India Takes First Step Towards Indus Water Treaty Withdrawal

MMuthu

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for the same reason China lets water pass through India.
If I am not wrong River Brahamaputra is flooded every year, and I hope it is hard for China to divert the rivers to their land.

because our ambition is to be a "responsible power" and get a UNSC seat with veto.
Do you think China will let that happen very soon?

aren't they suffering enough ?
They are not suffering enough, they need 100 times more.

and we will be ?
Yes we will be affected though....they cannot destroy the whole India..... They cannot develop a weapon (which destroys the whole India)like that even if they develop.... that Should be destroyed before they fire, but there is a limit for everything.... what will if we face 4 mumbai like incidents? even after that if we dont stop them.... We can eat their shits.

not necessarily.
If it is Pakistan or India...... End of day one should survive and one should die..... Unless if we keep pakistan in that position... they will not come down.
 

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Indus Waters Treaty Commissioner Jamaat Ali Shah, while leaving for New Delhi to talk about waters shared by India and Pakistan, said that Pakistan was getting its share of waters under the Indus Treaty and that building a dam was the right of India. He said less water in Pakistani rivers was because of lack of rain, not because India had blocked it.

Daily Times - Leading News Resource of Pakistan
aah..so their lies, so far, stands exposed.:blum3:
 

p2prada

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^^ They will blame India for lack of rains too.

Perhaps, they will ask us to build more of those Kajuraho temples to appease the rain god rather than build dams.
 

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Indus Waters Treaty Commissioner Jamaat Ali Shah, while leaving for New Delhi to talk about waters shared by India and Pakistan, said that Pakistan was getting its share of waters under the Indus Treaty and that building a dam was the right of India. He said less water in Pakistani rivers was because of lack of rain, not because India had blocked it.

Daily Times - Leading News Resource of Pakistan
If everything is fine why is he coming over to delhi?
 

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just to do some shopping
 

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If I am not wrong River Brahamaputra is flooded every year, and I hope it is hard for China to divert the rivers to their land.



Do you think China will let that happen very soon?



They are not suffering enough, they need 100 times more.


Yes we will be affected though....they cannot destroy the whole India..... They cannot develop a weapon (which destroys the whole India)like that even if they develop.... that Should be destroyed before they fire, but there is a limit for everything.... what will if we face 4 mumbai like incidents? even after that if we dont stop them.... We can eat their shits.


If it is Pakistan or India...... End of day one should survive and one should die..... Unless if we keep pakistan in that position... they will not come down.
MMuthu,

I am in a good mood so will reply to this rant.

If India is ready to go to war then it should by all means divert waters, and set a precedent for China to do the same. Pakistan can still go to war with us, but can we go to war with China ?

A nuclear war is the last case scenario. So bringing it, and saying us or them is stupid. No Indian leader no matter how deluded or jingoistic, would rather like to see no Indian dead than a milion Pakistani dead. The nation whose aim is to cause destruction can cause no benefit to anyone.

India and Pakistan I feel can co-habit if Pakistan is able to come out of the quicksand that it has forced itself to jump into. India is a nation of 1.1billion with a 1.1trillion dollar economy, Pakistan can be a good market for us. :)

Indian govt by showing restraint has engineered what few are able to engineer. Pakistan did much better after war's with India than it is now without going to a war with India. In fact a war with India will resuscitate Pakistan.
 

p2prada

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MMuthu,

If India is ready to go to war then it should by all means divert waters, and set a precedent for China to do the same. Pakistan can still go to war with us, but can we go to war with China ?
Singh, China can only block Brahmaputra and not the other major rivers. So, the damage we can cause Pak will be greater than the damage caused to India. Still, a lot of people in the NE and Bangladesh will suffer. Not worth the effort.

Pakistan can be a good market for us. :)
Yup, we will find the biggest dump right across our border. Atleast the Pakistanis will be driving Tata Nano rather than Sitara.:D

In fact a war with India will resuscitate Pakistan.
Yup, a lot of free money and materials will reach Pak from the West, ME and China. It's more profitable not fighting war.
 

Singh

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Singh, China can only block Brahmaputra and not the other major rivers.
why not ?
I don't doubt the Chinese :p

So, the damage we can cause Pak will be greater than the damage caused to India. Still, a lot of people in the NE and Bangladesh will suffer. Not worth the effort.
Not only people in NE and Bdesh will suffer but people all over India due to the inevitable war.

