Finland wants to join Russia

Illusive

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Is your current friendship with Russia based on anti- Americanism, or is it deeper ideological background?
Nothing to do with anti- americanism or any ideology,Russians came to our aid when america was threatening India with their gunboat diplomacy. India was largely non-aligned, US supported pak with aid and military equipments, so India had to look to Soviets for buying arms.

It was the need of the hour, but as you can see today relations between US and India are soaring.
 

prohumanity

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Kissinger is, of course, an old man ..but a very toxic old man , India Hater..of first degree .and now, he has little influence so his sanity is somewhat coming back. What is "new world order?" It means hegemony of one nation over all other nations and civilizations. Very crazy idea which has resulted in deaths of millions and the hegemony is losing power each day. There is only one solution..mutual respect and coexistence..accepting the diversity of different civilization and stopping the dirty dream of dominating and controlling the world..because this narcissistic dream can only bring more misery and destruction on the human race.
Likes of Kissinger represent the interests of a very small minority and for their benefit they are willing to destroy the rest of the World. They Do NOT believe in Liberty and justice for ALL..(they serve only for a few million) so I consider them anti-US constitution.
Most Americans are ,now, trying to understand these kinds of thugs who has tarnished the image of this great nation but the propaganda machine still, keeps running 24/7 ("breaking news") to delay this process of knowing the truth, the whole truth.
If you really want to know an unbiased account of last 60 years of history which will give you much clarity and insight into today's World , I suggest a book I just finished reading:
AFTER EMPIRE- THE BIRTH OF A MULTI-POLAR WORLD...By DILIP HIRO...publisher: Nation Books, New York ....ISBN: 978-1-56858-427-0
 

Ray

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Dilip Hiro was born in Larkana, Pakistan.

American actions may not appear pleasant to most of us, including me, but dispassionate observed, they are merely doing what is for their own national interests,

Detestable to us, but OK for them.
 

Ray

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Is your current friendship with Russia based on anti- Americanism, or is it deeper ideological background?
India is not friends of anyone but themselves given the new dispensation that rules India.

Russia is no longer on the vista.

It is Japan and the US.
 

jouni

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For Finns you Indian guys are much worse than Russians or Americans. You have stolen all our good IT-jobs, call centers, translation services, secretary services, your neighbors Thai´s even take all our natural berries and mushrooms from our forests...even berries from the forest. But guess what! We love you, we do not look backwards, we look forwards...soon maybe Finnish school systems principles may be used in India, maybe clean technology developed in Finland will help pollution in Indian cities, maybe our clean food will be next big thing in India etc. the list goes on. We welcome you on your holidays to come enjoy our clean nature and friendly people, hell maybe even together with Americans and Russians you can relax in our beautiful Lapland talking about soccer and tennis...
 

Ray

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For Finns you Indian guys are much worse than Russians or Americans. You have stolen all our good IT-jobs, call centers, translation services, secretary services, your neighbors Thai´s even take all our natural berries and mushrooms from our forests...even berries from the forest. But guess what! We love you, we do not look backwards, we look forwards...soon maybe Finnish school systems principles may be used in India, maybe clean technology developed in Finland will help pollution in Indian cities, maybe our clean food will be next big thing in India etc. the list goes on. We welcome you on your holidays to come enjoy our clean nature and friendly people, hell maybe even together with Americans and Russians you can relax in our beautiful Lapland talking about soccer and tennis...
Horrid India!

They are like Hagar the Horrible, right? :)

The only 'fins' I like is shark fins in soup.

But that too has been banned in India.
 

Illusive

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For Finns you Indian guys are much worse than Russians or Americans. You have stolen all our good IT-jobs, call centers, translation services, secretary services, your neighbors Thai´s even take all our natural berries and mushrooms from our forests...even berries from the forest. But guess what! We love you, we do not look backwards, we look forwards...soon maybe Finnish school systems principles may be used in India, maybe clean technology developed in Finland will help pollution in Indian cities, maybe our clean food will be next big thing in India etc. the list goes on. We welcome you on your holidays to come enjoy our clean nature and friendly people, hell maybe even together with Americans and Russians you can relax in our beautiful Lapland talking about soccer and tennis...
We'll come only if Kimi Raikkonen joins Force India:lol:
 

Ray

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Yeah, where is Alexander the Great when you need him ? ;)
The majority of Indians are said to he heterosexual.

Are you suggesting we require a homosexual, which Alexander is supposed to have been? ;)

Finns love homos?

You chaps are great. You follow the dictum - A good homo is a homo, who can homo another homo, without letting the other homo know he is being homo-ed

So, Finland is a homo paradise and spreading the message?

Is the actress Britt-Marie Eklund a Finn or is she Swedish?

Eklund has a vulgar connotation in India.

I take it that all males around the world are Eklunds.
 
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jouni

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We love "homos", Finnish post just published a stamp recognized around the world.

