Known unknowns about Modi are catalysts for a reset Indo US relations

ladder

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 28, 2013
Messages
7,255
Likes
12,207
Country flag
Re: Known unknowns about Modi are catalysts for a reset Indo US relati

@Ray, and others

Generally, I enjoyed and was informed by this well-written piece by Kanwal Sibal, Foreign ties will blossom under the new Modi government (IDR, Courtesy: Mail, 20 May, 2014); specifically, as to the COA Mr Sibal suggests to Pres. Obama in regard to Mr Modi and the US DoS:



What think you all as to the likelihood of the WH and US DoS admitting error in the "Modi Matter" ?

Regards

Mike
That's near to impossible.

Nor it would have that desired effect that Mr. Sibal wishes/ alludes to.

On the other hand it might send a wrong signal.

That restriction is already on the deathbed and therefore no need to kick it.

India USA relations aren't fragile enough to break if the premiers decide not to embark upon state visit to one another.

With the evolution of technology, I wish, both President Obama and PM Modi, talk to each other using the 3D hologram technology, which Modi used extensively for election campaign.

Though, I would like to give a piece of advice, to change the system of choosing your ambassadors, as in this case the tilt in the favor of Modi was amply visible from 2012. And any efforts to reach out to him then would have been more productive.

The same question of competence are being raised against your Thai ambassador, after the coup.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

LurkerBaba

Super Mod
Joined
Jul 2, 2010
Messages
7,882
Likes
8,125
Country flag
Re: Known unknowns about Modi are catalysts for a reset Indo US relati

As the western culture has dictated the rules and thought process of most of the world for last 100+ years, the vocabulary has become western. For example...If China "dominates"...or India "dominates"...All the time trying to compare the two and creating a rift and tension .....The eastern vocabulary is that of ...let's cooperate..grow together ...lets have harmony...lets have a multi-polar order and so on.
There is a fundamental difference in core thought patterns of westerners and easterners...west is individualistic and therefore very narcissistic...so uses language of domination and submission.....East has "we" type thought patterns....we can "coexist"..we can all live in "harmony" ..we can have mutual respect etc. These narcissistic longings for unlimited material wealth by individuals to prove to others that they are "special' or "exceptional" has spread to most of the world like cancer and is fast becoming "world culture" As East grows materially, its own native value system of "we can all live and cooperate and coexist" will become more commonplace. Its sad that Indian mind has to a great extent become like western mind in last few decades.
This is all feel good stuff. Read this

===
There were glaring asymmetries in the way India and China looked at each other, Perhaps as a result of Western scholarship, English educated Indians had developed an "orientalist" view of China. To Western scholars, the "Orient" or Asia was a cultural continuum, particularly because of the Buddhist connection. In the English educated Indian mind, however, it became "Indianisation" of China. This perspective gave a distorted picture of India's place in China's world-view.

In reality, Buddhism started on the periphery of the Chinese society and by the time it acquired a large number of adherents, it had become so transformed that it ceased to be Indian. Politically, Buddhism was strongly opposed by the Confucian mandarins who thought it subverted Chinese values. The much talked about "missions" were from and to the peripheries of both societies and by the early fifteenth century they had stopped altogether. But westernised consciousness in India took such contacts to be between nations.[11] Hence the myth of India and China being Asian sister-countries[12] a myth given currency not only by Nehru but many others.[13]

The Chinese communists also adopted the myth during the "bhai-bhai" days.[14] But their ancestors rarely ever showed any interest in India whatsoever except to acknowledge the remote origins of Buddhism in the "Western Heaven".[15] Until the early fifties, Chinese scholars had not produced a single work on India as a country.[16] "India" entered Chinese consciousness as the land from which soldiers of the British Indian Army came to loot and kill; it was from where opium came.[17] All state-to-state contacts were with British India where Indians were not the decision-makers.

They saw Indians in China as "zou gou" (running dogs) of the British. Through translated works, they came to know that Buddhism had disappeared from India, that India had first gone under Islamic rule and then western "barbarian" rule.[18] Public affairs, which were central to Chinese thinking, were mismanaged by Indians. Chinese thinkers when debating the Western challenge to China cited India as a negative example. They would deal with the West in their own way, decidedly not as India had done.[19]


The Nehru Years Revisited - Giri Deshingkar

===
 

W.G.Ewald

Defence Professionals/ DFI member of 2
Professional
Joined
Sep 28, 2011
Messages
14,139
Likes
8,594
Re: Known unknowns about Modi are catalysts for a reset Indo US relati

"Reset" has become just a buzzword anyway. Lets eliminate it altogether.
 

