India's SAM Systems - News and Discussions

Discussion in 'Defence & Strategic Issues' started by arnabmit, Jul 27, 2013.

  1. arnabmit

    arnabmit Homo Communis Indus Senior Member

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    India's SAM Systems - News and Discussions

    Please do not include BMD systems here.
     
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  3. arnabmit

    arnabmit Homo Communis Indus Senior Member

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    This is what I have collected from the internet and I might have missed a few. Please feel free to add.

    [​IMG]

    Alarming observation is that we do not currently have any SAM capability beyond 35Km range. Is this correct?

    Considering the Astra spin-off becomes a reality, this would be extended to 100Km probably.

    I read in some threads that India is developing SAM systems comparable or better than S-300. What are those?

    Why are we not acquiring S-400/S-500 systems with 400Km+ range?
     
    Last edited: Jul 27, 2013
  4. arnabmit

    arnabmit Homo Communis Indus Senior Member

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  5. SajeevJino

    SajeevJino Long walk Elite Member

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    For VSHORAD

    add Shilka too and there is no plan for getting Pantysir system for us

    and I think Maitri Project also scrapped

    and LR version of Akash MK2 planned
     
  6. p2prada

    p2prada Stars and Ambassadors Stars and Ambassadors

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    We have a requirement. The AAD will be modified into a SAM called Ashvin with a range of 150 Km.

    The range of IAF version of Barak-8 would be 70Km. It is classified as MRSAM.

    The Navy will also induct the extended range version of Barak-8 (120Km) on future ships.

    An Astra spinoff will be a MRSAM, like Akash. Check specs for Derby/SPYDER SAM and you will have an idea.

    I thought you didn't want to discuss these. AAD/PAD/PDV followed by AD-1/AD-2 will be part of our BMD system. We don't want the S-300 because we are already deploying a S-300 equivalent system. S-400, I don't know if we want it or not. It is a smaller upgrade on our own BMD, no point when we can upgrade our BMD with better missiles like the PDV. S-500 is still under development and the Russians armed forces will be inducting first.

    So we have a tender out for MANPADS at the lowest level.

    LLQRM/SRSAM - We have deals out for SPYDER (15 Km range, 9 Km altitude and 35 Km range, 16 Km altitude) and a development project with the French for Maitri (maybe 15 Km range and 9 Km altitude). Depending on configuration SPYDER can also handle MRSAM duties. Maitri will be a LLQRM, meaning a SPYDER SAM with only the Python missile.

    MRSAM - We have a successful Akash (30 Km range, 18 Km altitude) system and a Akash MK2 (35 Km range) in development. Barak - 8 (IAF)

    LRSAM - Ashvin (150 Km range, possibly 25 Km altitude), Barak-8 (IN 70-120 Km range)
     
  7. arnabmit

    arnabmit Homo Communis Indus Senior Member

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    So the longest range in the pipeline is of Ashwin - 150km. Still nowhere near the 400Km range of S-400. Equivalent maybe in intercept capability or seeker technology, but not in terms of range.

    Do we not need 400Km SAM capability? 400km is like the distance between Chandigarh & Islamabad. Fighter taking off from Islamabad can be taken out with a SAM launch from Chandigarh.

     
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2013
  8. p2prada

    p2prada Stars and Ambassadors Stars and Ambassadors

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    PDV (300-400 Km range, 150 Km altitude) will have such a range. I think PAD has a 200 Km range (80 Km altitude). Even in S-400 the missile with a 400 Km range is the 40N6 which has an intercept altitude of 150-200 Km. It is a BMD missile.

    There are two other missiles in S-400, one has a 120 Km range (called 9M96E, 30 Km altitude) and is equivalent to AAD (possibly 150 Km range, 30 Km altitude) while another has a 250 Km range (called 48N6, altitude 60 Km) which is equivalent to PAD.

    For fighters, the 9M96E and AAD can be used. 400 Km missile is for BMD purpose.

