be much higher than reported due to large scale illegal immigration of Bangladeshis to India (which Asom’s CM will deny for obvious political reasons). Hence today, the Muslims, for sure, have more children producing population within their community when compared to other groups. So, you can relatively expect more percentage growth of the Muslims in 2021 and 2031 census.

    Q11: Let’s have a look at the States where the Muslims had better literacy rate than that of the Hindus in 2001. As per 2001 census, in Andhra Pradesh, the Hindu male and female literacy rate was 69.5 per cent and 49.2 per cent respectively, while that of the Muslim male and female was 76.5 per cent and 59.1 per cent respectively. But still, in 2001, the Total Fertility Rate for the Muslims was 0.5 higher than that of the Hindus. Why?

    Similarly, in Gujarat, the Hindu male and female literacy rate was 79.1 per cent and 56.7 per cent respectively, while that of the Muslim male and female was 84.1 per cent and 71.2 per cent respectively. Even with such lead in literacy rate, the Muslim’s TFR was 0.2 above that of the Hindus. Why?

    Q12: If you take a look at a State where Muslim literacy rate is lesser than that of the Hindus, the difference in TFR is alarming. In Haryana, in 2001, the Muslims had 35 per cent less literacy rate than that of the Hindus. But the TFR was 3.2 above that of the Hindus. The Muslims were producing 3 babies per woman more than the Hindus. Why?

    Q13: In every region of India, the difference is stark and uniform. According to the 2001 census, in the North East, the Muslims produced more than 5 children on an average in 30 districts whereas the Hindus produced more than 5 children only in 2 districts (Thanks to illegal immigrants from Bangladesh). In Eastern part of India, the Muslims produced more than 5 babies in 35 districts as against the Hindus doing so only in 5 districts. In the west, the Muslims produced more than 5 babies in 8 districts as against the Hindus doing so only in 2 districts. In the North-West, the Muslims produced more than 5 babies in 31 districts as against the Hindus doing so only in 6 districts. In the south, the Muslims produced more than 3 babies per family in 24 districts whereas the Hindus produced more than 3 babies per family only in 5 districts. Overall in India, the Muslims produced more than 5 children on an average in 104 districts whereas the Hindus produced more than 5 children on an average only in just 15 districts.

    Also, the Hindus produced less than 2 kids on an average in 79 districts of India whereas Muslims produced less than 2 kids on an average in just 26 districts of India. These differences may be much more striking in 2011 census, considering various factors discussed till now. This alarming difference must be explained. How do you explain this, friends?

    Q14: In the year 1900, the Muslims constituted only 12 per cent of the world population; they grew to 18 per cent in 1992-93 (when Huntington published his first thesis on the clash of civilizations). Today, the Muslims constitute nearly 24 per cent of the world population. Don’t you see a pattern across the world, when it comes to relative population growth of all the religious groups?

    160 crore Muslims in the world: Dainik Siyasat

    Enough questions for now! These questions are just to initiate academic discussions and debates based on facts and figures instead of emotions and ideologies. It looks amply clear that religion is the prime reason because of which the Muslim population in India is growing way faster than that of the Hindus (and other groups). All other reasons look trivial.

    But you can prove me wrong. Go ahead!

    Anyone, with a correction or a question about the data produced above, is welcome.

    PS: I have collated this data from various presentations and graphs that are all available on the internet. Since the numbers are from different researchers such as S Irudaya Rajan, Ram Kumar Ohri, A Surya Prakash and Aariz Mohammed, there might be small differences. You can contest or correct the facts.

    References:
     
  17. trackwhack

    trackwhack Tihar Jail Banned

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    Are you freaking crazy ... This is exactly the correct approach. Modi did not need appeasement to get to power. He does not need to do so to stay in power either.
     
  18. Mad Indian

    Mad Indian Proud Bigot Veteran Member Senior Member

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    Srilankan tanils are treated as second class citizens in their own land by Lankans and are subjected to genocide and had to fight a fukcing war for their rights. Tell me in what respect Muslims like you compare to tham? Next time think before you make a dumb shit argument


    And 18 crore population which is breeding faster than rats is not a minority by any stretch of imagination. If you have a problem living here as equals with Hindus, with no special sops ,you can join your brethren in east pakistan who were seperated for exactly the same reason. We have no issues with that
     
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  19. roma

    roma NRI in Europe Senior Member

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    the UN is not the absolute supreme being is it ? The UN, indeed any and every organization especially one as large as the UN would require policy review every so often - say every couple of decades ? ...
    in certain aspects of its policies ?

    The word minority is derived from the word MINOR - basically it means insignificant and gives the sense of being
    unable to affect the major portion ... but Muslim voters in India , with their ability to "vote-tactically "
    and thus affect the outcome of a Lok Sabha election are thus even by definition no longer insignificant
    and thus not a minority.
    - you cant have your cake and eat it - although some might try !

    there is no hard and fast "rule " engraved in gold or platinum -

    India has every right to form its own system

    India has time and again proven the critics wrong - the wonderfully great Churchill the whites HERO of WW2 gave India a handful of years before it would collapse, he said...Now we are wondering if it is England who without Scotland
    which might collapse .

    Muslims might be a smaller community than Hindus but they are certainty not a minor community
    As for the insinuation that they are not doing as well as they want ?
    firstly who said so ?

    but even if it is the case, well work harder then . Indeed look at Dr Abdul Kalam - he didn't complain
    - just did more work and rose up....and so too many other Muslim Indians in prominent positions

    Muslims in India which number 120 million are a sizeable community .
    they are certainly not the majority but being sizeable they are thus not a minority

    Najma Heptullah was correct - Parsis, Jains , Indian Jews, and a few other small populations - those are.
    minor communities and should receive government assistance .
     
    Last edited: May 28, 2014
  20. Bhadra

    Bhadra Defence Professionals Defence Professionals Senior Member

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    Ok let us come to some understanding.

    Where Muslims are 06 per cent or more such as in UP and Bihar (more than 20 per cent in fact) - let them not get any minority benefits...

    Where Muslims are less than five per cent such as Himachal or Uttarakhand let them be termed as minority.

    Calling Muslims in J&K as minority is a big conspiracy joke...
     
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  21. rock127

    rock127 Maulana Rockullah Senior Member

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    The minority among so called "minority" should be given preference.

    Actually it's the Christians,Sikhs,Jains,Parsis etc the real minorities but hey did they ever cry about religion bases reservations? :hmm:

    Why the so called "minority" of 200 million considered as minority?
     
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