Innovations and Development of Indian Artillery

Discussion in 'Defence & Strategic Issues' started by Dinesh_Kumar, Nov 27, 2013.

  1. Dinesh_Kumar

    Dinesh_Kumar Regular Member

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    Innovations and Development of Indian Artillery

    Due to the unique scenario in India, Artillery development has taken place in many areas. This thread will discuss, among others, the following systems - Please note, contributors must put in Pics as well as Specification of Arty system being discussed. Developments should be highlighted.

    > 75/24 Pack Howitzer

    > IFG

    > LFG

    > 115mm/120mm Tank Gun

    > 155mm Metamorphosis

    > Pinaka

    > Prahaar

    > DRDO 52 Cal 155mm

    > Localisation of AK 630

    > L70/40 mm

    >etc.

    All are welcome!
     
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  3. The Fox

    The Fox Regular Member

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  4. Dinesh_Kumar

    Dinesh_Kumar Regular Member

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    The ARDE has a new Director, Dr KM Rajan , who has done good work on the Pinaka. He replaces perhaps the last "gunman" , Shri AM Datar. Datar had topped the "Gun Design Course" in Cranefield University, and had a major role in developments like the 105mm IFG / LFG, the 120mm Gun on Arjun Tank and INSAS Small Arms family. Good work was also done on Ammo and Shells during this time, with Arjun FSAPDS and 155mm BB Shell being developed. However, a simple 155mm howitzer could not be developed by ARDE, like in the UK with the FH-70 gun. Being Director of ARDE, perhaps Datar could have built 155mm prototypes as part of some "in-house project", and showcased it in various Defence Exhibitions, to convey that India had a capability to build 155mm pieces, if the political will was available.
     
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  5. Dinesh_Kumar

    Dinesh_Kumar Regular Member

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    ARDE has also done good work in 25-35mm Air Defence Guns, and prototypes were made which achieved good results. However, the user kept changing its requirements, and the project was finally cancelled.
    Today, the Arjun Mk-II has a puny 12.7mm Air Defence Gun, with less rate of fire.

    If the ARDE option was allowed to continue, we could have had not only towed options to replace the L70 (300 rounds per minute), but also a desi SPAAG Air Defence Tank like West Germany (Gepard), China (Type-95) and Russia (Tungushka).
     
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2014
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  6. Dinesh_Kumar

    Dinesh_Kumar Regular Member

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  7. Dinesh_Kumar

    Dinesh_Kumar Regular Member

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    A technology called "Hammer Forging" was developed for making Gun Barrels (everything from small arms to 203mm heavy guns.) Gun barrels are made in a span of a few days, with hammer forging, it is a matter of minutes. The Soviet Union imported this technology from GFM, Austria, and were thus able to field more than 24000 artillery pieces from the 70's onwards. Some Indian PSU's use this equipment, but for different applications, and it is not known whether OFB uses such technology. During Defexpo 2014, the OFB chairman had mentioned that 3 Dhanush Howitzers can be made per month. This seems to indicate that traditional methods are used in OFBs instead of Hammer Forging. GFM's website shows that most of their recent customers are steelmakers based in ............China.
     
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  8. Dinesh_Kumar

    Dinesh_Kumar Regular Member

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    Recently read abt Israeli use of a Small Arms Team (4 members) in 1967 Urban Combat Operations, with 3 having Uzi's and backed by FN-FAL Heavy version. Very Nice! Israel keeps refining her doctrine, backed by effective firepower, and hence the limited no. of IDF troops are able to take on numerically superior Arab Armies. I wish such tactics were on display more in the Indian Army as well. When seeing Army units, i get a feeling that they are having high numbers of troops as a solution to problems in equipment and training. The IA may have 1000s of tanks, but seems to lack adequate Maintenance and Support Vehicles, to keep the tanks going.
     
