IN Scorpene Submarines - News & Discussions

Adioz

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It's IN Scorpene DCNS has changed complete layout and specs of submarine and those said leaks now won't have any effect on IN operations. Also all these technologies are being shared with India by France as a strategic alliance between both countries. I was first to announce on this forum that Kaveri Jet will be made operational by Snecma and jet engine technology is being shared to India, while others mocked at me. Nuclear SSN sub technologies will also be shared for our SSN subs by DCNS. There's a reason why DCNS is moving in to INDIA expect 3 more scorpenes to come with AIP.
Highly unlikely they would do this without additional payment or publicity.
But I hope you are right a second time.:)
And if we do get good tech from France for our SSN, our SSN will be far more superior to PLAN SSN.:)
 

lcafanboy

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But I hope you are right a second time.
I had also stated that AMCA will come only after 2032 and more likely 2035, people here again mocked that it will be completed by 2025 and we will get first plane by 2027. Also i had told and still say that we are buying more than 250 Rafale, again people here mock at me that we can't buy 250 Rafale as it is expensive but after producing in India and significantly higher numbers which will be increased by new buyers like UAE, Indonesia etc. the R&D cost will come down, which reduce the cost of Indian made Rafale substantially making it affordable to both India & France which will then buy more further reducing cost.
 

deepak ghanvatkar

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Good to hear that the submarine will be commissioned ... but as far as I recollect we had problems with torpedoes purchase and varunastra is not fully ready .... Let us hope that the torpedoes purchase has been sorted...

Great News
 

indiandefencefan

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Highly unlikely they would do this without additional payment or publicity.
But I hope you are right a second time.:)
And if we do get good tech from France for our SSN, our SSN will be far more superior to PLAN SSN.:)
It's IN Scorpene DCNS has changed complete layout and specs of submarine and those said leaks now won't have any effect on IN operations. Also all these technologies are being shared with India by France as a strategic alliance between both countries. I was first to announce on this forum that Kaveri Jet will be made operational by Snecma and jet engine technology is being shared to India, while others mocked at me. Nuclear SSN sub technologies will also be shared for our SSN subs by DCNS. There's a reason why DCNS is moving in to INDIA expect 3 more scorpenes to come with AIP.
I know this is a late reply but the Kalvari Class is not getting pumpjet propulsion. That picture is of a Triomphant Class SSN.
If DCNS were to suddenly modify the Kalvari class to include pumpjets the subs wouldn't be inducted for another 3-4 years owing to the complex redesign.

The image can be recognised as a Triomphant due to its rear wing. Scorpene has its flat while the Triomphant's are in an 'H' shape.

Posted image
triomphant 2.jpg


Kalvari
scorpene.gif

Triomphant
triomphant.jpg


INS Khanderi


No pumpjet.

Sorry guys. Unless we use the Triomphant as the base design for for our future SSNs I don't think we will be seeing a DCNS pumpjet on our subs.
 
Last edited:

Thrishul

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I know this is a late reply but the Kalvari Class is not getting pumpjet propulsion. That picture is of a Triomphant Class SSN.
If DCNS were to suddenly modify the Kalvari class to include pumpjets the subs wouldn't be inducted for another 3-4 years owing to the complex redesign.

The image can be recognised as a Triomphant due to its rear wing. Scorpene has its flat while the Triomphant's are in an 'H' shape.

Posted image
View attachment 14372

Kalvari
View attachment 14370
Triomphant
View attachment 14371

INS Khanderi


No pumpjet.

Sorry guys. Unless we use the Triomphant as the base design for for our future SSNs I don't think we will be seeing a DCNS pumpjet on our subs.
If we go for the Barracuda Short fin for the Project 75-I, we should be able to use it's tech on the new SSN's as the design is based on the SSN Barracuda.
 

