India counters China, says no need to sign NPT for NSG membership

tejas warrior

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Block all chini Electronic imports.. and see if they change their stand..
 

sorcerer

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No Case For Simultaneous NSG Membership For India And Pakistan

In the midst of nearly daily attacks by home grown terrorists on its own populace, Pakistan found a moment of cheer when China engineered an unfavorable consideration of India’s case for Nuclear Suppliers Group (NSG) membership in June 2016. Having submitted its own application for membership within days of India doing so, Pakistan was hoping to piggyback the Indian case. Indeed, its all-weather friend China boldly stepped in to press home the point that there could not be a single country consideration without making a similar exception for other NPT holdouts. Both lobbied for the simultaneous inclusion of India and Pakistan, and if that was not to happen, then to deny a consideration of the Indian membership too.

In fact, by tying Pakistan to India’s coattails, China has cleverly sought to stymie India’s chances since those who are vehemently against Pakistan’s entry into the NSG are forced to rule against India’s membership. Meanwhile, Islamabad has since been building its own case for membership of the NSG along with India.

The major argument that Pakistan makes for a simultaneous grant of NSG membership to both is to “ensure parity for regional stability”. A longing for parity has indeed been an obsession for the country since its independence. Despite being nearly one fourth the size of India, about one tenth the size of its economy, nearly one sixth the size of its population and several notches behind on every other human development parameter (not that India has very high standards either), the country’s desire for military parity refuses to wither. Buoyed by this mindset, it has resented the India-US agreement for civilian nuclear cooperation and India’s exceptionalisation by the NSG. This de-hyphenation of India and Pakistan on non-proliferation, an issue that had long kept them conjoined owing to their non-membership of the NPT, has rankled Islamabad.

Craving for parity to be restored, Pakistan campaigns against the country-specific approach favored by the NSG members since a consideration on the independent merit of the country throws up the stark contrast between the two in terms of their nuclear histories, behavior and strategies. Wanting to gloss over its by now well documented history of proliferation, Pakistan presses for a criteria-based approach for the NSG membership. But the point is that no criteria designed to promote the cause of non-proliferation (the objective of the NSG), cannot but not take into account the myriad risks posed by a fast expanding nuclear arsenal that seeks developing and deploying tactical nuclear weapons in a politically volatile, terrorism supporting nation. In fact, the dilemma that Pakistan faces on this front is actually of its own making. On the one hand, its nuclear deterrence strategy is based on blatant brinkmanship that rests on keeping nuclear weapons in full view of India and the US in order to use them as a shield against the possibility of retribution for state sponsored terrorism. On the other hand, the country wants to project itself as a responsible nuclear power in order to be mainstreamed into the nuclear regime. Unfortunately, the two cannot go hand in hand. A choice will have to be made.

The fact of the matter is that at this moment there is no equivalence between the Indian and Pakistani cases for NSG membership – neither on the scale and nature of their nuclear power programs, nor in the capabilities of their nuclear industries to link into the global nuclear supply chains, and least of all in the level of responsibility shown through their program histories. In earning the nuclear cooperation agreement with US, India bore the cost of offering for safeguards several indigenous facilities (nuclear reactors and fuel cycle assets). Pakistan has none to offer. The differences are clearly evident. In fact, India meets all the factors for consideration for NSG membership as listed on the group’s website (including adherence to the principles of NPT, which China has tried to mischievously morph into membership of NPT).

In treating the cases of India and Pakistan independently of one another and on the basis of their individual merits and demerits as they should be, the non-proliferation regime has a golden opportunity to set an example that strongly disincentivises wrongful nuclear behavior. Grant of membership, or even the consideration of its application along with India (which itself constitutes parity in the mind of Pakistan) would only embolden the military to continue down the path they are presently on and even claim it as victory for such behavior. Use of terrorism as an instrument of state policy from behind the shield of nuclear weapons and dangers of deployed TNWs are all matters of deep concern for international security. Holding up NSG membership till such time as tangible reforms are visible offers a leverage that should be used judiciously to effect changes in Pakistan’s nuclear behavior.