Hari Sud

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 31, 2012
Messages
3,775
Likes
8,502
Country flag
Re: Known unknowns about Modi are catalysts for a reset Indo US relati

US has demonized Modi first. Neither Katrina Lantos and her father are students of history. They have not learnt anything from their own. US killed 100,000 civilians under the guise of fighting the terrorists in Afghanistan. They went their to find one master mind, but instead ended up killing 100,000 Afghans who were dirt poor and no reason to fight the monster US. Concurrently 300,000 Iraqis are dead because US went to fight on behalf of a client Kuwait. None of these people would be dead, had Ms Lantos had looked at its own country's dealings with gun culture. All the dead 100,000 Afghans would be alive, had US had exerted enough military pressure on double crossing Pakistan. They had been behind Osma Bin Laden being kept alive in a Pakistan for thei own benefit.

Ms Latos being human rights provocateur in the name of protecting the weak has to question it's own government first of all these deaths in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Do not believe any none sense that Ms Lantos was acting of her own and discovering human rights violations all over the world including violations by his own home country. She was set up by the US State Department's Human Rights watch group, which is highly political group and sent against people they do not like. When Ms Lantos got her orders, it was Hillary Clinton in charge and Iraq and Afghan wars were at full swing. Hillary wished to divert attention from US own human rights violations of fighting two illegal wars, hence turned on Modi in India.

As I said US officials have very poor knowledge of people elsewhere and things happening. Provocation for riots in Gujrat was burning of a train by Muslim activists where 80 Hindus were burnt alive. Something was going to happen. Just as something was going to happen when one black citizen of America was beaten up by white cops in California. The whole black community rose up with arms up for a fight. Hindus could not let the culprits escape.

US has to rationalize its own thinking first. They wished to demonize Modi. They found half a dozen left leaning people of Indian origin in US who have rarely visited that country again and with the help of Congress Party in India, who was afraid that one day this super star from Gujarat will eclipse their dynastic rule manufactured evidence and provided that to the Human Rights group in US. the US State Department believed all that. That is why I say US diplomatic bureaucracy is very poorly qualified.

If I were Modi, I will mind all this. I will not relent until US provides an apology. Until then there is no need to shake hand with Obama or Kerry or Hillary or Nancy in US. They can come to India, if they wished.
 

Ray

The Chairman
Professional
Joined
Apr 17, 2009
Messages
43,132
Likes
23,835
Re: Known unknowns about Modi are catalysts for a reset Indo US relati

@Ray, and others

Generally, I enjoyed and was informed by this well-written piece by Kanwal Sibal, Foreign ties will blossom under the new Modi government (IDR, Courtesy: Mail, 20 May 2014); specifically, as to the COA (Course of Action) Mr Sibal suggests for Pres. Obama in regard to Mr Modi and the US DoS:



What think you all as to the likelihood of the WH and US DoS admitting error in the "Modi Matter" ?

Regards

Mike
First, let me start with a brief backgrounder, so as to understand the influences/ motivation/ events at play.

Kanwal Sibal, was a foreign secretary of India. He has right wing views, and is not one of the 'turn the other cheek' type of diplomats that India regularly churns i.e. the types that believes in ''neither here, nor there''. His article must be read from that perspective

That said, who is Modi? He continues to be an enigma, even to the Indian audience. But one thing India knows for sure is that Modi is his own man. And he is a sharp strategist, who asks for no quarters and gives none. This aspect has been well enunciated by a Minister of the last Govt, Jairam Ramesh, who was and is one of the bitterest critics of Modi. Ramesh has said yesterday:

"He has changed the nature of campaigning in India. It would be unwise to deny the change he has brought about in the nature of campaigning in India. We were not prepared for it,"
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...igning-Jairam-Ramesh/articleshow/35579573.cms
(you may like to read this article too to understand what hit India called Modi)

While it is fashionable in the international circles to demonise Modi as a far right wing Hindu maniac, yet, since it does not help those who project and tomtom this view, they fail to mention that in Gujarat, where he was the Chief Minister, he leashed the right wing forces and made them impotent, so to say. That is why Praveen Togadia, a virulent far right Hindu leader and International Working President of the Vishva Hindu Parishad, is miffed and is a leading Modi baiter, so much so, he tried to skew Modi's electoral campaign with pro HIndu sentiments that embarrassed the psyche of India that is prevalent today.

