IS IWI GALIL ACE GOING TO BE STANDARD RIFIL FOR INDIAN SOILDER?

[sreenevasachha]

Please discuss about pros and cons of GALIL ACE gun

 

[Rchauhan]

IWI Tavor has also been launched in 7.62x51 Cal ...... I guess that will also be considered .....Do You know the Price diffrence between ACE and a Tavor ?

 

[Raj Malhotra]

Piece of outdated junk.....................

 

[Johny_Baba]

This is third time i'm writing about Galil Ace.

See,Galil ACE is nothing but overglorified Kalashnikov that is available with modern features (mainly,rails).What Israelis did with it is,They took normal Galil,Cut off lower receiver section a little bit (Where mainly magazine sits) and changed it with polymer one so same Receiver block can be used in various caliber variants - just change the polymer section in receiver to make it accept different magazines (of different calibers) and THIS is what i found praiseworthy about the ACE.

Apart from that,Everything else is more or less 'expected' from a modern combat rifle.
-It has typical Galil style thumb fire selector at Left side of the gun and on right side it has a kalashnikov style selector that reciprocates with the former,though this one is shortened compared to older one.Hence,technically it has Ambidextrous fire selector.
-Charging handle is of typical reciprocating type,but a big change from older Galil is,they removed it from right side to left side and closed that infamous charging handle slot with dust cover,while on the other side a spring loaded trapdor is provided that opens and closes with backward and foreward movement of charging handle,Taken directly from later variant of Micro-Galil.This one keeps the gun practically sealed compared to other Kalashnikov variants but i would have liked that rubberised cover more (from SG550 series of firearms) than this one.Nevertheless,a good idea.
-I read somewhere that the trigger group on this one is not taken from older Galils but from Galatz Sniper rifle.Now,I dunno which one is better so this is just an information i'm sharing with you guys.
-IWI experts have added a polymer buffer pading at the end of recoil spring that dampens excessive recoil during backward movement of bolt carrier group (i.e. firing).I have a bad feeling about this,as if it gets damaged because of excessive usage and gets stuck inside critical parts of the weapon (mainly trigger group,as it is placed directly above it),it may create malfunctions.
-Barrel is,as per IWI advertised 'Cold Hammer Forged with Chromium inlining at riflings'.Dunno what is rifling twist rate and other things.Has a muzzle brake and as per advertised can be used with various suppressors and other muzzle atrachments.
-Some variants are provided with Bolt Catch (mainly the variants that accepts 5.56 STANAG and 7.62 SR-25 type magazines which have those followers that can actuate bolt catch).This is definitely a good idea.
-Gas Piston on ACE is similar to older variant,it has some lugs on its circular periphery that acts as Stabilisers during reloading operation.A good idea borrowed from older Galil which she took from Valmet Series of Rifles.
-Gas tube on this one is not locked on receiver via any mean,hence it falls off from the gun during disassembly,taken from Galil.Now,i think the israelis wanted to make it simple to take the gas tube off as many kalashnikovs have very stiff gas tubes.
-Bolt is very much kalashnikov type bolt with two locking lugs and a bullet extractor on face with a slot provided for ejector (it is fixed on receiver) and at centre a firing pin sits inside the hollow section of bolt via a retaining pin.
This whole thing is inserted into kalashnikov style Bolt Carrier (on this one it has some metal scrapped off on right side,mainly to make it lighter).
Barrel is inserted into a trunnion which also act as guide for bolt to locking in place during the cycling operation.
Phew ,No matter what people say,internals of kalashnikov are not that simple to explain.
-Furniture on Galil ACE: Buttstock ia adjustable in length as well as foldable on right side.It has provision to accept a proprietory cheek piece attachment on it.Though it also has a unique cylindrical profile so typical aftermarket M4 style stocks cannot be used with it.Same goes for Pistol Grip,as it is also part of lower polymer section of receiver.Though Front Handguards are removable and can be replaced with aftermarket ones.
-As for Sights,it has typical Aperature type iron sights at its back with two peeps (300m and 600m) with a front sight post on Gas Block.Sights have provision to insert Tritium Sights for night firing operations.
Apart from that,Unique Selling Point of ACE is its distinguishable Full Length Top Rails and 3-6-9 rails under the detachable covers of Handguard.Though,i'm not quite sure how much it retains Zero on a Optic,specially a Magnifying Optic.
-Several Quick Detachable Sling Points are provided on the gun.

Hence this is what Galil ACE is.Some features on it are quite praiseworthy but others are pretty much what one can expect from a modern combat rifle.
I WONDER WHY OUR CHAPS AT DRDO AND OFB DON'T MAKE SOMETHING SUCH GOOD AS ACE

Anyway,This is how i'd like to see our desi kalashnikovs (INSAS and Excaliburs) developed into.

 

[sreenevasachha]

name and specifications of above gun?

