Haj subsidy phase out begins from next year

S.A.T.A

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No amount of austerities will ever enable a Muslim,deficient in finance or rendered incapable of handling, for whatever reasons journey that would involve(but not just restricted to)negotiating international borders and associated logistics,the same applies to Hindus intent on making a pilgrimage to manas sarovar in the icy forbidding heights of the Tibetan plateau,hence it becomes incumbent upon the govt to render whatever assistance and in whatever reasonable form it might be able to make it available.rendering such assistance does not controvert the principle of secular governance,although it might violate the concept of 'non discrimination'..........

International pilgrimage and its associated logistical requirements(which can never be solely provided for by an average or even above average citizen) is never on the same scale as a visit to Ajmer shariff or Shabarimala,hence any comparison between the two is irrelevant.
 
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ejazr

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Withdraw subsidy on Haj travel, provide cheaper fares: Muslim MPs

Several Muslim MPs today demanded withdrawal of the subsidy on Haj travel and instead suggested long-term agreements with airlines to provide better facilities and cheaper fares for people from the country who go for the annual pilgrimage.

The MPs also demanded better accommodation facilities for the pilgrims at Saudi Arabia and doing away with the practice of granting travellers with temporary passports for the pilgrimage and providing them with permanent passports instead.

The MPs from various parties today interacted with External Affairs Minister S M Krishna here on ways to improve Haj travel.

"We do not need subsidy. It is like an alm which we do not need...a long-term policy should be evolved where subsidy can be withdrawn. We can set up a corporation on the lines of Malaysia to handle Haj travel. The powers of the corporation should be centralised and not divided as is the case now,"

RLD's Rajya Sabha MP Mehmood A Madni said after the meeting.

Expressing similar sentiments, BJP's Lok Sabha member Syed Shahnawaz Hussain said subsidy has no meaning as the middlemen make profit out of it instead of the common man who goes to perform Haj.

"The airlines provide poor services to the Hajis"¦ their luggage is lost and so on," he said.

A senior Congress MP, who was present in the meeting, said the issue of withdrawal of subsidy and replacing it with a long-term arrangement with airlines to provide better services prevailed in the meeting which lasted over two hours.

Some said private airlines should be roped in to provide better facilities and the airlift should not be restricted to the national carrier.

Hussain said he raised the issue of providing the pilgrims with permanent passports.

"The practice now is to provide them (those who do not have a permanent passport) with temporary passports. Once you are issuing them with a passport, why not provide a permanent one," he said.

Several MPs also said the government should reach a long-term understanding with owners of accommodation in Saudi Arabia so that Hajis can get to stay at places near the pilgrimage site so that they do not have to walk for kilometres in scorching heat.

The issue of MEA keeping Haj quotas with it was also raised in the meeting with members saying that the Ministry should keep minimum share and distribute most of it with states based upon their population.
 

ejazr

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Well performing Hajj as per Islamic law is not compulsory if a person (1) can't afford it (2) is not healthy enough to perform it. Similarly, for fasting a person who can't stay without food or drink from dawn to disk(due to some medical condition like diabetes or being pregnant) does not have to fast under Islamic law.

Besides, the state should be focused on education, health and alleviating poverty and equal opportunity employment rather than subsidizing religious obligations. And of course subsidies in itself just create another vehicle for corruption. Be it Haj subsidy, food grain subsidy or other populist policies. Bringing in the private sector and putting up the Hajj arrangements for competitive bidding from airlines to accommodation will keep the service clean and also bring down prices for Hajj aspirants. Not to mention allowing the GoI to spend the "Hajj subsidy" money on development.
 

tarunraju

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The Messiah

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^ People are stingy and will welcome any decision that decreases there expenses.
 

ejazr

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Isn't that the same as subsidy? If you're providing cheaper fares (cheaper than operating costs), you're subsidizing.

Also, if wealthy Hajis are made to support those who can't afford, isn't that the same as borrowing from other individuals, which again is un-Islamic?

