India's K-15 Ballasic Missile tasked to take out China's Aircraft Carrier 'Liaoning'

[The Ultranationalist]

They are US, Russia, France, Britain and China.

Oh that.... but i beg to differ, each one of them has megaton weapons while we conducted a test of 45 kt device and maintain that in a nuclear strike we will hit the enemy with a 300kt bomb.

 

[no smoking]

Firstly, k15 is a strategic weapon meant for levelling the enemy cities with a nuclear strike and not a tactical weapon to be used against enemy warships.

A 750km range missile can hardly be used as a strategic weapon. This kind of short range weapon can only be shoot from somewhere close to your enemy border or coast, which greatly increase the possibility of being discovered and destroyed. So, they are generally the first to be used or the first to be destroyed in a war.

Secondly, Agni 5 has a CEP close to zero that means it will fall not more than 10 metres from the target, precise enough for you?

There are no way that Agni 5 has that level of CEP even though your scientisits claim so.The latest Russian Iskander missile with far shorter range (400km) gets that CEP (5m-7m).

http://www.strategic-culture.org/ne...nder-m-missile-system-credible-deterrent.html

If a 5000km missile can achieve single digit CEP, you basically claim that your missile technology is 20 years ahead of any country on this earth. Here is some other examples in public sources:

M51, Range-6000km~10,000km, CEP: 150m
DF16, Range-800km~1000km, CEP: 5-10m

 

[HariPrasad-1]

A 750km range missile can hardly be used as a strategic weapon. This kind of short range weapon can only be shoot from somewhere close to your enemy border or coast, which greatly increase the possibility of being discovered and destroyed. So, they are generally the first to be used or the first to be destroyed in a war.


There are no way that Agni 5 has that level of CEP even though your scientisits claim so.The latest Russian Iskander missile with far shorter range (400km) gets that CEP (5m-7m).

http://www.strategic-culture.org/ne...nder-m-missile-system-credible-deterrent.html

If a 5000km missile can achieve single digit CEP, you basically claim that your missile technology is 20 years ahead of any country on this earth. Here is some other examples in public sources:

M51, Range-6000km~10,000km, CEP: 150m
DF16, Range-800km~1000km, CEP: 5-10m

Not missile technology but surely guidence technology. We have certainly achieved single digit accuracy in one of the test but that can not be said to be single digit accuracy but certainly Agni series are well known for their accuracy of low two digit and in all the tests, two digit accuracy was achieved. K series is said to have even lower CEP in 2 digit.

 

[The Ultranationalist]

A 750km range missile can hardly be used as a strategic weapon. This kind of short range weapon can only be shoot from somewhere close to your enemy border or coast, which greatly increase the possibility of being discovered and destroyed. So, they are generally the first to be used or the first to be destroyed in a war.


There are no way that Agni 5 has that level of CEP even though your scientisits claim so.The latest Russian Iskander missile with far shorter range (400km) gets that CEP (5m-7m).

http://www.strategic-culture.org/ne...nder-m-missile-system-credible-deterrent.html

If a 5000km missile can achieve single digit CEP, you basically claim that your missile technology is 20 years ahead of any country on this earth. Here is some other examples in public sources:

M51, Range-6000km~10,000km, CEP: 150m
DF16, Range-800km~1000km, CEP: 5-10m

Why are you comparing our missiles with the second rated chinese junk? Secondly pakis and chinese commies havent got any technology to shoot down a ballistic missile in its flight

 

[Adioz]

Why are you comparing our missiles with the second rated chinese junk? Secondly pakis and chinese commies havent got any technology to shoot down a ballistic missile in its flight

Don't be vain. Don't underestimate China. Refrain from chest-thumping.

 

[sayareakd]

If we could make BMD out of prithvi missiles, then its not impossible to think this.

We first need dreamers and then persons who could nake that dream into reality.

 

[sayareakd]

A 750km range missile can hardly be used as a strategic weapon. This kind of short range weapon can only be shoot from somewhere close to your enemy border or coast, which greatly

K15 is about 2500 kms of range. Dont go in for what GOI or DRDO says.

Why waste all this resources for 750 km range missile on ATV.

 

[J20!]

K15 is about 2500 kms of range. Dont go in for what GOI or DRDO says.

Why waste all this resources for 750 km range missile on ATV.

Where's your source for this 2500km range?

Why would you doubt the specifications put forward by the missile's manufacturer? I sincerely doubt that the DRDO would miss out on the opportunity to brag about the range of their missiles, let alone understate its range by over 70%...

 

[sayareakd]

Where's your source for this 2500km range?

Why would you doubt the specifications put forward by the missile's manufacturer? I sincerely doubt that the DRDO would miss out on the opportunity to brag about the range of their missiles, let alone understate its range by over 70%...

Good example is China saying A5 has range of over 8000 kms whereas DRDO says max at 5500 kms.

 

[IndianHawk]

Why would we use a ballistic missile to take out a aircraft carrier when we have similarly ranged cruise missiles. Bramhos 600+ km range already.

K15 is primarily to be used against pakistan I suppose . For chinese mainland we will use k4 k5 slbm.

Also if required bramhos can carry nuclear warhead so what is the point of using a ballistic missile against an aircraft carrier.

 

[IndianHawk]

Don't be vain. Don't underestimate China. Refrain from chest-thumping.

I agree with chest thumping part. But he is right china doesn't have capacity to shoot down ballistic missile (at least not reliable or clearly known). So a Submarine with even short range missiles is equally dangerous to them as any other long range missiles unless of course they go into chest thumping mode and dismiss the threat:biggrin2:

 

[Adioz]

Why would we use a ballistic missile to take out a aircraft carrier when we have similarly ranged cruise missiles. Bramhos 600+ km range already.

