IAF’s air-to-air missiles are faulty: Report

Discussion in 'Strategic Forces' started by I-G, Jul 16, 2009.

  1. I-G

    I-G Tihar Jail Banned

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    IAF’s air-to-air missiles are faulty: Report


    Updated on Thursday, July 16, 2009, 12:34 IST

    Zeenews Bureau

    New Delhi: Nearly half of Indian Air Force’s beyond visual range (BVR) air-to-air missiles that were tested either did not home in on targets during evaluations or failed ground tests because they were ageing much before their shelf lives, a report claimed on Thursday.

    As per the report by an leading English daily, the Comptroller and Auditor General (CAG) in its yet to be released report has raised serious questions on the usability of the R 77 (RVV-AE) BVR missiles, each costing Rs 2 crore, which are fitted on board the Su-30 MKIs, MiG-29s and MiG-21 Bisons.

    India has been procuring these missiles from Russia since 1996 and has even ordered for more than 2,000 missiles after the Kargil conflict out of which 1,000 have already been delivered.

    The missiles failure has affected the “operational preparedness” of the IAF, the daily said quoting CAG report.

    Moreover, just yesterday Defence Minister A K Antony had disclosed that there were structural problems with India’s lead fighter planes, the MiG-29.

    IAF?s air-to-air missiles are faulty: Report
     
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  3. John

    John Guest

    why is this not a surprise?? anyways time for Astra to be inducted soon.
     
  4. I-G

    I-G Tihar Jail Banned

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    R 77 (RVV-AE) BVR missiles, each costing Rs 2 crore. have ordered for more than 2,000 missiles after the Kargil conflict out of which 1,000 have already been delivered.

    If astra should be inducted then first the order of the remaining 1000 missiles should be cancelled .
     
  5. prateikf

    prateikf Regular Member

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    Nearly half of Russian air-to-air missiles with IAF have homing, ageing problems: CAG

    Nearly half of Russian air-to-air missiles with IAF have homing, ageing problems: CAG report




    Putting a big question mark on the performance of the Russian beyond visual range (BVR) air-to-air missiles with the Indian Air Force, an audit report by the Comptroller and Auditor General (CAG) has noted that nearly half the missiles tested either did not home in on targets during evaluations or failed ground tests because they were ageing much before their shelf lives.



    The R 77 (RVV-AE) BVR missiles, fitted on board the Su-30 MKIs, MiG-29s and MiG-21 Bisons, were bought from Russia starting 1996. More than 2,000 missiles were ordered after the Kargil conflict and 1,000 have been delivered.



    The CAG report, which will be released soon, is based on evaluations of the missile — its range is close to 90 km — during ground tests, inspections and test firing by the IAF. The missiles were bought at a “cost of Rs 2 crore each” but their failure during tests, says the CAG report, has affected the “operational preparedness” of the IAF.
     
  6. John

    John Guest

    indeed and speed up Astra induction, when is Astra's 1st flight test??
     
  7. nitesh

    nitesh Mob Control Manager Stars and Ambassadors

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    The report has not even been "released" hmmmm.
     
  8. Singh

    Singh Phat Cat Administrator

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    Are only RVV-AE's faulty ? I wouldn't be surprised if Molniya's etc have become inoperative too.
    In any case RVV-AE's don't have a 100% strike rate.
     
  9. Yusuf

    Yusuf GUARDIAN Administrator

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    Question that arises is why did India go for this missile in the first place. What was the evaluation process?
    Maybe that's the reason why I read somewhere that AMRAAM is under active consideration by the IAF in future for the MRCA. The AMRAAMski is not that going places.
     
  10. LETHALFORCE

    LETHALFORCE Moderator Moderator

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    Someone wants to sell India air to air missiles so they put out this report I am sure it is not a coincidence with the Hillary Clinton trip.
     
  11. SATISH

    SATISH DFI Technocrat Stars and Ambassadors

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    C'mon the CAG has been telling a lot of stupid things nowadays. Or is the army hand in hand with the CAG to get more funds for arms procurement?...me is confused.
     
  12. venom

    venom DFI Technocrat

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    CAG=Politicians=Useless=Shit......So Forget It
     
  13. shreekash

    shreekash New Member

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    One more from Russia. Are they done yet?
     
  14. Dark Sorrow

    Dark Sorrow Respected Member Senior Member

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    Astra has passed unguided flight test. Astra still uses a French(MDBA) seeker. Untill a home grown seeker is not operational i doubt it would be inducted.
     
  15. kuku

    kuku Respected Member

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    BVR is very complicated and i suppose a lot of missiles will miss their mark, its very much possible that half of the missiles missed their mark without being defenctive, sometimes launching the missile too early could have a effect, several other parameters like speed altitude etc. etc. can have a lot of say, however if this is the performance in controlled tests i suppose it would account to even more dismal performance in combat where unpredictable and random events are the norm.

