India set to join NSG

Bheeshma

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Forget all these shitty bitty and MTCR. Staying outside India can sell Agni-I/II and Prithvis which are being replaced by Brahmos, Agni-4 & 5. We need to start testing the BMD phase -2 missiles and deploy Phase 1 all over India.
 

Illusive

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Forget all these shitty bitty and MTCR. Staying outside India can sell Agni-I/II and Prithvis which are being replaced by Brahmos, Agni-4 & 5. We need to start testing the BMD phase -2 missiles and deploy Phase 1 all over India.
Most of these missiles are old and expensive without nukes. If only somehow vietnam got its hand on nukes somehow ;)
 

Kshatriya87

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http://www.thehindu.com/news/nation...er-indias-admission-to-nsg/article7824793.ece

'Not signing the NPT could hamper India's admission to NSG'

India has sought membership of the 48-member elite nuclear exporters group the NSG since 2008.
India has sought membership of the 48-member elite nuclear exporters group the NSG since 2008, when it won a special waiver for to end nuclear sanctions. However its refusal to sign the NPT remains a stumbling block, although the Chairperson of the NSG Ambassador Rafael Grossi, who is visiting New Delhi, says a solution may be possible soon. He spoke in this exclusive interview to Diplomatic Editor Suhasini Haidar.

Excerpts:

Give us a sense of how your meetings in New Delhi went, and where the discussion on India’s NSG membership is…

Well I am the chair of the nuclear suppliers group, elected in 2014, and re-elected for another year. In that capacity, one of the responsibilities is to coordinate the consulatations on the political issues before the group. As you know India has been particularly interested in joining the nuclear suppliers group and I am here to steer the consultations so as to bring that request to a fruition.

How long could this process take? In the past few months India has applied to other regimes like the MTCR…

This depends. There is a political issue, but also a technical aspect to it, because the group has to analyse India’s compatibility with NSG guidelines. That is a dual process, and it can go in parallel or in sequence. So there is no fixed time. In some cases it can take less than a year, in some others more. The whole question here is whether we can steer the group into taking a decision on India. The issue has been discussed.

Is India looking at a timeline…did Ms. Swaraj indicate that in your meetings with her?

Well she didn’t put it like that. Let’s just say, India is willing to join the NSG now, today if possible . It has all the elements in place for membership. There have been some deliberations already, and I am trying to make the process more dynamic. The magnitude of India’s civil nuclear programme makes it one of the most dynamic countries in the world. It is developing, building nuclear power plants. All this activity will translate into more trade.

India has all elements in place, as you said. It has concluded agreements with the IAEA, as well as US, Canada and others. It hopes to conclude with Australia and make progress with Japan. What is holding it back from the NSG membership?

Within the group there are those who believe the fact that India is not a signatory to the NPT (non proliferation treaty). So the key to this matter is to see whether the group can find a solution. That is the challenge,

Is there a broad consensus within the NSG there, or is the NSG deeply divided?

I wouldn’t say it is divided. I don’t think there is a single member of the NSG that is against India. Most if not all of them have excellent relations with India. But this has to do with the non proliferation issue as a whole. The group could introduce a solution to benefit India, but there are other non-NPT countries that have aspirations.

Would the introduction of India be a negation of the NPT all together? Especially since the NSG was set up in reaction to India’s 1974 nuclear tests.

I haven’t heard anyone say that, but some are putting the question that bringing India in would weaken the non-proliferation regime. Others say it is better to bring India inside the tent rather than keep it out.

Does the world still need the NPT, or is it outdated?

That’s a big question…I do believe it needs the NPT and also a stronger non proliferation regime. We need an interlocking system of agreements that would allow all of us to work in nuclear trade. This is not like making ice-cream. India is an active trader, and a responsible one too…but we have to make sure all members are not contributing to destabilization somewhere else.

Have you asked India to sign the NPT?

No, my mandate is for the 48 countries of the NSG. We have a good dialogue with India, and we compare India’s institutionality in this areas to reconcile with the NSG’s parameters.

You said no one country is against India…are reports that China has tried to block India’s entry incorrect?

