Fulcrums & Flankers

[EnlightenedMonk]

Yep, I agree... suggest something good for PC... I know lots of things come out on consoles, but I'm not a hardcore gamer to go out and buy a console just to play a combat simulation game...

AFAIK there's been nothing good on the PC for quite sometime after the Novalogic releases... the new one is HAWX, but I've heard that doesn't live up to all the hype...

@Payeng - You may want to edit your last post... we don't solicit or support piracy on this site

 

[Payeng]

@Payeng - You may want to edit your last post... we don't solicit or support piracy on this site

Thanks for the information monk, I would like to leave it to the mods. more over its my views only and those are independent.

 

[Soham]

May I remind you gentlemen that this thread is not for discussing PC games...
I think theres a thread for that already.

 

[venom]

Which game is this..........?

is it the Mig - 29 Flurcum..?

 

[Dark Sorrow]

As per my knowledge both are based on different doctrine. Both of this fighter have a different purpose. The MKI being heavy and top class fighter do lot of carefull planning and are generally used in high endurance mission in stand alone mode or is paired with a specialized aircraft like Jaguar, etc. On the other hand migs are used as escorts, scramble alert, provide air-superiority and strike packages to underling bellycrowlers. For this reason pilots are trained in different manner. For dogfight training the two planes could face each other.

 

[Dark Sorrow]

I was told that time required to prepare a MKI for a mission is almost twice than compaired to Mig-29.

 

[bhramos]

i feel mig is feared by by western forces.
even F-16's came to save PA in kargil war, but fear of Mig 29 they went back and we won Kargil War

 

[Dark Sorrow]

i feel mig is feared by by western forces.
even F-16's came to save PA in kargil war, but fear of Mig 29 they went back and we won Kargil War

Pakistani F-16 refrained from engaging Mig-29 because Mig-29 were occassionaly armed with R-77 and were able to maintain lock on the F-16 while Pakistani F-16 did not posess BVR capability.

 

[venom]

The Indian upgrade of the radar of Mig-29 will bring the Mig-29 on par with f-16 Block-50\52 AGP-68(V5) which will enhance The BVR capability of Mig-29.With Zhuk-ME , the Mig-29's will be able to detect aircrafts & ships at longer range along with improvement in tracking capability & more resistance to Jamming.

 

[John]

Yep, I agree... suggest something good for PC... I know lots of things come out on consoles, but I'm not a hardcore gamer to go out and buy a console just to play a combat simulation game...

AFAIK there's been nothing good on the PC for quite sometime after the Novalogic releases... the new one is HAWX, but I've heard that doesn't live up to all the hype...

@Payeng - You may want to edit your last post... we don't solicit or support piracy on this site

well try the F-16 Allied Force Sim, gr8 sim, gr8 game its the same sim software used to train F-16 pilots on their simulators and hence its a very accurate game, the f-16 not a puzzle anymore, its every feature, almost every button in the cockpit is interactive and flying it is fun, you can play furballs, dogfights and matches against any number of threats including mig-29,23,31,25, su-27,30mkk, 37, EF tiffy, Jag, mirage, F-14/15/18/5s etc. Block 52 is not to be underestimated and can kill mig-29s quite effectively, one heck of an aircraft, not easy to kill it.

you can also try FSX and get the VRS f-18 E/F simulation, its the best aircraft sim ever made, every single thing is interactive, very accurate flying envelope and can drop very good weapons, lots of fun to fly.

Both sims comes with extensive aircraft flying manuals, both books are around 700 pages each, suggest read through it or else chances are you wont be able to start the Falcon or Super bug, you can forget about getting them into the air if you dont go through the first 100 pages of the manual. I now have around 400 hrs on the falcon and i still cant use the CCRP mode to release bombs yet, needs time and extensive training to use it fully. however F-18 sim is more fun and much more interactive.

 

[fulcrum]

The game is called MiG-29 Fulcrum... its by Novalogic... its pretty old now... I'm looking forward to some newer combat sims... nothing good has come out for the past 10 years or so in that field...

Nah.. that video is from the game Flanker2.5/Lockon.

I think you aren't aware of Flanker 2.5/Lockon. That is the best game for playing the Mig-29. Novalogic's Mig-29 is meant for the casual sim player. If you're looking for some serious realistic piloting, go for Flanker2.5. You need atleast a week to know the radar modes and get used to flying the plane, let alone Dogfighting. For dogfighting, another week or 2. Ofcourse as the name says, you can also pilot the Su-27 & 33 Flanker.
If you want to dogfight then nothing comes close as a Mig-29. Only the F-15 posses a challenge, but it can be defeated easily with lots of practice. The worst plane and the easiest to kill in a dogfight is ofcourse the F-18.

If you can't get Flanker 2.5, I guess the Novalogic's fulcrum will do. If you still have the Novalogic's game, can we play online?

