Greetings/Questions from Germany

Discussion in 'Introductions & Greetings' started by gridemann, Jul 11, 2011.

  1. gridemann

    gridemann New Member

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    Hi, let my introduce myself first. My Name is Daniel, I'm a german student living in a small town in the south of it. I will soon give a GFS (some kind of presentation) about how the British Raj changed India, also in Fact to the indian self-conception. And I guess it would be really really great to have some of your oponions. So if you want, just answer to the following questions, you would do me a big favor :thumb: :

    1.) Wich is/are the most important change/s the British brought to India, you can still notice today , and is it positive or negative in your opinion ?
    2.) Do you wished the British Raj never existed ?
    3.) How do you think about Great Britian today ?
    4.)What do you think is the main reason, many indians emigrate to great britian and how do you think about immigration/emmigration generally ?

    Yes I know these questions arent really military but I hope in the "Introductions & Greetings" part it's ok :rolleyes:.
    I would be really happy about many replys and of course you can ask me also questions back about germans and germany, in this domain I can also answer the military ones :becky:

    Please be sorry for my english, Im just a student im still learning ;)
     
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  3. Yusuf

    Yusuf GUARDIAN Administrator

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    Welcome to DFI Daniel.

    I will take a shot.


    1.) Wich is/are the most important change/s the British brought to India, you can still notice today , and is it positive or negative in your opinion ?

    Changes that are visible till today, bureaucracy and railways. Railways defenitely positive but the other is kinda 50-50. Bureaucracy helps in governance but red tape is screwing our country right now.

    2.) Do you wished the British Raj never existed ?

    Yes off course. But then if it had not come them we might not have had an "India" in it's current boundaries. Fight against Britain united 600 big and small kingdoms that existed into one nation.

    3.) How do you think about Great Britian today ?

    Today's Britain is on a decline. It can barely support itself now and has to resort to huge cuts that they are not accustomed to. Most resent it as they are used to imperial past, some move forward realizing the change that's coming around and the power equations with it. Their PM is pretty realistic about it. But still it will remain a decent power with it's 3 trillion economy. Aging population should concern them and they cannot disregard immigration.

    4.)What do you think is the main reason, many indians emigrate to great britian and how do you think about immigration/emmigration generally ?

    Main reason, economic off course. Nothing else. All those who emigrated there 2 generations or 3 ago are very very rich over there. Perhaps more than the local population.

    That apart, it's very difficult nigh impossible to understand the impact of the British Raj in four questions. There is a thread on the Raj here. Search it up. You will learn more.
     
  4. JAISWAL

    JAISWAL Senior Member Senior Member

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    hi.
    Welcom to DFI
    now about your answers. Let me try them to satisfy you.
    .
    Ans.1- most imp. Change is introduction of RAILWAY, ELECTRICITY, TELEPHONEY. These are positives.
    Now negatives.- religional, regional and cultural divide created by them in our country . These things are still there.
    .
    Ans.2- yes, every Indian wish that Raj should have never had happened to us. But we are equall responsible for the trouble they had caused to us.
    .
    Ans.3- in my openion Britan is still living in the era of RAJ and they still view other brown/dark skin pesons as lower to them. And thats not acceptible.
    In case of India or Indians they some what got mellow in there thinking and appreceat them only because of our increasing economical and millitry power other wise they still treat south-asian and african as 2nd class human.
    And these racial disscrimation is quit popular there even in todays society.
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2011
  5. JAISWAL

    JAISWAL Senior Member Senior Member

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    ans.4- the main reason for Indians to migrate to Britan (for that matter even to europe, USA, middle east) is the finencial security and opertunity they provide for one to grow and develop.
    Now this treand is of past as of after India opened its economy to world and project the 8% growth these same Indians are returning back to enjoy these facilities up at home.
    .
    .
    Now i think i have answered them as easy as possible. And if you have any other queary you can ask..
     
  6. Dinku

    Dinku Regular Member

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    wo kommen Sie, Herr Daniel?

    Ich komme aus Burkina Faso.

    Herzlich willkommen.
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2011
  7. gridemann

    gridemann New Member

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    first of all, thanks for this fast replys
    @ Yusuf
    yes, I guess you're right, its as impossible to talk about what the Raj means to you in four questions as learning it out of one of our school books ;) its just like having answers to questions written by myself (teachers want to see a little own work ;) ) but thx I will watch for this tread too.
     
  8. gridemann

    gridemann New Member

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    @Dinku Pforzheim, ganz in der nähe von Stuttgart
     
  9. The Messiah

    The Messiah Bow Before Me! Elite Member

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    1.) Wich is/are the most important change/s the British brought to India, you can still notice today , and is it positive or negative in your opinion ?

    Positives aren't worth mentioning since for every positive there are about 100 negatives.

    2.) Do you wished the British Raj never existed ?

    Yes.

    3.) How do you think about Great Britian today ?

    On the decline since all the looted wealth is slowly finishing. Once they have declined and we have marched way ahead then they should be taught a lesson.

    4.)What do you think is the main reason, many indians emigrate to great britian and how do you think about immigration/emmigration generally ?