 

Ray

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We love "homos", Finnish post just published a stamp recognized around the world.

Wow!

You are serious?

Who is that?

No wonder your population is dwindling.

And no wonder the population of a certain type of people who are known for deviant sex ( I am sure you know which countries they belong to) have risen to 50,000–60,000 in Finland, ;)
 
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jouni

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Tom of Finland a famous "homo" artist in Finland, he was active some 30-40 years ago. I would say we are quite liberal regarding sexual issues, to each his/hers own.
 
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Illusive

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Kimi is retiring, take Bottas, the next Finnish world champion
He already extended his contract with williams, but yeah he is world champion material........but wont win it in a williams.
 

apple

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Weak, weak effort from Russian Times. I'm pretty familiar with Finland and have never heard of "influential public figure" Hannah Krogerus. Although, unlike this article, I recognise that she isn't a "businessman". I also know how to spell Bäckman (not Beckman) but did smile to seem him called a human rights activist.

^^ Do we still have the Russian Empire and/or Soviet Union :lol:

Anyway, anybody can post about the near complete annihilation of Native Americans.
Seems to be some Russian people (and their fanboi's on this site) confused about that too.

American's have only "annihilated" a single culture. There's a long list of cultures and peoples destroyed/ subjugated by Russians.

Even our foreign minister said that "Russia is inveding Ukraine".
Erkki Tuomioja said that?



@Ray

Kissinger is an old man, he does not have influence on US policies anymore... I read some Bangladesh history and understand a little bit better relations between you ( Indians ) and Kissinger.
Wouldn't say he doesn't have an influence. Since 1975, every US public figure has done their best to distance themselves as far as possible for Kissinger. A member of the right wing of the Republican party could, maybe (but almost definitely not), not be too badly damaged, politically, from being associated with him. For everyone else he's not much poison as radioactive.
 
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prohumanity

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Juani..there are many reasons Indians people like Russian people. When India was being threatened ,intimidated, devalued by the West....Russia came to India's help as a good friend. It was Nikita Krushchev who re-asssured India worried India and said " If you have trouble..just shout across Himalayas and we ,your friends will be right there in hours to help you." Russia provided technology for giant steel plants, sold India fighter jets ,tanks, artillary etc at subsidized rates when US was giving Patton tanks, Sabre Jets and weapons to Pakistan to bully India.
Leonid Breznev used to call Indira Gandhi ..his sister..and was willing to help to boost India's economy in any manner required. Russia never, ever supplied weapons to Pakistan to be used against India. Indian space program, which is sending rockets to Moon and Mars these days, actually started with the help of Russia in 1970s with satelites such as Aryabhatt, Insat-1 and Insat 2. Russian people's warm, loving and idealistic style won the heart of Indian people in 1970s ,1980s and even today there is a very special place for Russian people in the heart of Indian people.
Indians are like Elephants..they have long memories..and don't forget easily. An Elephant can carry huge burden and is calm and peaceful until you mistreat/abuse him....it's not easy to make an Elephant angry..but you cross your limits and succeed in making Elephant really angry, then, even your God can not protect you. Elephant will tie your body with its trunk and throw you real hard 1000s of meters away..that only little pieces of your bones will remain. People to people bond of love between Indians and Russians is so strong that no govt in India can dare to create enmity between Indian and Russian people. Its a friendship forever.
India -Russia bond is absolutely not against USA as Indian do like USA and 3 million Indians have made USA as their home and happily contributing to American society. Russia did not misuse woman diplomats from India like US did. Russia does not issue threats to India as US does. Russia did not put Modi in criminal category and refused tourist visa just like US did. Russia wants to share its highest technology to empower India..whereas US just wants to sell its outdated weapons to India at exorbitant prices.
Therefore, ask any Indian on the street " who is India's best friend?" Answer will be swift and clear "Russia !" About Finland ,Indians are like neutral..not love..not hatred. Overall, Finland is seen as "a good nation" by most Indians.
 
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jouni

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Good that you are so close friends. Finland was also a friend of Russia until recently. Currently a lot of eyes in Finland has opened, because of Russia´s imperialistic policies in Ukraine. They have violated every European security agreements they have signed. Russia destabilizing neighboring country and using openly military force is something unseen in Europe for decades ( not since USSR was using same methods in East Europe. ). I am afraid that this will be a long period of worsening relations between Russia and EU. If this becomes a sanctions war, it is likely to hurt Russia more, EU is an economic Giant compared to Russia. ( 17 Trillion dollars versus 2 trillion.) And before you ( not prohumanity ) start replying with "Kosovo", "Junta", "coop", "Nuland", I want to say my view: Russia is just following a plan many years in the making, in case if Ukraine start to create closer ties with EU and break away from Russia. To the events happened in Ukraine "west" has very little to do.
 