Unlike many Chief Ministers, Modi is constantly reinventing himself and is focused in rejuvenating whatever is in his charge. He has taken some very innovation measures in Gujarat that are noteworthy. The latest example of his not being shy to think out of the box is inviting the leaders of the SAARC countries for his inauguration as the Prime Minister - a first around this part of the world.

That he is not risk averse is proved by the fact that amongst those invited include the PM of Pakistan (not friendly to India in the best of times too) and Rajpakse of Sri Lanka, who is hated in Tamilnadu for the genocide of Sri Lankan Tamil is the last few days of the LTTE. Modi has taken this great 'risk', so to say, since the Tamils of Tamilnadu (some political parties are Modi's allies) are up in arms against this invite.

Even for the Cabinet formation, he is doing it without going through the usual procedure of having a Ministry that caters for all views, all communities, all religious groups and all diverse element, by going it his way. This is a dangerous and risky way in Indian politics, since giving Ministries is rewards for support given and support thereafter - buying loyalties.

In short, Modi wants, what Modi gets.

Therefore, given his character, his foreign policy will indicate that he has no compunction to 'prove' himself to the international community. He will do what he thinks is in India's interest.

The outgoing PM, the good man that he was, was a timid and meek man obsessed with having a friendly Pakistan. One can't blame him. He was born there and so nostalgia overcame reality. In some circles, it is said that some had given him hope that he was a Nobel Prize material if he pulled off this coup! That delusional haze clouded his foreign policy outlook wherein timidity and passivity with all countries became his byword for foreign policy. The Wonder Woman of Italian origin helped him on his way.

As far as the US is concerned, the US Embassy set up under Nancy Powell, has not helped the relations in any way. In fact, this dispensation has turned even the otherwise well disposed Indian public opinion toward the US, hostile; and I am not meaning the Govt alone, but the general public too!

From the geostrategic standpoint, both India and the US has common aims in many areas, but Kerry has been a disaster for the India US relations, possibly for good reasons of his own. Ever since he took charge, it has been a downhill slide. While it would be wrong of India to assume that the US must share wholeheartedly the Indian regional perspective, but Kerry's obsession to appease Pakistan and even turn a blind eye is remarkably odious and counterproductive to the Indo US relationship.

US policies are spurred by the entrepreneurial lobby, industrial and military. Therefore, no matter what political dispensation rules the roost in the White House or the Congress, the vast Indian market and big ticket military buys will force the events. This I have mentioned earlier in one of my posts. The possibility of Modi looking the US way is very bright, at least for big military buys because US leads the pack and India has to refurbish its military and raise it from the moth eaten state the last Govt has left it in because of their dithering and acting coy. Importing US technology is another space where Modi will be looking at for sure since US technology, especially in military and space is world class. And as a quid pro quo, India will have to open up her markets to the US.

It is for the US to realise this and act or else, Modi may look at Europe, especially Germany and France. He sure is looking towards Japan for sure since Shinzo Abe and he shares a very warm relationship.

The US must also realise the resurgence of Russia on the international scene. Russia is down, but definitely not out, given the manner in which Russia has handled the Crimean and now handling the Ukrainian issue. Therefore, the US must seize the opportunity and extend a more favourable view towards India, and more so, towards Modi, since he has proved that he is his own man with a mind of his own indicating pragmatism and not influenced by emotions. So, before he moves towards Russia, the US must act. Or else, one more chess piece the US will lose on this chessboard of international powerplay.

India requires US and US requires India. Both in different ways. But if the opportunity to seize the moment, then it maybe lost and lost forever.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

JMM99

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 19, 2014
Messages
105
Likes
173
Re: Known unknowns about Modi are catalysts for a reset Indo US relati

@ladder,

Though, I would like to give a piece of advice, to change the system of choosing your ambassadors, as in this case the tilt in the favor of Modi was amply visible from 2012. And any efforts to reach out to him then would have been more productive.

The same question of competence are being raised against your Thai ambassador, after the coup.
I agree with the questions of competence being raised vs Nancy Powell in India, and Kristie Kenney in Thailand. IMO: neither one of them can hold a candle to, e.g., Kanwal Sibal or Subrahmanyam Jaishankar, as professional foreign service officers.

Yet, both Powell (Wiki) and Kenney (Wiki) are professional foreign service officers; with Powell having had five ambassadorial appointments under the Clinton, Bush II and Obama administrations; and Kenney having had three ambassadorial appointments under the Bush II and Obama administrations - with both (Powell more so), in addition, holding high level staff offices at Foggy Bottom (DoS, Washington HQ).