Those are not correct. What we have is an ongoing discussion. No one has blocked anything. The discussions are open and constructive.

What about reports that China proposes to support Pakistan’s membership to the NSG as well?

That is for China to say. What I can say is that I need all the countries to help me with this dialogue. Nobody disputes that India is a key, major player in the nuclear scenario, hence there is a recognition that some formula must be found for India (to become a member) and I think it is possible.

Would the formula for India also allow for the other non-NPT countries like Pakistan and Israel to be included?

Everything is possible, if there is a will to have political arrangements. I myself worked at the OPCW, when we were negotiation the CWC an arrangement was found so that everyone was included. It is not impossible to find solutions. The big question is how to reconcile the views. Consensus is not a zero sum game. And since you mentioned other non-NPT countries, I would say that we need to find a formula that is applicable to all. It would not be sustainable for us to go for a tailor made solution that is India-specific. The group may wish to go for that, but my diplomatic intuition is we need a broader solution that is applicable to all.

Given that all members of the NSG have to agree on India’s membership, how would you characterize the support for India within the NSG?

I would say that since we operate on the basis of consensus, not votes, it would be difficult to say how many are in favour of India now and how many are not. What I would say is that there is a growing recognition that given the role and weight of India in global affairs, this issue must be addressed and solved sooner rather than later. The NSG has to put itself in a decision making mode, and not addressing the problem is bad politics. This is an important issue. We care about non-proliferation, and India is doing more and more, so the NSG must factor this in.

How soon could all this play out?

I am conducting consultations now to see if we can move into a decisive phase. If I said anymore I might endanger the consultations. I have to speak to all NSG members first, and see what they want. If there are issues, they must be confronted, and if the group wants India to do anything specifically for the membership, then we must convey it. This circular debate is bad for everybody.
 
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This is really strange India is doing nuclear deals and not demanding NSG seat? Expected 150 billion dollars in nuclear deals and no NSG seat means Indian govt does not have a clue about how to do deals.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Mikesingh

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In this age and geo political environment, India will never test a nuclear bomb - ever. And that's for sure. So the question is:

Why doesn't India sign the NPT thereby pulling the rug from under the feet of the Pakis? This way it would be a cinch for India to get membership of any nuke club like the NSG etc.
 
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In this age and geo political environment, India will never test a nuclear bomb - ever. And that's for sure. So the question is:

Why doesn't India sign the NPT thereby pulling the rug from under the feet of the Pakis? This way it would be a cinch for India to get membership of any nuke club like the NSG etc.
Nsg and NPT are two separate things . India has more or less unofficially signed NPT with the US nuclear deal. China has done everything to prevent India from joining nsg which would accelerate nuclear trade between India and other countries .
 

AnantS

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India should never sign NPT. Period! Until India carries out another round of testing AND N-5 expands to N-5+1(India) with equal rights.

It would be stupid of this Govt to sign NPT!!
 

Neo

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In this age and geo political environment, India will never test a nuclear bomb - ever. And that's for sure. So the question is:

Why doesn't India sign the NPT thereby pulling the rug from under the feet of the Pakis? This way it would be a cinch for India to get membership of any nuke club like the NSG etc.
India signing NPTwould be a blessing for Pakistan as we will follow suit which might ease the entry into NSG. That is exactly what both China and Pakistan want.
 

Indx TechStyle

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India signing NPTwould be a blessing for Pakistan as we will follow suit which might ease the entry into NSG. That is exactly what both China and Pakistan want.
India signing NPT will push pak in NSG? :crazy:
FYI, NSG was formed because of Indian Atomic Weapon tests. So, it's India key role.
For pakistan, new generation of Indian kids don't know what's pakistan, nobody cares but you guys keep whining. :rofl:
 

ezsasa

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India signing NPTwould be a blessing for Pakistan as we will follow suit which might ease the entry into NSG. That is exactly what both China and Pakistan want.
Why do you think western media has suddenly started harping about Pakistani tactical nuclear warheads? Just to preempt what you are saying.

Your media did not help either, in ensuring everybody knows tactical nuclear weapons are part of your arsenal.
 