Meanwhile, one can be sure that other nations are watching and making their own assessments on the benefits that possession of nuclear weapons offer for blackmail and hard-core political bargaining. The future course of the non-proliferation regime lies in its own decisions.
Source>>
 

Mikesingh

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Beijing’s contention that India must sign the Non-Proliferation Treaty (NPT) to get membership of the Nuclear Suppliers’ Group, is utter rubbish as even France was included in the elite NSG group without signing the NPT.

These Chinese are playing hardball with India as it's getting pissed off with India's rise and influence in the world. They'll go to any extent to clip India's wings. And then they want to mollycoddle their all weather friend, Pakistan too.

China has started shooting itself in the foot on a number of occasions. This is one of them. They need to wake up and smell the coffee.
 

sorcerer

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Beijing’s contention that India must sign the Non-Proliferation Treaty (NPT) to get membership of the Nuclear Suppliers’ Group, is utter rubbish as even France was included in the elite NSG group without signing the NPT.

These Chinese are playing hardball with India as it's getting pissed off with India's rise and influence in the world. They'll go to any extent to clip India's wings. And then they want to mollycoddle their all weather friend, Pakistan too.

China has started shooting itself in the foot on a number of occasions. This is one of them. They need to wake up and smell the coffee.
pakistan is making china their asswipe and chinese have no shame in doing that in front of the international audience..
china is a rich servant of retard pakistan.
 

Mikesingh

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pakistan is making china their asswipe and chinese have no shame in doing that in front of the international audience..
china is a rich servant of retard pakistan.
Guess who the three rotten musketeers of the world are?

China, North Korea and the failed state of Pakistan. As the saying goes, birds of a feather flock together. They are the bane of civilized society, always at war with their neighbors.
 

OneGrimPilgrim

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pakistan is making china their asswipe and chinese have no shame in doing that in front of the international audience..
china is a rich servant of retard pakistan.
more like, packistan is the vassal of china, or, a paikhana-e-china, where the latter can take dump whenever wished. so packistan is infact paikhanistan of china. never and nowhere would have one heard of a bond deeper than the seas & higher than the mountains, between a paikhana & its user!
 

G10

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Why dont india just proliferate nuke to vietnam and phillipines. Then only china would realise.
 

Kshatriya87

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Why dont india just proliferate nuke to vietnam and phillipines. Then only china would realise.
Then we will become an "irresponsible" nuclear state and we can forget our entry in NSG.
 

Scarface

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Why dont india just proliferate nuke to vietnam and phillipines. Then only china would realise.
We don't seem to be making warheads ourselves let alone proliferate to Vietnam and Phillipines

Our warhead count seems to be stuck at a measly 90-120 which is hardly enough to ensure MAD against both China and Pakistan combined
 

Neo

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No NSG for India if Pak is not allowed: China

ANIRBAN BHAUMIK
SOURCE: DHNS



China on Tuesday made it clear that it would oppose India’s entry into the Nuclear Suppliers Group (NSG), unless the cartel opened its door to Pakistan too.A meeting between senior diplomats of India and China in New Delhi on Tuesday failed to make any breakthrough on the contentious issue, which emerged as the new irritant in the bilateral relations over the past few months.

The Chinese diplomats conveyed to their Indian counterparts that Beijing would remain firm on its stand that the NSG should adopt a “two-step approach” to address the issue of admitting new members. They pointed out that China would like the NSG to first “explore” — through “an open and transparent” process — and reach an agreement on a “non-discriminatory formula” to deal with the issue of granting membership to the countries which had not signed the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty (NPT).

Once the formula is adopted by the NSG, the cartel should move to the second stage to take up the “country-specific membership issues”, according to a press release issued by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of the Chinese government on Tuesday.

The Ministry of External Affairs of India in New Delhi stated that the discussions between the senior diplomats had been “candid, pragmatic and substantive” and the two sides had agreed to meet for the next round on a mutually convenient date in Beijing.