When we look at some other USDoS "gems" inflicted on the World as "professional foreign service officers" - e.g., Wayne and Alicia May (see this page for examples of their "professionalism") - one might fairly infer that the USDoS is fundamentally flawed in its basic culture, which transcends changes in political administrations.

@ladder, I honestly don't know the fix to change the system - a local tidal wave through Foggy Bottom is not likely to happen; but I'd be more than happy to consider and discuss any suggestions you have.

Regards

Mike
 
Last edited by a moderator:

mattster

Respected Member
Senior Member
Joined
May 30, 2009
Messages
1,171
Likes
870
Country flag
Re: Known unknowns about Modi are catalysts for a reset Indo US relati

First, let me start with a brief backgrounder, so as to understand the influences/ motivation/ events at play.

Unlike many Chief Ministers, Modi is constantly reinventing himself and is focused in rejuvenating whatever is in his charge. He has taken some very innovation measures in Gujarat that are noteworthy. The latest example of his not being shy to think out of the box is inviting the leaders of the SAARC countries for his inauguration as the Prime Minister - a first around this part of the world.

That he is not risk averse is proved by the fact that amongst those invited include the PM of Pakistan (not friendly to India in the best of times too) and Rajpakse of Sri Lanka, who is hated in Tamilnadu for the genocide of Sri Lankan Tamil is the last few days of the LTTE. Modi has taken this great 'risk', so to say, since the Tamils of Tamilnadu (some political parties are Modi's allies) are up in arms against this invite.

Even for the Cabinet formation, he is doing it without going through the usual procedure of having a Ministry that caters for all views, all communities, all religious groups and all diverse element, by going it his way. This is a dangerous and risky way in Indian politics, since giving Ministries is rewards for support given and support thereafter - buying loyalties.

In short, Modi wants, what Modi gets.

Therefore, given his character, his foreign policy will indicate that he has no compunction to 'prove' himself to the international community. He will do what he thinks is in India's interest.

India requires US and US requires India. Both in different ways. But if the opportunity to seize the moment, then it maybe lost and lost forever.

Modi does not need to cater to every community or bloc in India by appointing leaders from those groups to represent minorities or whatever.

People in India are so sick of pathetic low-life incompetent politicians, that they only want someone who will deliver - regardless of what his race, community or religion he belongs to. Modi must know this.

He need to be pragmatic and move on. The classic example is the Sri Lanka and the LTTE saga.

The LTTE saga was a 30-year disaster for SL and its people including the Tamils.
There is no doubt a large block in Tamil Nadu that is still very sympathetic to these guys.
Sri Lanka needs time for its own internal "Reset".......time to heal the wounds of a 30 year civil war.

Modi needs to ignore the subsection of these TN LTTE sympathetizers, and move on with Indian Foreign policy with regards to Sri Lanka and be supportive of the effort as Sri Lanka tries to recover from this 30 year nightmare.
The previous congress government was too weak and too dependent on its TN coalitions to make that move.

India already has 2 neighbours that are perpetually aligned against it - it certainly does not need to make that number into 3.

One of the biggest issue for foreign countries including the US dealing with India is that India is so unsure in its strategic policy decision making. Its always trying to straddle the fence - it basically leaves foreign countries unsure of where it is headed.
Part of it has to do with weak coalition governments that dont have a mandate.

Hopefully Modi can change all that, and deliver the goods. People will not care what his religion or caste is if he succeeds,
 

Mad Indian

Proud Bigot
Senior Member
Joined
Jan 27, 2012
Messages
12,835
Likes
7,762
Country flag
Re: Known unknowns about Modi are catalysts for a reset Indo US relati

One of the biggest issue for foreign countries including the US dealing with India is that India is so unsure in its strategic policy decision making. Its always trying to straddle the fence - it basically leaves foreign countries unsure of where it is headed.
Part of it has to do with weak coalition governments that dont have a mandate

Yes it was onleee stupid Indians' fault with their coalition govt and shit. It has nothing to with the hypocritic US things like Visa denial to a democratically elected Chief Minister of a state and Devyani episode is due to stulid Indian coalition onleee:thumb::sarcastic:


Anyone who follows the US in it foreign policy will know that it does not want strong countries around the wworld and it is the same with India. A strong india is/was never in US interest as it question their sole super power status. Their strategy evry where is the same- turn neighbours against each and every one and make them constantly on each others throat- Ukraine for Russians, play China and India, play India and Pakiswines, play Pakis and afghans. The list would be endless.