Rahul Singh

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In this age and geo political environment, India will never test a nuclear bomb - ever. And that's for sure. So the question is:

Why doesn't India sign the NPT thereby pulling the rug from under the feet of the Pakis? This way it would be a cinch for India to get membership of any nuke club like the NSG etc.
Oh its so wrong here. Any weapon system needs testing before induction, and same goes true for nuclear bombs. And we need better bombs than we have right now. This should be obvious from the fact why we do not want to sign NPT. There will be tests, more of it in future. Keep no doubt about it.

And BTW NSG or no NSG India will find its way around. Getting in treaties with individual supplying nations holds key to it. Something which we already doing, and are getting what we need, however not as much as we need. But it will also be solved as we include more supplying nations to the list.

With Mr.Modi in driving seat, our economy will grow exponentially and with it our influence will grow at world stage. It won't take much time to reduce the practical value of preventive groups like NSG to that of garbage.

Bottomline is: we should just focus on developing our economy and many of our present problems will get solved. That unlike an idiotic banana republic that is there on our west which has a history of trying to join every other group that is there on worlds stage.:rofl:
 

roma

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With Mr.Modi in driving seat, our economy will grow exponentially and with it our influence will grow at world stage. It won't take much time to reduce the practical value of preventive groups like NSG to that of garbage.
.
i agree with the first 3/4 of your post ...but the last portion mentioned above is the part that i seek clarification from as many members as possible

one of your "emphatic" statements is that under Namo's leadership
Quote" the econ will grow exponentially"

Namo has had 40% of the term of office

So my question therefore is :-

has he achieved at least 25% of his stated goals ? at the very least in the critical areas ?
if he has fine....then we are on track and i can accept your statement

otherwise ? ...is it another dream ?

but i'd like members' responses please



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Last edited:

Screambowl

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How would India give Brahmost to Vietnam then?
 

Rahul Singh

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i agree with the first 3/4 of your post ...but the last portion mentioned above is the part that i seek clarification from as many members as possible

one of your "emphatic" statements is that under Namo's leadership
Quote" the econ will grow exponentially"

Namo has had 40% of the term of office

So my question therefore is :-

has he achieved at least 25% of his stated goals ? at the very least in the critical areas ?
if he has fine....then we are on track and i can accept your statement

otherwise ? ...is it another dream ?

but i'd like members' responses please



@PrashantAzazel
@angeldude13 @Abhijat @Ancient Indian @anupamsurey @aliyah @Alien[/USER ]@angeldude13 [USER=14535]@Abhijat @Ancient Indian @anupamsurey @aliyah @Alien @Aravind Sanjeev @A chauhan @asingh10
@aditya g @asianobserve @Bahamut @BATTLE FIELD @bose @Bornubus @brational @blueblood @Blackwater @Blood+ @bhai-117 @Bangalorean @bengalraider @Bengal_Tiger @biswas_k11
@cobra commando @Chirag @Chris Jude @Chinmoy @Cadian @DingDong @dhananjay1 @ersakthivel @FRYCRY @Gessler @garg_bharat @guru-dutt @Hari Sud @hit&run @HeinzGud @indiandefencefan @I_PLAY_BAD @Indian Devil @Indibomber @Jangaruda @jackprince @Kshatriya87 @LETHALFORCE @laughingbuddha @mhk99
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Cause of optimism lies in seeds his government is sowing. Fruits will obviously come in time but projected economic growth figures are optimistic. Also there is sea of change in attitude towards defence manufacturing with a renewed enthusiasm towards export.....i will prepare a better post in morning. Right now its late here. But if i can say in one line, then will be, dynamic leadership of NAMO is the reflection of future.
 

sasum

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And we need better bombs than we have right now. This should be obvious from the fact why we do not want to sign NPT. There will be tests, more of it in future. Keep no doubt about it.
Our nuclear bombs are crude, low-yield bombs. We needed to test many more. Thermo-nuclear test was a failure. Only fission part took place. Fusion fizzled out. And if we undo the self-imposed moratorium on testing, we have to say goodbye to civil nuclear deal. Civil Nuclear Deal is nothing but an India specific NPT.