Yup, a lot of free money and materials will reach Pak from the West, ME and China. It's more profitable not fighting war.
and unite the nation. Today the Pakistanis still believe Taliban are good, some uncircumcised mischief mongers read hindus are causing trouble there.
 

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Pak to get minute-to-minute info on river flow from India

Islamabad, June 18: In an effort to minimize damage caused by floods in the country, Pakistan has made arrangements with India to receive minute-to-minute detailed information about river flows in the north-western parts of the country.

In an inter-provincial meeting of the Federal Flood Commission here, Pakistan Minister for Water and Power, Raja Pervez Ashraf, was told by the Indus Waters Commissioner that adequate arrangements have been made for receiving up-to-the-minute flood flow data of Indian rivers crossing over into Pakistan.

The meeting also reviewed various measures undertaken by the federal and provincial departments to manage the increased volumes of water flow during the monsoon season.

During the meeting, Ashraf asked the top officials of the Meteorological Department to assist all other concerned departments through timely and accurate weather forecasts, The Dawn reports.

Ashraf said the government is eager to provide all possible resources for the implementation of flood management measures on a large and long term scale.

ANI

Pak to get minute-to-minute info on river flow from India
 

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India says no to compensation for blocking Chenab in Aug ‘08

India says no to compensation for blocking Chenab in Aug ‘08

Wednesday, June 24, 2009
ISLAMABAD: New Dehli has refused to extend compensation both in shape of water or in monetary form to Islamabad for the blockade of Chenab river by India in August, 2008 that inflicted huge monetary loss to agrarian economy of Pakistan.

“During the three-day dialogue between Pakistan and India at Permanent Commission of Indus Waters (PCIW), held in New Dehli from May 31 to June 2, Islamabad raised the issue of compensation of massive dip in water availability that Pakistan experienced in August 2008 owing to filling of Baglihar hydropower project, but India has turned down any compensation saying that it does not believe the data of Pakistan and argued that water dip that the lower riparian country experienced was not because of the filling of Baglihar project, rather it was because of the hydrological conditions of Chenab river,” reveals the document containing the minutes of the Delhi meeting exclusively available with The News.

However, India, the document says, desires to verify the data collected by Pakistan authorities when the River Chenab experienced dip in the month of August 2008.

Syed Jamaat Ali Shah headed Pakistan delegation during the meeting at Permanent Commission of Indus Waters level.

Under the Indus Waters Treaty, India cannot reduce the flow in Chenab River below 55,000 cusecs between 21st June and August 31, 2008, whereas Pakistan had been receiving a discharge of as low as 20,000 cusecs during August-September 2008.

When contacted spokesman of Ministry of Water and Power, Zarar Aslam confirmed that India has refused to compensate Pakistan for the water shortage that the country faced in August 2008 in River Chenab. However, he refused to share the modus operandi that the government will adopt to tackle this issue.

Pakistan Commission of Indus Water Commissioner Syed Jamaat Ali Shah was not available for comments despite many attempts to contact him.

India is currently spending around $200 billion on the construction of water tunnels to the River Indus, which could turn parts of Pakistan barren, a senior official at the Ministry told The News.

According to, Advisor to the Punjab Irrigation Department advisor M H Siddiqui says that Chenab blockade in August 2008 affected over 10 million acres of land in the province and the standing paddy crop in the area suffered losses, as it was the time of maturity and needed the last watering, which could not be completed just because of the blatant violations of Indus Waters Treaty 1960 by India and continuing to fill up the dead shortage of Baglihar HPP beyond August 31, 2008.

The document also reveals that Jammat Ali Shah has sought permission from New Delhi to visit three large hydropower projects that India is constructing at Laddakh Area on River Indus, which is the lifeline of Pakistan. —KM
 

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IHK government calls for compensation for Indus Water Treaty

IHK government calls for compensation for Indus Water Treaty

* Finance minister of disputed region says IHK has capacity to produce 20,000MW of electricity but faces 10-hour power blackouts

By Iftikhar Gilani

NEW DELHI: The Indian-held Kashmir (IHK) government on Tuesday demanded compensation from New Delhi for losses incurred due to the Indus Water Treaty (IWT), a water-sharing agreement signed between India and Pakistan in 1960.

Participating in the discussions at the state power minister’s meeting, chaired by Union Power Minister Sushil Kumar Shinde, IHK Finance Minister Abdul Rahim Rather said the valley had been adversely affected by the IWT and called for measures to alleviate the people’s suffering.