Only top class morons would think US wants a strong India. What US actually wants is a lap dog much like UK, which is not too powerful that it would be out of US control.

India has the potential to become a country much more powerful than US wants it to be and it can achieve that without the US help which has a lot of baggage.

The Americans must be shown their place for needlessly medling into our affairs if Indians have any kind of self respect
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Mad Indian

Proud Bigot
Senior Member
Joined
Jan 27, 2012
Messages
12,835
Likes
7,762
Country flag
Re: Known unknowns about Modi are catalysts for a reset Indo US relati

US has demonized Modi first. Neither Katrina Lantos and her father are students of history. They have not learnt anything from their own. US killed 100,000 civilians under the guise of fighting the terrorists in Afghanistan. They went their to find one master mind, but instead ended up killing 100,000 Afghans who were dirt poor and no reason to fight the monster US. Concurrently 300,000 Iraqis are dead because US went to fight on behalf of a client Kuwait. None of these people would be dead, had Ms Lantos had looked at its own country's dealings with gun culture. All the dead 100,000 Afghans would be alive, had US had exerted enough military pressure on double crossing Pakistan. They had been behind Osma Bin Laden being kept alive in a Pakistan for thei own benefit.

Ms Latos being human rights provocateur in the name of protecting the weak has to question it's own government first of all these deaths in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Do not believe any none sense that Ms Lantos was acting of her own and discovering human rights violations all over the world including violations by his own home country. She was set up by the US State Department's Human Rights watch group, which is highly political group and sent against people they do not like. When Ms Lantos got her orders, it was Hillary Clinton in charge and Iraq and Afghan wars were at full swing. Hillary wished to divert attention from US own human rights violations of fighting two illegal wars, hence turned on Modi in India.

As I said US officials have very poor knowledge of people elsewhere and things happening. Provocation for riots in Gujrat was burning of a train by Muslim activists where 80 Hindus were burnt alive. Something was going to happen. Just as something was going to happen when one black citizen of America was beaten up by white cops in California. The whole black community rose up with arms up for a fight. Hindus could not let the culprits escape.

US has to rationalize its own thinking first. They wished to demonize Modi. They found half a dozen left leaning people of Indian origin in US who have rarely visited that country again and with the help of Congress Party in India, who was afraid that one day this super star from Gujarat will eclipse their dynastic rule manufactured evidence and provided that to the Human Rights group in US. the US State Department believed all that. That is why I say US diplomatic bureaucracy is very poorly qualified.

If I were Modi, I will mind all this. I will not relent until US provides an apology. Until then there is no need to shake hand with Obama or Kerry or Hillary or Nancy in US. They can come to India, if they wished.
I agree with you absolutely. Unless US apologies to Modi on public, Modi should never visit the US . US can go royally ---- itself with a cactus up their ass.

Modi should show to the entire world that You dont mess with India and can get away with it scott free
 

Razor

STABLE GENIUS
Senior Member
Joined
Feb 7, 2011
Messages
7,701
Likes
9,099
Country flag
Re: Known unknowns about Modi are catalysts for a reset Indo US relati

I agree with you absolutely. Unless US apologies to Modi on public, Modi should never visit the US . US can go royally ---- itself with a cactus up their ass.

Modi should show to the entire world that You dont mess with India and can get away with it scott free
Do you really think that'll happen. I mean, the only thing bigger than American debt is the ego that Amerik gov carries around.
 

Mad Indian

Proud Bigot
Senior Member
Joined
Jan 27, 2012
Messages
12,835
Likes
7,762
Country flag
Re: Known unknowns about Modi are catalysts for a reset Indo US relati

Do you really think that'll happen. I mean, the only thing bigger than American debt is the ego that Amerik gov carries around.
I am hoping they would not. In that case, Modi should never visit US. Foreign minister can do that for representing India in UN or US. Thats more than enough.


Besides if the US has so much ego to refuse to acknowledge their mistake, why should we forget it when we were the victim? Should Indian self respect be any smaller than American? Have we become lesser creatures than them?

I will maintain my stand that US can go ---- itself unless it delivers an apology


You dont beg for respect- you demand it!
 
Last edited:

pmaitra

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 10, 2009
Messages
33,262
Likes
19,594
Re: Known unknowns about Modi are catalysts for a reset Indo US relati

You dont beg for respect- you demand it!
Agree with most of the post, except this - respect should be commanded. Modi commands the respect of millions of Indians, and that is what should matter.

