Let's celebrate Independence Day together

[ajtr]

Let's celebrate Independence Day together

Every year on Aug 14 and 15, 2012 groups of Indians and Pakistanis around the world join hands to celebrate Independence Day together, including groups that light candles at Wagah border. This year, various groups are coordinating to make the commemoration of 2012 more visible, utilising social media tools and the connections that have been developed over the recent past.
A facebook event hosted by several organisations and individuals, 'Pakistanis, Indians celebrate Independence Day together' (Pakistanis, Indians celebrate Independence Days together | Facebook) says "Please join in where ever you are. Please feel free post to information about relevant events."
One of the organisations behind this move is the Pakistan Youth Alliance, which recently launched its Karachi chapter and plans to celebrate 14th August with a parade. At 12 midnight, PYA wants to "wish India happy Independence day," says PYA Karachi coordinator Shumail Zaidi, who approached Aman ki Asha. "I want our voice to go across the border as a gesture of love and peace." Students in Mumbai and Lahore are also getting involved. Last year, students from IIT Mumbai led by Ronnie Philip initiated a Peace-Diary campaign titled Ummeed-e-Milaap in which two diaries travelled through different schools and universities, with students adding comments on them. "The diaries were exchanged and put on display at our respective universities," says Hassaan Zafar, a student at the Lahore University of Management Sciences (LUMS). "We received an overwhelming response. Furthering this idea we can record video messages in different schools and universities on both sides of the border and can share them on social media for August 14th and 15th."
Another host organisation is the online group Pray for Peace Between India and Pakistan. Initiated by Toronto-based writer and activist Swati Sharan, Pray for Peace Day was observed around the world on the randomly chosen day of Dec 18, last year, with thousands of people at various ashrams and in homes and parks joining in.
"We had at least 200 000 people praying last year for this," says Sharan. "One of my guru's senior meditators could actually gauge the energy level coming from the prayer on Pray for Peace Day because of their heightened abilities." We say, never doubt the power of collective prayer. Watch this space for more information on how Indians and Pakistanis are celebrating Aug 14-15, 2012. - aka
Visa-free 400 metres at Pak-India border
In a significant move that could show the way for putting in place a liberal visa regime between them, India and Pakistan have agreed to do away with requirement of a visa to cross the border on both sides within a radius of 400 metres at the Attari-Wagah point in Punjab for Customs and other related border officials, reports Indian media on Monday.
According to The Hindu it was agreed that officials monitoring and administrating trade would be issued "special permits'' to work within the 400-metre radius. At present, such permits are issued to drivers and workers to drive in and out of the border carrying goods and unloading them.
Now this special facility will be extended to certain officials, including Customs, on both sides to enable proper scrutiny, inspection and early clearance of goods coming through trucks. However, this limited access is unlikely to be available to the BSF or Pakistan Rangers.

 

[Galaxy]

There was nothing called Pakistan before 1947. They got the land on the name of Islam. Opportunist, Radical and Terrorist Islamist country!

 

[ajtr]

Collective psyche changing in favour of peace between Pakistan, India

President Rotary International Kalyan Bannerjee
Anil Datta

The Rotary International president has said the efforts being made by his organisation and Aman Ki Asha to bring the people closer will go a long way in wiping out the atmosphere of mistrust and acrimony that has plagued ties between India and Pakistan.

"I am sure our efforts at bringing the people closer and mitigating the sufferings, which affect all human beings equally regardless of race or nationality, will go a long way in wiping out the perennial atmosphere of mistrust and acrimony that has plagued ties between India and Pakistan for six decades, Kalyan Bannerjee said while talking to The News at a local hotel on Tuesday evening.
He appreciated collaboration between Rotary International (RI) and Aman Ki Asha - an initiative jointly undertaken by the Jang Group and The Times of Indian to make efforts to help create an environment conducive to peace talks between the South Asian neighbours.

"We at Rotary International (RI) are now hand in hand with Amn Ki Asha in the matter of medical treatment and surgeries for Pakistani patients in India," said Bannerjee, currently based at Evanston, Illinois, USA (the headquarters of Rotary International.