Sent from my SM-J200G using Tapatalk

 

[sreenevasachha]

seems to be ideal for army

 

[Doc Mozart]

This is third time i'm writing about Galil Ace.

See,Galil ACE is nothing but overglorified Kalashnikov that is available with modern features (mainly,rails).What Israelis did with it is,They took normal Galil,Cut off lower receiver section a little bit (Where mainly magazine sits) and changed it with polymer one so same Receiver block can be used in various caliber variants - just change the polymer section in receiver to make it accept different magazines (of different calibers) and THIS is what i found praiseworthy about the ACE.

Apart from that,Everything else is more or less 'expected' from a modern combat rifle.
-It has typical Galil style thumb fire selector at Left side of the gun and on right side it has a kalashnikov style selector that reciprocates with the former,though this one is shortened compared to older one.Hence,technically it has Ambidextrous fire selector.
-Charging handle is of typical reciprocating type,but a big change from older Galil is,they removed it from right side to left side and closed that infamous charging handle slot with dust cover,while on the other side a spring loaded trapdor is provided that opens and closes with backward and foreward movement of charging handle,Taken directly from later variant of Micro-Galil.This one keeps the gun practically sealed compared to other Kalashnikov variants but i would have liked that rubberised cover more (from SG550 series of firearms) than this one.Nevertheless,a good idea.
-I read somewhere that the trigger group on this one is not taken from older Galils but from Galatz Sniper rifle.Now,I dunno which one is better so this is just an information i'm sharing with you guys.
-IWI experts have added a polymer buffer pading at the end of recoil spring that dampens excessive recoil during backward movement of bolt carrier group (i.e. firing).I have a bad feeling about this,as if it gets damaged because of excessive usage and gets stuck inside critical parts of the weapon (mainly trigger group,as it is placed directly above it),it may create malfunctions.
-Barrel is,as per IWI advertised 'Cold Hammer Forged with Chromium inlining at riflings'.Dunno what is rifling twist rate and other things.Has a muzzle brake and as per advertised can be used with various suppressors and other muzzle atrachments.
-Some variants are provided with Bolt Catch (mainly the variants that accepts 5.56 STANAG and 7.62 SR-25 type magazines which have those followers that can actuate bolt catch).This is definitely a good idea.
-Gas Piston on ACE is similar to older variant,it has some lugs on its circular periphery that acts as Stabilisers during reloading operation.A good idea borrowed from older Galil which she took from Valmet Series of Rifles.
-Gas tube on this one is not locked on receiver via any mean,hence it falls off from the gun during disassembly,taken from Galil.Now,i think the israelis wanted to make it simple to take the gas tube off as many kalashnikovs have very stiff gas tubes.
-Bolt is very much kalashnikov type bolt with two locking lugs and a bullet extractor on face with a slot provided for ejector (it is fixed on receiver) and at centre a firing pin sits inside the hollow section of bolt via a retaining pin.
This whole thing is inserted into kalashnikov style Bolt Carrier (on this one it has some metal scrapped off on right side,mainly to make it lighter).
Barrel is inserted into a trunnion which also act as guide for bolt to locking in place during the cycling operation.
Phew ,No matter what people say,internals of kalashnikov are not that simple to explain.
-Furniture on Galil ACE: Buttstock ia adjustable in length as well as foldable on right side.It has provision to accept a proprietory cheek piece attachment on it.Though it also has a unique cylindrical profile so typical aftermarket M4 style stocks cannot be used with it.Same goes for Pistol Grip,as it is also part of lower polymer section of receiver.Though Front Handguards are removable and can be replaced with aftermarket ones.
-As for Sights,it has typical Aperature type iron sights at its back with two peeps (300m and 600m) with a front sight post on Gas Block.Sights have provision to insert Tritium Sights for night firing operations.
Apart from that,Unique Selling Point of ACE is its distinguishable Full Length Top Rails and 3-6-9 rails under the detachable covers of Handguard.Though,i'm not quite sure how much it retains Zero on a Optic,specially a Magnifying Optic.
-Several Quick Detachable Sling Points are provided on the gun.

Hence this is what Galil ACE is.Some features on it are quite praiseworthy but others are pretty much what one can expect from a modern combat rifle.
I WONDER WHY OUR CHAPS AT DRDO AND OFB DON'T MAKE SOMETHING SUCH GOOD AS ACE

Anyway,This is how i'd like to see our desi kalashnikovs (INSAS and Excaliburs) developed into.

Since your answer brilliantly summarizes the characteristics of the ace as well as its familiarity with the Kalashnikov and seeing the way army loves their kalashnikovs, it doesn't seem too far fetch to think that ace might be the front runner in the race for the army's battle rifle requirement after all.

 

[sthf]

Pros:

Lightweight, accurate, reliable, relatively cheap.

Part of a family which can effectively fulfill the 5.56 carbine and 7.62×39 rifle requirements of IA, RR, Assam rifles, CAPFs among others.