Modi can skip the UN. Instead, India should focus on strengthening it own position, by increasing in non-Dollar trade, and by restricting foreign influence and lobbyism in India. Once the centre of power shift to the east, with active cooperation from Russia and PRC, the west will come to its senses.

On the other hand, I think India needs to play a balancing game.

The US wants India to be a counter-weight to PRC, but it also wants Pakistan to be a counter-weight to India. India needs to weaken Pakistan, and that it can do by leveraging whatever is left of Israeli influence over the US. In the foreseeable future, we will see US and EU drifting away from Israel, and Israel requiring India as a counter to the elements in the Middle East.

India's focus should be to stabilize relations between Iran and Israel. We need both of them as friends.
 

Mad Indian

Proud Bigot
Senior Member
Joined
Jan 27, 2012
Messages
12,835
Likes
7,762
Country flag
Re: Known unknowns about Modi are catalysts for a reset Indo US relati

Agree with most of the post, except this - respect should be commanded.
Thats what I meant to say. Poor choice of words on my side. But I agree with everything you have said.

The time has come for western domination of world to end. That arrogant US can take its time to realize that and they will come to terms with it one way or the other. But we cant wait for them. Our destiny lies with making our country strong, with or without US.
 

Ray

The Chairman
Professional
Joined
Apr 17, 2009
Messages
43,132
Likes
23,835
Re: Known unknowns about Modi are catalysts for a reset Indo US relati

A window of opportunity

Geo-strategically, some of the big issues that confront the United States today, China, Pakistan, and the shaping of the post-2014 transition in Afghanistan, all happen to be in India's periphery. A more rapid expansion of India's economy can accelerate the creation of a common economic space in South Asia

India's weak economic performance, the 2008 financial crisis and the economic downturn in the United States have all diminished the India-U.S. relationship in recent years, after the two countries had come a long way together since the 1950s. When I arrived in Philadelphia in early April, Prof. Surjit Mansingh — once an Indian Foreign Service officer and now teaching at the American University — ruefully said, "Nothing can be expected from a U.S. government that has relegated South Asia, India included, to the strategic unimportance it had during the Cold War." While the two governments remained somewhat somnambulant, business and industry leaders and the Indian-American community, the other drivers of the relationship, became dormant too. Extricating it from the depth it has sunk will be no easy task.

Consonance of interests

Post-election, there has been a visible change in the outlook of experts on India within think tanks, universities and the beltway in Washington DC. There is a sense that India's destiny depends not just on economic progress; it also needs governance that has a social vocation, public institutions that are accountable, and a society that is tolerant and secular. From Prime Minister Narendra Modi's statements, they hope he might turn out to be different from how he has been portrayed by the Opposition. They believe it is time to re-engage with an India that is energised, self-confident, and which will grow faster under a new government.

On his part, Mr. Modi has set aside the personal affront of his visa blacklisting. Declaring that national interest is higher than individuals, he has committed himself to work for improved India-U.S. ties. He fought the election on an agenda of development, for which India needs markets, investments and technology. For India, the U.S. remains the prime source of all three.

Geo-strategically, some of the big issues that confront the U.S. today, China, Pakistan, and the shaping of the post-2014 transition in Afghanistan, all happen to be in India's periphery. A more rapid expansion of India's economy can accelerate the creation of a common economic space in South Asia. Such an India can better contribute to the design of the currently absent security architecture in Asia and the Indo-Pacific. India's contribution to stabilising the subcontinent, underwriting its integration and development through its own growth, and investment in building regional infrastructure and connectivity, as also India's growing role in protecting maritime routes in the Indian Ocean, all benefit the U.S too.

Defence preparedness

Besides the economy, India's focus externally will be on improving relations with the contiguous countries, including China. Given our experience since Independence, this also requires better defence preparedness, for which the relationship with the U.S. will be critical in the years ahead.

So far, India's major military platforms, including some still being developed, have come from Russia. The two countries have enjoyed a special relationship for several decades and this must be preserved and nurtured. The inept U.S. handling of its ties with Russia has cemented Sino-Russian strategic relations in a way that India's preferential customer status of Russian defence supplies is now imperilled. India might not be able to rely indefinitely on exclusive or favoured treatment from Russia vis-à-vis China.