Please help me understand, I don't intend to be judgmental.
I think the title is a bit misleading. First to clarify, the subsidy is only on Air Fares and is directly paid to the Air India. What we have in India is that Air India fares are decided by the Hajj comittee. The Hajj committee is appointed by the govt. in power and they basically fix the price. In otherwords, you have the old soviet model of price fixing rather than allowing the markets to dictate the true price. This ofcourse results in higher costs but also corruption. There is no transparency on how the price of the ticket (usually has been more expensive then their counterparts).

For example, Air India tickets where around INR 45000 of which GoI payed around INR 28000 as subsidy while the last year bids won by a consortium of saudi based airlines resulted in air tickets cheaper than Air India and a 25% savings on the total subsidy to GoI as compared to last year becuase of cheaper air fares. 2009 bill was 770 crore while 2010 was 611 crore.

By completely going free market on air fares and getting rid of subsidies in the present form and allowing international bidding, we would naturally get more competition and cheaper fares. And these cheaper fares are due to the competition and market and not subsidies. And where ever there is subsidies, there is usually corruption.

The part of wealthy Hajis or even wealthy muslims funding Hajj trips for poorer Hajis has to be voluntary. On the other hand, the GoI subsidies are mandatory and practically speaking we can't have consensus from the tax payer on using it for Hajj. The important point is that this should be completely voluntary on part of the wealthy muslim. And because this is believed to result in great reward, most wealthy Hajis would be expected to agree happily.

Ofcourse, the most preferred option still is that it should be your own money. And that is where the savings scheme and Hajj investement schemes come into play. For example, investing your savings in Mutual Funds over a few years and then use that money for Hajj. I believe that is how its done in Malaysia.

Bottom line is that the state should not be funding religious activities, this money could be used in setting up schools or hospitals in backward districts or providing scholarships to poor students. And sooner they phase out the Hajj subsidy the better.
 

amitkriit

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Instead of draining money on Hajj subsidy government must channel this money for upliftment of poor and needy in the Muslim community. This will serve our Muslim citizens better. Even a development plan carved solely for Muslim community must be welcomed, the community needs to catch up.
 

Ray

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Actually, it will cut costs for Air India who will no longer have to subsidize a good percentage of their middle eastern routes.

Plus, Govt. shouldn't be running air lines in the first place. Privatize it! ;-)
I believe the Haj subsidy also went to pay the air fare and that was a way to keep the govt airline afloat!

If that is right, then it is a case of Robbing Peter to Pay Paul.

Further, what is so important for the Hajis to travel by Air India? They could go by any other airlines, but the poorer Hajis went by Air India since it saved costs.
 

Ray

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Instead, "a premium would be charged from better-off Hajis to cross-subsidise the travel cost for the less well-off Hajis". For this, the quota of poor Hajis going through the lottery route and the rich going through the premium route would be kept equal.

"The better-off Hajis will pay 20 per cent premium in the first year with the government funding the rest. This premium would be raised gradually to its full value in seven years so that the government is kept out of the funding," said an MEA officials
I have not understood what the Govt has to do in the matter of making the richer to pay a premium and all that.

It is purely a matter amongst the Muslims and the Haj Organisers.

What role has the govt to decide how the richer Muslims will care for the poorer ones.

To be frank, the more I read the govt's instructions as given in Post#1, the more befuddled I get.
 

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Supreme Court strikes down Centre's Haj subsidy policy

Supreme Court strikes down Centre's Haj subsidy policy

New Delhi: The Supreme Court on Tuesday struck down the Centre's policy of giving subsidies to Haj pilgrims. The court also directed the Centre to eliminate the policy of Haj subsidies over a period of ten years.

The Supreme Court directed the Centre to reduce the number of its representatives to two persons to be sent along with Haj delegations.

"We hold that this policy (giving subsidies to Haj pilgrims) is best done away with," the apex court said.

SC strikes down Centre's Haj subsidy policy - India News - IBNLive
 

Ray

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Too late in the day.

The Muslim themselves don't want the subsidy.

