India set to join NSG

Mad Indian

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If Pakistan gets NSG membership, this will multi fold their nuclear and power generation capabilities. Thus overcoming power crisis. This will give them platform to set up manufacturing industries.
Pak is never going to get NSG cclearance in its lifetime. Forget about it. Even Russia cant do something about that for Iran , when Russia has more no. of allies and satelites than PRC. The only friends China has are NoKo and Pak, China cant do shit with diplomacy. China is heading towards what it always has been historically - underachiving and isolated, full of its own BS superiority . And seriously, who is gonna back Pak for NSG waiver in NSG?
 
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Maddy

I never gave it more than a .00001 percent chance of happening. It makes china look silly . Like a commie pawn for a bunch of terrorists.
 

sorcerer

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India and the Missile Regime

India's long-awaited entry into the Missile Technology Control Regime is beneficial to both India and the International Non-Proliferation Community
by Arka Biswas
In June 2015, India formally applied for membership to the Missile Technology Control Regime (MTCR), and a decision on India’s membership is expected to be taken at the upcoming annual plenary of the MTCR in October 2015. Once a target of the regime and treated as an outsider by the global non-proliferation community, India has traversed a long way to now becoming a strong partner of the same community. As India seeks to contribute further to the cause of non-proliferation, it is also in the interest of the global non-proliferation community to bring New Delhi—a potential industrial producer and supplier of many, if not all, sensitive items covered—into its folds to ensure that the same rules apply to India as they do to other suppliers. While MTCR members assess India’s membership application, it will be important to understand what the objective of the regime has been and to identify how India can contribute to the same. Also critical will be assessing if India meets all the technical requirements to be a part of the MTCR. Finally, it is important to acknowledge the benefits of India’s entry into the MTCR.

Established in 1987, MTCR is a voluntary and consensus-based association of countries, set up to build a level of export control measures focused on curtailing the horizontal spread of missile systems capable of delivering weapons of mass destruction (WMDs). As Barry J. Hurewitz notes, it was the inadequacy of the pre-existing non-proliferation bodies—namely the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty (NPT) and the Nuclear Suppliers Group (NSG)—in addressing the challenge of global nuclear proliferation through export of weapon delivery systems which led to the inception of the MTCR. Though the initial focus was on missile systems capable of delivering nuclear weapons, the regime later expanded its scope to include the missiles and unmanned aerial vehicles (UAVs) which could deliver chemical and biological weapons.

India has applied for MTCR membership as a part of its efforts to integrate itself with the global non-proliferation community. As C. Raja Mohan notes, the efforts began right after its nuclear tests in 1998, when India expressed its support for the basic objectives of the NPT—marking a complete turnaround from the approach it had previously demonstrated. The United States, one of the founding designers of the existing global non-proliferation architecture, realized that while India would not join the NPT, it could play a crucial role in strengthening other non-proliferation and export control bodies. This was the premise of the India-U.S. nuclear initiative which began in 2005, and over the years, the importance of integrating India with the global non-proliferation architecture has now been realized by many other governments, including Australia, Canada, France, Germany, Japan, Russia, South Korea and the United Kingdom.

This understanding resulted in the first phase of India’s acceptance into global non-proliferation architecture, channelled via the waiver from the NSG’s full-scope safeguards requirement in 2008 and a special safeguards agreement signed with the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) for India’s civilian nuclear facilities, allowing India to engage in global nuclear commerce.

India’s entry in the four export control bodies, including the NSG, the Wassenaar Arrangement, and the Australia Group, is the next phase of India’s integration into the global non-proliferation community and New Delhi’s application for membership to the MTCR is the first step of this phase.
Considering that MTCR’s sole objective has been to globally control exports of missile technologies and related items, standards of the non-proliferation and export control policies and practices of a particular country shape the prospect of its inclusion in the regime. While India has always remained committed to non-proliferation of sensitive items covered by the MTCR, it has updated its domestic laws as well as its Special Chemicals, Organisms, Materials, Equipment, and Technologies (SCOMET) List in the last five years, harmonizing them completely with the MTCR guidelines. This has been recognized by the US and all other like-minded partners.IDN

Meanwhile, it has been argued that a country’s pursuit of developing and modernizing missile technology could go against the spirit of the regime and that such a country should not be included in the MTCR. In the Indian context, skeptics argue that New Delhi is treated as an outsider for its pursuit of a guided missile development program. Such arguments, however, do not hold strong ground, because the MTCR, far from requiring it, does not even suggest that its members curb indigenous development of missile technologies or related items. This is further exemplified by the fact that some of the current members of the regime are known to have run or are currently running their own missile development programs.