He said under the treaty, IHK had been unable to utilise the water in Indus, Chenab and Jhelum rivers. “Had it not been for the restrictions imposed by the IWT, storage facilities could have been created to help IHK meet its increased winter requirements and the state would not have been forced to arrange costly alternatives under short-term arrangements,” Rather said while representing IHK Chief Minister Omar Abdullah – who holds the power portfolio as well.

Shortage: The minister said it was ironic that IHK, which had the potential to produce upto 20,000 megawatts of electricity, had to face power shortages of almost 10 hours a day.

“Only 10 percent of that potential has been realised in the last six decades,” he added.

Rather said his government was working to add 450MW to the system through the second phase of the Baghliar project.

He also demanded increasing the royalty from central power stations from 12 to 25 percent and complained that the federal gvernment’s National Hydro Electric Power Corporation (NHPC) was offering only 14MW of free power to IHK from the 120MW Sewa-II project on a tributary of River Ravi, set to be commissioned by the end of 2009.

The minister reminded New Delhi the Prime Minister’s Working Group had recommended transfer of 390MW of power from Dul Hasti hydel to IHK. “The recommendation needs to be taken to its logical conclusion,” he said.

Rather said the IHK government had also launched several programmes to add 670MW of electricity to the system by the end of 12th Plan (2012-17). He said the government was ready to revise the hydel policy.
 

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Pakistan to move WB on Kishenganga

Pakistan is all set to move the World Bank (WB) for appointment of a neutral expert instead of opting for the Court of Arbitration on the Indian Kishanganga Hydropower Project.

“The WB-appointed neutral expert is our top most priority after receiving a discouraging response while exercising bilateral channels as the Indian project is being built to divert River Jhelum water,” sources told The News here on Friday.

The sources pointed out that the Permanent Indus Water Commission (PIWC), appointing two negotiators from each side, proved merely time buying moves of India.

“It will also be a futile exercise if Pakistan opts for court of arbitration consisting two nominees from each country and three mutually agreed ones, and, we can ill-afford to give more and more time to New Delhi to go ahead with its controversial project,” they elaborated.

“We are examining the possibility of invoking the option of neutral export instead of court of arbitration,” a Foreign Office spokesman confirmed to this correspondent when contacted.

The FO spokesman maintained that the Pakistan government along with experts was working seriously on an urgent basis to go for a neutral expert appointment since India was wasting time while engaging us in step-by-step process.

“Should India continue to prevaricate and procrastinate first?” he questioned while referring to the water dispute between Islamabad and New Delhi with almost a 30 per cent existing water shortage in Pakistan for ongoing Rabi crop season.

Pakistan first tried to resolve the problem at PIWC, the only body between two neighbouring rivals, secondly called for negotiators and then comes the option of court of arbitration. “We do not believe that India will agree within one month under IWT 1960 to nominate its members for the arbitration court.

“This is too serious a matter and Pakistan cannot afford to sit back and allow India to continue violating the IWT,” the spokesman said.

In response to a question, Abdul Basit said he was not in a position to give exact time-frame as to when Pakistan will move the WB for appointing a neutral expert whose findings will be binding both on Pakistan and India on water issues.

The PIWC Commissioner for Pakistan, Syed Jamaat Ali Shah ,said Pakistan was moving ahead with the relevant clauses of the treaty. “And next step is establishment of a court of arbitration.”

He, however, referred to the Foreign Office for furtherance on the Kishanganga project while saying it was now before the Government of Pakistan to handle after the India did not agree to the PIWC platform.

“And if the issue is not settled on the platform of court of arbitration, Pakistan can exercise the option to move the WB for appointment of a neutral expert.
 

lupgain

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I think friends..Any country should exploit all opportunities that helps it keep control over countries that affects it.. be it an opportunity of geographical advantage.. and every one knows Pakistan.. it never tries to miss any opportunity to spread terrorism in India Now.. tell me.. Isn't pakistan using PoK territory as their geographical advantage to sponsor terrorism in India. Now until and unless Pakistan agrees and is made to bow down not to use PoK a territory to sponsor pakistan in J&K and India and to stop fomenting unrest in J&K... we should certainly do that, until they leave their stubbornness of their Anti-India feeling
 

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Much of Afghanistan will fall to the Taliban - it already has. Unlike 1990, where after the Red Army left Afghanistan Pakistan was united, this time the blow-back will rock Pakistan to its foundations. It will be a bigger mess than we can imagine. The Indians will remain Clueless. They will founder, they will be confused, they will flail about, but like all God's retarded children, they will emerge safe. But the pressures they will be put into, on top of all the other internal pressures India faces, will not do any good.India gonna see repeat of history when taliban returns in kashmir and again for 20 years kashimir will boil but it will encompass whole india along withit coz of pussyfooting of the ruling elites in india as its always been through out indian civilizational history.and this time one more dispute will be added the water.