    And this is the most modern Russian missile. :))

    I think we owe it to the people who are ready to give their lives for our protection, to provide them with the best equipment we can provide.
     
  16. wild goose

    wild goose Regular Member

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    However good your bird is , if her projectiles can't hit the bulls eye ,you are dead meat.
    But the positive aspect is that the secret is out. And the CAG report may speed up the procurement of better missiles.
     
  17. John

    John Guest

  18. bhramos

    bhramos Elite Member Elite Member

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    Nearly half of Russian air-to-air missiles with IAF have homing, ageing problems:CAG

    Nearly half of Russian air-to-air missiles with IAF have homing, ageing problems: CAG

    Putting a big question mark on the performance of the Russian beyond visual range (BVR) air-to-air missiles with the Indian Air Force, an audit report by the Comptroller and Auditor General (CAG) has noted that nearly half the missiles tested either did not home in on targets during evaluations or failed ground tests because they were ageing much before their shelf lives.

    The R 77 (RVV-AE) BVR missiles, fitted on board the Su-30 MKIs, MiG-29s and MiG-21 Bisons, were bought from Russia starting 1996. More than 2,000 missiles were ordered after the Kargil conflict and 1,000 have been delivered.

    The CAG report, which will be released soon, is based on evaluations of the missile — its range is close to 90 km — during ground tests, inspections and test firing by the IAF. The missiles were bought at a “cost of Rs 2 crore each” but their failure during tests, says the CAG report, has affected the “operational preparedness” of the IAF.

    “All figures in the report are based on air force records. Everything is verified by the IAF,” an official said.

    The problem with the missiles was referred to Russia and several teams subsequently visited India to rectify faults. IAF officers familiar with the missiles confirmed that this has been a problem area for long. “It is a known fact that the missiles do not work as we would like them to. Periodic tests that are carried out when they are in storage show their dismal state. We also have problems with spare parts,” said a retired officer who was closely associated with the matter.

    Former Air Chief Marshal S Krishnaswamy said: “When the missiles were bought, they were top of the line, world class systems that no other country had. As we did not have our own testing facilities, they had to be tested in Russia. The question to be asked is whether the government approved testing facilities for the missiles in India.”

    The IAF has for long enjoyed an edge over Pakistan due to its inventory of BVR air-to-air missiles. In an article on the Pakistani side of the Kargil war — it was published in The Indian Express — the then PAF Director (Operations) Kaiser Tufail admitted that the presence of the BVR missiles with the IAF kept away the Pakistani F-16s from disrupting aerial bombing being carried out by India near the Line of Control.

    http://www.indianexpress.com/news/n...ve-homing-ageing-problems-cag-report/490055/0
     
  19. Payeng

    Payeng Daku Mongol Singh

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    Thread requires a merger.
     
  20. Sridhar

    Sridhar House keeper Moderator

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    A post by anonymous user in Trishul group says the missile could be actually R 27 not the R 77.

    when I Googled , i got this below link which says India received R 77 only during 1999 - 2001


    R-77; items: 174; transferred from Russia to India between 1999 and 2001
    Items: 174
    Delivery Items
    2001 24
    2000 120
    1999 30

    R-77 / AA-12 Adder, RVV-AE

    Air-to-Air Missiles >> R-77


    So we can confirm things only when the report is actually released.
     
  21. Sridhar

    Sridhar House keeper Moderator

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    Russia explained the criticism of the Indians to launch their lobbying


    Claims of Indian military and the controlling bodies of the Russian aircraft missiles R-77 (export version - RMA-AE) reported by local media, are not unfounded, but their main reason is the competition in the Indian arms market.

    This is like writing "Kommersant," said a source in Russian military-industrial complex. According to the publication of the interlocutor, the Ministry of Defense of India, there are lobby groups that are targeted to different suppliers of weapons. In this case, in his opinion, this is a trying one of these groups lobbied heavily purchase similar missiles AIM-120 AMRAAM U.S. company Hughes Aircraft Corporation, has publicly compromised Russian production. "
    Nevertheless, as reported in the publication of a corporation Tactical missile weapons, a claim to the quality of RMA-AE missiles actually occurred during the first shipments of supplies - until 2003. " However, according to a source publication, specialists CB Vympel in recent years "developed and implemented a range of measures to improve the reliability and quality of the missiles."


    "Recent tests and shooting, at the Indian sites, to fully demonstrate the high combat readiness and reliability of missile RMA-AE", - said the representative of the corporation. He also stressed that Russian producers have not yet received the claims of Indian military on the quality of weapons, as claimed by the Indian media.



    Google ??????????
     

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