India’s entry into the regime will benefit both India and the MTCR. Membership in the regime will allow India to better contribute to the global non-proliferation cause. It will also enhance the level of understanding between MTCR members and India, allowing the latter to import dual-use technologies and items for peaceful purposes. On the other hand, by including India, MTCR members will ensure that all supplies of sensitive missile and related technologies that India exports will adhere to MTCR guidelines and that the same rules will apply to New Delhi as they do to other MTCR suppliers. The proceedings and outcome of the upcoming MTCR plenary will shape the future of India’s engagement with not just the MTCR but also the broader global non-proliferation community.

Source>>
 

blue marlin

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NEW DELHI: Barring an unpleasant last-minute surprise, India could be accepted as a member in the Missile Technology Control Regime (MTCR) next week. One of the world's top four non-proliferation regimes, the MTCR plenary will be held in Rotterdam where the Indian application for membership will be considered. The 34-nation grouping takes decisions by consensus.

Since India made a formal application for membership in summer this year, India has worked closely with key countries who have promised to support its membership. If India is accepted in the grouping it would be a huge fillip to its missile and space programmes, even allowing it to export its own technology to member countries. In recent years, MTCR has even assumed oversight regarding non-proliferation of UAVs - ironically, Pakistan, not a member of MTCR, has just developed its own armed drones which it has recently used on its own people.

Accession to MTCR is one of the leftover tasks of the India-US nuclear deal. The US had promised to support India's membership to all four - Wassenaar Arrangement, Nuclear Suppliers Group and Australia Group, along with MTCR. Initially, Indian diplomatic push was to bundle its membership to all four. The Indian thinking then was India could leverage its candidature all at once rather than lobby separately for all four. However, that thinking underwent a change and the MEA decided to approach all four regimes separately.

It was originally believed that Australia Group would be the easiest to get into. But India still has to harmonize some of its controls on chemicals etc to make the cut. Instead the government has worked hard to harmonize its export control lists, called SCOMET with MTCR regulations. In March 2015, Indian government put in a host of new items on the SCOMET list which would need prior permission before exports and invite strict oversight by government agencies. A second list on military items also served to harmonize export licensing of military stores, a key compliance demand for MTCR. Acceptance to MTCR might make it easier for India to access the other regimes, though no one is in any doubt about how difficult it would be for India to get into the NSG, where China remains opposed.

Between the PM, foreign minister Sushma Swaraj and even President Pranab Mukherjee, the government has lobbied with all the members of the MTCR in the past year. Officials said Indians have been ready with answers to any question put to them by MTCR members. The US has worked closely as well, lobbying for India, the first time after the nuclear deal waiver at the NSG. In the recently concluded Strategic Dialogue between Swaraj and John Kerry, the joint statement noted, "The US side affirms its support for India's membership in the Missile Technology Control Regime at its upcoming plenary, the Nuclear Suppliers Group, and in the other global non-proliferation export control regimes."

China is not a member of the MTCR but has promised to abide by the original 1987 Guidelines and Annexure, but not the subsequent revisions. China has also asked for membership, but China, like Pakistan, is believed to have lax export control systems.

Established in 1987, the MTCR aims to curb the spread of delivery systems like missiles which carry a minimum payload of 500 kg to a distance of a minimum of 300km.

su-39mki firing astra bvraam
http://**********/attachments/astra-jpg.261865/
 

warrior monk

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Good news when it becomes reality
It means the international community has finally come to terms with our nuclear weapons program and its delivery vehicles , India becomes the third country within the group other than Russia and US which has an extensive indigenous ballistic missile program including both land and sea based capabilities.
 