Accord on roadmap to settle Pak-India water dispute

LAHORE: India and Pakistan agreed on Wednesday on a “roadmap for resolving water disputes” and decided to hold two additional meetings, besides a routine meeting due in May, over the next six months.

On the last day of a five-day visit, a three-member Indian delegation yielded to a Pakistani demand that all “water disputes must be resolved with an agreed timeframe” because their lingering would create problems for both countries.

Pakistan’s Indus Commissioner Syed Jamaat Ali Shah said the two sides had decided to hold one of the additional meetings by the end of March and the other by the end of June to expedite the pace of dispute resolution.

“The decision is the biggest achievement made during five days of deliberations,” he told Dawn.

Pakistan expressed concern over dwindling water supplies in western rivers which were given to Pakistan as a replacement for eastern rivers. Pakistan is supposed to transfer western water to its eastern part.

Shah said the Indians were told that a reduction in supplies was jeopardising the water transfer operation which should be allowed to happen.

Pakistan called for an effective flow of information as required under the Indus Basin Water Treaty and said that any obstruction in this regard would create problems for implementing the treaty.

Shah said the Indian delegation had agreed that settlement of all water disputes must be time-bound because open-ended talks were counter-productive and bred confusion and frustration.

The Indus treaty protects rights of both the upper (India) and lower riparian (Pakistan) states. The two countries needed to stick to their parts of implementation, Mr Shah said, adding that Pakistan had also asked India to take steps if deforestation and environmental impact affected river flows on its side. Talking to reporters at the Lahore airport before leaving for home, Auranga Nathan, India’s Indus Commissioner, rejected a perception that the water issue could trigger a war between Pakistan and India.

“After all the two countries have signed an international treaty which includes elaborate dispute resolution mechanism. They not only committed to the treaty provisions but also regularly invoke different provisions to resolve disputes. Under such circumstances, there was hardly any chance of war between Pakistan and India on water issues,” he said.

Nathan termed his visit a success and reiterated that India was committed to the treaty and ready to resolve all disputes in accordance with the Indus Basin Water Treaty.

The current water reduction, he said, was result of weather variations rather than any activity on the Indian side of the border.
 

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Getting ready for a 'water war'?

Khaled Ahmed

For once Commissioner Jamaat Ali Shah is right. He sees no violation of the Treaty. And he has no jurisdiction over the new issue of scarcity of water because the Treaty doesn't deal with it

Pakistan may be getting ready to go to war with India, not over Kashmir, which it finds futile, but over the river water India is supposed to insist on stealing from it despite the Indus Water Treaty of 1960. Pakistan’s army chief has mentioned ‘water’ in his last challenging statement, followed by the Prime Minister, and there is a one-sided media war going on as the Indian side, still angry over the Mumbai attack, is poised to jump in, all guns blazing. One chief editor in Pakistan says Pakistan should nuke the Indian dams stealing Pakistani water – with him as human payload tied to a nuclear missile!

The world is waiting for this to happen. Water wars have been predicted by the UN, but statistics show that states continue to be sane over shared waters. The Economist wrote on May 1, 2008, ‘Researchers at Oregon State University say they have found that the world’s 263 trans-boundary rivers generate more co-operation than conflict. Over the past half-century, 400 treaties had been concluded over the use of rivers. Of the 37 incidents that involved violence, 30 occurred in the dry and bitterly contested region formed by Israel and its neighbours, where the upper end of the Jordan river was hotly disputed, and skirmished over, before Israel took control in the 1967 war’.

Alarmism of the Lower Riparian : The Economist ends by stating : ‘And some inter-state water treaties are very robust. The Indus river pact between India and Pakistan survived two wars and the deep crisis of 2002’. We may be about to prove the observation wrong. As we go for the next round of Indo-Pak talks – with the Indian army chief alleging cross-border infiltration in Kashmir – Pakistan’s lawyer Ahmer Bilal Soofi, writing in Dawn on February 20, 2010 focuses on the real issue : scarcity rather than theft of water, and recommends fresh talks to consider supplementing the 1960 Indus Water Treaty with a water regime during scarcity of water. The Treaty did not take into account the ecological change that would occur half a century later, depriving the subcontinent of rains and run-off from its mountain glaciers.