Sources in New Delhi, however, told DH that China’s position clearly meant that it would not allow India to enter the NSG unless it could ensure that the cartel would also admit Pakistan.

The NSG controls global nuclear commerce.

The guidelines of the 48-nation organisation prohibit its members from entering into nuclear ties with the countries that have not signed the NPT. Neither India, nor Pakistan has signed the NPT.

The NSG, however, granted a waiver to India in 2008.

The waiver paved the way for India entering into a civil nuclear deal with the United States.

India subsequently struck similar agreements with other countries, including France, Australia and Canada.

India submitted its application for membership of the NSG on May 12.
Pakistan did the same on May 19.

China, however, stonewalled the US-led move to admit India into the NSG when the cartel had its annual plenary in Seoul in June. China argued that if the “NPT signatory” criterion was diluted to admit India into the NSG, it should also open up the door for other non-NPT countries, including Pakistan.

China on Tuesday also conveyed to India that the issue of the non-NPT states’ participation in the NSG raised “new questions for the group under the new circumstances”. It said the crux of the question was “how to address the gap between the existing policies and practices of the non-NPT states and the existing international non-proliferation rules and norms based on the NPT as the cornerstone”.

http://www.deccanherald.com/content/570270/no-nsg-india-pak-not.html
 

Kshatriya87

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No NSG for India if Pak is not allowed: China

ANIRBAN BHAUMIK
SOURCE: DHNS



China on Tuesday made it clear that it would oppose India’s entry into the Nuclear Suppliers Group (NSG), unless the cartel opened its door to Pakistan too.A meeting between senior diplomats of India and China in New Delhi on Tuesday failed to make any breakthrough on the contentious issue, which emerged as the new irritant in the bilateral relations over the past few months.

The Chinese diplomats conveyed to their Indian counterparts that Beijing would remain firm on its stand that the NSG should adopt a “two-step approach” to address the issue of admitting new members. They pointed out that China would like the NSG to first “explore” — through “an open and transparent” process — and reach an agreement on a “non-discriminatory formula” to deal with the issue of granting membership to the countries which had not signed the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty (NPT).

Once the formula is adopted by the NSG, the cartel should move to the second stage to take up the “country-specific membership issues”, according to a press release issued by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of the Chinese government on Tuesday.

The Ministry of External Affairs of India in New Delhi stated that the discussions between the senior diplomats had been “candid, pragmatic and substantive” and the two sides had agreed to meet for the next round on a mutually convenient date in Beijing.

Sources in New Delhi, however, told DH that China’s position clearly meant that it would not allow India to enter the NSG unless it could ensure that the cartel would also admit Pakistan.

The NSG controls global nuclear commerce.

The guidelines of the 48-nation organisation prohibit its members from entering into nuclear ties with the countries that have not signed the NPT. Neither India, nor Pakistan has signed the NPT.

The NSG, however, granted a waiver to India in 2008.

The waiver paved the way for India entering into a civil nuclear deal with the United States.

India subsequently struck similar agreements with other countries, including France, Australia and Canada.

India submitted its application for membership of the NSG on May 12.
Pakistan did the same on May 19.

China, however, stonewalled the US-led move to admit India into the NSG when the cartel had its annual plenary in Seoul in June. China argued that if the “NPT signatory” criterion was diluted to admit India into the NSG, it should also open up the door for other non-NPT countries, including Pakistan.

China on Tuesday also conveyed to India that the issue of the non-NPT states’ participation in the NSG raised “new questions for the group under the new circumstances”. It said the crux of the question was “how to address the gap between the existing policies and practices of the non-NPT states and the existing international non-proliferation rules and norms based on the NPT as the cornerstone”.

http://www.deccanherald.com/content/570270/no-nsg-india-pak-not.html
Finally the real intentions are spoken out loud. There is no point in NPT. China is just forcing it down our throats as pakistan won't get entry either way. The whole point of china blockade is that both countries get NSG membership together or not at all.
 

mayfair

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Our warhead count seems to be stuck at a measly 90-120 which is hardly enough to ensure MAD against both China and Pakistan combined
GoI and SFC NEVER discuss the number of warheads that India has or is capable of producing. All figures are pure speculation by media and the so-called think tanks.
 