Neo

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Italy Blocks Indian Application to MTCR
By Tom Kington and Vivek Raghuvanshi 4:47 p.m. EDT October 17, 2015



(Photo: Frederick Florin/AFP via Getty Images)

ROME and NEW DELHI — Italy has blocked India’s application to join a key missile and UAV technology control committee in protest of India’s arrest of two Italian Marines suspected of shooting dead Indian fishermen.

Italy's veto of India’s entry into the Missile Technology Control Regime (MTCR), which counts 34 member states and was set up in 1987, was not supported by any other member and defies US ambitions to get India admitted to the club.

The diplomatic spat occurred in Rotterdam at the Oct. 5-9 plenary meeting of the group, whose members agree to work to stop the proliferation of missile and UAV technology capable of carrying a 500-kilogram payload for at least 300 kilometers.

Decisions to admit new members must be approved unanimously, which allowed Italy to block India’s entry.

“Italy was not ready to give its consensus to India’s application,” a source familiar with events at the meeting said.

The source added that members were aware that Italy’s decision was linked to the arrest of the Marines. “It didn’t come up,” he said, “but it was the subtext, everyone knew.”

The two Italian Marines, Massimiliano Latorre and Salvatore Girone, were guarding an Italian cargo ship off the Indian coast in 2012 when an Indian fishing boat approached. The Marines claim they fired warning shots, which went unheeded, and they were later arrested and held by Indian authorities for shooting dead two of the fishermen on board.

The case has dragged on, with the Hamburg-based International Tribunal for the Law of the Sea becoming involved this year, while Italian politicians have lambasted the Italian government for being unable to free them.

According to an official account of the MTCR meeting, “Partners exchanged views on issues relating to future membership. Individual applications for membership were thoroughly discussed. The membership issue will continue to be on the agenda.”

“While India failed to receive consensus support for its entry to the Missile Technology Control Regime this month,” an official of the Indian Ministry of External Affairs said, “India’s application was received well and it remains under consideration.”

India formally submitted an application in June with active support from member nations the US and France. US President Obama first made his support known for India’s entry during his visit to the country in 2010.

Originally founded by Canada, France, Germany, Italy, Japan, the UK and the US, the MTCR has since grown to include South Korea, Russia, Brazil, Turkey and Ukraine.

The Rotterdam meeting was chaired by Dutch ambassador at large Piet de Klerk, who will head the group this year on behalf of the Netherlands and Luxembourg.

Italy has itself fallen afoul of the MTCR. In 2009, it sought to offer the United Arab Emirates unmanned vehicle technologies, a deal that was attached to the sale of M-346 jet trainers to the Arabian Gulf state. When the UAV deal was deemed to fall outside the limits imposed by MTCR rules, the jet trainer sale collapsed, too.

In Rotterdam this month, India was not the only country whose entry was not agreed on unanimously.

“There is a list of new candidates,” the source said. Among them, he said, were the nine EU members not yet inside the group: Croatia, Cyprus, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Malta, Romania, Slovakia and Slovenia.

“The EU is pushing all members to become members of this group and three other groups,” the source said — the Nuclear Suppliers Group, which seeks to limit the spread of nuclear weapons; the Australia Group, which limits chemical weapons; and the Wassenaar Arrangement, a group of 41 states limiting the use of conventional weapons.

“The argument for bringing in the other EU members to the MTCR is that there is a risk that products could be transported there from an MTCR member under the EU’s free market rules before they are subsequently exported,” the source said. “On the other hand, one could argue the EU’s export policies should stop such exports anyway. This was discussed at the meeting.”

Italy’s veto of India’s entry follows the drawn-out entanglement between the two countries over allegations of corruption surrounding the sale of 12 Italian AW101 helicopters to India in 2010 for €560 million (US $639.2 million).

Giuseppe Orsi, the former CEO of Italian group Finmeccanica, was jailed and tried in Italy, prompting India to cancel the contract. But even after Orsi was acquitted last year, India’s anti-fraud agency, the Central Bureau of Investigation (CBI), continued its own probe.

Now, properties belonging to brothers of a former Indian Air Force chief, S.P. Tyagi, who were alleged to have been involved in the payoffs, have been seized.

A New Delhi court last month, following a request from the CBI, issued a warrant for the arrest of British consultant Christian Michel James, who is alleged to have been involved in the helicopter deal.