Today, water management is akin to conflict management. But India and Pakistan are busy conflict-creating: they started with Kashmir and have ended up with half a dozen more casus belli issues even as they talk peace. Water is the latest such issue. Before we as a lower riparian state raise the ante, let us consider some aspects of the developing confrontation. As a lower riparian, Pakistan is naturally alarmist. This is true of lower riparians anywhere in the world including lower riparian provinces in India and Pakistan. We don’t want water storage on our rivers in Kashmir; Sindh doesn’t want water storage on its rivers in Punjab. And Sindh is as alarmist and non-trusting vis-à-vis Punjab as Pakistan is vis-à-vis India.

Treaty good despite universal hatred of Treaty : In India everyone thinks signing the Indus Water Treaty was wrong. They know that not having a waters treaty is advantageous to the upper riparian if it is militarily strong. In Pakistan, even as Punjab and Sindh fight over waters, both sides denounce the 1960 Treaty. No one says how it would have benefited Pakistan if there was no treaty reserving certain rivers for Pakistan. In India those who hate the Treaty have a good reason for doing so : take all the water and make Pakistan suffer. One is astounded by the intensity of the warmongering in Pakistan over the waters, especially as one looks at the record of Pakistan’s past behaviour under the Treaty.

The Indus Treaty envisages three kinds of complications over waters. The first type is ‘questions’ which are resolved by the two sides through their water commissioners at the Indus Water Commission. The second is ‘differences’ for which the two sides approach the World Bank which appoints a neutral expert. The third type is ‘disputes’ which goes to a Court of Arbitration assembled by the World Bank for the purpose. Both sides fund the process; and the Court can also award costs. So far ‘questions’ have been many, but only one difference, over Baglihar Dam, which turned out to be not as grave as Pakistan had thought, which must have been chastening for our watchdog water commissioner, Jamaat Ali Shah. There has never been a ‘dispute’. It is on the basis of this record that the world thinks the Indus Treaty such a good bilateral arrangement. Have we learned anything from this record?

India allowed storage and some use of Western Rivers : Our bearded Water Commissioner Jamaat Ali Shah once symbolised our lower riparian alarmism, returning from his meetings in India with his dire warnings about the male fides of Indian intent. Today he is being castigated and even insulted on TV programmes because his accumulated knowledge prevents him from crossing the line on the jurisprudence of the 1960 Treaty. Discussants fall into red-faced paroxysms when he says India is not in violation even though it is in the process of building dozens of dams over our rivers – Indus, Chenab, Jhelum – and diverting water from Kishenganga.

As stated above, an upper riparian will not enter into a water treaty unless it sees advantage in it – an advantage over the lower riparian. Although Nehru is cursed in India for having signed the Indus Treaty, the truth is that he did extract from it the advantage of using some water from our three Western Rivers for consumptive use, that is, agriculture. Annexure C of the Treaty is about India diverting certain amount of water in certain months from the Western Rivers. Then, there is no bar on the building of water storage for electricity production or any other non-consumptive use on Western Rivers (Annexure E). If anyone complains in Pakistan about India building dams and taking some water out of our rivers, he speaks out of ignorance.

Water-management is conflict-management : For once Commissioner Jamaat Ali Shah is right. He sees no violation of the Treaty. And he has no jurisdiction over the new issue of scarcity of water because the Treaty doesn’t deal with it. He can only say he doesn’t believe what the Indians are saying; and he is saying that. India and Pakistan are facing a calamity they can’t quantify and that pertains to climatic change as never seen in human memory. This calamity is the ‘third party’ against which both should unite, taking along also the other states of South Asia. But this can only happen if India and Pakistan normalise their relations and become ‘sympathetic’ rather than ‘punitive’ in their view of each other. It has been observed in the context of riparian relations that water disputes can be resolved if relations are normal, that is, allowing interpenetration of interests through free bilateral trade and investment.

As a lower riparian Pakistan has no aggressive advantage, nuclear weapons or no nuclear weapons. All advantages lie in its median status and the potential it has as a trading corridor with regional states dependent on it for the movement of their goods and for the transit of their oil and gas pipelines. As stated above, 263 trans-boundary rivers in the world have caused the riparian states to cooperate rather than go to war. Many Pakistanis believe they have the advantage of leverage over America and can go on benefiting from America despite being anti-American. One has to look at Pakistan’s record with India to see how much leverage Pakistan has seen seep away as it follows its aggressive approach. Those who denounce the Indus Treaty in India want Pakistan to go on acting like this. We must remember that the Treaty can be set aside in the case of a hostile escalation; and the world will find itself siding with India if it thinks Pakistan is in the wrong.