An ideal example of locking the stable door after the horse has bolted.

I know of many poor Muslim, who inspite of the subsidy, cannot afford to go on Haj, a ritual dear to them and yet Fate and Circumstance steals away this most auspicious and holy satisfaction that a Muslim cherishes.
 
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ejazr

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The bench of Justice Aftab Alam and Ranjana Prakash has been scrutinizing and exposing the "Haj subsidy" policy for well over a year now.

On top of the GoI announced phasing out of the Haj subsidy policy by , the SC has now directed that it be phased out in the next 10 years.

The ministry of minority affairs had already announced that it will be phased out by 2017, so that should not be a problem. Most importantly, it has exposed this practice of sending "official delegation" of VIPs of around 800 or so people based on recommendations rather than the normal lucky draw process and arbitrary selection of tour operators. So that has rightly been struck down as Hajj has to be done by your own personal money.

SC strikes down Haj subsidy
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A Bench of Justices Aftab Alam and Ranjana Prakash Desai had directed the Centre to provide details of subsidy given by it and criteria adopted for allocation of seats to state committees.

The apex court frowned at the practice of sending official delegations to accompany the pilgrims and had asked the Centre to furnish entire details regarding Haj subsidy, as also to the criteria adopted.

The apex court was hearing an appeal filed by the Centre challenging a Bombay High Court judgement which had directed the Ministry of External Affairs to allow certain private operators to operate the services of 800 of the 11,000 pilgrims earmarked under the VIP quota subsidised by the government.

Earlier, the bench had pulled up the Centre's practice of "politicising" the annual Haj pilgrimage by permitting official delegations to accompany the pilgrims, for which the government offers huge subsidy, saying, "It's a bad religious practice."
 

ejazr

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Specifically on the "VIP quota"

Supreme Court wants 'VIP quota' for Haj to go - India News - IBNLive

New Delhi: The Supreme Court Monday said the "goodwill" delegation that the government sends every year during Haj to Saudi Arabia has become some kind of VIP quota and was not in conformity with religious duty and it should be stopped.

An apex court bench of Justice Aftab Alam and Justice Ranjana Prakash Desai said the government has proposed to reduce the strength of the "goodwill" delegation to one plus nine, but it should come down to one plus three or four and eventually should cease.

"You have suggested that you will reduce it to one plus nine, but we want it at one plus three or four and that should be also be discontinued in the next few years," the court told the government.
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Ray

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Besides, as a secular welfare state, the government should not be involved in subsidizing religious observances for any faith. This is of course different from providing logistics and security to pilgrims like security to pilgrims going to Mansarover or Ajmer for example. It would be a similar role if someone wanted to have a huge rock concert or a some other event as well.
But the state should not be involved in subsidizing the travel costs for people of any faith. If Hindus and Muslims are subsidised for Mansarover and Mecca, then what about Buddhists, or Christians who want to go on pilgrimages as well.
What is meant by security and logistics being provided for those going to Mecca and Mansarovar?

What logistics? Vehicle, airlift or what?

Are there subsidies to go to Mansarovar? I thought that it is through travel organisers.

Mansaover is in Tibet and is the Chinese allowing India to provide logistics and security?

Does India provide any logistics and security for Mecca visit?
 

ejazr

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What is meant by security and logistics being provided for those going to Mecca and Mansarovar?

What logistics? Vehicle, airlift or what?

Are there subsidies to go to Mansarovar? I thought that it is through travel organisers.

Mansaover is in Tibet and is the Chinese allowing India to provide logistics and security?