But the case could take years before it reaches any conclusion, given the slow track record of India’s investigating agencies.

Email: [email protected] | [email protected]

http://www.defensenews.com/story/de...v-missile-technology-control-regime/74019832/
 

maomao

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^^^^^ Booohoooooo Italy Blocked us!! LOL

How does it matter!! If we are gonna get NSG we will get it and pakis can't do shyt!! ;)
 

bose

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Italy Blocks Indian Application to MTCR
By Tom Kington and Vivek Raghuvanshi 4:47 p.m. EDT October 17, 2015



(Photo: Frederick Florin/AFP via Getty Images)

ROME and NEW DELHI — Italy has blocked India’s application to join a key missile and UAV technology control committee in protest of India’s arrest of two Italian Marines suspected of shooting dead Indian fishermen.

Italy's veto of India’s entry into the Missile Technology Control Regime (MTCR), which counts 34 member states and was set up in 1987, was not supported by any other member and defies US ambitions to get India admitted to the club.

The diplomatic spat occurred in Rotterdam at the Oct. 5-9 plenary meeting of the group, whose members agree to work to stop the proliferation of missile and UAV technology capable of carrying a 500-kilogram payload for at least 300 kilometers.

Decisions to admit new members must be approved unanimously, which allowed Italy to block India’s entry.

“Italy was not ready to give its consensus to India’s application,” a source familiar with events at the meeting said.

The source added that members were aware that Italy’s decision was linked to the arrest of the Marines. “It didn’t come up,” he said, “but it was the subtext, everyone knew.”

The two Italian Marines, Massimiliano Latorre and Salvatore Girone, were guarding an Italian cargo ship off the Indian coast in 2012 when an Indian fishing boat approached. The Marines claim they fired warning shots, which went unheeded, and they were later arrested and held by Indian authorities for shooting dead two of the fishermen on board.

The case has dragged on, with the Hamburg-based International Tribunal for the Law of the Sea becoming involved this year, while Italian politicians have lambasted the Italian government for being unable to free them.

According to an official account of the MTCR meeting, “Partners exchanged views on issues relating to future membership. Individual applications for membership were thoroughly discussed. The membership issue will continue to be on the agenda.”

“While India failed to receive consensus support for its entry to the Missile Technology Control Regime this month,” an official of the Indian Ministry of External Affairs said, “India’s application was received well and it remains under consideration.”

India formally submitted an application in June with active support from member nations the US and France. US President Obama first made his support known for India’s entry during his visit to the country in 2010.

Originally founded by Canada, France, Germany, Italy, Japan, the UK and the US, the MTCR has since grown to include South Korea, Russia, Brazil, Turkey and Ukraine.

The Rotterdam meeting was chaired by Dutch ambassador at large Piet de Klerk, who will head the group this year on behalf of the Netherlands and Luxembourg.

Italy has itself fallen afoul of the MTCR. In 2009, it sought to offer the United Arab Emirates unmanned vehicle technologies, a deal that was attached to the sale of M-346 jet trainers to the Arabian Gulf state. When the UAV deal was deemed to fall outside the limits imposed by MTCR rules, the jet trainer sale collapsed, too.

In Rotterdam this month, India was not the only country whose entry was not agreed on unanimously.

“There is a list of new candidates,” the source said. Among them, he said, were the nine EU members not yet inside the group: Croatia, Cyprus, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Malta, Romania, Slovakia and Slovenia.

“The EU is pushing all members to become members of this group and three other groups,” the source said — the Nuclear Suppliers Group, which seeks to limit the spread of nuclear weapons; the Australia Group, which limits chemical weapons; and the Wassenaar Arrangement, a group of 41 states limiting the use of conventional weapons.

“The argument for bringing in the other EU members to the MTCR is that there is a risk that products could be transported there from an MTCR member under the EU’s free market rules before they are subsequently exported,” the source said. “On the other hand, one could argue the EU’s export policies should stop such exports anyway. This was discussed at the meeting.”

Italy’s veto of India’s entry follows the drawn-out entanglement between the two countries over allegations of corruption surrounding the sale of 12 Italian AW101 helicopters to India in 2010 for €560 million (US $639.2 million).

