Indian Fishermen do cross into Sri Lanka - Indian Coast Guard

pmaitra

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@KS, Coast Guard should protect Indian fishermen, agree; but don't you think they should be carrying the tracking devices, especially since they have been distributed?
 

KS

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The disputed, ceded but not ratified island of Kachchativu is no where even near the fishing area between Point Calimere and East Coast of SL.
You dont get it..

The current IMBL is taken as referenced from Indian mainland. But if Katchatheevu is taken as Indian territory then the border will change which will make the fishign grounds as Indian.

Also its the job of the Indian Govt to provide GPS devices (like how the chinese provide to their fishermen) so that our fishermen dont cross into their waters not near Katchatheevu.

But yeah, leave everything and keep blaming the Tamil fishermen as if the Govt is doing a spectacular job in other fronts and there is no fault on it.
 

nrj

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If JJ is really serious bout this issue, let us see her make those GPS positioning devices and distress systems mandatory on all fishermen's vessels. Anyone without one will not be allowed to fish. Lastly, maybe JJ can also set up a central monitoring station in TN which will monitor the positions of all those fishing vessels in real time and share that data with the Sri Lankans. The Sri Lankans can do the same with India. Not only will this remove the ambiguity of when and where the crossings are happening, but it will also put an end to illegal smuggling and/or terrorist activities in the area.
They have twisted agenda against SL and love for foreigners. Indian Forces are helpless if TN Govt and Fishermen are more interested in waving arms than fishing. If state govt or people advocating from fishermen side are so concerned then they will not turn blind eye to fishermen disregarding Coast Guard's guidelines. I have no sympathy for such idiots who want firearms when they are not even keeping tracking equipment on boat. These people should cross over and fight tamil cause than hiding as fishermen.
 

KS

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Issue is simple on per case basis. If you are taking risk of entering waters without protection, you are inviting consequences.
The job of the Coast Guard is not to sit back and invent excuses but make sure tthere are no consequences for exercising their legitimate right.


They don't even take tracking equipment they are supposed to keep on-board & call coast guard stupid ?? Sounds to be rear hole logic.
More excuses.

Bottom line -

-Tamil fishermen fish in their traditional fishing grounds, a right that was afforded to them in both the 1974 and 1976 agreements.

-Coast Guard's job is to ensure that our fishermen exercise this right without any problem.

So anything other than action from CG only is a excuse either for not doing their duty or they are helpless on higher orders.
 

pmaitra

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@KS, you are right about Katchatheevu, but @arnabmit is talking about a different place. Just as @nrj said, it is to be taken on a case per case basis. I would be the last person to put all blame on Tamil fishermen, but we gotta be objective here.
 
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Razor

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@KS : The wiki page on katchtheevu says :

With the 1976 agreement where delimitation of International Maritime Boundary Line (IMBL) was agreed upon as required by the UNCLOS, Indian fishermen do not have any right to even engage in drying of nets and use of Church in Kachchativu as 1976 agreement supersedes 1974 agreement.
But you say: it is allowed :confused:

I agree ceding the Islands was a retarded and sycophantic thing to do. Where exactly do we stand on that ? What does the Supreme court say on that and has it been enforced ?

13-00-18-44-04-15
 
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KS

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@KS you are right about Katchatheevu, but @arnabmit is talking about a different place. Just as @nrj said, it is to be taken on a case per case basis. I would be the last person to put all blame on Tamil fishermen, but we gotta be objective here.
The latest incident happened around Kodikkarai coast in Nagapattinam and the fishermen say they were well within Indian waters.

Also the CG is also saying that our fishermen do cross sometimes and not all times.

So what about the rest of times they are attacked ?

The solution is retrieve Katchatheevu and restore the livelihood of our fishermen. Even after that if they supposedly cross, then they are doing it at their own risk. No arguments there.


@KS : The wiki page on katchtheevu says :



But you say: it is allowed :confused:

I agree ceding the Islands was a retarded and sycophantic thing to do. Where exactly do we stand on that ? What does the Supreme court say on that and has it been enforced ?

13-00-18-44-04-15
Dude read the PDF i linked. The Wiki page seems BS.

The Wiki page also says no ratification is needed. But the Article VIII in the agreement says Ratification is a must.

As for the SC case..well you know how glacial and slow the whole judicial process is.

Actually I dont know why do we even need the SC involvement...the agreement has not been ratified in Indian parliament and hence it is not formally in force.
 