Does India provide any logistics and security for Mecca visit?
I was referring to logistics within India until the Haj pilgirms embark from the country and then when the return and disburse back to their homes.
You have close to 200 000 people travelling out and back in a short period of time, you have to arrange for crowd control, medical facilities and extra security just because of the large number of people involved. Then you have the logistics of assigning visas to tour operators and processing Haj visa appliacations
Then you have the cost in appoiting the MEA as the nodal ministry to organise the Haj and sign the Haj visa agreements with the Saudi govt. Ofcourse, just like in MAnsarovar yatra, the trip by itself would be borne by the pilgrims with no "subsidy"

In the Kailash Mansraovar yatra, the MEA is the nodal body that organises the trip just like int he Haj and it also incurs administrative costs in the normal course of duties in getting visa from the Chinese govt. and arranging the Yatra itself. MEA also appoints liason officers whose trip is funded by the MEA to take care of things like communication, medical requirements and air-evacuation in case of emergency (http://mea.gov.in/staticfile/kailash/liaison.pdf)

But since the Saudi govt. appoints and takes care of these, the MEA has no need provide that.

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And welcoming of the SC order from all sections of the Muslim community as expected

Muslims welcome Haj ruling
New Delhi, May 8: Muslim leaders and clerics today welcomed the Supreme Court order for progressive elimination of the Haj subsidy, and demanded the Haj committee be allowed to float international tenders for chartered flights to carry the pilgrims to Saudi Arabia.

They pointed out that Air India's Haj fares are higher than other airlines' fares on the same routes, because under Saudi rules, the carrier's planes have to return empty after dropping the pilgrims and again fly to Saudi empty to bring them back.

But private airlines are expected to offer lower fares during the bidding if a tender is floated, said Zafaryab Jilani, an All India Muslim Personal Law Board member.

Mufti Maulana Abdul Qasim Nomani termed the subsidy un-Islamic, saying Islam does not permit Muslims to take money from anybody for Haj — a point the court itself made.

"The government started giving the subsidy for obvious reasons, as nobody from the community had asked for it," he said.

Jilani said the law board had been demanding the abolition of the Haj subsidy for several years. He added that Air India's Haj high fares means the bulk of the subsidy goes to it instead of the pilgrim.

"The subsidy is mainly aimed at bailing out the sick Air India. We have been demanding abolition of the subsidy and the floating of a global tender for chartered flights," he said.

"Since 1.25 lakh pilgrims go to Mecca to perform Haj through the Haj committee, a global tender will bring competition from several airlines and this would automatically lead to a fall in fare."

Minority affairs minister Salman Khurshid welcomed the order and said the government had been working in the same direction. "The issue of Haj subsidy has been already under consideration for over the last four years and discussions had taken place for rollback of Haj subsidy."

He said the government was also working to ensure there was no burden on the pilgrims and the financial arrangements with the airlines were "more viable".

"I hope it will even out and balance out. This is my impression," he said.

Around 1.7 lakh Indians will go on Haj this year in September-October. Of them, 1.25 lakh will go through the Haj committee and the rest with the help of private tour operators.

Zafarul Islam Khan, working president of the All India Muslim Majlis-e Mushawarat, said the government had started the practice of giving Haj subsidy in 1973.

"The subsidy stops the pilgrims from flying private airlines, some of which offer more attractive packages, including hotel rooms and transport within Saudi Arabia at the same or lower price."

He suggested the government also look for an alternative mechanism modelled on the Malaysian concept of Tabung Haji, which allows Hajis to make the pilgrimage by investing their own money in an "Islamic, Shariat-compliant" way.

They put whatever amount they can afford into a kitty and can withdraw it whenever they want to go on Haj.

Lok Sabha MP Asaduddin Owaisi of the Majlis-e-Ittehadul Muslimeen (MIM) expressed happiness at the apex court order.

"The subsidy money should be invested in the education of minority girls and for their overall development," he said.
 

SHURIDH

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ray da hajj is not faraj for poor muslim it is clearly written in quran.only economicly stable muslim has this religious obligation.waklf board has huge property but they are missmanegment. you knew ray da few days ago karantaka waklf board has 2 lakh core scam.with this money walkf board can send muslim of india for hajj for at least 250years!it alone karnataka.in wb walkaf board has huge property.my area murshidabad is full of walkf property.but they don't do manegment of those property.they undervalued those property.wb walkf board property is estimated over few lakh cores.
 

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