INSAS Indian Small Arms System

[Tamil_Canuck]

Insas is a excellent rifle, I have used it many time and i never got any complains..
But Insas replacement can only be Insas, Perhaps a new bullpup variant..

how does it perform in FIBUA operations ?
I can only imagine how horrible it must be doing a gunfighter stance with a 4.1kg rifle

 

[Kunal Biswas]

so why is IA asking for replacement ? is weight an issue ?

Insas is good rifle, but it need to be update with time for example its fiber colour also the quality is a major concerns in Army, Weight is just fine!
Also recent experience with Bullpup tavor, Army in interested with bullpup types!

I can only imagine how horrible it must be doing a gunfighter stance with a 4.1kg rifle

Our soldiers done things with FN-FAL ( 8kgs ), Insas is around 4 kgs with 20rnds is not a big issue!

 

[AJSINGH]

Insas is good rifle, but it need to be update with time for example its fiber colour also the quality is a major concerns in Army, Weight is just fine!
Also recent experience with Bullpup tavor, Army in interested with bullpup types!

so basically what IA is saying is that we need upgraded rifle , then i think it is fair enough on the part of IA to demand new weapons ,as any weapon platform becomes obsolete

 

[Tamil_Canuck]

Our soldiers done things with FN-FAL ( 8kgs ), Insas is around 4 kgs with 20rnds is not a big issue!

FN FAL is 4.3 Kg...I'm guessing you haven't taken any Urban Ops courses. If you do you will definitely see how weight and barrel lengths are vital when stacking up and clearing rooms.

my 2cents.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

FN FAL is 4.3 Kg...I'm guessing you haven't taken any Urban Ops courses. If you do you will definitely see how weight and barrel lengths are vital when stacking up and clearing rooms.

my 2cents.

Personally i have used FAL twice and i was very impressed with its firepower but dissaponted with its weight, it was way heavy than Insas, Also it had a bad reputation in IPKF Srilanka ( Length and semi auto ) also a proved a prob in CT operation, The long barrel is heavy also take twice the time to move compare to short Insas and AK-47s..

Indian FAL are of wooden furniture and have metal mag its total weight with mag is around 7-8kgs..

 

[Logan]

It's well understood that India has the merit to develop a better assault rifle than INSAS ,,also with due respect to INSAS which some people consider to be a decent assault rifle I do not think it has a good bulid quality to be at par with international standards.DRDO surely has tried to deliver better alteratives to the INSAS but has failed repeatedly and i don't think just for the 'Made in INDIA' tag the Army will want to induct a DRDO product if it is operationally unsatisfactory because as far as i know the Excalibur was rejected due to it's loud noise and huge muzzle flash.
So finally it comes down to,the point that if the indian Army is in urgrnt need for modification and upgradation then foreign made assault rifles are the only choice at hand.However if it chooses to wait till the multicalibur weapon comes out which may take ages going by the trackrecord then no problem.
But we all want a better equipped IA dont we??

 

[Kunal Biswas]

It's well understood that India has the merit to develop a better assault rifle than INSAS ,,also with due respect to INSAS which some people consider to be a decent assault rifle

I can assure u that regular Army units i know are all happy with Insas!

I do not think it has a good bulid quality to be at par with international standards

I agree but its not that bad quality!, still its very reliable and have good accurate rifle specially in Infantry units..

DRDO surely has tried to deliver better alteratives to the INSAS but has failed repeatedly

I call them varient but not a replacement!

and i don't think just for the 'Made in INDIA' tag the Army will want to induct a DRDO product if it is operationally unsatisfactory because as far as i know the Excalibur was rejected due to it's loud noise and huge muzzle flash.

Excalibur is meant for SF and its not a exact call for SF not because of its noice or muzzle flash but also its length!

So finally it comes down to,the point that if the indian Army is in urgrnt need for modification and upgradation

Their is no urgency its media crap!

But we all want a better equipped IA dont we??

Buying a 5.56mm Western rifle is expensive compare to home made good assault rifle.

 

[Tamil_Canuck]

Insas is good rifle, but it need to be update with time for example its fiber colour also the quality is a major concerns in Army, Weight is just fine!
Also recent experience with Bullpup tavor, Army in interested with bullpup types!


Our soldiers done things with FN-FAL ( 8kgs ), Insas is around 4 kgs with 20rnds is not a big issue!

I can guarantee you no FN FAL weights 8kg. 4kg is a issue its damn heavy an M4 weights 2.7 kg and INSAS weights 4.25kg almost double.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

I can guarantee you no FN FAL weights 8kg. 4kg is a issue its damn heavy an M4 weights 2.7 kg and INSAS weights 4.25kg almost double.

