India to kick-off 5th-Gen. fighter aircraft-AMCA development project

Discussion in 'Indian Air Force' started by rahulrds1, Jan 8, 2015.

  1. rahulrds1

    rahulrds1 Regular Member

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    India plans to kick-off its own fifth-generation fighter aircraft (FGFA/AMCA) development project this year to build on the expertise gained in the
    developmental of the indigenous Tejas light combat aircraft.

    Top defence sources on Wednesday said the preliminary design stage of the futuristic fighter called the advanced medium combat aircraft (AMCA), with collaboration among IAF, DRDO and Aeronautical Development Agency, is now "virtually" over.

    "Once the project definition and feasibility is completed in the next few months, the defence ministry will go to the cabinet committee on security for approval. It will require Rs 4,000-5,000 crore for the initial design and development phase," said a source.

    The aim is to fly the first twin-engine AMCA prototype by 2023-2024. IAF is slated to get its first Tejas Mark-I in March this year.

    [​IMG]

    "After Tejas-II, we have to move ahead to a fifth-generation-plus AMCA. Basic design work of AMCA as well as presentations by five to six global aero-engine manufacturers is over. Simulation modelling is also in the works," said the source.

    India, of course, is also trying to sort out its differences with Russia over their proposed joint development of the Indian "perspective multi-role fighter" based on the latter's under-development FGFA called Sukhoi T-50 or PAK-FA.

    India, in fact, had told Russia it cannot wait till 2024-2025 to begin inducting 127 of these single-seat fighters, which will entail an overall expenditure of around $25 billion. But India also wants its own home-grown AMCA project in the long-run for strategic and economic reasons.

    A swing-role FGFA/AMCA basically combines advanced stealth, supercruise (capability to achieve supersonic cruise speeds without use of afterburners), super-maneuverability, data fusion and multi-sensor integration on a single fighter.

    But the 20-year long development of the American F/A-22 "Raptor", the only fully-operational FGFA in the world today, has shown that such a project is an extremely complex and costly affair.

    The US shut down the production of Raptors in 2012 after inducting 188 of them at an overall cost of $67 billion due to huge costs, technical glitches and time overruns. The US is now finally moving towards operationalizing a more advanced FGFA, the F-35 "Lightning-II" joint strike fighter. With the project yet to overcome all technical and software glitches, the overall cost for the planned induction of almost 2,500 such fighters stands at around $400 billion.

    source : Make-in-India: Plan to develop 5th-generation fighter aircraft - The Times of India
     
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  3. rahulrds1

    rahulrds1 Regular Member

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    Re: India to kick-off 5th-Gen.fighter aircraft-AMCA development projec

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  4. Sylex21

    Sylex21 Regular Member

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    Re: India to kick-off 5th-Gen.fighter aircraft-AMCA development projec

    Quite excited about this project. Can't wait to see how it develops over the years. Definitely another step in the right direction for the nation.
     
  5. rahulrds1

    rahulrds1 Regular Member

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    Re: India to kick-off 5th-Gen.fighter aircraft-AMCA development projec

    [​IMG]
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  6. rahulrds1

    rahulrds1 Regular Member

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    Re: India to kick-off 5th-Gen.fighter aircraft-AMCA development projec

    "Basic design work of AMCA as well as presentations by five to six global aero-engine manufacturers is over. "

    26000 lb GE F414 EPE / EP (120 kN) engine could be one of them. F414 EPE / EP (120 kN) 20% more thrust compare to current F414(98 kN) engine.

    http://www.geaviation.com/engines/docs/military/datasheet-F414-Enhanced.pdf

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EyNm7xrqpFk

    http://defenceforumindia.com/forum/...erformance-fighter-plane-engine-26000-lb.html
     
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  7. rahulrds1

    rahulrds1 Regular Member

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    Re: India to kick-off 5th-Gen.fighter aircraft-AMCA development projec

    [​IMG]
     
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  8. Hari Sud

    Hari Sud Senior Member Senior Member

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    Re: India to kick-off 5th-Gen.fighter aircraft-AMCA development projec

    There are no choices left. Russians have dragged their feet in stealth fighter. They will not supply anything before 2023/25. That means that if sufficient money is placed at the now idled LCA -1 team, their could be our own design and we can thumb at the Russians. The LCA-2 work is to be handled by the second team, hence this may be good strategy.

    What we missed in LCA-1 was lack of finances, political will, project management skills, expertise and most of all the experience. I think with new Sherrif in town the political will and finances are supplied. The technical team has to supply experience, expertise and good project management.