Getting in treaties with individual supplying nations holds key to it.
Largest uranium suppliers in the world are Australia & Canada, both NATO members. India could sign treaty with those countries only after US gave nod in the wake of civil nuclear agreement. Without the blessings of uncle Sam India can not do a thing.
@roma .
I am not very optimistic about India's economic revival under Modi. As soon as he assumed office in 2014, he started globe-trotting to satiate his wonder-lust. Publicly though, he went to bring home billions of dollars of FDI from as diverse countries as China, Japan, US & Australia (nothing really came on ground). No new jobs created, however, inflation remained controllable thanks to crash in international crude prices resulting in swelling of India's Foreign Exchange reserve and improving balance of payment situation.
All these things didn't register in Modi's child-like mind as he drew up plans to blow up scarce resources on Sardar Patel Memoriam, Smart Cities, Bullet Trains.......
 

DingDong

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i agree with the first 3/4 of your post ...but the last portion mentioned above is the part that i seek clarification from as many members as possible

one of your "emphatic" statements is that under Namo's leadership
Quote" the econ will grow exponentially"

Namo has had 40% of the term of office

So my question therefore is :-

has he achieved at least 25% of his stated goals ? at the very least in the critical areas ?
if he has fine....then we are on track and i can accept your statement

otherwise ? ...is it another dream ?

but i'd like members' responses please



@PrashantAzazel
@angeldude13 @Abhijat @Ancient Indian @anupamsurey @aliyah @Alien[/USER ]@angeldude13 [USER=14535]@Abhijat @Ancient Indian @anupamsurey @aliyah @Alien @Aravind Sanjeev @A chauhan @asingh10
@aditya g @asianobserve @Bahamut @BATTLE FIELD @bose @Bornubus @brational @blueblood @Blackwater @Blood+ @bhai-117 @Bangalorean @bengalraider @Bengal_Tiger @biswas_k11
@cobra commando @Chirag @Chris Jude @Chinmoy @Cadian @DingDong @dhananjay1 @ersakthivel @FRYCRY @Gessler @garg_bharat @guru-dutt @Hari Sud @hit&run @HeinzGud @indiandefencefan @I_PLAY_BAD @Indian Devil @Indibomber @Jangaruda @jackprince @Kshatriya87 @LETHALFORCE @laughingbuddha @mhk99
@MetsaMan @Mark Antony @manutdfan
@maomao @Navneet Kundu @Neil @Nicky G @OneGrimPilgrim @pmaitra @parijataka @PaliwalWarrior @Pulkit @Rowdy @Razor @Rashna @rock127 @R.parida @shade @sasum @smestarz
@Sakal Gharelu Ustad @Srinivas_K @sunnyv @sgarg @sabari @Sameet2 @saik @sorcerer @Superdefender @sydsnyper @Sridevi @SREEKAR @Screambowl @Sylex21 @Tactical Frog @TejasMK3 @The enlightened @tejas warrior @tharun @thethinker @tsunami @VIP @VaghaDeva @Vishwarupa @Vishal Guts @Yusuf @Yumdoot @Zebra[/USER]
post 2014 government might not have done much but it has changed the way we think and make political decisions. We Indians feel proud of ourselves more than ever before, we are confident and we are positive about our future.

This small change in the mindset is the first step towards changing the fundamentals. If 2016 and 2017 bring good monsoon then we will witness huge jump in the rural consumption and a surge in growth.
 

Bornubus

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Forget all these shitty bitty and MTCR. Staying outside India can sell Agni-I/II and Prithvis which are being replaced by Brahmos, Agni-4 & 5. We need to start testing the BMD phase -2 missiles and deploy Phase 1 all over India.
According to wikileaks Prithvi will no longer be used for delivering nukes but as a long range artillery.
 