Superdefender

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First Indian Scorpene-class Submarine To Be Inducted In June
Our Bureau.
03:11 PM, March 9, 2017


Indian Navy will induct a French-designed diesel-electric attack Scorpene-class submarine this year.
First Scorpene-class submarine, named Kalvari, will be inducted this June, whereas the second vessel ‘Khanderi’ will be commissioned in December, Hindustan Times reported Thursday.
Kalvari and Khanderi are two of the six Scorpene submarines being constructed in the country with technology transfer from French firm DCNS under a Rs 23,562-crore programme called Project 75.
The Scorpene is expected to become the main conventional submarine of the Indian fleet and replace the ageing Russian Kilo class and German HDW vessels that are almost three decades old.
All six submarines are expected to join the Indian fleet over the next three years, with a third boat, Vela, likely to be launched in the coming months.

Source Link: http://www.defenseworld.net/news/18660/First_Indian_Scorpene_class_Submarine_To_Be_Inducted_In_June
 

Prashant12

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Mazagon Docks, DCNS keen on making 3 more Scorpene-class subs


Scorpene submarine ‘Kalvari’ at the Mazagaon Dock

Approach the Navy for another order; submarines to be made in Mumbai

Mazagon Docks Ltd along with French shipbuilder DCNS, its technology partner for the Scorpene submarines, has approached the Indian Navy with a repeat order for three Scorpene-class submarines, despite the data leak scandal that had threatened to derail the project last August.

Like the first six Scorpenes, the three new submarines would also be manufactured at the Mumbai site, and would be equipped with a new anaerobic propulsion system (AIP) developed by the DRDO.

Six Scorpene submarines were ordered in 2005, and are being built at the state-owned Mazagaon Docks (MDL) in Mumbai, with technical assistance and transfer of technology as well as equipment from DCNS. INS Kalvari, the first Scorpene class stealth submarine built under Project 75, is currently undergoing extensive sea trials, while INS Khanderi, the second indigenous Scorpene-class submarine was recently launched at MDL.

The Scorpene submarine is one of the newer submarines of the Indian Navy, and has the capability of launching an anti-ship missile from below the surface of water which is expected to give the Navy a boost. Sensitive data related to the Scorpene was leaked in the Australian media last year. A committee was set up to look into the matter.

In early March, the Indian Navy conducted the maiden firing of an SM39 anti-ship missile from INS Kalvari. The missile successfully hit a surface target at extended ranges during the trial firing, and was hailed as a significant milestone, not only for the Kalvari submarine, but also in enhancing the Indian Navy’s sub-surface warfare capability.

Sources in the know pointed out that all six Scorpene being built in India are to be equipped with anti-ship missiles, which can help neutralise surface threats at extended ranges.

Sources pointed out that a repeat order for three new submarines would also help the Indian shipyard maintain the know-how and skills it has acquired through the manufacture of the first two Scorpene.

“At a seminar in November 2016, former Defence Minister Manohar Parrikkar had expressed a need for 24 submarines to be built for the Navy, including the six P-75 Scorpene submarines currently on order.

“Given the extensive submarine building programme in other countries, the Minister was keen to strengthen the fleet. It makes emminent sense to continue to build on the first order,” said an official, requesting anonymity, adding that it was also an option under the P-75 programme.

Transfer of technology from DCNS also involves changing “the shells of the Scorpene by making them thicker with steel”, and the Indian counterparts have been educated on the same, as also integrating it with missiles and weapon systems.

Recently, the Indian Navy detailed a timeline for the induction of six Scorpene submarines, with the first two set to be commissioned end-2017.

http://www.thehindubusinessline.com...e-scorpeneclass-submarines/article9591479.ece
 

Thrishul

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Mazagon Docks, DCNS keen on making 3 more Scorpene-class subs


Scorpene submarine ‘Kalvari’ at the Mazagaon Dock

Approach the Navy for another order; submarines to be made in Mumbai

Mazagon Docks Ltd along with French shipbuilder DCNS, its technology partner for the Scorpene submarines, has approached the Indian Navy with a repeat order for three Scorpene-class submarines, despite the data leak scandal that had threatened to derail the project last August.

Like the first six Scorpenes, the three new submarines would also be manufactured at the Mumbai site, and would be equipped with a new anaerobic propulsion system (AIP) developed by the DRDO.