    The Americans have SM-3 with a range of 500 Km and altitude of 160 Km. Apart from PAC-3 (range 100+ Km and altitude 25-30 Km) and THAAD (range 200Km, altitude 150 Km). This is for BMD.

    So AAD = 9M96E (S-400) = MIM-104F (PAC-3)
    PAD = 48N6 (S-400) = RIM-174 or also called SM-6 (SAM not BMD)
    PDV (not ready yet) = 40N6 (S-400) = THAAD and RIM-161 or SM-3 (AEGIS)

    Later,
    India will have AD-1 and AD-2.
    Russia will have S-500. I suppose 3 missiles will be made again.
    Both are meant for ICBMs. As of today reports indicate the Russians will tip the scale in their favour with S-500.

    US, we don't know what they have planned to stop ICBMs.

    Israel, Arrow-2 is equivalent to PAD.

    French Aster Block 2 may be equivalent to AAD.

    The problem is nobody has been able to achieve the sheer speeds Russian missiles have. Russian 40N6 missile managed speeds in excess of Mach 12 while American and Israeli missiles manage Mach 9 at most for THAAD and Arrow 2. PAD does Mach 5. Hopefully PDV changes this a little bit.

    The Chinese are still importing. They will be placing orders for a downgraded export version of the S-400 while they already operate S-300 in numbers.
     
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2013
  9. arnabmit

    arnabmit Homo Communis Indus Senior Member

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    Thank you for all the information! :)

     
  10. Kunal Biswas

    Kunal Biswas Member of the Year 2011 Moderator

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    Rahul Malohtra and arnabmit like this.
  11. Kunal Biswas

    Kunal Biswas Member of the Year 2011 Moderator

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    Its true Indian operational SAM range is Max 35kms..

    In such situation producing more of Akash is logical..

    In mean time long range sam research can continue..
     
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  12. WMD

    WMD Regular Member

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    @Kunal Biswas @p2prada

    AFAIK India bought some S-200 systems. Are they still operational?
    another thing, doesn't the IAF version of Barak-8 which is scheduled to be delivered in 2014 has a range of 120km making it a LR-SAM?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 10, 2015
  13. Neil

    Neil Senior Member Senior Member

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  14. Kunal Biswas

    Kunal Biswas Member of the Year 2011 Moderator

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    It was mentioned that India has S-300V system in some of the BR article by Ex IAF officials..

    I think they are operational for main cities such as Delhi and Mumbai..
     
  15. p2prada

    p2prada Stars and Ambassadors Stars and Ambassadors

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    Not sure.

    Its been classified as MRSAM. The Navy calls it LRSAM.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 10, 2015
  16. WMD

    WMD Regular Member

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    Well, wiki lists India as a current operator of S-200 system.

    SIPRI shows that India bought a Big Back radar which replaced the older Tall King radar in late 80s along with two S-200 Angara system and 40 missiles all delivered in 1989.

    But I don't think they are in operation now.
     
  17. Abhijeet Dey

    Abhijeet Dey Regular Member

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    I have heard Pakistan & Bangladesh are buying HQ-9 SAM missile from China.
     
  18. Payeng

    Payeng Daku Mongol Singh

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    What is Astra spin-off exactly?
     
  19. sayareakd

    sayareakd Moderator Moderator

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    must be SAM.................
     
  20. Twinblade

    Twinblade Senior Member Senior Member

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    Barak-8 -> Indian Navy LRSAM
    Barak-8 ER -> Indian Airforce MRSAM and Indian Navy ERSAM

    [​IMG]
    LRSAM/Barak-8 on left MRSAM/Barak-8 ER (with additional booster) on right.

    Project 15A will have Barak-8/LRSAM, Project 15B will have Barak-8 ER/ERSAM
     
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2013
  21. SajeevJino

    SajeevJino Long walk Elite Member

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    Not sure But ..

    Mostly the Air to Air missile with some Modification can act as a Short Range SAM ..like AMRAAM in US ships and Python and Derby in Spyder System ..So they too working on Astra BVRAAM into Surface launched one
     
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