K15 is primarily to be used against pakistan I suppose . For chinese mainland we will use k4 k5 slbm.

Also if required bramhos can carry nuclear warhead so what is the point of using a ballistic missile against an aircraft carrier.

Same reason the Chinese developed DF-21. IMHO, its a lot difficult to stop a ballistic missile in its terminal phase 'cause of its enormous speed. Also, SAMs are not optimised to take out such targets as ballistic missiles.

Another way to think of it is this:-
Saturating enemy defences can be done by salvo firing a 16 Brahmos volley.
OR
It can be done by firing a 6 Brahmos volley combined with a 6 K-15 ASBM volley.

I agree with chest thumping part. But he is right china doesn't have capacity to shoot down ballistic missile (at least not reliable or clearly known). So a Submarine with even short range missiles is equally dangerous to them as any other long range missiles unless of course they go into chest thumping mode and dismiss the threat:biggrin2:

True they cannot shoot down Ballistic missiles today, but neither can we target them with K-15-based ASBM today. And I do not think its much of a stretch for a nation possessing ASAT weapons to develop ABM capability sometime in the near future, if they so choose.

 

[captscooby81]

you never know what the dragon is cooking in its belly..We should never underestimate the capabilities of china especially with their lot of investment going into weapons R&D thanks to their saving of making most of their weapons ingeniously...they will sure catch up with the world in BMD also .. Same like how they have now two 5th Generation fighters after only the USA .. Where old fox like russia who mastered the supersonic fighter jets in the 60s struggling to finish Pak-FA on time

 

[Chinmoy]

We already know now that Brahmos is a 450 km range missile and talk is on way to double its range. Let me cap it on 700 km which is as same as the official range of K15. Now why on earth would we want to use a ASBM with 50-50 chance when we could have a 99% hit chance with Brahmos?

ASBM are more like theoretical weapon more then practical one. Even with an MaRV, an ASBM hit is not ensured. But with a CM scenario is totally different. So better invest in CM for anti shipping role rather then to go for ASBM.

 

[no smoking]

Not missile technology but surely guidence technology.

Don’t you know that factors of missile body also affect the CEP, i.e, the structure, material, shape, etc, etc.

We have certainly achieved single digit accuracy in one of the test but that can not be said to be single digit accuracy but certainly Agni series are well known for their accuracy of low two digit and in all the tests, two digit accuracy was achieved.

That is the problem. The accuracy you are talking about were achieved in the tests under perfect weather and familiar environment, which minimize the external effect on the accuracy.

And another issue is the number of Agni tests is so small that the conclusion of accuracy is quite questionable. Generally, the P5 only get their accuracy figure after 20-30 times of tests in various weather conditions and various sites.

K series is said to have even lower CEP in 2 digit.

That won’t be possible. Land base missile is always more accurate than sea based missile if they are developed with the same generation technology.

 

[no smoking]

Good example is China saying A5 has range of over 8000 kms whereas DRDO says max at 5500 kms.

That is because Chinese propaganda machine trying to overstate the threat of A5.

 

[HariPrasad-1]

Don’t you know that factors of missile body also affect the CEP, i.e, the structure, material, shape, etc, etc.





That is the problem. The accuracy you are talking about were achieved in the tests under perfect weather and familiar environment, which minimize the external effect on the accuracy.

And another issue is the number of Agni tests is so small that the conclusion of accuracy is quite questionable. Generally, the P5 only get their accuracy figure after 20-30 times of tests in various weather conditions and various sites.




That won’t be possible. Land base missile is always more accurate than sea based missile if they are developed with the same generation technology.

BS...............................................

 

[no smoking]

Same reason the Chinese developed DF-21. IMHO, its a lot difficult to stop a ballistic missile in its terminal phase 'cause of its enormous speed. Also, SAMs are not optimised to take out such targets as ballistic missiles.

No, Chinese did have their own reason but Indian only “need” this because some fanboys say so.


The Challenge Chinese faces is 6-7 US aircraft carriers plus another 200-300 US land based fighters deployed in Japan and South Korea. There is no way that Chinese can have such scale of forces sent to India Ocean in next 20-30 years.


Indian generals will laugh their ass off if Chinese dare to send 4 carriers (the maximum available in next 20 years) to India Ocean.

Another way to think of it is this:-

Saturating enemy defences can be done by salvo firing a 16 Brahmos volley.

OR

It can be done by firing a 6 Brahmos volley combined with a 6 K-15 ASBM volley.

Turning a ballistic missile into a anti-ship weapon requires lots of re-design, additional equipment, higher standard techs. All these will make this weapon lots more expensive than both Brahmos and normal ballistic missile. But its effectiveness will be no better than Brahmos on anti-ship, neither better than other ballistic missile on land target strike. Then why you want to waste the money on such a weapon.

 

[Chinmoy]

Turning a ballistic missile into a anti-ship weapon requires lots of re-design, additional equipment, higher standard techs. All these will make this weapon lots more expensive than both Brahmos and normal ballistic missile. But its effectiveness will be no better than Brahmos on anti-ship, neither better than other ballistic missile on land target strike. Then why you want to waste the money on such a weapon.

Exactly my point. Even with all the improvements in tech, the improvement in accuracy would still be far behind then what could be achieved by any CM. For any country without any proven CM tech, ASBM could be a choice of weapon for maritime warfare. But if someone does have a proven CM like Brahmos in arsenal, investing in ASBM is pure misplacement of funds. Improving accuracy is one thing, but diverting energy to configure K15 into ASBM role is simply not economical for India atleast.

 

[Saichand K]

That is because Chinese propaganda machine trying to overstate the threat of A5.

It's range can be 8000km with reduced payload.