    To earn. I have no problems in people moving to britain to earn more.
     
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  10. civfanatic

    civfanatic Retired Moderator

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    Welcome to DFI Daniel.

    1.) Wich is/are the most important change/s the British brought to India, you can still notice today , and is it positive or negative in your opinion ?

    The most important things that the British brought were railways, bureaucracy, and the use of English as a unifying language. Railways are definitely beneficial, but when they were first built their primary purpose was to facilitate the exploitation of India's resources and solidify British control by enabling rapid transportation between provinces. Bureaucracy is both a positive and negative; it allowed a more centralized government to exercise power over all of India but at the same it opened the way for corruption and inefficiency which is a big problem in India today. The English language is probably the single most important thing that was introduced, and it kind of ties in with bureaucracy. The bureaucracy of the British Raj was generally open to anyone who could speak English; it didn't matter if you were from South India or North India or East India. The adoption of English as an official language of the government and bureaucracy allowed governance to transcend regional lines, because everyone in India had to learn it and no one had a "headstart" so to speak. This is still present in India today, and today it is even more important than before because India's large English-speaking population gives us an edge in the international market as well as in diplomacy.

    2.) Do you wished the British Raj never existed ?

    Absolutely. Despite its few positives, the largest impact of the British Raj on India was the impoverishment of the subcontinent and destruction of native industries. For example, in 1700 India had the world's largest textile industry, but by 1900 India's industry was behind every major power in the West. Similarly, India's share of world GDP fell from about 25% to 3%.

    If the British Raj had never existed, the Maratha Confederacy would have most likely continued the process of unifying India, and it is very possible that a unified Indian nation would emerge by itself sometime in the late 19th century. Also, contrary to popular belief, many of the "600 princely states" that constituted India were formed UNDER the British Raj; the few princely states that existed before were large regional powers like Hyderabad State and Kingdom of Mysore. A large portion of India was under Maratha jurisdiction, and the political setup was not unlike the British Raj.

    3.) How do you think about Great Britian today ?

    It's a declining power and will disappear into irrelevance this century. The balance of power on a global scale is shifting from the West back to the East.

    4.)What do you think is the main reason, many indians emigrate to great britian and how do you think about immigration/emmigration generally ?

    Education and economics are the two main reasons for emigration. I personally emigrated to U.S. for pursuing higher studies so I have no problem with it. However, I believe that all Indians should uphold the dignity of their motherland regardless of where they are in the world today. The Indians that I have a problem with are the ones that try to throw away their heritage and national pride.
     
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  11. pmaitra

    pmaitra Moderator Moderator

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    Zuerst, wilkommen Herr Gridemann! Hier vorwärts diskutieren wir auf Englisch!

    Railways and military and to a lesser extent the parliamentary democracy (actually the Indian Constitution is more Irish and Swiss than British). You may include the English language, but it was introduced not by the English, but by David Hare, a Scottish watch-mechanic, in form of the first school to teach English in India.

    Yes indeed. One may say the Mughals were bad too, but I must say that except Aurangzeb and Babur, most of the Mughal rulers were benevolent, especially Emperor Akbar.

    My opinion about Great Britain is not very generous:
    1. First of all, it is not 'Great' anymore.
    2. It is a pet dog of the USA.
    3. Tiny Island with a bloated ego.
    4. Won't give freedom to Norther Ireland but will do doublespeak on Kashmir.
    5. Will use big words in diplomatic duels with the Russian Federation, little realising that Britain vs Russia is like Mosquito vs Elephant. A minor irritant and a glaring example of: "Empty vessel sounds much."
    6. Creator of Pakistan.
    7. Their queen is still in possession of stolen property (e.g. Koh-i-Noor and many more).
    8. Committed genocide all over the world in such a scale that makes Hitler look like a Saint, relatively speaking (*).

    * Explanation of the theory of relativity: If you sit on a hot stove for one minute, it seems like an hour; if you sit with a beautiful girl for an hour, it seems like one minute. - Albert Einstein.

    To make money. The other reason is that Indians would rather migrate to an English speaking country (UK, USA, Australia, Hong Kong) but not so much to Germany, France, Spain, Italy or Russia.

    Thanks for asking and your English is great.

    I invite you to visit and comment here:
    http://defenceforumindia.com/military-history/20751-britain-blame-many-worlds-problems.html
    http://defenceforumindia.com/members-corner/23265-my-dear-friend-hitler.html
     
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2011
  12. Shaitan

    Shaitan Zandu balm all day Senior Member

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    British Raj gave the geographical shape of India today.

    The British Conquered many Indian ethnic groups and lands, and left India(and Pakistan) with it.

    Its similar to the invading Manchurians with China. Manchus invaded China and along with it conquered Tibet, Mongolia, etc in the form of the Qing Empire. And in the end the majority Hans got the land the Manchus conquered.

    They also in a scene fueled Indian nationalism like never before in history. This allowed many different groups of people all around the subcontinent unite for a common cause. Marathas are not fighting Rajputs, Sikhs are not fighting the Muslims, etc, etc, etc it allowed many different people to fight under one banner. It made us even more proud even though we can be very different. The fact that today a Malayalii Christian from Kerala can be proud of a Rajasthani Hindu and call him a fellow countrymen is un heard of in Indian history. This nationalism/brotherhood was because of the common hate for the British.
     