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nrj

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The fault is on the coast guard and their bosses for not protecting them in the first place where they are legally allowed to cross and exercise their right and instead inventing excuses to shirk their duty.
Indian Government on that site is represented by Coast Guard. If you don't wish to follow their advice, go ahead and get killed. If TN Govt or its people are so worried they will look into fishermen escaping tracking device & ask them to suspend fishing in troubled waters till the genius state Govt resolves the issue. But fishermen are cheaper than victim card TN Govt wants to play.

Suppose a lady goes for a walk in the night in a lonely road where there is no police. She is raped there. Is that her fault ? What nonsense.
When Policemen tell her not to walk beyond this point for her own safety & she still takes the risk out of adventurism then she is sharing the blame. I remember people blaming Foreign tourists for rapes in India because they ignore police guidelines.
 

arnabmit

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74 agreement allows Indians access to Kachchatheevu, but not to fish.

76 agreement does not allow Indians any access.

What is disturbing is Indian govt not even seeking to enforce the terms of the 1974 and 1976 agreements which uphold the rights of the fishermen in what was considered their traditional grounds even if lies on the other side.

Understandable since acknowledging that Katchaatheevu belonged to India would open a pandora's box on why it was transferred illegally and unconstitutionally to Lanka in the first place by Indira.

BS.

http://ilantamilar.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/Final-book.pdf

Ratification is indeed required and that is enshrined in the agreement itself. But trust the anti-national govt to lie to its own people to cover up its faults.

BTW even though "national security" may not lie within the state subjects, the security of lives of the people does lie with the state govt. Also the fishermen being citizens of India, the central govt is duty bound to protect them, so if the central govt fails in that, then the fishermen have no obligation to follow the national policy too. Duties and Rights are two way street.
 

nrj

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The job of the Coast Guard is not to sit back and invent excuses but make sure tthere are no consequences for exercising their legitimate right.

More excuses.

Bottom line -

-Tamil fishermen fish in their traditional fishing grounds, a right that was afforded to them in both the 1974 and 1976 agreements.

-Coast Guard's job is to ensure that our fishermen exercise this right without any problem.

So anything other than action from CG only is a excuse either for not doing their duty or they are helpless on higher orders.
This post has no relevance whatsoever to the point that Fishermen are purposefully not carrying tracking device with them.
 

nrj

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Also its the job of the Indian Govt to provide GPS devices (like how the chinese provide to their fishermen) so that our fishermen dont cross into their waters not near Katchatheevu.
Read the thread properly first.

The fishermen have been distributed Distress Alert Equipment, free of cost by the Coast Guard, but they seldom take the devise
 

KS

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@KS, Coast Guard should protect Indian fishermen, agree; but don't you think they should be carrying the tracking devices, especially since they have been distributed?
pmaitra the tracking devices that they are supposedly distributing is plagued by two problems.

- the ones they give is substandard which breaks down often
- many of them have not even received it. Looks like some scam in that too.

Also only the fishermen in the main towns like Rameswaram, Tuthukudi, Kanyakumari, Nagai etc know about this..there is no effort on the part of CG to even raise awareness in the remote hamlets about the tracking devices.
 

Known_Unknown

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What is disturbing is Indian govt not even seeking to enforce the terms of the 1974 and 1976 agreements which uphold the rights of the fishermen in what was considered their traditional grounds even if lies on the other side.

Understandable since acknowledging that Katchaatheevu belonged to India would open a pandora's box on why it was transferred illegally and unconstitutionally to Lanka in the first place by Indira.



BS.

http://ilantamilar.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/Final-book.pdf




Ratification is indeed required and that is enshrined in the agreement itself. But trust the anti-national govt to lie to its own people to cover up its faults.

BTW even though "national security" may not lie within the state subjects, the security of lives of the people does lie with the state govt. Also the fishermen being citizens of India, the central govt is duty bound to protect them, so if the central govt fails in that, then the fishermen have no obligation to follow the national policy too. Duties and Rights are two way street.
Can you please provide a source which is not full of anti-India propaganda by Eelam activists? :dude:

The document provides the author's interpretations of the 1974 and 1976 agreements, but in not the entire text of the document. In addition, the author clearly admits:

The essence of the forgoing articles is that one Country should not traverse its ship over the territorial Seas of the other Country, without obtaining its ermission. This had been affirmed by the then Indian Foreign Secretary, Mr.Keval Singh, who in his letter to his Sri Lankan counterpart, written on 23.03.1976, the date on which the agreement was signed, held that "fishermen from one Country shall not fish in the territorial Sea of the other Country."