"During the last five years, since Rotary International began to collaborate with Aman Ki Asha, there have been 500 surgeries performed on Pakistani patients in India. This year (during the remaining part of it), we are likely to see another 200 of them. This compares very favourably with just 50 earlier, before Aman Ki Asha and Rotary International began to collaborate in the matter," he noted.
When asked as to what the total number of surgeries performed was since they began, he said he could not provide the exact figure off the cuff, but added, "Rest assured, there have been a large number of them."

He said that delving into the heart of the matter, one would come to the conclusion that numbers did not really matter all that much. "What really matters is the spirit behind the endeavour."

He quoted the words of a 1962 song from the Indian film "Hum Hindustani", rendered by the late Indian vocalist, Mukesh, the words being, "Choro Kal Ki Baatein, Kal Ki Baat Purani". Mutual hatred, he said, would not get the people of either country anywhere.

Bannerjee narrated the case of a 12-year-old Pakistani child who was operated upon for a major heart complication in India. He said that while sitting in a company of family members and elders, he interrupted the conversation by declaring that while he had been born in Pakistan, his "second birth" had taken place in India. So at least, he said, a beginning had been made in changing the collective psyche in favour of peace and harmony, away from continuous acrimony.

It was announced during the interview by Rotarian Faiz Kidwai that Sindh Governor Dr Ishrat-ul-Ebad had on Tuesday morning promised to allot 300 acres in the city to a 300-bed cardiac hospital.

Talking about this hospital, Bannerjee said that in all likelihood, there would be collaboration between the medical staff of the two countries. It was most likely that the Pakistani medical staff at the hospital would go to India on "familiarisation tours" and then on their return would perform surgeries in Pakistan. The hospital is to be designated Peace Hospital. As for the cost of treatment at the hospital, he said that it would be considerably subsidised and if need be totally subsidised.

Talking about the e-literacy programme that was decided on at the last Saarc summit in Kathmandu, Bannerjee said the idea had been initiated in India because school classrooms in most of rural India were poorly equipped and not meant to handle a large number of students. "So why not educate them through laptops and other symbols of information technology?"

Rotary International and Aman Ki Asha, he said, planned to help Pakistan implement such a programme.Rotarian Aziz Memon announced that the Rotary Humanitarian Trust had decided to build a village for the families hit by the floods of 2010 and 2011 in Thatta. Apart from other things, the settlement is to have a bio-gas plant.

Rotary International was founded in 1905 in Evanston, Illinois by an American businessman, Paul Harris. The agenda of the organisation was for the business community to help in community development. The motto of Rotary International is: Service before self.

NUMBERS THAT COUNT
500
surgeries performed on Pakistani patients in India since Rotary began to collaborate with Aman ki Asha

 

[ajtr]

VIEWPOINT...A Pakistani in India

By Babar Ayaz

Last December, while processing the plethora of forms a Pakistani visitor has to submit in spite of having a valid visa, an immigration officer at the newly refurbished Indira Gandhi International Airport at Delhi asked me: "Babu ji, aap patarkar ho; yeh batao humare duno deshon kay beech rishta kab theek hoga?" [You are a journalist; tell me, when will the relations between our countries normalise?] "When I served the Indian Army, I hated Pakistanis and thought of them as the enemy but since I've joined the immigration department and met so many Pakistanis at the immigration counter, hum ko to ab aap log apne jaise hi lagte ho [you people are the same as us]."

The immigration officer is not the only one who finds more similarities than differences between Pakistanis and Indians. Since my first visit to India in 1986 to the last trip this April, I have heard this observation many times. Another common observation on both sides of the border is that while there are no hostilities among the people, barring some ultra-nationalists and religious extremists venomous chants, the Delhi and Islamabad establishments are too slow and cautious in normalising relations at the official level.

Why? I think weak coalition governments in both countries fear the so-called public perception that is projected by vested interests. The fact is that it is very irresponsible of the opinion-makers - politicians and media - to generalise peoples' perception on important issues in multi-ethnic and multi-structural societies. As these opinion-makers represent the ruling establishment's interest, most of the time they present official views as the people's views. There is no genuinely 'national' view in India and Pakistan except in times of war or a cricket match between the two countries. In peace time, whenever an individual gets the chance to visit the other's country (in spite of perhaps the most ridiculous visa regime in the world), they get a warmer reception than anywhere else in the world.

