Han Chinese Y Chromosome Test Results

Discussion in 'China' started by Ray, Jul 16, 2012.

  1. G90

    G90 Regular Member

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    The Fst distance between different European groups: http://i45.tinypic.com/1411vf5.jpg, this is from [2] Genetic Structure of Europeans: A View from the North–East, PLos One, 2009, the one which show the Fst for Chinese is ffrom [1]: Genomic Dissection of Population Substructure of Han Chinese and Its Implication in Association Studies, The American Journal of Human Genetics, Vol. 85, Issue 6, pp.762-774.

    So learn to live with it, hehehe.
     
  2. opkeyen

    opkeyen Regular Member

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    Han, the earliest ancestor ,huaxia( Tocharian),is the white tribes from Central Asia, all the way down and Tungus, Baiyue, Miaoman mestizo, Han is a big dye vat. Many Mongolia and Manchu are integrated.
     
  3. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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  4. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    No I am not a racist, but a pragmatist.

    Racist is a very loosely used word, when one discusses these issues and one has nothing constructive to offer being fact denied and embarrassed.

    Racism means discrimination or prejudice based on race.

    How does my post qualify?

    The issue is what the Chinese Govt statistics state and whether Han is a race or a culture.
     
  5. Oblaks

    Oblaks Regular Member

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    So.. is Han a race or a culture??? You say it's a culture! any evidence? Or is it really a race which is dimishing due to cross-breeding? just curious to know the facts.
     
  6. Oblaks

    Oblaks Regular Member

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    I don't know what the fuzz is all about. It may be true that Ray hates PRC :scared1: but the post is so neutral and not racy at all. It is merely trying to rule out if Han is indeed a race. I suggest Our Chinese posters to enlighten everybody instead of making paranoid defensive responses since you assume to be more knowledgeable on this topic.
     
  7. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    [​IMG]



    There are 56 ethnic groups in China that are officially recognized by the government of the People's Republic of China.
     The not recognised ethnic minorities are
     Ayi people
     Äynu people
     Gejia (亻革家人, Gèjiā Rén)
     Bajia (八甲人, Bājiǎ Rén)
     Deng (僜人, Dèng Rén)
     Khmu (克木人, Kèmù Rén)
     Kucong (Yellow Lahu/Lahu Shi (苦聪人; Traditional: 苦聰人; Kǔcōng Rén)
     Mang (芒人, Máng Rén)
     Sherpas (夏尔巴人; Traditional: 夏爾巴人; Xiàěrbā Rén)
     Tuvans (图瓦人, Túwǎ Rén)
     Waxiang (瓦乡人, Wǎxiāng Rén)
     Yi (羿人, Yìrén)
     Youtai (犹太; Traditional: 猶太; Yóutài) (Jewish people of China and Jewish people in general)
     Yamato Japanese (大和民族) and Ryukyuans (琉球民族) living as permanent residents in Taiwan and North East China
     Macanese (土生葡人, Descendant of Portuguese in Macau since 16th century)

    What you have mentioned in your post is just what the article mentions.

    It is correct that there are many facilities given to the Tibetans and Uighurs that are not given to the Han. And yet they are not happy. They are not happy since they possibly want to maintain their singular identity to include language, culture, religion, customs, tradition and so on.

    That is not want China wants. China want then to be assimilated so that they have the same attitude towards nationalism as the Hans. To achieve this, China is ensuring that there is an uniform culture i.e. the Han culture, or in other words, assimilation of the Uighurs and Tibetans and making them Han.

    On the issue of language, they wish to maintain their own language. And yet, the best universities and jobs are in Mainland China and the language there is Mandarin.

    The solution would be to teach both their language as also Mandarin. But then if that is done, then the Uighurs and Tibetan will not get assimilated to become Han. It obviously is not to the advantate of how China wants to shape the country as one monolithic entity where there is no dissension.
     
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  8. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    This did come handy in your post Haplogroup O3 (Y-DNA) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia, though you forgot to mention the same.

    Although Haplogroup O3 appears to be primarily associated with Chinese populations, it also forms a significant component of the Y-chromosome diversity of most modern populations of the East Asian region.

