India opens bids in $10.4-bn combat plane tender.

[Yusuf]

guys be patient.....its better this is taken slowly rather get it done in a huff and puff, we don't want another scam....

10 years in the making. No huff and puff here. India's prestige hinges on this. Any mess up in this deal will put off all manufacturers who will not even participate in Indian tenders in the future.

Or may be its a ploy of te govt under US pressure to put off all others so that Amercian companies can rule.

 

[H.A.]

see.....if a person is hell bent on creating a scam.....then it surely will come....even if there is no scam.....

If a decision is taken quickly then the media will wonder and keep saying what was the reason to get it done in a hurry.
If the decision is taken slowly media will say that after a long wait India finally announces a winner....

they are just taking precautions...

 

[SpArK]

see.....if a person is hell bent on creating a scam.....then it surely will come....even if there is no scam.....

If a decision is taken quickly then the media will wonder and keep saying what was the reason to get it done in a hurry.
If the decision is taken slowly media will say that after a long wait India finally announces a winner....

they are just taking precautions...

National security and lives of pilots are of more imporrtance than media dramas.

 

[Nirvana]

Today the last day I'm visiting this thread.

You will come here again , mark my word

 

[Nirvana]

---- this Idiots !! It doesn't matter which plane you choose but replace those Migs ASAP , They are risking lives of our pilots

 

[H.A.]

National security and lives of pilots are of more imporrtance than media dramas.

Thats what i am saying....see they are not revealing anything...everything is hush hush which means they are taking precautions......in such a situation you may take everything the way you want...Its just your point of view...
I believe they are taking precautions rather than hurrying with an answer....

What if Rafale was L1 and the GOI got the news that they will stop the production. Now we don't want an aircraft whose spare parts and servicing are not easily available or become costly as a result of the closure of production operations....which might affect the airworthiness of the plane and eventually the life of the pilots....

 

[SpArK]

Thats what i am saying....see they are not revealing anything...everything is hush hush which means they are taking precautions......in such a situation you may take everything the way you want...Its just your point of view...
I believe they are taking precautions rather than hurrying with an answer....

What if Rafale was L1 and the GOI got the news that they will stop the production. Now we don't want an aircraft whose spare parts and servicing are not easily available or become costly as a result of the closure of production operations....which might affect the airworthiness of the plane and eventually the life of the pilots....

I dont like the what if... production lines wont be closed. otherwise we wouldnt have chosen them in the first place.. there is no justification for the delay of the past few months... and thanks to that the prices for the deal has also rocketed.

 

[H.A.]

I dont like the what if... production lines wont be closed. otherwise we wouldnt have chosen them in the first place.. there is no justification for the delay of the past few months... and thanks to that the prices for the deal has also rocketed.

-----deleted----
..

 

[H.A.]

I dont like the what if... production lines wont be closed. otherwise we wouldnt have chosen them in the first place.. there is no justification for the delay of the past few months... and thanks to that the prices for the deal has also rocketed.

France Might Stop Producing Its Fighter Jet As No One Is Buying It - Business Insider

Check the link buddy

 

[SpArK]

France Might Stop Producing Its Fighter Jet As No One Is Buying It - Business Insider

Check the link buddy

Yup.. its simple.. if we buy... the production line will be open.. what so hard to understand in that statement... that decision has nothing to do with ongoing process.

 

[H.A.]

Yup.. its simple.. if we buy... the production line will be open.. what so hard to understand in that statement... that decision has nothing to do with ongoing process.

The words have been blurted out....once it is said it would take some amount of negotiation from both the government with a little bit of confirmation from the government that the production will not be stopped atleast for the next 30 years.

The government needs to cover this angle before announcing the winner because if it does not the tender will never see the light of the day and the media will not spare the government...Which again would affect the pilots...

The whole discussion is based that Rafale is L1, it might even be that EF is L1 and the government is asking them to confirm in writing if they will not do something like that....

 

[SpArK]

The words have been blurted out....once it is said it would take some amount of negotiation from both the government with a little bit of confirmation from the government that the production will not be stopped atleast for the next 30 years.

The government needs to cover this angle before announcing the winner because if it does not the tender will never see the light of the day and the media will not spare the government...Which again would affect the pilots...

The whole discussion is based that Rafale is L1, it might even be that EF is L1 and the government is asking them to confirm in writing if they will not do something like that....

The production of our order will run for years in case of Dassault along with other ones.. same like MKIs.

It doesnt matter if France stops it.. since we are making it here in HAL..

And regarding spares, well we didnt have any issues on spares as of yet and its true for any vendor.

 

[SpArK]

ADS CALLS INTO DOUBT CREDIBILITY OF TIMES ARTICLE
26/01/2012
NEWS RELEASE

Issued: Thursday 26 January 2012
Our reference: ADS PR 2012 004

For immediate release

ADS CALLS INTO DOUBT CREDIBILITY OF TIMES ARTICLE

Trade body says Times article built on unsubstantiated evidence

ADS today (Thursday) calls into doubt an article published in The Times (MoD turns to France as fears grow over fighter jet choice, 26 January 2012).