  9. Dinesh_Kumar

    Dinesh_Kumar Regular Member

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    I recently saw the news reports abt the Arjun Catapult. IMHO, the fusion of a locally built Armoured Vehicle along with easily available 130mm ordanance is a good idea. Sure, it may not be perfect, but it is good enough. It gives the tank commanders a long range support weapon which can keep up with armoured columns on the move. The OFB lists '130mm Ordanance-Spare' as one of its products, which leads me to believe that the 130mm breech + barrel is being built locally. It is my personal opinion that upgunned 155mm barrel can be matched with the existing breech , as done on the Metamorphosis, and this would, in time, give us a 155mm SPG, and put us on a list of about 30 countries which already have their own SPG. The boys at CVRDE have done a good job with the Arjun turret, and I think , it is time for them to make a modified turret, maybe something which sits on the same base plate and structure as the Arjun, having same running gear, and maybe uprated motors. This new turret need not be low profile like a tank, but its USP would be:
    i) Armoured Protection for the Crew - Same levels as Arjun / T-72 is good enough.This would be a vast improvement over the present STANAG Spec canopy the IA is currently managing with.
    ii) Serve as a Mounting platform, act as a counterweight and offer stabilization to the Breech and Gun Barrel.
    iii) Have parts commonality with existing Arjun platform - low cost and easy maintenance by EME Workshops.

    The SPG will look a lot like the Bhim, the picture of which I have here:
    imgur: the simple image sharer
     
  10. Sea Eagle

    Sea Eagle Senior Member Senior Member

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    DRDO can think of making a universal launch vehicle for Pinaka which can fire different caliber rockets just like the Brazilian Astros which can even fire cruise missile.

    I checked the dimensions of Tatra 813 Kolos used in Pinaka (correct me if I am wrong)

    Pinaka can't be transported by C-130J but only by C-17s and Il-76.
     
  11. Dinesh_Kumar

    Dinesh_Kumar Regular Member

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    A Version of Rocket Artillery could be made having just 1-2 Launch Tubes, and mounted on jeep, like in the US. This is easy to make, compared to a Howitzer, and will help tide over the huge shortfall in artillery on the mountains. Also, along with mortars, this can give some support to infantry in mountains (not high end support like a howitzer, but some support).
     
  12. Dinesh_Kumar

    Dinesh_Kumar Regular Member

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    155 mm Howitzers in IA are limited, but 105 mm guns are available in large numbers. (some reports mention over a 1000). The 17.5 km range is useful in the mountains, but the shell seems to be weak. As postulated here in DFI before, a version of the US M932 Shell, with splinter shell and TNT explosive, could be developed. An effective 105 mm Artillery piece would reduce the pressure somewhat in a crisis, when many different theater commanders request for 155 mm support, limited by the no. of pieces available.
     
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2014
  13. Dinesh_Kumar

    Dinesh_Kumar Regular Member

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    Also, more 160 mm Mortars could be inducted, for commanders who need the similar effect of 155 mm shells. While I don't know how effective their shells are, pics of German Wartime mortars like "Brenda" and "Thor" seems to point to heavy, siege weapon type devastation, which is perfect to take out walled cities, army camps and heavy concrete bunkers and underground tunnels. Range would be only 7 km, but what the hell, this could be "last mile" type of artillery to take out the base camp type of fortification after surrounding threats have been softened up.
     
  14. Dinesh_Kumar

    Dinesh_Kumar Regular Member

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    US Dragon Fire Mortar on the Stryker uses an old 1960's mortar from France. Only innovation is an automatic loading system.
     
  15. Kunal Biswas

    Kunal Biswas Member of the Year 2011 Moderator

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    [​IMG]

    Valkiri Multiple Launch Rocket System | Military-Today.com

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    Over mountains TATA 207 is most suited for such armament ..

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    As far as i know, 120mm HE and 155mm HE fragmentation are similar ..

    Actually 120mm has better fragmentation, And quite lethal ..

     
  16. Dinesh_Kumar

    Dinesh_Kumar Regular Member

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    With regards to Arjun Catapult, the Chinese SPG has

    > Better protection.
    > Seems to be built on a lighter BMP type Chassis
    > Hence better transportability / use existing infrastructure / Maybe Air portable.

    A pic taken from one of the DFI threads is put here:
    imgur: the simple image sharer
     
  17. Dinesh_Kumar

    Dinesh_Kumar Regular Member

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    Last edited by a moderator: May 10, 2015

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