Let's talk about the people of Pakistan first. The people of Baluchistan - Baloch and Pashtun - have never been anti-India or enthusiastic about fighting for Kashmir. The same is the case with Sindhis. Now even the Mohajir - the Urdu-speaking Sindhi - youth think along the same lines. The Seraiki-speaking people of southern Punjab, barring the jihadists of Bahawalpur Division, have never been in the forefront of any anti-India movement; they are mostly indifferent. Most of the Pashtuns of Khyber Pakhtunkhwa have also supported having good relations with India. This leaves only northern Punjab, which is the beneficiary of the war economy. However, even in central and northern Punjab, spurred by the ruling industrial class, sentiments have been changing in favour of having better relations with India.

Similarly, India is too big and diverse to have homogenous views. The people of southern and eastern India are, by and large, not hostile towards Pakistanis. If they're not very close, it is mainly because of the language and cultural barriers. On the other hand, the people of northern India have a lot in common. Whenever they meet at international conferences, they huddle together. I am reminded here of the Head of Asia-Pacific Organisation conference organised by The Economist at Penang, Malaysia in 1993. I met Adit Jain, a young India country expert, for the first time. Both of us were The Economist Conferences resource persons for presenting on the economic, business and political environment. Adit and I clicked immediately; he is now one of my best friends. When The Economist Conferences' regional managing director Sam Moon asked why we were together all the time when India and Pakistan were supposed to be enemies, Adit said that culturally he has more in common with me than his boss who was from Bengal. Adit loves to talk in Urdu and listen to Urdu poetry.

Another reason for Indians and Pakistanis becoming friendlier is that the population profile of both countries has changed a lot in the last quarter of a century. The size of the under-25 years population is 50 percent in India and 60 percent in Pakistan. This is the post-1971 generation, which is not burdened with the heavy baggage of the past. This generation is also forward-looking and wants to move upward at a fast-forward pace. A few years ago in Mumbai, young Nitesh Kumar put it thus: "The issues like Kashmir and tension with Pakistan are a drag on our economy and time."
Perhaps one of the reasons of the friendly attitude of Indians towards Pakistani visitors is that Muslims are no strangers to them as Muslims comprise 13 percent of India's population. When a Pakistani visits India, he is taken as somebody who has been once a part of the same society.
The mass migration after Partition created hundreds of thousands of people on both sides who have either direct nostalgic relations with cities and villages in the other country or have heard the same from their parents or grandparents. My first such encounter was on a train from Lucknow to Delhi in 1986, where I was attending the Golden Jubilee Conference of the Progressive Writers Association - again the joint heritage of litterateurs of both the countries. Next to me was Bhisham Sahni, celebrated Hindi writer and Rajinder Pal, a leading Urdu short-story writer. The common bond between them and me was not only that we belonged to the progressive writers' movement but also that Bisham's family had migrated from Rawalpindi and his elder brother (the famous actor Balraj Sahni) was my father's friend from their schooldays. Rajinder had migrated from Sialkot, the city of my mother.

While we were talking, a man sitting on the opposite seat with his mother, asked me if I was from Pakistan. When I replied in the affirmative, his mother started telling me about how she'd migrated from Karachi where her father had a locks shop at Lea Market. And I began thinking, of the six people sitting opposite each other, five had something in common. The Punjabi Hindus and Sikhs speak fondly of Lahore and Rawalpindi and ask when they can visit. The Sindhi Hindus speak about their forefather's cities with teary eyes. When I met the elder Mittal in Bali many years ago, for example, the founder of the steel mills empire went on and on about Karachi.

Admittedly, India has anti-peace lobbies like the Hindutavavadis, the RSS, Bal Thakaray's party and some hawks in the BJP. Pakistan too has its share of extremists. It has an anti-India lobby like the Jamaat-i-Islami, Lashkar-e-Taiba and Jaish Mohammed etc. But the fact remains that India has had seven elections since 1989 and Pakistan has had six; in all these elections, no major political party whipped up hysteria against the other country. Whichever party came to power in both countries expressed its desire to normalise relations. That reflects the peoples' mood - the real proof of goodwill of people. This also belies the media and politicians who want us to believe that peoples of these countries are enemies.