Shahid Javed Burki’s advice for normalisation : Pakistan’s former finance minister and ex-vice president of the World Bank, Shahid Javed Burki, anticipating the Indo-Pak ministerial talks in late February 2010, wrote in Dawn (16 Feb 2010): ‘If thinking outside the box is to be encouraged, my suggestion would be that Islamabad base the dialogue on an entirely new consideration : how to bring about greater economic integration between the two countries.

‘The objective should be to develop a stake for India in the Pakistani economy and also in its stability. This would entail a number of things including unhindered flow of trade between the two countries, encouraging the private sectors on either side of the border to invest in each other’s economy, the opening up of the border that separates the two parts of Kashmir to trade and movement of people, and grant of transit rights to each other for trade with third countries. As the experience of Europe shows, economic integration among states with a history of hostility towards one another is a good way of easing tensions. Taking that approach would constitute real thinking outside the box’.
 
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Talks based on economics

By Shahid Javed Burki
Tuesday, 16 Feb, 2010

THERE has been a significant shift in the positions of most countries involved in the current Afghan conflict. The process started with President Barack Obama’s speech on Afghanistan last December.

Another important development has been the decision by New Delhi to give up its position that it would not talk to Pakistan on the resolution of issues souring ties unless Islamabad took to task those who masterminded the terrorist attack on Mumbai in November 2008.

On Feb 4, New Delhi proposed the resumption of talks at the foreign-secretary level but did not suggest an agenda. The response from Islamabad was quick. The Foreign Office spokesman said that if India dispensed “with its traditional inflexibility there [was] a possibility of moving ahead. Pakistan has always believed that it is only through genuine and meaningful talks that Pakistan and India can resolve their disputes”.

On the same day P. Chidambaram, India’s home minister, said in New Delhi that the handler of the group that penetrated Indian defences in the 2008 Mumbai attack may have been an Indian. “When we say he could be an Indian, he could be somebody who acquired Indian characteristics. He could have been infiltrated into India and lived here long enough to acquire an Indian accent, familiarity with Indian Hindi words…,” he said.

On Feb 5, Shahid Malik, Pakistan’s high commissioner in India, met Nirupama Rao, India’s foreign secretary, to discuss the timing and content of the high-level meeting between the two countries. “All possible issues which are of concern to Pakistan or India will be discussed,” he told the press after the meeting. “Kashmir is an issue we have been raising with India at every possible opportunity and forum. Terrorism will certainly be one of the areas of discussions because we have issues relating to terrorism and this is something that affects Pakistan.”

The news that India was prepared to restart its dialogue with Pakistan, begun in 2004 but suspended in 2008 after the Mumbai terrorist attack, was received in Pakistan with a mixture of relief and triumph. Most policymakers were of the view that the position Pakistan had taken following the Mumbai carnage had been vindicated. Its neighbour had begun to recognise that there was no official Pakistani involvement in the attacks.

The terrorist activity by the Tehrik-i-Taliban Pakistan in 2009 was a clear indication that Pakistan was also a victim of terrorism. Hundreds died in attacks on major cities and in several small towns in the NWFP.

The fact that there was some disagreement over the content of the dialogue once it began is a good indication of the nature of the relationship between these two countries. Even relatively minor issues became contentious. India initially indicated that it only wished to discuss terrorism while Pakistan wanted to go back to the composite dialogue which covered most contentious issues that had caused so much hostility between the two South Asian neighbours.

This may be a good time to completely change the framework within which India and Pakistan have been discussing their relations ever since 2004. Then, at the sidelines of a regional summit, Gen Pervez Musharraf and Indian Prime Minister Atal Behari Vajpayee had agreed that the two countries should attempt to resolve their differences through dialogue. In the context of the history of India-Pakistan relations this was a major breakthrough.

As was always the case, Islamabad wanted to focus on the issue of Kashmir. New Delhi was in favour of discussions that covered the many reasons for continuing tensions between the two countries. These included territorial issues other than Kashmir. For a number of years India and Pakistan had been fighting over the Siachen glacier in the eastern part of the disputed territory of Kashmir. There was also a dispute over Sir Creek on the western side between the two states. The Indians suggested that movements on these issues would build confidence and ultimately lead to the resolution of more difficult problems, including Kashmir.