    Another good reason why everything in East Asia is Chinese!

    Let me add:

    In human genetics, Haplogroup O3 (M122) is a Y-chromosome haplogroup.

    Haplogroup O3 is a descendant haplogroup of haplogroup O. Some researchers believe that it first appeared in China approximately 10,000 years ago. However, others believe that the high internal diversity of Haplogroup O3 indicates a late Pleistocene (Upper Paleolithic) origin in South China or Southeast Asia of the M122 mutation that defines the entire O3 clade, while the common presence among a wide variety of modern East and Southeast Asian nations of closely related haplotypes belonging to certain subclades of Haplogroup O3 is considered to point to a recent (e.g., Holocene) geographic dispersion of a certain subset of the ancient variation within Haplogroup O3. The spread of these particular subsets of Haplogroup O3 is conjectured to be closely associated with the sudden agricultural boom associated with rice farming.

    Although Haplogroup O3 appears to be primarily associated with Chinese populations, it also forms a significant component of the Y-chromosome diversity of most modern populations of the East Asian region. Haplogroup O3 is found in over 50% of all modern Chinese males (ranging up to over 80% in certain regional subgroups of the Han ethnicity), about 40% of Manchurian, Korean, and Vietnamese males, about 35% of Filipino and Malaysian males, about 25%[1] of Zhuang males, and about 15%[2] to 20%[3] of Japanese males. The distribution of Haplogroup O3 stretches far into Central Asia (approx. 18% of Khalkh Mongols and approx. 6.2% of Altayans[4]) and Oceania (approx. 25% of Polynesians), albeit with reduced frequencies of most subclades. It should be noted that Haplogroup O3* Y-chromosomes, which are not defined by any identified downstream markers, are actually more common among certain non-Chinese populations than among Chinese ones, and the presence of these O3* Y-chromosomes among various populations of Central Asia, East Asia, and Oceania is more likely to reflect a very ancient shared ancestry of these populations rather than the result of any historical events. It remains to be seen whether Haplogroup O3* Y-chromosomes can be parsed into distinct subclades that display significant geographical or ethnic correlations.

    Among all the populations of East and Southeast Asia, Haplogroup O3 is most closely associated with those that speak a Sinitic, Tibeto-Burman, or Hmong-Mien language. Haplogroup O3 comprises about 50% or more of the total Y-chromosome variation among the populations of each of these language families. The Sinitic and Tibeto-Burman language families are generally believed to be derived from a common Sino-Tibetan protolanguage, and most linguists place the homeland of the Sino-Tibetan language family somewhere in northern China. The Hmong-Mien languages and cultures, for various archaeological and ethnohistorical reasons, are also generally believed to have derived from a source somewhere north of their current distribution, perhaps in northern or central China. The Tibetans, however, despite the fact that they speak a language of the Tibeto-Burman language family, have a very high percentage of the otherwise rare Haplogroup D1, which is also found at much lower frequencies throughout Central and Northeast Asia. These facts suggest that Haplogroup O3 is characteristic of the easterly part of the zone of transition between the Northeast Asian and Southeast Asian genepools: namely, the region that comprises the North China Plain and the area between the Yellow and Yangtze rivers. It is notable that Haplogroup O3 is the only haplogroup that occurs at high frequencies among populations that possess Northeast Asian genetic characteristics as well as among populations that possess Southeast Asian genetic characteristics.

    Haplogroup O3 has been implicated as a diagnostic genetic marker of the Austronesian expansion when it is found in populations of Oceania. Its distribution in Oceania is mostly limited to the traditionally Austronesian culture zones, including moderately high frequencies in the Philippines, Malaysia, Indonesia, and Polynesia, with generally lower frequencies found in coastal and island Melanesia, Micronesia, and Taiwanese aboriginal tribes.

    The subgroup O3a5-M134 is particularly closely associated with Sino-Tibetan populations, and it is generally not found outside of areas where a Sino-Tibetan language is currently spoken or that are historically supposed to have suffered Chinese colonization or immigration, such as Korea, Japan, Vietnam, Malaysia, the Philippines, and Indonesia. However, its presence among non-Sino-Tibetan populations is always very limited and never amounts to more than 10% of the total Y-chromosome diversity. There are also reports that Y-chromosomes belonging to Haplogroup O3a5 have been sampled from populations of such far-flung places as Western Samoa. Surprisingly, Haplogroup O3a5-M134 Y-chromosomes have also been found in about 1% to 3% of indigenous Australian men in the northwest of that continent, which might indicate that a certain degree of contact has occurred between the Austronesian expansion from Asia and some indigenous Australian populations. The fact that Haplogroup O3a5 is so strongly associated with Chinese populations, however, and the fact that no Y-chromosome haplogroups characteristic of Austronesian populations have been found among these indigenous Australian populations may be taken to suggest the possibility of some direct Chinese-Australian contact in the precolonial era.

    Haplogroup O3's brother clade, Haplogroup O1, displays a similar geographical distribution, being found among nearly all the populations of East and Southeast Asia, but generally at a frequency much lower than that of Haplogroup O3. Another brother clade, Haplogroup O2, has an impressive extent of dispersal, as it is found among the males of populations as widely separated as the Mundas of India and the Japanese of Japan; however, Haplogroup O2's distribution is much more patchy, and the Haplogroup O2 Y-chromosomes found among the Mundas and the Japanese belong to distinct subclades.
    Edited by ryukyurhymer, 07 February 2008 - 08:33 PM.
    Japanese Haplogroup O3a5 from Han Chinese - Asian Anthropology - China History Forum, Chinese History Forum
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2012
  9. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    Haplogroup O3 is characteristic of the easterly part of the zone of transition between the Northeast Asian and Southeast Asian genepools: namely, the region that comprises the North China Plain and the area between the Yellow and Yangtze rivers.
     
  10. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    I don't hate the Chinese at all.

    I only am interested in putting the facts in place where I feel that misrepresentations are bandied as the Gospel Truth.
     
  11. satish007

    satish007 Senior Member Senior Member

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    pure Hans have two Y Chromosones. they are very tough.
    one old said and a poetry describe What Hans were.

    1/ 犯我强汉者,虽远必诛
    Translate: we will dig anyone who violate big Hans out from sewers and kill them despite of how far and deep they hide because Hans able to hold the grudge for pretty long time which even Indian elephants enable to.

    2/ 壮志饥餐胡虏肉,笑谈渴饮匈奴血。
    Translate: Hans never mind fighting without any supply. Hans barbecue enemy bodies if they hungry , drink enemy blood if they thirsty.

    but Indian bhai need not worry about it now , China hard to find enough dual Y guys in China now.
    yes, we have found some and start to breed them , hopefully in 2050, China will have enough pure Hans troops to take back South Tibet from India.
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2012
  12. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    Doctorate Li Hui from Fudan University of China had analyzed the DNA of Asians to derive a conclusion that the ancestors of Mongoloid Asians possessed a distinctive Mark M89 by the time they arrived in Southeast Asia. About 30,000 years ago, from the launching pad of Southeast Asia, the early Mongoloids went through a genetic mutation to Marker M122.

    Li Hui, at http://web.wenxuecit...amp;MsgID=56818, claimed that the early migrants to the Chinese continent took three routes via two entries of Yunnan and Guangxi-Guangdong provinces. In the timeframe of about 10,000 years and developing a genetic mutation to marker M134, this branch of people who went direct north would penetrate the snowy Hengduan Mountains of Tibetan-Qinghai Plateau to arrive at the area next to the Yellow River bends. Owning to cold weather, big nose, heavy lips and long face developed among this group of people. Splitting out of this northbound migrants would be those who went to the east with a new genetic marker M117, i.e., ancestors of modern Han Chinese. However, our ancestors forgot that they penetrated northward the Hengduan Mountains from the Indo-China "CORRIDOR" in today's Vietnam. "Walking down Mt Kunlun", i.e., the "collective memory of ethnic Han Chinese" that was echoed in Guo Xiaochuan's philharmonic-agitated epic, was the starting point of the eastward migration which our Chinese ancestors remembered. Li Hui grouped the 3000-year-old Chu and Qi people in the same category as Han Chinese, albeit meeting the ancient classics records as to Qi statelet's lineage from the Qiangic-Tibetan Fiery Lord. The rest would develop into ancestors of today's Tibetans. This seems to corroborate with Scholar Luo Xianglin's claim that early Sino-Tibetan peoples originated from Mt Minshan and upperstream River Min-jiang areas of Sichuan-Gansu provincial borderline and then split into two groups, with one going north to reach Wei-shui River and upperstream Han-shui River of Shenxi Prov and then east to Shanxi Prov by crossing the Yellow River.

    The second branch of early Mongoloids, about 10,000 years ago, entered China's southeastern coastline with genetic marker M119. Li Hui, claiming the same ancestry as the Dai-zu and Shui-zu minorities of Southwestern China, firmly believed that his ancestors had dwelled in Hangzhou Bay and Yangtze Delta for 7-8 thousand years. The people with M119 marker would be the historical "Hundred Yue Peoples". Li Hui then pointed out that the ancient Wu people, with M7 genetic marker, came to the lower Yangtze area about 3000 years ago. While Li Hui claimed that the M7 Wu people had split away from the northbound M134 Sino-Tibetan people, historical classics pointed out that Wu Statelet was established by two uncles of Zhou Dynasty King Wenwang, i.e., migrants from the Yellow River area.

    The last interesting theory adopted by Li Hui would be still one more possible Mongoloid branch of people who, at about 20,000 years, continued to travel non-stop along the Chinese coastline to reach the Liao-he River area of Manchuria where they developed into Altaic-speaking peoples, i.e., ancestors of Huns, Turks and Mongols. This claim did corroborate with this webmaster's historical analysis of Huns, Turks and Mongols which yielded the conclusion that i) there was no through traffic from west to east in the Gobi or the Steppe in early times and that ii) the Mongoloid had a pattern of raiding to the west, not the other way around by the Indo-Europeans. Today's Koreans, in the opinion of Li Hui, would be the mixtures of the early migrants to Manchuria and the later Dong-yi [Eastern Yi] migrants from Eastern China. This certainly dealt a blow to the Korean nationalists' claim of "Siberian origin". (See Assertions By Wang Zhonghan for clues as to the relationship between Qiangic Proto-Tibetan and Altaic Proto-Hun activities: "the northern barbarians and western barbarians were similar [i.e., Qiangs] at Spring-Autumn time period, but by the time of late Warring States, Chinese began to see the northern barbarians as different from the western barbarians".)
    Japanese Haplogroup O3a5 from Han Chinese - Asian Anthropology - China History Forum, Chinese History Forum

    Dr Li Hui of Fudan University of China
    http://web.wenxuecity.com/BBSView.php?SubID=memory&MsgID=56818
     
  13. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    [​IMG]

    Check the area between the Hwang Ho and Yangtse kiang.
     
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  14. satish007

    satish007 Senior Member Senior Member

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    India should have Chemical or biological weapons to attack Chinese Y Chromosome.
    change it to mouse or woman or something like that.
     
  15. RedDragon

    RedDragon Regular Member

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    LOL :rofl:
     
  16. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    Han culturism differentiates between the culture of the Han, the inner people (nei ren) and the barbarians, the outer people (wai ren). This concept is a hand me down from the time of the Shang Dynasty, who political centre was located North of the Yellow River.

    The Chinese differentiate between raw barbarians (shengfan) or the unassimilated people and the “cooked barbarians” (shufan) or those who were assimilated and yet were not the Han people e.g. the Han Chinese separated the ‘cooked’ Li of the coast of Hainan from the ‘uncooked’ Li of the central forest.


    Barbarians were given generic names in the Chinese classics and histories: the Yi barbarians to the East, the Man to the South, Rong to the West and Di to the North.


    Until the 1930s, the names of the outgroups (wai ren) were commonly written in characters with the animal radical: the Di, a northern tribe were linked to the dog; the Man and Min of the South were characterised with reptiles; the Qiangs were written with a sheep radical. This reflected the Han Chinese conviction that civilisation and culture were linked with humanity; alien groups living outside the pale of Han society were regarded as inhuman savages.

    The custom of sharply distinguishing between the inner and outer people went along with the calling China the Middle Kingdom (zhong guo) , which began by ruling the Central plain (zhongyang) in North China. Rather than using outright military conquest, the theory of ‘using the Chinese ways to transform the barbarians (yongxiabianyi)’ was promulgated. By cultural absorption or racial integration through intermarriage, a barbarian could become a Han Chinese (Hanhua).

    Excerpted from:

    An Ethnohistorical Dictionary of China
    http://books.google.com/books?id=IOM8qF ... t#PPA95,M1

    Sun Yat Sen, the founder of Chinese Republic overthrew the Qing Dynasty which ruled over all of China from 1644 to 1911 and proclaim when he launch his rebellion against the Qing Dynasty which was ruled by Manchus:

    “ In order to restore our national independence, we must first restore the Chinese nation. In order to restore the Chinese nation, we must drive the barbarian Manchus back to the Changbai Mountains. In order to get rid of the barbarians, we must first overthrow the present tyrannical, dictatorial, ugly, and corrupt Qing government. Fellow countrymen, a revolution is the only means to overthrow the Qing government!


    Just to mention what is

    1. Han culture and expansionist imperialism.

    2. The use of the word 'barbarian' is from the Chinese to include Sun Yat Sen (Got that Nimo?)
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2012
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  17. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    Han Chinese Culturalrism

    China’s topography has historically encouraged regional separatism, but Han culturalism provided unity for the Chinese. Han Chinese culturalism arose to distinguish between the culture of the Han, or inner people (nei ren) and the ‘barbarians’, the outer people (wei ren), Chinese social institution and feelings of cultural and aesthetic superiority have provided reassurance for the Han Chinese in the face of barbarian penetration and conquest.

    The concept of Han culture began with the Shang dynasty, 1750 -1040 BC, whose political centre was located north of the Yellow River. The Shang provided China’s first written history as well as the assertion of central cultural superiority over the surrounding people by designating as barbarians everyone who did not yet acknowledge the central government supremacy. The Chinese distinguished between ‘raw barbarians’ (shengfan) or the unassimilated people and the ‘cooked barbarians’ (shufan) or assimilated taxpayers who enjoyed the fruits of Chinese culture. For example, Han Chinese officials separated the ‘cooked’ Li of the coast of Hainan, who enjoyed the benefits of Chinese civilisation, from the wild ‘uncooked’ Li of the central forests, far from the influences of Han culture.

    Barbarians were given generic names in the Chinese classics and histories: the Yi barbarians to the east, the Man to the South, the Rong to the west and Di to the north (when westerners arrived by sea, they were officially designated until the late 19th century as Yi). Until the 1930s, the names of outgroups (wai ren) were commonly written with an animal radical: the Di, the northern tribe, were linked to the Dog; the Man and the Min of the south were characterised with reptiles; the Qiang was written with a sheep radical. This reflected the Han Chinese conviction that civilisation and culture were linked with humanity; alien groups living outside the pale of Chinese society were regarded as inhuman savages. To be labelled a barbarian was a cultural rather than racial distinction.

    That the custom of sharply distinguishing went along with calling China the Middle Kingdom (zhong guo), , which began by ruling the Central Plain (zhongyang) in North China. Rather than using outright military conquest of outsiders, the theory of ‘using the Chinese ways to transform the barbarians’ (yongxiabianyi) was promulgated. By Chinese cultural absorption or racial integration through intermarriage, a barbarian could become Han Chinese (hanhua). To be counted within China, groups accepted the rituals and cosmology that gave the Han dynastic state the Mandate of Heaven to rule over mankind. Non acceptance of this politicised culture left one outside of Zhongguo or China

    An Ethnohistorical Dictionary of China - James Stuart Olson - Google Books
     
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  18. asianobserve

    asianobserve Elite Member Elite Member

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  19. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    Han is a culture that is always in a race with everyone else and thinks that Usain Bolt is THE HAN! :pound:

    [​IMG]
     
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  20. satish007

    satish007 Senior Member Senior Member

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    Only some south-east asian contries came from Africa Monkeys
    Hans created by a goddess.
     
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