Euphoria about the breakthrough in Pakistan-India relations has started a flurry of activities with delegations from both countries visiting each other. The businessmen of both countries have picked up the peace initiative for which a few starry-eyed peaceniks of Pakistan and India have been struggling for decades. As businessmen have the economic might and political clout, this time around there is hope that the establishment of both countries will gather courage and take some bold decisions. Let the 1.4 billion people of Pakistan and India bloom.

 

[Galaxy]

There should be a case of treason on all people who support, demand, or propagate "Aman Ki Asha".

Friendship with terrorist country ? WTF.

 

[ajtr]

There should be a case of treason on all people who support, demand, or propagate "Aman Ki Asha".

Friendship with terrorist country ? WTF.

And why it should be so?you cant suppress peoples' emotions like PRC

 

[Yusuf]

And why it should be so?you cant suppress peoples' emotions like PRC

Peoples emotions? No country loves Pakistan. Least of all Indians. And galaxy is right about the punishment for those who do and come up with aman ka tamasha crap.

 

[Galaxy]

And why it should be so?you cant suppress peoples' emotions like PRC

Yes, We can suppress if it's related to National issue. I don't think even 1% Indians are interested in such crap.

Friendship with Terroirst country Pak is considered as Anti-India. (I am not counting politician/diplomats as they have some compulsion)

On one side, Pak is sending terrorist and want to see India in many pieces. And Aman ki Asha ?

Anyone who believes in "Aman Ki Asha" should be deported to Land of ShIt!! Period!!

 

[ajtr]

Yes, We can suppress if it's related to National issue.

Friendship with Terroirst country Pak is considered as Anti-India. (I am not counting politician/diplomats as they have some compulsion)

On one side, Pak is sending terrorist and want to see India in many pieces. And Aman ki Asha ?

Anyone who believe in "Aman Ki Asha" should be deported to Land of ShIt!! Period!!

Indira tried it by imposing emergency and then soon was shown the door.

 

[Yusuf]

Indira tried it by imposing emergency and then soon was shown the door.

Trust me no one will be shown the door for shutting down aman ka tamasha. In fact they will win a lot of the educated class's vote.

 

[Galaxy]

Indira tried it by imposing emergency and then soon was shown the door.

But then Same Indira Gandhi gave unforgettable pain to Pak.

1,00,000 Paki surrendered. Pakistan, The thekedar of Islam was divided in two parts.

I wish, we have another Iron Lady. we can live few years in Emergency if it's after biggest humiliated defeat for Pak.

Not to forget, She lost next election very badly and gave Anti-Congress parties a new hope. In Democracy, You can't win election like that. You won't understand as you are not a democratic country like us!

 

[ajtr]

But then Same Indira Gandhi gave unforgettable pain to Pak.

1,00,000 Paki surrendered. Pakistan, The thekedar of Islam was divided in two parts.

I wish, we have another Iron Lady. we can live few years in Emergency if it's after biggest humiliated defeat for Pak.

Not to forget, She lost next election very badly and gave Anti-Congress parties a new hope. In Democracy, You can't win election like that. You won't understand as you are not a democratic country like us!

Three decades before india got divided by jinnah too.

 

[Galaxy]

Three decades before india got divided by jinnah too.

Good for us.

Due to bastard like Jinnah, We are safe from Talban and Pigs growing like Mushrooms in Pukistan.

Bankruptcy economy, Hub of Terrorism, Centre of Islamist radical fanatic, Most hatred country of the world. It was good that puke was separated.

Hopefully, Trend will continue and Pakistan will disintegrate in 3 more parts. Baluchistan, Sindhe and Punjabistan. POK will merge with us sooner or later in any case as it's our part!!

If Pakistan will initiate any war, Then repeat of 1965-1971-1999 and Pak will surrender en mass as usual!

 

[ashdoc]

it seems pakistanis are realising that all the warmongering and opening of anti india terrorist camps has affected them more than it did indians , for the terrorists are targetting less religious pakistanis more than they do indians and creating mayhem in pakistan itself .

so now they are talking peace .

however there is good news for you AJTR.
people on this forum are military minded people who are bound to hate pakistan . but the common public in india is far more receptive to forgiving pakistanis for their sins than the warriors of defence forums .

india is a country of vegeterian effeminates who are all forgiving even to their oppressors . the weak minded have no choice but to forgive anyway .