I dont know about M4 but Insas was just fine with me and most of the Units i know, the fal was twice as heavy as Insas i had!
Btw, what is the effective range of M4?

 

[Tamil_Canuck]

I dont know about M4 but Insas was just fine with me and most of the Units i know, the fal was twice as heavy as Insas i had!
Btw, what is the effective range of M4?

500 meters compared with INSAS 450 meters.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

500 meters compared with INSAS 450 meters.

Strange!
Insas have a longer barrel 464mm where as M4 have 368 mm, how come it can archive 500m?

slightly inferior ballistic performance compared to the full-size M16, with its nearly 6" (15 cm) longer barrel. This becomes most apparent at ranges of 300 yards and beyond.

Means +300m and after that bullet start to drop!

 

[Tamil_Canuck]

Strange!
Insas have a longer barrel 464mm where as M4 have 368 mm, how come it can archive 500m?

Means +300m and after that bullet start to drop!

Yes it has to do with the rifling twist rate I believe don't quote me on this but m16 is 1:7 inches while m4 is 1:12inches.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Yes it has to do with the rifling twist rate I believe don't quote me on this but m16 is 1:7 inches while m4 is 1:12inches.

Whatever, Still Insas is a good quality rifle with good accuracy using ss109, Mostly Insas is very effective at long ranges..
And Army units are quite happy with the rifle!

 

[Tamil_Canuck]

Whatever, Still Insas is a good quality rifle with good accuracy using ss109, Mostly Insas is very effective at long ranges..
And Army units are quite happy with the rifle!

This article says otherwise http://www1.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/1759706828.cms

So does this

http://news.indiamart.com/news-analysis/indo-nepal-war-of-wo-10160.html

 

[Kunal Biswas]

This article says otherwise http://www1.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/1759706828.cms Aug 13, 2001, 11.20pm IST

So does this

http://news.indiamart.com/news-analysis/indo-nepal-war-of-wo-10160.html

It was found that some of the guns did not fire because the soldiers had not wiped off the grease the factory had coated them with to prevent rust. The team test-fired 400 rounds continuously during the demonstration without hitch.

According to defence experts, the Royal Nepalese Army suffers from lack of training and motivation.

While in India, soldiers are given battle training for 12-14 months, in Nepal rookies get only five months training.

During the Khara battle, the Army used INSAS rifles. Though the attack lasted for nearly 15 hours, the rifles did not get heated or malfunction.

1st Article is outdated almost by a decade!
2nd Aricle itself proved Insas is reliable!

I have mentioned about Insas popularity on my own experience!
Besides that Anyone fired Insas is happy with its performance.

 

[Tamil_Canuck]

1st Article is outdated almost by a decade!
2nd Aricle itself proved Insas is reliable!

I have mentioned about Insas popularity on my own experience!
Besides that Anyone fired Insas is happy with its performance.

Let me tell you from experience there is a difference between firing a weapon few times and actually mastering the weapon.
doing section,platoon,company attacks with them; living with it, doing drill with it, carrying it around for days and days soaking it with mud and dirt.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Let me tell you from experience there is a difference between firing a weapon few times and actually mastering the weapon.
doing section,platoon,company attacks with them; living with it, doing drill with it, carrying it around for days and days soaking it with mud and dirt.

Exactly that is what Indian Army do..
In siachen 18,875 ft under extrem cold, In Northeast wettest tropical zone in country Average annual rainfall 10.31 inches, In rajasthan under extrem heat 24°- 26°C during summer and between 4° - 10°C, during winter..

And Insas works just fine..

 

[Tamil_Canuck]

Exactly that is what Indian Army do..
In siachen 18,875 ft under extrem cold, In Northeast wettest tropical zone in country Average annual rainfall 10.31 inches, In rajasthan under extrem heat 24°- 26°C during summer and between 4° - 10°C, during winter..

And Insas works just fine..

I think your national pride is clouding you're mind, are you in the Indian military as a Infantryman if you are I'll take your word for it no rebuttal, if not there are plenty of articles against your claims

 

[tarunraju]

Everyone with the maroon username like yours is a military professional. We even have Maj Gen rank officers from the Indian Army on DFI.

 

[Tamil_Canuck]

Everyone with the maroon username like yours is a military professional. We even have Maj Gen rank officers from the Indian Army on DFI.

yes but an admiral of the navy would have no clue about company attack if you catch my drift. wow Maj Gen thats pretty high up.
I would still like to know Kunals military background