Making electric cars popular in India

[Sabir]

Honda civic hybrid was launched in India and failed. it has range,looks,sex,and technology. then why it failed?????/

Initially people dont get interested in new tech....So hybrid and electric are facig some problems to be accepted by consumer...

We are discussing possibility of full electric car in non-private category...like bus, taxi etc....where-

1)Route are within city and more or less predictable thus helping in installing charghing facilities
2) Low range 80-100 km or limit in top speed wont be a problem

If after 8-10 years people see thousands of electric vehicles are running around them, they may consider to buy electric cars. But targettig them at first instance is a wrong strategy.

 

[Blackwater]

Initially people dont get interested in new tech....So hybrid and electric are facig some problems to be accepted by consumer...

We are discussing possibility of full electric car in non-private category...like bus, taxi etc....where-

1)Route are within city and more or less predictable thus helping in installing charghing facilities
2) Low range 80-100 km or limit in top speed wont be a problem

If after 8-10 years people see thousands of electric vehicles are running around them, they may consider to buy electric cars. But targettig them at first instance is a wrong strategy.

Even in west too electric cars don't have long range . we got Nissan leaf and chevy/opel volt as good electric car.we got also charging point in all markets and petrol pumps+ mac Donald. which extend their range

if we take India. Immediate solution is hybrid cars which not only saves petrol but got long range and less pollution but govt will loose money in petrol taxes.

i feel electric or hybrid cars/buses both are distant dream in india

 

[Sabir]

Even in west too electric cars don't have long range . we got Nissan leaf and chevy/opel volt as good electric car.we got also charging point in all markets and petrol pumps+ mac Donald. which extend their range

if we take India. Immediate solution is hybrid cars which not only saves petrol but got long range and less pollution but govt will loose money in petrol taxes.

i feel electric or hybrid cars/buses both are distant dream in india

Yes, GOI will lose tax...but think if Crude touches $200 in 5-7 years, fuel consumption increases here what will happen to our BoP.

 

[t_co]

A large part of the Indian electricity mix is generated by coal, and India's electrical infrastructure is already overloaded. Not sure how adding electric cars would help either India's economy or environment.

 

[Sabir]

A large part of the Indian electricity mix is generated by coal, and India's electrical infrastructure is already overloaded. Not sure how adding electric cars would help either India's economy or environment.

The balance ca be shift in favour of wind and solar enregy....India has long coastlines ideal for wind power projects ...high solar insolation makes it ideal for solar power too..........And both of these can be installed in much less time than hudel or thermal power stations. Other sources could be Nuclear power and power from biomas.

Even in your country, generation of Solar or wind energy was negligible in the biginning of this century.....in last 5-6 years these segments have seen a growth of 50-60% annually....and now China is among top two countries in both the segments.

Problem in India is poor distribution system and power theft which lead to wastage of around 45%(according to the data by Planning commission). GoI need to take it seriously.

It will take money and planning but the benefits are manyfold- not only cut in pollution. It will cut the demand of fossil fuel which we mostly import paying from our forex reserve.

 

[W.G.Ewald]

Study: Electric Cars No Greener than Gasoline Vehicles

Electric cars, despite their supposed green credentials, are among the environmentally dirtiest transportation options, a U.S. researcher suggests.

Writing in the journal IEEE Spectrum, researcher Ozzie Zehner says electric cars lead to hidden environmental and health damages and are likely more harmful than gasoline cars and other transportation options.

Electric cars merely shift negative impacts from one place to another, he wrote, and "most electric-car assessments analyze only the charging of the car. This is an important factor indeed. But a more rigorous analysis would consider the environmental impacts over the vehicle's entire life cycle, from its construction through its operation and on to its eventual retirement at the junkyard."

 

[t_co]

I guess the only real benefit electric cars could have in India would be reducing dependence on imported POL (petroleum, oil, and lubricants), but given the hefty switching costs and required political focus, I'm not sure that's the best place for India to be exerting itself over the next decade.

 

[TrueSpirit]

@Sabir, wind power typically the efficiency or Capacity Factor as they call it typically vares from 15% to 50%. In TN most of the wind farms typically have a Capacity Factor of 33% odd which is quite good. In terms of efficiency and also the ratio of power to area reqd. I would prefer wind farms over solar.

In fact USAID is in talks with some people in India to set up state of the art wind mills in Leh, Ladakh area, where the main challenge will be the extremely low temperatures.

SUzlon has not able to break even so far; is raising money from public, venture capitalists & private equity players. Cost of Solar cells has come done sharply from what it was a few years back (though still not at par with our regular supply). As adoption & penetration (volumes) increases and tech. gets more commercially viable, economy of scale could be expected, within a decade (which is much less than the gestation period of nuclear projects & probably at comparable costs).