Neo

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Finally the real intentions are spoken out loud. There is no point in NPT. China is just forcing it down our throats as pakistan won't get entry either way. The whole point of china blockade is that both countries get NSG membership together or not at all.
Let the justice be served indeed. US can't aaply double standards all the time.
 

DingDong

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No NSG for India if Pak is not allowed: China

ANIRBAN BHAUMIK
SOURCE: DHNS



China on Tuesday made it clear that it would oppose India’s entry into the Nuclear Suppliers Group (NSG), unless the cartel opened its door to Pakistan too.A meeting between senior diplomats of India and China in New Delhi on Tuesday failed to make any breakthrough on the contentious issue, which emerged as the new irritant in the bilateral relations over the past few months.

The Chinese diplomats conveyed to their Indian counterparts that Beijing would remain firm on its stand that the NSG should adopt a “two-step approach” to address the issue of admitting new members. They pointed out that China would like the NSG to first “explore” — through “an open and transparent” process — and reach an agreement on a “non-discriminatory formula” to deal with the issue of granting membership to the countries which had not signed the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty (NPT).

Once the formula is adopted by the NSG, the cartel should move to the second stage to take up the “country-specific membership issues”, according to a press release issued by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of the Chinese government on Tuesday.

The Ministry of External Affairs of India in New Delhi stated that the discussions between the senior diplomats had been “candid, pragmatic and substantive” and the two sides had agreed to meet for the next round on a mutually convenient date in Beijing.

Sources in New Delhi, however, told DH that China’s position clearly meant that it would not allow India to enter the NSG unless it could ensure that the cartel would also admit Pakistan.

The NSG controls global nuclear commerce.

The guidelines of the 48-nation organisation prohibit its members from entering into nuclear ties with the countries that have not signed the NPT. Neither India, nor Pakistan has signed the NPT.

The NSG, however, granted a waiver to India in 2008.

The waiver paved the way for India entering into a civil nuclear deal with the United States.

India subsequently struck similar agreements with other countries, including France, Australia and Canada.

India submitted its application for membership of the NSG on May 12.
Pakistan did the same on May 19.

China, however, stonewalled the US-led move to admit India into the NSG when the cartel had its annual plenary in Seoul in June. China argued that if the “NPT signatory” criterion was diluted to admit India into the NSG, it should also open up the door for other non-NPT countries, including Pakistan.

China on Tuesday also conveyed to India that the issue of the non-NPT states’ participation in the NSG raised “new questions for the group under the new circumstances”. It said the crux of the question was “how to address the gap between the existing policies and practices of the non-NPT states and the existing international non-proliferation rules and norms based on the NPT as the cornerstone”.

http://www.deccanherald.com/content/570270/no-nsg-india-pak-not.html
These statements have zero consequence, China doesn't enjoy sufficient geopolitical advantage over India, in fact the equation is perfectly balanced.

India's induction into NSG is just a matter of time. In worst case, if India fails to break in, then India will go for government-to-government arrangements turning NSG into a paper tiger. A rising power like India may not be eager to legitimize these organizations representing the old world order arising after World War 2.

However these reports are extremely relevant from domestic politics. We really need such news items to be prominently put on front pages to silence all those dalaals flying peace doves here in India. Such news items are further legitimize current central government's aggressive foreign and defense policy.

Let the justice be served indeed. US can't aaply double standards all the time.
Geopolitics is AMORAL. Everything is fair.
 