It is imperative to note that this condition will ap-ply only to the sector surrounding the Gulf of Mannar and the Bay of Bengal and not in the sector surrounding Palk Strait, Katchatheevu Island, which sector had already been covered under the earlier 1974 agreement, wherein it had been agreed that fishermen of both the countries had a right to fish transcending maritime boundaries.
Now the underlined part is the author's interpretation of what the agreement stipulates. Whether that interpretation is correct or not will be determined in court. But is is obviously not as clear cut as you are making it out to be.
 

KS

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Can you please provide a source which is not full of anti-India propaganda by Eelam activists? :dude:

The document provides the author's interpretations of the 1974 and 1976 agreements, but in not the entire text of the document. In addition, the author clearly admits:

Now the underlined part is the author's interpretation of what the agreement stipulates. Whether that interpretation is correct or not will be determined in court. But is is obviously not as clear cut as you are making it out to be.
whoa man, read the next paragraph :

It is imperative to note that this condition will ap-ply only to the sector surrounding the Gulf of Mannar and the Bay of Bengal and not in the sector surrounding Palk Strait, Katchatheevu Island, which sector had already been covered under the earlier 1974 agreement, wherein it had been agreed that fishermen of both the countries had a right to fish transcending maritime boundaries.
that is from the Article VI of the agreement,

ARTICLE VI :
The vessels of India and Sri Lanka will enjoy in each
other's waters such rights as they have traditionally enjoyed therein
Plus the thing about the interpretation is only a side point, The main point is

1) why was the island transferred in the first place
2) why wasnt the agreement ratified till date in Indian parlieament.
 
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nrj

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74 agreement allows Indians access to Kachchatheevu, but not to fish.

76 agreement does not allow Indians any access.
TN Govt can ask its fishermen to suspend their fishing activity temporarily in troubled waters till the matter is resolved through diplomatic channels for their own safety since allegedly evil Central Govt is working for SL interests. JJ can at least do that along with fierce campaign to SC but they don't care about fishermen's safety. Their agenda is totally biased.
 

arnabmit

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Boats DID have GPS.

Fishermen DID NOT take tracking devices.

Fishermen arrested 2km off the cost near Bolder point. India DOES NOT have any claim over those waters. Check #25 and see where Bolder point is.

Please read OP again, carefully.

You dont get it..

The current IMBL is taken as referenced from Indian mainland. But if Katchatheevu is taken as Indian territory then the border will change which will make the fishign grounds as Indian.

Also its the job of the Indian Govt to provide GPS devices (like how the chinese provide to their fishermen) so that our fishermen dont cross into their waters not near Katchatheevu.

But yeah, leave everything and keep blaming the Tamil fishermen as if the Govt is doing a spectacular job in other fronts and there is no fault on it.
 
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nrj

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Read the above post.

Everything happens in India on paper, seldom on ground.
Oh we are supposed to take your word instead of Coast Guard. Real come back!

I am going to quote again for non-ignorant people.

The fishermen, who were equipped with GPS, know fully well their location of fishing, but they were wilfully crossing the border, taking a risk. When the Coast guard vessel, stop them at the IMBL, they take a deviation to get into the Lankan waters.
The fishermen have been distributed Distress Alert Equipment, free of cost by the Coast Guard, but they seldom take the devise, when they set out for fishing, he complained.
 

Known_Unknown

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Well India does not control Aksai chin or POK too..and no way in hell are we going to win it back..we have neither the military nor political will. So why not make their transfer to China and Pak de jure and try to solve the whole conflict. Too much resources are wasted on that anyway. And actually if the China border dispute is solved then we would not need to worry about them in Lanka too !

Also the island is a sovereign territory of India that transferred without the necessary procedures which makes the whole process illegal, null and void. Tamil Nadu govt and its fishermen are right. Its the Govt that is skirting its duty and trying to cover for its failure.
In my opinion, Aksai Chi should be officially ceded to China, as it is a useless desert with no habitation possible. However, those cases are different because in both of them a foreign country committed military aggression against India and occupied part of our territory. If those territories were now just given away, we would legitimize that military aggression and basically invite other states to follow in their example.

The island issue is different because India has willingly and under no pressure given away a territory (for whatever reason).
 

KS

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They have twisted agenda against SL and love for foreigners. Indian Forces are helpless if TN Govt and Fishermen are more interested in waving arms than fishing. If state govt or people advocating from fishermen side are so concerned then they will not turn blind eye to fishermen disregarding Coast Guard's guidelines. I have no sympathy for such idiots who want firearms when they are not even keeping tracking equipment on boat. These people should cross over and fight tamil cause than hiding as fishermen.
What ignorance and hatred.

And its funny you should accuse us of loving foreigners when you practically ass kiss the Lankans (who are foreigners) and ignore your own countryman.

if you dont know about the issue just shut it, but dont denigrate the deaths of our people.
 

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