During his just concluded visit to Beijing, Russian President Vladimir Putin said Russia-China relations were "at the highest level in history." The Skovorodino-Mohe pipeline project worth over $60 billion in investment, and nearly half a trillion dollars in overall value over three decades, is about to roll. In his phone-in-interview on April 17, available on his website, President Putin said Russia and China are neighbours and "allies," and that, with China, Russia has "never had such trust based relations in the military industry." Earlier, this year, Kommersant, a Moscow trade paper reported that Mr. Putin had given his assent for a deal to sell China — over the objections of his general staff — the state-of-the-art S-400 missile system, capable of shooting down all "enemy aerial targets that are known today." Talks are at an advanced stage for sale of Su-35 fighter aircraft to China. Meanwhile, Russia itself is buying higher quality military platforms, such as the Mistral helicopter carriers from France.

India might, therefore, need to diversify its defence procurement further. On offer from the U.S, among other equipment, is the 'Javelin,' said to be among the best available crew fired anti-tank weaponry, as also the co-development and manufacture of the next generation of such missiles, long-range surface-to-air missiles, and the next generation naval gun. An even more pressing need for India is to raise the level of technology domestication in the defence industry, for which a tweaking of the offset policy and increasing the cap on foreign direct investment (FDI) in defence to nurture joint ventures might lead to a breakthrough in an area that have confounded India's efforts at indigenisation so far.

Another area where constructive India-U.S. ties will have a positive impact is on India's other external relationships. Until 15 years ago, India-U.S. exchanges were confined largely to bilateral issues. When on the Americas Desk in the Ministry of External Affairs (MEA) between 2001 and 2004, I saw the start of multiple India-U.S. dialogues, on East Asia, the rise of China, the Association of Southeast Asian Nations (ASEAN) and Indonesia, the situation in the Gulf and the Middle East, and a range of multilateral and global issues. Other great powers quickly took notice and followed suit by pursuing similar conversations.

As the India-U.S. relationship gathered momentum, and an accord with the U.S. on peaceful uses of nuclear energy began taking shape, not perhaps as a consequence of but certainly as a sequel to it — there has been a spate of small successes in India's interactions internationally. A case in point is the agreement with China in 2005 on the "Political Parameters and Guiding Principles for the Settlement of the India-China Boundary Question." It was arguably the sole, significant success of the 17th round of talks of the Special Representatives negotiating the India-China boundary. This came when India's global importance was at a high point, with flourishing relations with Russia, the U.S., the European Union, key European countries, and the start of warming relations with Japan. That traction in India's external engagement was lost concurrently with India-U.S. relations losing steam, especially over the past five years.

The instruments of revival

For a revival in relations, the onus is on the U.S. side. The challenge would be how to do it. Mr. Modi has had the least contact with U.S. leaders, compared to those of Russia, China and Japan, and not of his own volition. U.S President Barack Obama has reached out to Mr. Modi by doing what other world leaders have done, but that is not enough.

The right mechanics must be harnessed in cranking up a cold motor — for starters, a new U.S. Ambassador in New Delhi. It appears that the eminent personalities who have been sounded out, such as the U.S. Exim Bank chairman/president, Fred Hochberg, do not want it with a lame duck presidency behind them. As of now, there is more than an even chance that in the coming Congressional elections, the Republicans will gain a narrow majority in the Senate, foreclosing presidential initiatives that do not have bipartisan support.

India's well-wishers in Washington DC are urging the President to send out an envoy soon to confer with India's new leadership. The obvious choice for this, U.S. Secretary of State, John Kerry, might not find enthusiastic resonance in New Delhi. Bill Burns, the Deputy Secretary of State, is leaving at the end of summer. A more inspired choice, some have suggested, might be Vice-President Biden, who knows India better than President Obama does. That might also indicate that the White House is taking back the India account from the State Department.

On India's side, the most categorical step to revive its global standing, including with the U.S., would be to get the engine of the Indian economy roaring again. In today's world, economic heft is the booster rocket of foreign policy.

In discussions in New Delhi, both in South Block and outside, there is often a debate on whether the India-U.S. story should be strategic or transactional. When times are difficult, there is nothing wrong with a give-and-take approach, a prudent and practical engagement that looks at the relative costs and benefits and eschews normative arguments. The congruence of interests of India and the U.S. is self-evident. So also is the current hiatus in the relationship. There is a window of opportunity to resuscitate it now.

(Jayant Prasad is a former diplomat and currently a visiting scholar at the Center for the Advanced Study of India, University of Pennsylvania.)