Giuseppe Orsi, the former CEO of Italian group Finmeccanica, was jailed and tried in Italy, prompting India to cancel the contract. But even after Orsi was acquitted last year, India’s anti-fraud agency, the Central Bureau of Investigation (CBI), continued its own probe.

Now, properties belonging to brothers of a former Indian Air Force chief, S.P. Tyagi, who were alleged to have been involved in the payoffs, have been seized.

A New Delhi court last month, following a request from the CBI, issued a warrant for the arrest of British consultant Christian Michel James, who is alleged to have been involved in the helicopter deal.

But the case could take years before it reaches any conclusion, given the slow track record of India’s investigating agencies.

Email: [email protected] | [email protected]

http://www.defensenews.com/story/defense/policy-budget/warfare/2015/10/17/italy-blocks-indian-application-mtcr-uav-missile-technology-control-regime/74019832/
India need to take those two Italian Marine Bastards and parade them naked into the streets of Delhi...

I see more trouble for those Italian Marines !!
 

Neo

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India need to take those two Italian Marine Bastards and parade them naked into the streets of Delhi...

I see more trouble for those Italian Marines !!
How's that going to change anything?
Italy isn't the only country that's blocking the deal, it it?
 

roma

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Italy Blocks Indian Application to MTCR
By Tom Kington and Vivek Raghuvanshi 4:47 p.m. EDT October 17, 2015



(Photo: Frederick Florin/AFP via Getty Images)http://www.defensenews.com/story/de...v-missile-technology-control-regime/74019832/
^^^^^ Booohoooooo Italy Blocked us!! LOL
How does it matter!! If we are gonna get NSG we will get it and pakis can't do shyt!! ;)
@maomao - aw no probs bro , i know a great way to solve this and even that woman holding the protest placard in the pic above, which , incidentally, reads "Free Seas" , yes even she will be very happy with the deal that i propose to offer to the Italians

and it goes l ike this:-

we get to jail those naughty italian sailors but in return we send back to italy the infamous "italian woman " .... antonia etc etc ...........
now how about that ??

!invitation to comment and if you feel what ive written is interesting, go ahead and "clicke" :-
@angeldude13@Abhijat@Ancient Indian@anupamsurey@aliyah@bose @Bornubus @brational@blueblood@Blackwater@Blood+@Bangalorean@bengalraider@cobra commando@Chirag@DingDong@ersakthivel@guru-dutt@Hari Sud@hit&run
@indiandefencefan@I_PLAY_BAD@Indibomber@jackprince
@Kunal Biswas@LETHALFORCE@laughingbuddha@mhk99 @maomao @Neil@OneGrimPilgrim@pmaitra@PaliwalWarrior@Pulkit
@Rowdy@Razor@Rashna@[email protected]
@Sakal Gharelu Ustad@Srinivas_K@sgarg@sabari@Sameet2@saik@sorcerer@TejasMK3@The enlightened
@tejas warrior@tharun@thethinker@tsunami@Screambowl@Sylex21@VIP@Yusuf@Yumdoot@Zebra
@Nicky G@FRYCRY@Aravind Sanjeev@A chauhan
 
Last edited:

Rowdy

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These pizza people should focus on Pizza ... :lol:
 

bose

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How's that going to change anything?
Italy isn't the only country that's blocking the deal, it it?
India has done without it so nothing can change if some tom, dick or harry oppose it...

Infact India is fine without it... India will get it for sure, make no mistake !! it is a matter of time...

But for those two Italian Marines I see tough time ahead...
 
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Hari Sud

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Italy and those marines have learnt a lesson.

It is time to bury the hatchet with Italy.

The families could receive the blood money.

The international court which has the case now could summarily rule to compensate the victims families and the marines get a dishonable discharge.
 

Compersion

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The italians looks to be upset and have bring this into outside affairs like formula one (why india race not there and also their protest at race and especially not at other places where it is held - where dubious human rights) and even nsg and mtcr seems a bit strange. Italy and India are not bloody enemies but why the severe reactions.

If italy saying they did right. Develop a joint document together which States how such armed people ought to behave in future for both country that include India armed people in Mediterranean. And match it to.the facts of the case. Does italy understand the sensitivity of shooting people and imply them to be terrorists in south India. Near Pakistan might he plausible. But Pakistan is far away from incident.