The two countries are now debating once again the content of the dialogue expected to be resumed in late February. According to a newspaper report, the issue of what should be the right approach to the Indian initiative was discussed at a brainstorming session at the foreign affairs’ ministry in Islamabad where some concern was expressed that unless the composite dialogue was fully restored, Pakistan should not participate in the discussions.

However, the diplomats left the final decision to the politicians who, it was said, might be able to think outside the box to find a way to depart from the entrenched positions in the two bureaucracies. The Indian position dealt with terrorism as the main focus of discussions and Pakistan’s position was that the entire relationship should be on the discussion table.

If thinking outside the box is to be encouraged my suggestion would be that Islamabad should base the dialogue on an entirely new consideration: how to bring about greater economic integration between the two countries.

The objective should be to develop a stake for India in the Pakistani economy and also in its stability. This would entail a number of things including unhindered flow of trade between the two countries, encouraging the private sectors on either side of the border to invest in each other’s economy, the opening up of the border that separates the two parts of Kashmir to trade and movement of people, and grant of transit rights to each other for trade with third countries.

As the experience of Europe shows, economic integration among states with a history of hostility towards one another is a good way of easing tensions. Taking that approach would constitute real thinking outside the box.
 

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Pakistan is all set to move the World Bank (WB) for appointment of a neutral expert instead of opting for the Court of Arbitration on the Indian Kishanganga Hydropower Project.
As the so called "Azad Kashmir" is Dejure Indian Territory under the Instrument of Accession and provisions of the Indian Government Act 1935 and the Indian Independence Act 1947 therefore the GOP has no right to go for WB assistance in the case of the Krishnaganga project
 

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they'll gonna lose again as happened in Baglihar Dam case.coz we are never in voilation of treaty.even khaled ahmed in above article mentions it that india has not voilated the treaty.its the pakistani leadershi who in order to hide their failure in water mismanagement and water staling by punjab try to put blame on india.

India allowed storage and some use of Western Rivers : Our bearded Water Commissioner Jamaat Ali Shah once symbolised our lower riparian alarmism, returning from his meetings in India with his dire warnings about the male fides of Indian intent. Today he is being castigated and even insulted on TV programmes because his accumulated knowledge prevents him from crossing the line on the jurisprudence of the 1960 Treaty. Discussants fall into red-faced paroxysms when he says India is not in violation even though it is in the process of building dozens of dams over our rivers – Indus, Chenab, Jhelum – and diverting water from Kishenganga.
 

ajtr

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‘Water’ in India-Pakistan talks

As differences can be dealt with within the ambit of the Indus Waters Treaty, there is no case for raising them in a different forum.

Pakistan wishes to bring water on to the agenda for future talks. Siddharth Varadarajan (“Water as the carrier of concord with Pakistan,” The Hindu, February 25) takes a benign view of this development and sees in it a positive potential for cooperation. I should like to put forward a different perspective.

The Indus Waters Treaty 1960, which settled the sharing of the Indus waters, is internationally regarded as an example of successful conflict-resolution between two countries otherwise locked in a bad relationship. The Treaty contains provisions for dealing with any ‘questions' or ‘differences' or ‘disputes' that might arise in the course of operation. (These can arise not over water-sharing but over technical features of Indian projects on the western rivers.) The arbitration clause was actually used to settle the differences that arose over the Baglihar Project. Questions or differences on other projects can be similarly dealt with. Why then is Pakistan raising ‘water' as a subject for India-Pakistan talks, and why is it giving it considerable salience?

India is reported to have told Pakistan that there is no case for including water in the agenda for the ‘composite dialogue' (as and when resumed) because there is another forum for talking about it; but Pakistan is likely to persist in its efforts. It is therefore necessary to understand why it is doing so. There are three possible explanations.

The first and most obvious one is that Pakistan wants to deflect attention from the Indian focus on terrorism, and unsettle India by accusing it of wrongdoing on water. The second explanation is that an attempt is being made to shift attention away from inter-provincial conflicts within Pakistan over water and other matters by portraying India as the cause of water-shortages in Pakistan, and bringing the disputing provinces together by rousing national anger against the national enemy, India. The third explanation is that Pakistan is indeed dissatisfied with the working of the Indus Treaty and feels that it must be on the agenda for any serious India-Pakistan talks. Possibly, a combination of all three factors lies behind Pakistan's move to raise the subject of water.