 

[agentperry]

well as per britisher documents, the british indian union was granted independence on 15 august which include all the princely states and the state of india and pakistan... so pakistan celebrating i-day on 14th is well against the deceleration by the masters

 

[pmaitra]

So if we do celebrate our independence days together, it will have to be either 0001 hrs 14th Aug, or 0001 hrs 15th Aug. Which one will it be? If we take the average, then it will be 1201 hrs 14th Aug, and will still fall on 14th of August anyway. So why should I not foresee squabbling on this issue?

Alternatively, since Pakistan wanted to be a separate entity, why not keep our celebrations separate as well?

P.S.: "Good fences make good neighbours." - Robert Frost.

 

[W.G.Ewald]

MENDING WALL
Robert Frost

Something there is that doesn't love a wall,
That sends the frozen-ground-swell under it,
And spills the upper boulders in the sun,
And makes gaps even two can pass abreast.
The work of hunters is another thing:
I have come after them and made repair
Where they have left not one stone on a stone,
But they would have the rabbit out of hiding,
To please the yelping dogs. The gaps I mean,
No one has seen them made or heard them made,
But at spring mending-time we find them there.
I let my neighbor know beyond the hill;
And on a day we meet to walk the line
And set the wall between us once again.
We keep the wall between us as we go.
To each the boulders that have fallen to each.
And some are loaves and some so nearly balls
We have to use a spell to make them balance:
'Stay where you are until our backs are turned!'
We wear our fingers rough with handling them.
Oh, just another kind of out-door game,
One on a side. It comes to little more:
There where it is we do not need the wall:
He is all pine and I am apple orchard.
My apple trees will never get across
And eat the cones under his pines, I tell him.
He only says, 'Good fences make good neighbors'.
Spring is the mischief in me, and I wonder
If I could put a notion in his head:
'Why do they make good neighbors? Isn't it
Where there are cows?
But here there are no cows.
Before I built a wall I'd ask to know
What I was walling in or walling out,
And to whom I was like to give offence.
Something there is that doesn't love a wall,
That wants it down.' I could say 'Elves' to him,
But it's not elves exactly, and I'd rather
He said it for himself. I see him there
Bringing a stone grasped firmly by the top
In each hand, like an old-stone savage armed.
He moves in darkness as it seems to me~
Not of woods only and the shade of trees.
He will not go behind his father's saying,
And he likes having thought of it so well
He says again, "Good fences make good neighbors."

 

[mikhail]

it seems pakistanis are realising that all the warmongering and opening of anti india terrorist camps has affected them more than it did indians , for the terrorists are targetting less religious pakistanis more than they do indians and creating mayhem in pakistan itself .

so now they are talking peace .

however there is good news for you AJTR.
people on this forum are military minded people who are bound to hate pakistan . but the common public in india is far more receptive to forgiving pakistanis for their sins than the warriors of defence forums .

india is a country of vegeterian effeminates who are all forgiving even to their oppressors . the weak minded have no choice but to forgive anyway .

are you serious!

 

[mikhail]

it seems pakistanis are realising that all the warmongering and opening of anti india terrorist camps has affected them more than it did indians , for the terrorists are targetting less religious pakistanis more than they do indians and creating mayhem in pakistan itself .

so now they are talking peace .

however there is good news for you AJTR.
people on this forum are military minded people who are bound to hate pakistan . but the common public in india is far more receptive to forgiving pakistanis for their sins than the warriors of defence forums .

india is a country of vegeterian effeminates who are all forgiving even to their oppressors . the weak minded have no choice but to forgive anyway .

mate i think u have got a wrong perception about Indians!yeah its true that 30-40% of our populace are vegeterian but that doesn't mean that we are weak in any way.its an urban myth that vegeterians are inheritly weak in nature.we aren't the same people who were subjugated by foregn invaders in the past.now we are one of the strongest nation in the world(and probably the 2nd strongest in Asia)!so i don't think that the present generation of our country will ever forgive the pakis for all the heinous crimes that they have commited to us for the last six decades!:cool2: