IAF flight training to suffer with Kiran's retirement

Discussion in 'Indian Air Force' started by AVERAGE INDIAN, May 10, 2013.

  1. AVERAGE INDIAN

    AVERAGE INDIAN EXORCIST Senior Member

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    [​IMG]


    Notwithstanding the recent inclusion of the Pilatus basic trainer, flight training of Indian Air Force will continue to suffer as it is set to lose its Kiran intermediate jet trainer with no replacement in sight.

    Rookie pilots in the Air Force have been trained on Kiran Mk 1/1A aircraft since 2009 after the grounding of HPT-32 basic trainer fleet. Before the switch, Kiran was used for stage-II training at the IAF academy, Dundigal. Now, IAF has a brand new basic trainer.

    But it is in no position to go back to its old training schedule of Stage-I and II flying in the absence of an intermediate jet trainer (IJT), which is being built by the Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL) for the last 14 years.

    As Kirans are slated to be phased out in 2014 with IJT nowhere on the horizon, the Defence Ministry and IAF recently informed a Parliamentary panel they did not have a contingency plan in place for intermediate training. This raises the possibility of having a void in intermediate jet training in the same manner as was seen in the basic training.

    HAL now claims it will receive the initial operational clearance (IOC) for IJT by December 2013. But there is no clarity on how long the aviaton major would take to get the subsequent final operational clearance as only the second prototype of IJT is now being produced in a limited series production assembly.

    Moreover, HAL is still in consultation with BAE system – manufacturer of Hawk advanced jet trainer – to resolve the design issues.The first squadron of 14 Pilatus will be inducted in the IAF by May end. The first batch of pilots will receive their flying training in Pilatus from July. The second squadron of Pilatus will go to Flying Instructor’s School in Ambala.

    The IAF will receive the entire fleet of 75 Pilatus basic trainer aircraft by 2015.

    Previously, IAF pilots used to receive 75 hours of stage-I flying training in basic aircraft and similar hours of stage-II training in intermediate trainer Kiran. They could fly advanced trainers like Hawks and operational platforms only after commissioning.

    Shortage of aircraft, however, compelled the IAF to recalibrate its training schedule. Now the stage-I training lasts for only 30 hours and stage-II by around 80 hours. Kiran remains the only platform for both stages, though it is nearing its scheduled life.

    IAF flight training to suffer with Kiran's retirement
     
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  3. Decklander

    Decklander New Member

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    IAF seems to have completely lost it when It comes to training Pilots. I really can't understand the need for IJT when we have the Pilatus and Hawk in the fleet.
    Pilatus is used to teach a student the basics of flying and give him a competance level wherein he is comfortable and well orientated with flying. It is after this stage that Hawk stage starts.
    IAF has trained 10 batches on all jet course from 134PC to 143PC. I am from one such batch. We never faced any problems what so ever in training on jets straight from Bicycles.
     
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  4. feathers

    feathers Tihar Jail Banned

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    Life of Kiran aircraft to be extended up to 2017-18
    New Delhi, Feb 12, 2014 DHNS:

    In the absence of an intermediate jet trainer, the Indian Air Force (IAF) will have to extend the life of ageing Kiran Mk-I trainers up to 2017-18 to prevent any disruption in the pilot training programme.

    “After the study of the fatigue life spectrum of Kiran Mk-I aircraft, the Regional Centre for Military Airworthiness (Aircraft) has recommended extension of total technical life of the aircraft. This will help IAF to utilise the fleet till 2017-18, though in gradually reducing numbers,” Defence Minister A K Antony informed the Lok Sabha on Monday.

    Rookie pilots were trained on Kiran Mk 1/1A aircraft since 2009 in the wake of grounding of HPT-32 basic trainer fleet. Before the switch, Kiran was used for stage-II training at the IAF academy, Dundigal.

    The service now has new Pilatus basic trainer.
     
  5. Jagdish58

    Jagdish58 Regular Member

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    Really a work horse IJT-16 Kiran:thumb:

    What is the status on HJT-36 Sitara:confused:
     
  6. kseeker

    kseeker Retired

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  7. Blackwater

    Blackwater Veteran Member Veteran Member

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    Sitara GARDISH me ha:laugh::laugh::laugh:
     
  8. abingdonboy

    abingdonboy Senior Member Senior Member

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    There is ZERO need for the IJT now the IAF has the PC-7 MK.2 and HAWK MK.132 in large numbers and in service- NO NEED WHATSOEVER. Other AFs transition straight from BTTs to the AJT, why should the IAF be any different?? The IJT was conceived when both the BTT and AJT purchases were on shaky ground and looking like distant hopes now, thankfully and surpassingly, both procurements have out-paced the IJT and made it an entirely redundant bird as far as the IAF is concerned.


    The IAF's training regime is in the best shape it has been in for a long, LONG time.
     
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  9. Phantom

    Phantom Regular Member

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    I too don't get it as to why IAF needs the IJT. Agreed that a 3-stage training schedule has been envisaged, but compare this with 2010, when there were no BTs and AJTs, and pilots had to begin on a Kiran and then directly move on to Mig 21 or Mirage Trainers. If they could ride through that phase well, why should they be complaining when they have a good BT and AJT now?
     
  10. Jagdish58

    Jagdish58 Regular Member

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    The HJT-36 Sitara intermediate jet trainer hasn't obtained initial operational clearance (IOC) yet, but a statement was submitted in Parliament today providing some fresh timelines. Here it is in full:


    [The] Development of IJT is in the advanced stages of certification with more than 800 test flights completed so far. The activities are progressing well with completion of Sea level trials, night flying trials, high altitude trials as well as weapon and drop tank trials. The activities left for obtaining Final Operational Clearance (FOC) are the refinement of stall characteristics and spin testing which will be commenced as soon as stall characteristics are refined.


    The project was sanctioned in 1999 and the first and second prototypes flew in March 2003 and in March 2004 respectively. The prototypes were initially flight tested with the LARZAC Engines from SNECMA. To meet technical parameters, a high powered engine AL-55I from Russian was selected based on a global tender. Due to developmental issues in Russia, flight-worthy Engines were supplied to HAL in January, 2009 against the contractual schedule of January, 2007. Flights with these Engines commenced in May, 2009 after resolution of Engine-Aircraft interface issues with the Russians.


    The Progress of project was affected due to loss of prototype during flight testing which necessitated major changes like total redesign of flight control system and associated increased number of design iteration for recovery and resolution. All efforts are being made to achieve FOC by December 2014. Production of aircraft will commence immediately


    Livefist: HJT-36 Target FOC By Dec 2014, Says MoD
    [​IMG]
     
  11. Twinblade

    Twinblade Senior Member Senior Member

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    Many airforces have three trainers for three stage training (Japanese, Italians, Chinese, Pakistanis, Indians) while many airforces now conduct intermediate training with a BTA (USAF, USN, almost everyone else). It really depends on their curriculum.
     
  12. abingdonboy

    abingdonboy Senior Member Senior Member

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    Actually the IAF has a FOUR stage curriculum- BTT, IJT, AJT and OCU (OCU being operational conversion unit i.e. the trainer variant of whatever fighter they are assigned to), supplemented with the ever increasing use of full-mission ground simulators the demand for an IJT is ever more untenable.

    I'd argue, however, there was a legitimate need for supersonic LIFT between AJT and OCU stages if the IAF was insistent on a 4 stage training curriculum and for this the LCA trainer variant could do wonders.


    But, again, I simply don't see the need TODAY for the IJT (HJT-36) given the PC-7 MK.2 BTT and HAWK MK.132 are in service. Many AFs around the world who use BTTs transition their pilots onto AJTs straight away with no stage in between in fact many of the AFs who operate the Hawk AJT do just that. I can see why the IJT was needed 4-5 years ago but today it is entirely redundant and the IAF and HAL are pursuing it for God only knows why.
     

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