This seems to me a dubious and dangerous move. The inclusion of water in the India-Pakistan talks might give the world the impression that water is an unresolved issue between the two countries and, worse still, that India implicitly accepts that it has given Pakistan cause for complaints about water.

Even more important is the fact that water is a highly sensitive issue over which passions are easily roused. After the attack on Mumbai, when there was some uneasiness in Pakistan, the Pakistan army was able to rally the entire country behind it (the army) by raising the bogey of war and causing the spirit of nationalism to surge and drown all other feelings. Water is an issue that has similar potential. A feeling of insecurity over this life-sustaining substance, and the further feeling that it can be used as a weapon of war by an enemy country, can be used to mobilise the whole country against India. On this subject, as on the Kashmir issue, even members of ‘civil society' (including intellectuals, academics and others who advocate good relations with India) are likely to echo the government/army view (or the view that these cynically put forward), and anger against India will blaze across Pakistan.

(It may be recalled that in October 2008, the Pakistani media and general public were led to believe that India had stopped the flow of the Chenab, when all that had happened was that India was doing the initial one-time filling of the reservoir of the newly constructed — and arbitrated — Baglihar Project, and it took a day or two for the water to reach the spillway gates, placed high as required by the Treaty, and flow to the other side. If the gates had been still higher as Pakistan wanted, it would have taken some more time for the water to reach them.)

If water does come on to the agenda of India-Pakistan talks, even international opinion may be tilted towards Pakistan because the sympathy of the world is generally with the lower riparian rather than the upper riparian.

Let us consider the possibility that Pakistan has genuine concerns over water. Two kinds of arguments are often heard. The first is that the Indus treaty was unfair to Pakistan and gave India too much water. This is a widespread belief in Pakistan. The other argument is that Pakistan as the lower riparian is vulnerable because India as the upper riparian will acquire a measure of control over the waters through the structures that it builds on the western rivers, and can use those structures either to stop the waters from flowing to Pakistan or to store the waters and then release them in a flood.

Insofar as the feeling of unfair division of the waters is concerned, it exists in India too, and is quite strong. If both India and Pakistan feel that the division of waters is unfair, then it is perhaps quite a fair division. In any case, when a Treaty is negotiated over a period of ten years or more and is then approved and signed at the highest level, we have to assume that it represented the best agreement that could be reached at that time. Thereafter either side is precluded from talking about unfairness. If a feeling of dissatisfaction develops in time, the Treaty can of course be re-negotiated. However, in any such re-negotiation, either side would want to change the Treaty to its own advantage; and it is clearly impossible for both sides to succeed in that effort. The best course, therefore, would be to leave the Treaty alone and try and operate it in a spirit of constructive cooperation.

As for apprehensions of harm, it is the Indian view that there is no ground for them. However, it is a fact that lower riparians do feel a visceral anxiety about upper riparian control. That is why the Indus Treaty 1960 contains elaborate provisions to safeguard the interests of Pakistan. These include various aspects of design, engineering and operation of the proposed projects. The provisions are very stringent and, further, India is required to communicate its plans and designs in advance to Pakistan to enable that country to satisfy itself that these conform to the Treaty stipulations.

Pakistan would of course be happy if there were no Indian projects at all on the western rivers; but that is not what the Treaty says. It allocates the western rivers to Pakistan but allows some limited Indian use of those rivers, subject to certain conditions. It follows that what Pakistan can ask for is strict adherence to the Treaty. If it has doubts on this score it can take recourse to the Treaty provisions for dealing with differences. As differences can be dealt with within the ambit of the Treaty, there is no case for raising them in a different forum.

Finally, is there a scope for ‘cooperation' or for joint projects under the Treaty? There is hardly any ground for such a ‘positive' view. The ideal course of joint integrated management of the Indus basin as a whole by the two countries was ruled out by the circumstances of Partition and the bitter hostility of the two countries. Instead, a division of the waters was agreed upon, with stringent restrictions on Indian use to safeguard the interests of Pakistan. The Treaty is thus a partitioning Treaty. The land was partitioned in 1947, and the waters were partitioned in 1960. There is indeed an article on cooperation (art. VII), but the kind of cooperation that it envisages is extremely limited. It is hardly possible to base any large visions of cooperation on that article.

The relationship between the two countries which was very bad for years seemed to improve recently, but it has deteriorated again. Besides, if the raising of water as a subject for discussion is in fact a disingenuous tactical move, how can that provide a basis for a constructive new relationship?
 

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