The article cites as its source a detailed note of a speech made by Admiral Soar at an ADS event being held under the Chatham House rule. This note however has misled the journalist, wrongly attributing statements to the Admiral and in certain cases alleging, such as with the main premise of the article, a comment which was not made during the course of the Admiral's speech at the ADS event.

Rees Ward, CEO at ADS, says:

"While it is lamentable that the Chatham House rule of the event where the Admiral spoke was broken, of greater concern is the inaccurate reporting. The Admiral's comments were wrongly attributed and in certain cases not even raised during the course of his speech or at the event itself as the article alleges.

"Had the journalist sought to contact ADS, we could have verified whether these comments were made, but their lack of contact suggests they have accepted at face value the second hand reporting of what has turned out to be an unreliable source. In doing so they have potentially damaged the reputation of a senior member of our armed forces - certainly they have thrown into question their own personal credibility and ultimately the paper for which they write."

ENDS


ADS CALLS INTO DOUBT CREDIBILITY OF TIMES ARTICLE

 

[p2prada]

Patience people. No official has ever released any info about when they will reveal the winner. The IAF chief said "they" will have an idea on who's winning, not "us." Only the media jingos are coming out with dates like 24th and 10 days from now etc. Woe be unto us if we are to believe everything they say. When the fat lady sings we will hear it.

 

[death.by.chocolate]

You mean the use of MEMs and some basic embedded systems to measure stress. This is going in the MKI too, post upgrade. Currently the MKI is fitted with a HUMS system which is not real time. It is made by South Africa's AMS.

The MKI was also light years ahead of what HAL could manufacture. We literally jumped from 2nd generation Mig-21s, 3rd gen Jaguars to MKIs.

Goodrich is sitting in India.

Hawk, being manufactured in India, has a BAE made HUMS as well and has real time capability.

Anyway, this is being made for LCA as well.
DIAT system soon to monitor in-flight health of Tejas Mk-II - Indian Express

The one going on LCA is said to be a generation ahead of what's on the MKI and also has real time capability. A similar system may go on the MKI or maybe even a Russian system.

MEMs or HUMS monitor parts health and orders just in time flight-line replacement parts, its technology that was implemented decades ago; the Rafale has some form of HUMS as well. SHM (Structural Health Monitor) on the other hand, monitors air frame stress in real time, the Typhoons FCS flight computers receive data from piezo electric sensors that are embedded in the aircraft's composite skin and predicts air frame stress from maneuvers the pilot is attempting. The FCS is also linked to the Typhoons store management system, the Typhoons fight computers optimize flight performance based on the stress the airframe is experiencing this includes the stress from external stores carried under the aircraft belly and wings. Neither the MKI nor the LCA have anything comparable, in many ways the Typhoons production techniques are closer to fifth generation fighters such as the F-35.

 

[p2prada]

MEMs or HUMS monitor parts health and orders just in time flight-line replacement parts, its technology that was implemented decades ago; the Rafale has some form of HUMS as well. SHM (Structural Health Monitor) on the other hand, monitors air frame stress in real time, the Typhoons FCS flight computers receive data from piezo electric sensors that are embedded in the aircraft's composite skin and predicts air frame stress from maneuvers the pilot is attempting. The FCS is also linked to the Typhoons store management system, the Typhoons fight computers optimize flight performance based on the stress the airframe is experiencing this includes the stress from external stores carried under the aircraft belly and wings. Neither the MKI nor the LCA have anything comparable, in many ways the Typhoons production techniques are closer to fifth generation fighters such as the F-35.

Ok DBC. Then we cannot build the EF. So, we will choose the Rafale because our puny brains cannot handle anything better than that. Cheers.

 

[pankaj nema]

My personal feeling is that the France is aggressively wooing us with Nuclear submarine /
Nuclear enrichment technology and Kaveri Snecma tie up

Therefore though IAF GOI initially might have decided on Typhoon but the French counter offers
have put a spanner in the whole process

 

[p2prada]

Nobody except Russia is providing us with nuclear submarines. France has offered a Scorpene based nuke sub to Brazil, but it's not much. I don't think that has been offered to us. The Civilian Nuclear deal has no link to the MRCA program. They have already signed reactor deals anyway.

The MRCA deal cannot be linked to any other deal for any reason. The winner takes all.

 

[pankaj nema]

Nobody except Russia is providing us with nuclear submarines. France has offered a Scorpene based nuke sub to Brazil, but it's not much. I don't think that has been offered to us. The Civilian Nuclear deal has no link to the MRCA program. They have already signed reactor deals anyway.

The MRCA deal cannot be linked to any other deal for any reason. The winner takes all.

The French are really desperate for atleast ONE export order for the RAFALE

Desperate times calls for desperate measures

And when India and Russia are celebrating the successful transfer of Akula to India why would nt the French
love to make some money from the BARRACUDA

 

[p2prada]

France Might Stop Producing Its Fighter Jet As No One Is Buying It - Business Insider

Check the link buddy

This is after 2019 when the first order of 180 Rafales are done.

The French are really desperate for atleast ONE export order for the RAFALE

Desperate times calls for desperate measures

And when India and Russia are celebrating the successful transfer of Akula to India why would nt the French
love to make some money from the BARRACUDA

No country is allowed to sell nuclear subs. France "may" do it, but there are higher chances it won't happen.