How to get the Italian marines away from here ... Is it cordinates is it somethig more. Is it question of Indian law ... International law ... Italian law. Is it murder. It is not a civil case like how pakis deal with. Is it under islamic law (no way). The fact is Indians got killed and not terrorist. If italy case is that they were been attacked ... That will not only sound but look like they were near Pakistan when it was many km away and no risk of captain phillip pirates which is even further km away. And in international forum India might think they are Pakistan ally especially by way of blocking and denying ...

And they have been allowed compassionate leaves and bail and no death penalty. Good treatment ??
 
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Screambowl

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Italy is itself very less influential. And more over on the verge of getting bankrupt soon. Soon Germany and France will explain them the importance of India.

It is temporary veto, finally Italy is itself known for corrupt politicians.
 

tarunraju

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The italians looks to be upset and have bring this into outside affairs like formula one (why india race not there and also their protest at race and especially not at other places where it is held - where dubious human rights) and even nsg and mtcr seems a bit strange. Italy and India are not bloody enemies but why the severe reactions.

If italy saying they did right. Develop a joint document together which States how such armed people ought to behave in future for both country that include India armed people in Mediterranean. And match it to.the facts of the case. Does italy understand the sensitivity of shooting people and imply them to be terrorists in south India. Near Pakistan might he plausible. But Pakistan is far away from incident.

How to get the Italian marines away from here ... Is it cordinates is it somethig more. Is it question of Indian law ... International law ... Italian law. Is it murder. It is not a civil case like how pakis deal with. Is it under islamic law (no way). The fact is Indians got killed and not terrorist. If italy case is that they were been attacked ... That will not only sound but look like they were near Pakistan when it was many km away and no risk of captain phillip pirates which is even further km away. And in international forum India might think they are Pakistan ally especially by way of blocking and denying ...

And they have been allowed compassionate leaves and bail and no death penalty. Good treatment ??
I've written to PMO telling them to use FiatPowerTrain (FPT) MultiJet diesel engine as leverage to win Italy's vote. In the wake of VW-TDIgate, it would be a shame if Fiat MultiJet engine suddenly failed emission tests. Think about all the Fiat, Tata, Maruti Suzuki and Chevrolet cars that will run out of diesel engines overnight, and the billions of dollars in annual revenue losses for FPT from India.
 

sayareakd

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Forget this bias treaty, we are not testing Agni missiles for some time. Even BMD are put to cold storage. What is going on.
 

tarunraju

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Forget this bias treaty, we are not testing Agni missiles for some time. Even BMD are put to cold storage. What is going on.
Being an MTCR signatory is a crucial component to securing a civil nuclear agreement. We need this, we just need to stop countries like Italy from using it as leverage.
 

Compersion

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I've written to PMO telling them to use FiatPowerTrain (FPT) MultiJet diesel engine as leverage to win Italy's vote. In the wake of VW-TDIgate, it would be a shame if Fiat MultiJet engine suddenly failed emission tests. Think about all the Fiat, Tata, Maruti Suzuki and Chevrolet cars that will run out of diesel engines overnight, and the billions of dollars in annual revenue losses for FPT from India.
Devani Khobagrade ... ?? Perhaps need to see Italy and India both benefit. Dont want to see India be too kind. The venue change of case to new delhi ...

It was good to see formula 1 here but why suddenly market not important was it really tax issues (that can be negotiate). And Ratan tata is good buddy with important italian people he can be used intermidary. We also have Sonia Gandhi and Rahul Gandhi but not sure on them.

Italy also have a wide variety of legal opinion on their legal system ... Amanda knox and their own problems and issues with justice. But why it seems and appears that italy is behaving in a condensing way and even looking down on india like India is not "normal". Might be because they have history with us who knows. But that attitude and approach needs to change from italy and also we are not enemy and they are not ally of pakistan last time I check.

Don't know why but this modi administration seems like it is waiting for something. Even something like crossing a date ... Is it January 2016 ... Related to rajya sabha. Proactive and use of experts why not being seen more. Might be wrong because not privy to behind the scene actions. But this situation with italy and npt and mtcr can be transformed from a negative to positive if thought ...
 

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