Six Scorpene submarines were ordered in 2005, and are being built at the state-owned Mazagaon Docks (MDL) in Mumbai, with technical assistance and transfer of technology as well as equipment from DCNS. INS Kalvari, the first Scorpene class stealth submarine built under Project 75, is currently undergoing extensive sea trials, while INS Khanderi, the second indigenous Scorpene-class submarine was recently launched at MDL.

The Scorpene submarine is one of the newer submarines of the Indian Navy, and has the capability of launching an anti-ship missile from below the surface of water which is expected to give the Navy a boost. Sensitive data related to the Scorpene was leaked in the Australian media last year. A committee was set up to look into the matter.

In early March, the Indian Navy conducted the maiden firing of an SM39 anti-ship missile from INS Kalvari. The missile successfully hit a surface target at extended ranges during the trial firing, and was hailed as a significant milestone, not only for the Kalvari submarine, but also in enhancing the Indian Navy’s sub-surface warfare capability.

Sources in the know pointed out that all six Scorpene being built in India are to be equipped with anti-ship missiles, which can help neutralise surface threats at extended ranges.

Sources pointed out that a repeat order for three new submarines would also help the Indian shipyard maintain the know-how and skills it has acquired through the manufacture of the first two Scorpene.

“At a seminar in November 2016, former Defence Minister Manohar Parrikkar had expressed a need for 24 submarines to be built for the Navy, including the six P-75 Scorpene submarines currently on order.

“Given the extensive submarine building programme in other countries, the Minister was keen to strengthen the fleet. It makes emminent sense to continue to build on the first order,” said an official, requesting anonymity, adding that it was also an option under the P-75 programme.

Transfer of technology from DCNS also involves changing “the shells of the Scorpene by making them thicker with steel”, and the Indian counterparts have been educated on the same, as also integrating it with missiles and weapon systems.

Recently, the Indian Navy detailed a timeline for the induction of six Scorpene submarines, with the first two set to be commissioned end-2017.

http://www.thehindubusinessline.com...e-scorpeneclass-submarines/article9591479.ece
The Deal was for a 6 submarines with a follow on 6 submarines clause.
The IN need more submarines, the line is already set up and the workers are trained. We could go for 6 more Scorpenes under a follow on P75 order.
 

prateikf

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They need to sort out the torpedo mess prior to ordering more subs. What's the use of spending billions when they lack critical weaponry?
 

tharun

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Is scorpene class single hull or double hull submarine?
 

uoftotaku

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Is scorpene class single hull or double hull submarine?
Almost all Western sub designs have been Single Hull. The only modern non-Russian sub using Double Hull design as far as I know is Japanese Soryu-class. Rest all including US SSNs& SSBNs are Single Hull
 

BON PLAN

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Mazagon Docks, DCNS keen on making 3 more Scorpene-class subs


Scorpene submarine ‘Kalvari’ at the Mazagaon Dock

Approach the Navy for another order; submarines to be made in Mumbai

Mazagon Docks Ltd along with French shipbuilder DCNS, its technology partner for the Scorpene submarines, has approached the Indian Navy with a repeat order for three Scorpene-class submarines, despite the data leak scandal that had threatened to derail the project last August.

Like the first six Scorpenes, the three new submarines would also be manufactured at the Mumbai site, and would be equipped with a new anaerobic propulsion system (AIP) developed by the DRDO.

Six Scorpene submarines were ordered in 2005, and are being built at the state-owned Mazagaon Docks (MDL) in Mumbai, with technical assistance and transfer of technology as well as equipment from DCNS. INS Kalvari, the first Scorpene class stealth submarine built under Project 75, is currently undergoing extensive sea trials, while INS Khanderi, the second indigenous Scorpene-class submarine was recently launched at MDL.

The Scorpene submarine is one of the newer submarines of the Indian Navy, and has the capability of launching an anti-ship missile from below the surface of water which is expected to give the Navy a boost. Sensitive data related to the Scorpene was leaked in the Australian media last year. A committee was set up to look into the matter.