 

[AJSINGH]

It seems the Fulcrum has more room in the nose then a F-16/18 if equipped with a capable radar it would be useful in the BVR role. Not on the same level as Flanker because the radar is smaller and less powerful. To me one of the main strengths of the Flanker is the means to enter and leave the fight and then reengage because of the great fuel load it carries.

One of its weaknesses is its size its tail fin is almost the size of a Fulcrums wing, there huge bigger then F-14s.

I'm a real firm believer in using the Flanker in a duel role India needs a platform to bring the fight outside India's borders. Nothing else India flies has the range and more important the payload capabilities as the Flanker.

One of Pakistan's strengths with using the Viper is it's duel role. They beat F-15Cs in turning fights and are one of the best proven mini attackers in the world flying. Once you get in the no escape zone of the ARRAMS it's makes no difference what your flying it kills you the same.

If I were setting up tactics to maybe do battle with Pakistan's Vipers I would focus on their bases. Your Flankers can fly above and around most of the ROSE Mirages and J-7 anyway.

Can HAL speed up production of the MKI kits? Isn't the delivery dates sometime like 2015 or 2017. I like India's AF don't get me wrong but it blows my mind that you'll wait that long for basically high end 4th generation fighter that might be by 2015 be outdated anyway?

not true .constant upgrade program will take place like with your F-18 .it was developed in late 1970s but it is very well used even now .How? because of constant upgrade

 

[AJSINGH]

This is a good question...I think that the Flankers and the Fulcrums will be pretty evenly matched at long range because the Flanker being much bigger will light up like a Christmas tree on radar, however it can carry on it a lot of equipment to jam these sensors. The fulcrum remains to date one of the most maneuverable dog fighters in the world and if you have a good pilot he can prbbly evade any missile. In close range, I don't think the flankers stand a chance. The Mig-29 is ridiculously maneuverable. Infact, till the end of the 1990's it could outperform in close combat any warplane that was currently in service.

not anymore . u see now the sukhoi which IAF has which are Su 30MKi have TVC technology which makes it THE MOST AGILE combat aircraft in the world .it can even equal the raptor in terms of agility
Fulcrums were good at some point of time but if we upgrade them to TVC technology they may equal flanker

 

[AJSINGH]

Yes the Mig-29 Fulcrums are the best in Dogfights, but this is an era of BVR's, & the Flankers are more decisive.... correct me if am wrong..:vehicle_plane:

u cant really say that this is the time of BVR .yes there is more possibility of BVR combat but not entirely that situation .almost the same thing happened in vitenam war when USAF doctrine was using missile and not guns kill
hence the new F-4 were without any guns .that is why much f-4 were shot down by gun kill ( mig 21 also being much more agile than the f-4)

so wvr combat is very much possibility and is here to stay
because if USA comes out with new BVR missile . russia will come out with jammers for that missile .no missile is jam proof as of now
its like virus ( being missile ) and anti virus ( being the jammers )

 

[Yusuf]

Both the fighters carry BVRs. The fighters are complementry as both are air superiority fighters.

 

[ppgj]

not anymore . u see now the sukhoi which IAF has which are Su 30MKi have TVC technology which makes it THE MOST AGILE combat aircraft in the world .it can even equal the raptor in terms of agility
Fulcrums were good at some point of time but if we upgrade them to TVC technology they may equal flanker

no AJS. mkis have 2 dimensional tvc. mig 35s have all dimensional tvc. they are still the most agile dogfighter seen so far.

 

[ppgj]

Yes the Mig-29 Fulcrums are the best in Dogfights, but this is an era of BVR's, & the Flankers are more decisive.... correct me if am wrong..:vehicle_plane:

BVR is not a sure kill. that is why russians would fire not 1 but 2 bvr missiles just to be sure. still it does not assure of the kill. though BVR fight may become the norm once they can come with a sure kill guidance, for the forseeable future dogfights are going to stay.

 

[Yusuf]

BVRs did pretty well a couple of decades ago in the first gulf war. But most fighters made today are very agile and yes missiles can be exhausted so the guns will come into the picture when two large forces will come to head.

 

[bhramos]

not anymore . u see now the sukhoi which IAF has which are Su 30MKi have TVC technology which makes it THE MOST AGILE combat aircraft in the world .it can even equal the raptor in terms of agility
Fulcrums were good at some point of time but if we upgrade them to TVC technology they may equal flanker

hi man did u forget, our Mig-29 are going to get 3-D TVC,
our HAL brought some 60 RD-33 Series 3 engines in MAKS-2009, which will be same used on Mig-35 too.

 

[bhramos]

BVR is not a sure kill. that is why russians would fire not 1 but 2 bvr missiles just to be sure. still it does not assure of the kill. though BVR fight may become the norm once they can come with a sure kill guidance, for the forseeable future dogfights are going to stay.

u are right, when two fifth gen fighters face each other they cant almost see others, almost dogfight is formidable,