Indx TechStyle

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No NSG for India if Pak is not allowed: China

ANIRBAN BHAUMIK
SOURCE: DHNS



China on Tuesday made it clear that it would oppose India’s entry into the Nuclear Suppliers Group (NSG), unless the cartel opened its door to Pakistan too.A meeting between senior diplomats of India and China in New Delhi on Tuesday failed to make any breakthrough on the contentious issue, which emerged as the new irritant in the bilateral relations over the past few months.

The Chinese diplomats conveyed to their Indian counterparts that Beijing would remain firm on its stand that the NSG should adopt a “two-step approach” to address the issue of admitting new members. They pointed out that China would like the NSG to first “explore” — through “an open and transparent” process — and reach an agreement on a “non-discriminatory formula” to deal with the issue of granting membership to the countries which had not signed the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty (NPT).

Once the formula is adopted by the NSG, the cartel should move to the second stage to take up the “country-specific membership issues”, according to a press release issued by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of the Chinese government on Tuesday.

The Ministry of External Affairs of India in New Delhi stated that the discussions between the senior diplomats had been “candid, pragmatic and substantive” and the two sides had agreed to meet for the next round on a mutually convenient date in Beijing.

Sources in New Delhi, however, told DH that China’s position clearly meant that it would not allow India to enter the NSG unless it could ensure that the cartel would also admit Pakistan.

The NSG controls global nuclear commerce.

The guidelines of the 48-nation organisation prohibit its members from entering into nuclear ties with the countries that have not signed the NPT. Neither India, nor Pakistan has signed the NPT.

The NSG, however, granted a waiver to India in 2008.

The waiver paved the way for India entering into a civil nuclear deal with the United States.

India subsequently struck similar agreements with other countries, including France, Australia and Canada.

India submitted its application for membership of the NSG on May 12.
Pakistan did the same on May 19.

China, however, stonewalled the US-led move to admit India into the NSG when the cartel had its annual plenary in Seoul in June. China argued that if the “NPT signatory” criterion was diluted to admit India into the NSG, it should also open up the door for other non-NPT countries, including Pakistan.

China on Tuesday also conveyed to India that the issue of the non-NPT states’ participation in the NSG raised “new questions for the group under the new circumstances”. It said the crux of the question was “how to address the gap between the existing policies and practices of the non-NPT states and the existing international non-proliferation rules and norms based on the NPT as the cornerstone”.

http://www.deccanherald.com/content/570270/no-nsg-india-pak-not.html
:crazy:
What the heck?
When we objected about pakistani membership?
At first place, when we did even talk about Pakistan?
We applied ourselves for NSG, pak must apply itself and get focused on own membership.
What you gonna achieve by blocking India? That ME TOO syndrome of pak always leaves me in Facepalm.

Or as that balance of power in south Asia statement or India-Pak entering same time is totally baseless,
Now, came up with NPT (case is different that NPT itself is baseless which limits all nukes to 5 irresponsible, ignorant countries).
We broke every jinx, from nukes to ICBMs, nuclear subs etc..
We raped MTCR many times and now it's member.:biggrin2:
And now, we are playing to be the member of an organization which was established against our own country 40 years ago.:pound:
We will get a wavier NPT some day and
Let the justice be served indeed. US can't aaply double standards all the time.
In fact, double standards of entire P5.
And we will play with similar standards now.:devil:
 

Kshatriya87

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Let the justice be served indeed. US can't aaply double standards all the time.
What justice? What double standards? If you want to serve justice then let the US or NSG have a chat with A Q Khan first. Why are you hiding him from the US?
 

no smoking

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Why dont india just proliferate nuke to vietnam and phillipines. Then only china would realise.
Because:
1. India can't unless India wants to be isolated by the whole world;
2. Vietnam and Philipines don't dare to accept it. Iraq proves any small country willing to possess nuke without protection of big powers will end up miserably. India can't provide follow up political and economical protection. Once you give to them, they will hand out under the threat of P5 in next minute.
3. Vietnam and phillipines don't need your nuke in their case. The problem for them is they can't handle Chinese maritime police, let alone Chinese navy or air force.
 

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