In early March, the Indian Navy conducted the maiden firing of an SM39 anti-ship missile from INS Kalvari. The missile successfully hit a surface target at extended ranges during the trial firing, and was hailed as a significant milestone, not only for the Kalvari submarine, but also in enhancing the Indian Navy’s sub-surface warfare capability.

Sources in the know pointed out that all six Scorpene being built in India are to be equipped with anti-ship missiles, which can help neutralise surface threats at extended ranges.

Sources pointed out that a repeat order for three new submarines would also help the Indian shipyard maintain the know-how and skills it has acquired through the manufacture of the first two Scorpene.

“At a seminar in November 2016, former Defence Minister Manohar Parrikkar had expressed a need for 24 submarines to be built for the Navy, including the six P-75 Scorpene submarines currently on order.

“Given the extensive submarine building programme in other countries, the Minister was keen to strengthen the fleet. It makes emminent sense to continue to build on the first order,” said an official, requesting anonymity, adding that it was also an option under the P-75 programme.

Transfer of technology from DCNS also involves changing “the shells of the Scorpene by making them thicker with steel”, and the Indian counterparts have been educated on the same, as also integrating it with missiles and weapon systems.

Recently, the Indian Navy detailed a timeline for the induction of six Scorpene submarines, with the first two set to be commissioned end-2017.

http://www.thehindubusinessline.com...e-scorpeneclass-submarines/article9591479.ece
Maybe Indian Scorpene will not have torpedoes for a time, but at least they have SM39 missiles !
 

brational

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Maybe Indian Scorpene will not have torpedoes for a time, but at least they have SM39 missiles !
This is Epic!
I am carrying a cell phone without SIM card for a while, but I can at least access internet through wifi...
 

aditya g

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This is Epic!
I am carrying a cell phone without SIM card for a while, but I can at least access internet through wifi...
Such is the state of affairs, but that's the way things are. Navy is improvising
 

captscooby81

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Extremely Difficult for Indian Navy’s Submarine Force to Counter Any Hostilities in Current State : Standing Committee on Defence.

In a recent report tabled before the parliament, the ‘standing committee on defence’ has raised serious concerns about the Indian Navy’s underwater force. The submarine force of the navy is at the epicentre of the navy’s operations in the contested Indian Ocean Region (IOR). Under the navy’s command are just 14 submarines which are tasked with the crucial task of guarding India’s coastal waters and also the far flung maritime interest of the country.

Besides, the submarine force is also in-charge of maintaining a privy eye over multiple chokepoints along Strait of Hormuz and Malacca Straits in the Indian Ocean. The submarines are critical for India to impose and to repel any naval blockades along these vantage maritime strategic chokepoints. The effective management of these naval blockades will prove decisive in war-time.

The high-powered standing committee in its report has strongly noted that “It is very unfortunate that Navy has landed into such a critical situation where MRLC (Medium Refit Life Certification) of six submarines is the only available option. Even MRLC will be completed only by 2019. In such a dismal scenario, it is very difficult for Navy to be adequately prepared for any eventuality.”

The navy’s under-water force is composed of 13 conventional and 1 nuclear powered submarines which are all on an average aged between 16-30 years. A classified report prepared by the navy had stated that at any given time, a very minimal amount of the force is available for operations as most of the submarines are either under minor or major refitting programs.

The navy, in an effort to address the short fallings, had in 1999 drafted the 30-year submarine construction plan, under which navy envisioned to constructs 12 conventional submarines by 2012 in Phase – I and another 12 by 2024 in Phase – II. But after almost two decades down the lane, the navy has failed to induct even a single submarine to its force.

The Maritime Capability Perspective Plan (MCPP) 2012-27, under which the navy’s modernisation programs are being floated, envisages a force level of at least 18 conventional submarines. The committee has raised concerns about the country’s efforts and capabilities to meet these ambitious targets.

The P-75 program under which six conventional ‘Scorpene’ submarines are being built by DCNS and MDL is at least four years behind schedule. INS Kalvari, the first submarine being constructed under the program, is expected to be commissioned only in mid-2017.