A window of opportunity - The Hindu
 

Razor

STABLE GENIUS
Senior Member
Joined
Feb 7, 2011
Messages
7,701
Likes
9,099
Country flag
Re: Known unknowns about Modi are catalysts for a reset Indo US relati

I am hoping they would not. In that case, Modi should never visit US. Foreign minister can do that for representing India in UN or US. Thats more than enough.


Besides if the US has so much ego to refuse to acknowledge their mistake, why should we forget it when we were the victim? Should Indian self respect be any smaller than American? Have we become lesser creatures than them?

I will maintain my stand that US can go ---- itself unless it delivers an apology



You dont beg for respect- you demand it!
Come on now MI, a lot of USA sycophants on the forum will be pissed off with you now. :lol:
And I don't think an apology from the US will come, they'll wiggle their way out of it.
And frankly I don't care about an apology. I think the US is embarrassing itself with its BS policies.
Also as long as India is weak, an apology from the US means nothing.
JMT.
 

trackwhack

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 20, 2011
Messages
3,757
Likes
2,590
Re: Known unknowns about Modi are catalysts for a reset Indo US relati

@Ray,

Given India's tidal wave election, Mr Modi should have a great degree of freedom of action in setting the stage for India's future foreign relations with major powers, including the US. With respect to the US, he does not have to make any sudden moves and can proceed with deliberate speed, sizing up the reaction of the present USG to his electoral success. He also has to take into account (and one can be reasonably assured that he will) that a substantial segment of the present USG has a negative regard for Mr Modi.

The "poster child" for the anti-Modi segment of the present USG is Katrina Lantos Swett, daughter of Tom Lantos (also father of the US "human trafficking" legislation which underlay the prosecution of Ms Khobragade). She presently leads the Lantos Foundation for Human Rights & Justice - whose 2013 Human Rights Prize winner was Hillary Rodham Clinton (currently the leading candidate for the 2016 Democratic presidential nomination). Ms Swett, although herself an unsuccessful political candidate, has been a faithful member of both the West Coast and East Coast Democratic, left-progressive establishments (e.g., Sens. Feinstein, Boxer, Schumer, Gillibrand; the Clintons and the Cuomos).

Ms Lantos-Swett's campaign against Mr Modi has gone on for years; and has been mounted from her position as a USCIRF Commissioner (United States Commission on International Religious Freedom; see her link to her USCIRF statements from 2012). She was re-appointed to that position 11 Apr 2014, together with two other commissioners who have joined with her, Mary Ann Glendon and Dr. M. Zuhdi Jasser (USCIRF link). Here are several of her statements on Mr Modi from 2013-2014:



Ms Lantos-Swett (and her allies) are not likely to be swayed by arguments contrary to their ideology.

Now we can wait for the results of our Nov congressional elections; although currently, a serious wave election doesn't seem that likely to me - e.g., Gallup, Democratic Party Still Seen More Favorably Than GOP; Both parties face "upside down" net favorable ratings (May 16, 2014):



This poll has an interesting discussion of "favorable-unfavorable" ratings in US politics, beyond the bottom line quoted above.

Regards

Mike
Hello Mike,

Its nice to see a well researched US poster. Thats a rarity. I would like to point out to you that Narendra Modi is the only person to ever be denied a visa under the Immigration Act provision which denies entry to people who have infringed on religious freedoms. Not one other single person from the entire planet has been denied a visa based on that particular provision.

In my personal opinion, India has nothing to gain from a waning power like the United States. So Modi can afford to completely ignore the US during his entire first term. He should also tell Raghuram Rajan to stop hoarding the worthless dollar so that the rupee appreciates enough to bring our fuel prices under control.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Mad Indian

Proud Bigot
Senior Member
Joined
Jan 27, 2012
Messages
12,835
Likes
7,762
Country flag
Re: Known unknowns about Modi are catalysts for a reset Indo US relati

Come on now MI, a lot of USA sycophants on the forum will be pissed off with you now. :lol:
And I don't think an apology from the US will come, they'll wiggle their way out of it.
And frankly I don't care about an apology. I think the US is embarrassing itself with its BS policies.
Also as long as India is weak, an apology from the US means nothing.
JMT.
I think Obama administration meeds to be credited for opening our eyes to the actual US nature. Here is to hoping that history glorifies Obama for bringing the otherwise gullible Indian populace to its senses regarding US-India relationship:laugh:

Anyway, 10 yrs of Modi as PM is more than enough for Indian story to be recognised around the world. But three to four decades of good govt(center right) can make India the strongest nation in the world:india:
 

Latest Replies

Global Defence

New threads

Articles

Top