 

[sob]

SUzlon has not able to break even so far; is raising money from public, venture capitalists & private equity players. Cost of Solar cells has come done sharply from what it was a few years back (though still not at par with our regular supply). As adoption & penetration (volumes) increases and tech. gets more commercially viable, economy of scale could be expected, within a decade (which is much less than the gestation period of nuclear projects & probably at comparable costs).

Suzlon is a different story. They were too greedy, paid huge sums to acquire Hansen and are not able to come out of the financial mess.
You are correct about solar energy, technology is changing but for reasons mentioned above I would still push for wind. Today in India the wind energy is bigger then the nuclear energy, but then we need sources of stable 24x7 generation also.

 

[Sabir]

I guess the only real benefit electric cars could have in India would be reducing dependence on imported POL (petroleum, oil, and lubricants), but given the hefty switching costs and required political focus, I'm not sure that's the best place for India to be exerting itself over the next decade.

Switching to elctric cars should be done step by step. The private car owners should no be touched at all in next ten years; as electric car is not suitable for their use. Government need to consider the segment which is under its control- public vehicles which mostly run within the city. The older vehicles will be automatically removed from the road over the years. Government need to build up the ifrastructure so that these vehicles can be substituted by electric vehicles. If necessary it should sit with the top vehicle manufacturers of the country and prepare a road map jointly.

 

[TrueSpirit]

Suzlon is a different story. They were too greedy, paid huge sums to acquire Hansen and are not able to come out of the financial mess.
You are correct about solar energy, technology is changing but for reasons mentioned above I would still push for wind. Today in India the wind energy is bigger then the nuclear energy, but then we need sources of stable 24x7 generation also.

I agree with the inherent limitation you have pointed out. Economic storage of vast amount of electric power is a challenge unto itself.

 

[TrueSpirit]

I'm not sure that's the best place for India to be exerting itself over the next decade.

Would you mind sharing your view on "the best place for India to be exerting itself over the next decade" ?

I would rather opine, electric cars, if happen to go mainstream in India, would be game-changer especially when it come to foreign policy as well as energy & economic security.

 

[t_co]

Would you mind sharing your view on "the best place for India to be exerting itself over the next decade" ?

I would rather opine, electric cars, if happen to go mainstream in India, would be game-changer especially when it come to foreign policy as well as energy & economic security.

Sure. I think India should be exerting itself at developing a world-class medical infrastructure that can export medical services abroad without the use of huge amounts of well-trained doctors. China, Japan/SKorea, Russia, Europe, and North America are all aging quite heavily; if India can somehow leverage its demographic boom to position itself as the most affordable caregiver of the world, it would create and wield an immense amount of soft power in a way no other nation could really counter.

What's more, Hindu culture and existing NRI proclivities would synergize well with being "the world's hospital".

Food for thought.

 

[Abhijeet Dey]

India to establish nuclear reactor that uses Thorium as fuel: Atomic Energy Commission
Ashok Pradhan, Times of India Jun 27, 2012

BHUBANESWAR: India is planning to establish a nuclear power plant that uses thorium as main fuel instead of uranium, which is used in the conventional reactors. "It is natural for India to go for thorium reactors given the abundance in its supply in the country. We are in the process of selecting an appropriate site for establishing one," said Atomic Energy Commission (AEC) chairman R K Sinha.

Speaking to reporters in the sidelines of the first graduation ceremony of National Institute of Science Education and Research (NISER), Sinha said the country already has the technological know-how to use thorium. However, for large-scale use of thorium, the country will need two decades. "We have to assess the thorium-powered reactor on various aspects in the long-term before replicating similar models in bigger ways," the AEC chief said.

Thorium is regarded cleaner fuel compared to uranium. Sinha described the protest against Kudankulam nuclear power plant in Tamil Nadu as nothing unusual, and said the opposition is because the local people think it would not serve them any purpose and apprehend regarding safety of the plant. The government by undertaking neighbourhood development programme and creating awareness about the safety aspects has largely overcome the protests, he said.

Sinha said the international embargo after the 1974 nuclear test in a way helped develop almost 100 per cent indigenous technology for nuclear programmes, making India self-reliant on nuclear energy. Speaking about country's need for quality research, Sinha said researches must be part of the university system. More research should be promoted among academic institutions.

About Indian scientists deserting country for greener pastures abroad, the AEC chief said there is no harm as such scientists gain experience in international laboratories. "Some students go abroad under peer pressure as they do not lag behind. There are also reverse brain drain. We should strive to create more quality laboratories to attract the best brains back again," he said.