IWI/Punj Lloyd can become one stop shop for IA and therefore can get a better deal. Negev NG7 did win the LMG tender only to be canned.

Same goes for the optics.

Cons:

Great in its own right but not the best out there. There are better rifles out there.

 

[Shaitan]

There are two rifles being looked into for this years emergency small arms procurement, correct?

These two?

Fill me in please?

 

[sthf]

Retraining world's largest infantry to use bullpups doesn't sound good.

 

[devhensh]

I'll go out on one limb, and predict that the Galil Ace (7.62x51mm) will be selected by IA over Tavor 7....

My reasons are, The Galil Ace is simply the most reliable modern platform and it's has a big track record of being in service with many countries.....

It's an evolution rather than a revolutionary design, where they have taken the proven AK firing mechanism and have added all other modern features required in a service rifle...The spring loaded dust cover practically seals this gun against sand, snow and mud.....

Tavor 7 is a good rifle , but two things go against it. First it's a Bullpup(not preferred for normal Infantry and that too in 7.62x51 )....secondly, it's a completely new design with no track record(Tavor 7 is short stroke piston whereas the normal Tavors are long stroke like AKs)

The article below, is the best, i have seen about Galil reliability....and Indian army has to operate in one of the toughest operating conditions in world (mountains, deserts, swamps, sea etc)

http://www.theakforum.net/forums/14...eather-rifle-testing-alaska-s-p-pdf-link.html

 

[nongaddarliberal]

I'll go out on one limb, and predict that the Galil Ace (7.62x51mm) will be selected by IA over Tavor 7....

My reasons are, The Galil Ace is simply the most reliable modern platform and it's has a big track record of being in service with many countries.....

It's an evolution rather than a revolutionary design, where they have taken the proven AK firing mechanism and have added all other modern features required in a service rifle...The spring loaded dust cover practically seals this gun against sand, snow and mud.....

Tavor 7 is a good rifle , but two things go against it. First it's a Bullpup(not preferred for normal Infantry and that too in 7.62x51 )....secondly, it's a completely new design with no track record(Tavor 7 is short stroke piston whereas the normal Tavors are long stroke like AKs)

The article below, is the best, i have seen about Galil reliability....and Indian army has to operate in one of the toughest operating conditions in world (mountains, deserts, swamps, sea etc)

http://www.theakforum.net/forums/14...eather-rifle-testing-alaska-s-p-pdf-link.html

Galil? I would rather prefer if they adopted the domestic 7.62x51 rifle. I dont see why we cant make something like Galil at home. If they were going for something like Scar, or HK 417, I would understand.

 

[devhensh]

Galil? I would rather prefer if they adopted the domestic 7.62x51 rifle. I dont see why we cant make something like Galil at home. If they were going for something like Scar, or HK 417, I would understand.

I am myself a big supporter of domestic arms adoption....

But the question being asked in this post was, out of the two rifles mentioned, which one will the Army choose....also it was mentioned that IA has already shortlisted these two.....so i answered the specific question with specific answer !

 

[soikot banerjee]

I am myself a big supporter of domestic arms adoption....

But the question being asked in this post was, out of the two rifles mentioned, which one will the Army choose....also it was mentioned that IA has already shortlisted these two.....so i answered the specific question with specific answer !

No it was "Guess Tweet" NO FIREARMS IS SELECTED UNTIL TENDER ARE FLOATED. GOVERMENT IS NOT PAYING OFB FOR NO REASONS TO DEVELOPE 7.62*51 which are to be tested in may, if army has already selected also why would they continue with the trials of OFB gun if they have alrwady selected.

 

[devhensh]

No it was "Guess Tweet" NO FIREARMS IS SELECTED UNTIL TENDER ARE FLOATED. GOVERMENT IS NOT PAYING OFB FOR NO REASONS TO DEVELOPE 7.62*51 which are to be tested in may, if army has already selected also why would they continue with the trials of OFB gun if they have alrwady selected.

To me atleast the PRIMARY objective is that the Indian Army Jawans get the BEST assault rifle in the world and everything else is secondary......

So let there be a fair trail WHERE THE OFB 7.62X51 COMPETES AGAINST THE REST AND LET THE BEST RIFLE BE SELECTED !!!

 

[Shaitan]

Both foreign and domestic designs will b inducted.

 

[shankyz]

Vietman already producing Israeli GALIL ACE & about to manufacture Russian OSV sniper rifles domestically @ its Z111 plant.

Time for India to move fast ...

 

[tharun]

My vote for FN FNC.
We can copy it easily and reduce the weight and change the materials used.
My last pick will be ACE.

 

[rkhanna]

Aside from the AR/Carbine I would like to see more 7.62 Crew Served Weapons. The NEGEV GPMG could be seen as a good replacement to our PKMs

 

[Trololo]

My vote is strongly for MCIWS. Had the DRDO been pushed hard in the last 2 years MCIWS would have been rolling out of the OFB shop floors by now.