The Navy and MoD, in a written reply to the committee’s query in regard to answering the deficit in the force, have stated that there exists no solid procurement option. Further, they have observed that the lone viable option to pursue under current condition is to rely on Medium Refit Life Certification (MRLC) of submarines.

These demanding and costly MRLCs the navy says will increase the service life of every single submarine by at least 10 years. A single MRLC according to the navy will take at least 2-3 years and the program shall duly be certified by OEMs.
Way forward for re-energising submarine force of Indian Navy
The navy is currently modernising its submarine force under the ‘30 year submarine construction’ program and the Maritime Capability Perspective Plan 2012-2027. Accordingly, the navy will have to operate at least 30 submarines to counter balance the surging induction rate being followed by the hostile neighbours.

The navy is desperately waiting for the induction of the six ‘Scorpene’ diesel-electric submarines being built by state-run Defence PSU Mazagon Dock Shipbuilders Limited (MDL) in collaboration with French based DCNS under the P-75 program. The submarines under the program are delayed over four years and this is largely attributed to the development of indigenous technology.

INS Kalvari, the first of the submarine being built under the program, is slated to be commissioned by mid-2017, as the submarine has successfully completed all sea trials. INS Khanderi, second of the six submarines, was launched by MDL in February, 2017 and is expected to be commissioned in December, 2017. The rest of the four submarines are expected to be rolled out with a time gap of nine months between each of them.

The navy is said to be contemplating to order at least three more Scorpene submarines to meet the deficit in the force. MDL and DCNS have stated that possible construction of these additional submarines will incubate the construction line and facilities that were built under P-75 program. Further, the company has stated that the development period for these submarines will be less compared to the ones contracted under P-75 Program. The move is largely being viewed as a win-win situation for all stakeholders.

Another program the navy is pinning its hope on is the P-75I program under which six more AIP equipped conventional submarines are to be constructed. The program has been delayed even before its inception as the MoD is yet to release a RFP and this is attributed to the delay in notification of the much awaited ‘Strategic Partnership’ model.

Several global submarine manufacturers have made elaborate offers to the MoD and it is believed that the manufacturers are offering unmatched ToT (Transfer of Technology). Following its tryst with the Indian market, DCNS is expected to make the most economically viable offer. Further, the company already has established prerequisite expertise and infrastructure at MDL. HDW is offering its Type-214 submarine and Sweden based Saab AB is making an aggressive, unmatched and ‘no-strings attached’ ToT offer for its A-26 NG submarine.

With the planned involvement of private shipyards, the tender is expected to offer high stakes for foreign manufacturers in India’s lucrative defence industry. Much of the selection process will demand up on the financial and ToT offer made by the companies.

In February, 2015, the Cabinet Committee on Security (CCS) cleared the construction of six nuclear powered attack submarines (SSN) at an estimated cost of over INR 50,000 crore. The submarines will be designed by navy’s Directorate of Naval Design and are to be constructed at the state-run Hindustan Shipyard Limited (HSL), Vishakhapatnam. Sources have indicated that the submarine will be mainly based around the design of Russian origin Akula-class SSN. The design and development teams are expected to encounter no major hurdles as they have acquired prerequisite expertise following the successful construction of INS Arihant.

The navy will also be acquiring at least four Arihant-class nuclear powered ballistic missile (SSBN) submarines by 2022. These submarines are being constructed under the secretive Advanced Technology Vessel (ATV) project. INS Arihant, the first of the four SSBN, is rumoured to have already entered service with the navy. The addition of Arihant, if true, will provide the country with credible second strike capability.

Arihant-class SSBNs are armed with the 750-KM ranged K-15 ‘Sagarika’ Submarine Launched Ballistic Missile (SLBM) and the 3500+ KM ranged K-4 SLBM. These missiles comprehensively allow India to drastically boost its deterrence capabilities by several folds.

A combined and comprehensive effort by all stakeholders can alone boost the operational capability of the Indian Navy’s submarine force. A synergy between stakeholders will effectively pave way for the navy to receive several of the under-construction and planned underwater combatants at least by the next decade.
 

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