 

[TrueSpirit]

Some houses in second tier cities are driven by Solar energy plant i nTN.
Most people have set up a complete solar plant for individual houses. The cost starts @ 1 lakh, I guess.

In HP & Uttarakhand homes, the numbers run in several thousands since more than a decade.

 

[TrueSpirit]

I guess the only real benefit electric cars could have in India would be reducing dependence on imported POL (petroleum, oil, and lubricants), but given the hefty switching costs and required political focus, I'm not sure that's the best place for India to be exerting itself over the next decade.

Would you mind sharing your view on "the best place for India to be exerting itself over the next decade" ?

I would rather opine, electric cars, if happen to go mainstream in India, would be game-changer especially when it come to foreign policy as well as energy & economic security.

Sure. I think India should be exerting itself at developing a world-class medical infrastructure that can export medical services abroad without the use of huge amounts of well-trained doctors. China, Japan/SKorea, Russia, Europe, and North America are all aging quite heavily; if India can somehow leverage its demographic boom to position itself as the most affordable caregiver of the world, it would create and wield an immense amount of soft power in a way no other nation could really counter.

What's more, Hindu culture and existing NRI proclivities would synergize well with being "the world's hospital".

Food for thought.

What makes you think both cannot be attempted in parallel ?

1.2 billion people in world's largest democracy might have multiple aspirations.

Which nation focuses in just 1 direction ? Doing that would be highly lop-sided & flawed policy.

 

[t_co]

What makes you think both cannot be attempted in parallel ?

1.2 billion people in world's largest democracy might have multiple aspirations.

Which nation focuses in just 1 direction ? Doing that would be highly lop-sided & flawed policy.

Good point.

 

[SPIEZ]

Sure. I think India should be exerting itself at developing a world-class medical infrastructure that can export medical services abroad without the use of huge amounts of well-trained doctors. China, Japan/SKorea, Russia, Europe, and North America are all aging quite heavily; if India can somehow leverage its demographic boom to position itself as the most affordable caregiver of the world, it would create and wield an immense amount of soft power in a way no other nation could really counter.

What's more, Hindu culture and existing NRI proclivities would synergize well with being "the world's hospital".

Food for thought.

This is probably the best post by a foreigner

 

[ashicjose]

my 2 cent

1. Give Priority to solar energy, give 80% subsidy to domestic and 35% to commercial power.
2. Give subsidy to electric cars.
3. Speed-up the works of Nuclear energy.
4. Do not plan anymore fossil powered plants.
5. Use the hot spots like Rajasthan Deserts, Tamilnadu to build solar plants.
6. Allocate funds to research in more capable batteries and panels.

I read in yahoo news that a girl (Indian) in US invented something to charge mobile phone batteries 100% in just 20 seconds, with these kinds of technologies we could charge the batteries of electric cars just like fossil fuels.

We need someone like APJ in our Gov. to do something for the sake of our country. Please please don't stick in fossil fuel ( Majority of our revenue is coming from fossil fuel ) { If the price of petrol is 70 Rs., the actuall cost is just below 35 Rs. }

Please do have some foresight ....... do something for the future of our country.

 

[Sabir]

my 2 cent

1. Give Priority to solar energy, give 80% subsidy to domestic and 35% to commercial power.
2. Give subsidy to electric cars.
3. Speed-up the works of Nuclear energy.
4. Do not plan anymore fossil powered plants.
5. Use the hot spots like Rajasthan Deserts, Tamilnadu to build solar plants.
6. Allocate funds to research in more capable batteries and panels.

I read in yahoo news that a girl (Indian) in US invented something to charge mobile phone batteries 100% in just 20 seconds, with these kinds of technologies we could charge the batteries of electric cars just like fossil fuels.

We need someone like APJ in our Gov. to do something for the sake of our country. Please please don't stick in fossil fuel ( Majority of our revenue is coming from fossil fuel ) { If the price of petrol is 70 Rs., the actuall cost is just below 35 Rs. }

Please do have some foresight ....... do something for the future of our country.

We just need some people in the top with some vision. We are totally dependent on fossil fuels from Middle East- what will happen if there is one more war involving Iran (which is quite possible)....can we handle the spike in crude oil price? What will happen to our forex reserve if crude price reach to $200 in next 5-7 years?

I started this thread because I strongly believed we can cut down our dependency on import of crude oil by 40% through use of electric cars in Public transport and total electrification of our railway trucks. Genrating electriticy via solar and wind energy (and nuclear energy wherever possible) should be given priority.