    If external help is needed, get it early. Do not shy away in over confidence.

    In about ten years Russians and Chinese can come and kiss our backside.
     
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  9. asianobserve

    asianobserve Elite Member Elite Member

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    Re: India to kick-off 5th-Gen.fighter aircraft-AMCA development projec

    JV with the Japanese or the Koreans would be a good start.... No doubt they are infinitely better than the Russians at delivering on business agreements.
     
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  10. kaboom!

    kaboom! Regular Member

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    the indian paper being mentioned here is Indian express and the journalist reporting this is Ajai Shukla

    So, i have a worry,
    (a)with the reduction in price of the fgfa development and
    (b)with the aggressive push by russia for FGFA development and sale
    I fear the AMCA development might take a hit (since both of them appear to have similar function).....I would have been damn sure of it had this happened under the previous govt but with this govt I dont think so.

    Still could anyone enlighten me with the operational difference between AMCA and FGFA
    (i realise both are in development but both are 5th gen fighters by which i understand them to be stealthy fighters primarily intended to be ground attack fighters akin to F-35).
     
  11. kaboom!

    kaboom! Regular Member

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    i think there is another thread of AMCA which is bigger/has more participation.
    Moderator is requested to merge the threads if he deems it right. @pmaitra @Kunal Biswas
     
  12. Srinivas_K

    Srinivas_K Senior Member Senior Member

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    AMCA is a medium category fighter jet, FGFA is a heavy category. These are the requirements of Indian armed forces, US has different doctrines and capabilities.

    AMCA will have naval variant as well.
     
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  13. kaboom!

    kaboom! Regular Member

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    so you mean russian doesnt intend to develop naval version of FGFA.
    then i wonder what will russia stock its 100-ton super carrier with? Any idea?(i am not being sarcastic, just wondering) bcause Russia would want an advanced aircraft i reckon(in league with f-35) and the only option of MiG29k/kub is nowhere near that. :confused1::ear:
     
  14. guru-dutt

    guru-dutt Regular Member

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    Thing is neither Rafale nor PAKFA or FGFA seem to be coming at least in next 5 years even if we are ready to give in to russian and french demands and that aint happening so we have no choice and MP from day one was more interested in AMCA than LCA MK2 read my words if some how HAL/ARDE/DRDO is able to shed some 500Kg's from Tejas and add AESA, IFR ,OBOGS and possibally IRST(even as a pod) within next couple of years i dont see india waisting money on MK2 or even rafale as Mig29's, M2K's, Jag's & MKI's just might get EL2052+Python+Derby&IDerbyER+Astra MK1&2 upgrade will be more than enof with LCA MK1A as a goal keeper
     
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  15. Nuvneet Kundu

    Nuvneet Kundu Senior Member Senior Member

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    I think AMCA will eventually replace Rafale since they fall in the same category of 'medium multirole'. France has already offered us ToT on Snecma M88 engine for AMCA project.

    Also, how many times are we going to 'kick off' this same project? :D I am hearing this since a decade now. We have kicked off so many times that our legs must be swollen now.
     
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  16. guru-dutt

    guru-dutt Regular Member

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    read my lips sirji niether rafle deal is going ahead nor M88 as frenchies are asking for too much until some how NaMo makes some kind of miracle and kaveri is still a decade away so its gonna be GE414 EPE/EP for AMCA and if things go as per plan then we also might see F/A-18 advanced super hornets both in our air force and air wing of INS Vishal
     
  17. Indx TechStyle

    Indx TechStyle Perfaarmance Naarmal Senior Member

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    Title of thread is misleading.
    Project isn't scrapped yaaron. :eek:
     
  18. Nuvneet Kundu

    Nuvneet Kundu Senior Member Senior Member

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    If we ever buy F18, or F16 or F35, I request all of you forum members to contribute some money and buy some good quality poison for me to drink.
     
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  19. warrior monk

    warrior monk Regular Member

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    I have it on good authority that India is not interested in PAKFA/FGFA , though we may buy few PAK-FA of the self to fill squadron strength IAF is not happy with PAK-FA so AMCA program will get a boost as there is no chance for F-35 in IAF .
     
  20. Srinivas_K

    Srinivas_K Senior Member Senior Member

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    The project has started, seems they are working on it !
     
  21. Srinivas_K

    Srinivas_K Senior Member Senior Member

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    IAF wants mix of heavy and medium stealth aircraft, I think LCA mark 2 with stealth capabilities, AMCA and FGFA will be composition of Indian Airforce of the furure.
     

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