Indx TechStyle

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Our nuclear bombs are crude, low-yield bombs. We needed to test many more. Thermo-nuclear test was a failure. Only fission part took place. Fusion fizzled out. And if we undo the self-imposed moratorium on testing, we have to say goodbye to civil nuclear deal. Civil Nuclear Deal is nothing but an India specific NPT.
They are low yield against P5,but enough for pakis.
Largest uranium suppliers in the world are Australia & Canada, both NATO members. India could sign treaty with those countries only after US gave nod in the wake of civil nuclear agreement. Without the blessings of uncle Sam India can not do a thing.
So, you're scaring us with US? :D
@roma .
I am not very optimistic about India's economic revival under Modi.
No surprise Every commie says so.
As soon as he assumed office in 2014, he started globe-trotting to satiate his wonder-lust. Publicly though,
Boosted international relationship and better diplomacy.
he went to bring home billions of dollars of FDI from as diverse countries as China, Japan, US & Australia (nothing really came on ground).
Then, what was this?
:rofl:
India pips US, China as No. 1 Foreign Direct Investment(FDI) destination
No new jobs created,
24 lakh people got jobs in one day, during launch of Skill India mission.
Plan is still underway and major change will be in next five years plan.
however, inflation remained controllable thanks to crash in international crude prices resulting in swelling of India's Foreign Exchange reserve and improving balance of payment situation.
Only international crude price controlled inflation in entire country? :doh:
Anyway, inflation plus ruppee re appreciation is needed for economic growth otherwise we will lag behind in nominal GDP.
Prizes need to grow.
All these things didn't register in Modi's child-like mind as he drew up plans to blow up scarce resources on Sardar Patel Memoriam, Smart Cities, Bullet Trains.......
Construction of First Bullet train starting in 2017,
3 smart cities already under construction
Saradr Patel Memorial too is now going well on schedule.
Ask for links if needed. :namaste:
 

Anikastha

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i agree with the first 3/4 of your post ...but the last portion mentioned above is the part that i seek clarification from as many members as possible

one of your "emphatic" statements is that under Namo's leadership
Quote" the econ will grow exponentially"

Namo has had 40% of the term of office

So my question therefore is :-

has he achieved at least 25% of his stated goals ? at the very least in the critical areas ?
if he has fine....then we are on track and i can accept your statement

otherwise ? ...is it another dream ?

but i'd like members' responses please



@PrashantAzazel
@angeldude13 @Abhijat @Ancient Indian @anupamsurey @aliyah @Alien[/USER ]@angeldude13 [USER=14535]@Abhijat @Ancient Indian @anupamsurey @aliyah @Alien @Aravind Sanjeev @A chauhan @asingh10
@aditya g @asianobserve @Bahamut @BATTLE FIELD @bose @Bornubus @brational @blueblood @Blackwater @Blood+ @bhai-117 @Bangalorean @bengalraider @Bengal_Tiger @biswas_k11
@cobra commando @Chirag @Chris Jude @Chinmoy @Cadian @DingDong @dhananjay1 @ersakthivel @FRYCRY @Gessler @garg_bharat @guru-dutt @Hari Sud @hit&run @HeinzGud @indiandefencefan @I_PLAY_BAD @Indian Devil @Indibomber @Jangaruda @jackprince @Kshatriya87 @LETHALFORCE @laughingbuddha @mhk99
@MetsaMan @Mark Antony @manutdfan
@maomao @Navneet Kundu @Neil @Nicky G @OneGrimPilgrim @pmaitra @parijataka @PaliwalWarrior @Pulkit @Rowdy @Razor @Rashna @rock127 @R.parida @shade @sasum @smestarz
@Sakal Gharelu Ustad @Srinivas_K @sunnyv @sgarg @sabari @Sameet2 @saik @sorcerer @Superdefender @sydsnyper @Sridevi @SREEKAR @Screambowl @Sylex21 @Tactical Frog @TejasMK3 @The enlightened @tejas warrior @tharun @thethinker @tsunami @VIP @VaghaDeva @Vishwarupa @Vishal Guts @Yusuf @Yumdoot @Zebra[/USER]
Can't say about MTCR...but China won't allow India to enter NSG ( Nuclear supply group).
Last year America said "they will support India for UNSC..But what happened?
America or China won't take any risk by allowing rise of another super power. Take it for granted.
Until we put end to corruption, extremist movements and other problems , We can't get into any group.
 

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