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2011
  13. civfanatic

    civfanatic Retired Moderator

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    @pmaitra

    English and Scots are both considered "British", so it is not wrong to say that the English language was brought to India by the British.
     
  14. pmaitra

    pmaitra Moderator Moderator

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    You are right. I was being specific as the person was Scottish not English. Never said he was not British. :)
     
  15. Dinku

    Dinku Regular Member

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    Is Hare School same school Shiek Mitra talk?

    I told Raja Ram Mohan school make mit Hare. Hindu School also Calcutta.
     
  16. niharjhatn

    niharjhatn Regular Member

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    The others have tackled the previous questions well, so all I have to add is that there was much more forced migration under the British than there is now. Indians were scattered all over the globe, from South Africa, Kenya, West Indies, Fiji...

    There are many in Britain who are opposed to immigration, but they need to keep in mind previous history, use of Indian soldiers in wars and conflicts which we had no interest, and the general looting of the subcontinent. If this means that some want to emigrate to improve their lives, so be it.

    One positive of the Raj is the introduction of English - I'm not sure you know, but India is a very diverse country, where there are about 30 completely distinct regional languages, with innumerable dialects with each (my mother learnt a dialect from her father, another from her mother, whilst my father learnt a dialect completely different, even though they are from the same state). The use of english has helped unify India, and I think, helps give a somewhat competitive edge we enjoy over some other nations.
     
  17. Dinku

    Dinku Regular Member

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    India sent Africa labour work railway.

    Settle. Become businessmen.

    Make money.

    Become B'wana.

    British like Indian. Not like African much. Indian better English speak. Know British life better, so like more.

    Speak English unify India? All speak English in Raj? How unify speak much English.

    I think English know few in Raj.
     
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2011
  18. pmaitra

    pmaitra Moderator Moderator

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  19. Arunpillai

    Arunpillai Regular Member

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    @gridemann.
    If i may answer your questions..
    1)the most important thing british brought to india was modern thought and education. It was through this education and thought that our early freedom fighters were inspired to change the condition of our country. Yes i think there are more positives than negative.
    2) yes, i believe british raj should have existed.,
    3) most of us educated indians hold no rancour against british anymore.
    4)as for immigration, its just migrating to greener pastures for a better life.. Nothing more.
     
  20. Rahul M

    Rahul M Regular Member

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    hi gridemann, assuming you are still interested in this 'survey', here are a few facts to round out your presentation. :)

    1.) Wich is/are the most important change/s the British brought to India, you can still notice today , and is it positive or negative in your opinion ?

    poverty & genocide. and the continued weakness in our rural economy and society, in spite of their immensely resilient nature.
    millions of Indians were killed off by deliberate policy during british rule.
    now keep in mind this was happening in one of the MOST fertile lands in the world !! the Indian sub-continent has a monsoon failure every 10 years or so and a major one once every 30 years (roughly speaking).
    however, the bounty in other years more than make up for these food shortages. historically speaking, the kings and rulers always had enough grains stored and in times of shortage handed out dole to let people tide over the difficult period.
    NEVER in Indian history, barring the period ruled by the british have so many died of famine and every time there was food available (cultivated by the same people who were dying of hunger) which could have been used to prevent the death of millions. every time the british decided to send the grain elsewhere.

    here is a very detailed look at the man made famines of british raj.
    Famines in British ruled India: Their Causes and Consequences - Bharat-rakshak Wiki
    [​IMG]

    as for poverty, for starters you can perhaps get hold of Angus Maddison's Contours of World Economy or similar works. here's a sample. notice how the Indian economy plummeted as part of the global (per capita income stayed stagnant for the entire period of british rule)
    [​IMG]

    local industry was systematically and brutally destroyed in order to create a market for british goods. and the farmers were forced to produce raw materials for british industry at the expense of food crops.

    2.) Do you wished the British Raj never existed ?
    wishing about the past doesn't change anything. what I do hope that we do not repeat the mistakes.

    3.) How do you think about Great Britian today ?

    a second grade power now that it has lost colonies to suck dry. trying to ride on the coat-tails of US.

    4.)What do you think is the main reason, many indians emigrate to great britian and how do you think about immigration/emmigration generally ?

    the reason any immigrant move from one place to another, better economic opportunities. why did germans move to US in droves in the 18th and 19th centuries ?
    whether US or UK the reason was the same, booming economies and relatively familiar environment due to english. although I don't think there has been much permanent immigration to UK in the last decade, that was mostly in the period immediately after independence to 70's, when India was an economic basket case.

    as for immigration it is upto the individual and the country he/she wishes to immigrate to.
     
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  21. Rahul M

    Rahul M Regular Member

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    :rolleyes:
    please, speak for yourself, don't bring the rest of educated Indians into the debate.

    if you think the british brought "modern thought and education" to India, it says more about your knowledge than anything else.
     
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