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Ray

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Good that you are so close friends. Finland was also a friend of Russia until recently. Currently a lot of eyes in Finland has opened, because of Russia´s imperialistic policies in Ukraine. They have violated every European security agreements they have signed. Russia destabilizing neighboring country and using openly military force is something unseen in Europe for decades ( not since USSR was using same methods in East Europe. ). I am afraid that this will be a long period of worsening relations between Russia and EU.
If we look at issues dispassionately, and if possible from the point of view of the Nation acting in a certain way, we will possibly understand as to why they acted that way.

Finland, is wary of Russia ever since Russia annexed Crimea. It is natural given the past Russo - Finnish history.

But is there any guarantee that Russia will do a 'Crimea' on Finland? The answer is not likely.

But does that mean that Finland will no longer be wary and apprehensive?

No, they have good reasons to be apprehensive.

There are about 30,000 people have citizenship of the Russian Federation, and Russian is the mother language of about 70,000 people in Finland. The ECRI recommended that action be taken to combat negative societal attitudes and manifestations of intolerance towards the members of Russian-speaking communities.

When considering the integration of Russian immigrants to Finland from the viewpoint of employment, it can be noticed that the Russian immigrants have not been very successful in finding their place in the job market. The educational level of Russian immigrants in Finland is fairly high: almost 40% of them have graduated from the university or polytechnic, whereas the corresponding number of the whole Finnish population is 30%. Despite this fact unemployment among people with Russian backgrounds is notably higher than that of Finnish citizens. The Russians and Estonians have been more successful than refugees in finding employment in Finland, but the unemployment rate of Russian citizens is twice that of Estonians.

Therefore, there is adequate reasons for these Russian speaking citizens to be neutral or even hostile to Finland in any confrontation with Russia, and many of them are living in South-East Finland, close to the Russian border. Not a happy or a comfortable thought for Finland, if you ask me.

Then Russian aggressiveness rekindles the thought in the Finnish mind of the Winter War. It was as you will recall a military conflict between the Soviet Union and Finland in 1939–1940. It began with the Soviet invasion of Finland in 1939 because Finland refused to bow down to the Soviet Union claiming parts of Finnish territory, demanding—amongst other concessions—that Finland cede substantial border territories in exchange for land elsewhere, claiming security reasons, primarily the protection of Leningrad, which was only 30 km (19 mi) from the Finnish border.

Churn all what I have stated and you will find that Finland has good reasons to distrust and be wary of Russia and its intentions.

But does that yet unproven rationale for Finland's wariness make Finland's apprehensions and anticipatory actions wrong, immoral or preemptively provocative?

I don't think so.

Now, apply the Russian apprehensions to the NATO expansion to the East.

The Soviet Union was a superpower. With the dissolution of the USSR, Russia is a pale shadow of the Cold War days. The once mighty USSR is not struggling to keep its country afloat and military is down to its knees, with it global clout reduced to a zero. A mighty blow to the Russian pride, enough to make it fear that its existence is at stake. Therefore, their aggressiveness to assert is understandable, even if not palatable to many.

With each push East by the NATO, the Russians fear that the 'barbarians are at the gates' even closer.

The comfort and safety of a 'strategic depth' that it had earlier as the Soviet Union given by The Warsaw Pact or the Treaty of Friendship, Co-operation, and Mutual Assistance, a collective defence treaty among eight communist states of Central and Eastern Europe in existence during the Cold War, vanishing before their eyes has given the fear of God in the Russian hearts.

They now struggle to ensure the few of the erstwhile Soviet territories now independent and neutral does not fall under the wizardry of the NATO Eastward push brining the 'enemy' closer to the Russian gates.

Therefore, their action is justifiable through the Russia prism as is the actions of Finland through the Finnish prism.

But are the actions of the NATO, US, Russia or even Finland moral is a moot question, even if each is acting for its own survival and security.

The jury is still out.
 

Ray

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Good that you are so close friends. Finland was also a friend of Russia until recently. Currently a lot of eyes in Finland has opened, because of Russia´s imperialistic policies in Ukraine. They have violated every European security agreements they have signed. Russia destabilizing neighboring country and using openly military force is something unseen in Europe for decades ( not since USSR was using same methods in East Europe. ). I am afraid that this will be a long period of worsening relations between Russia and EU. If this becomes a sanctions war, it is likely to hurt Russia more, EU is an economic Giant compared to Russia. ( 17 Trillion dollars versus 2 trillion.) And before you ( not prohumanity ) start replying with "Kosovo", "Junta", "coop", "Nuland", I want to say my view: Russia is just following a plan many years in the making, in case if Ukraine start to create closer ties with EU and break away from Russia. To the events happened in Ukraine "west" has very little to do.
Heard of Kosovo?

and

NATO Game-Plan: Destabilize Yugoslavia
http://emperors-clothes.com/articles/szamuely/natogame.htm



As the saying goes in India - hamam men sab nanga hai (all are nude in the Turkish bath).


To be fair, the West, NATO and Russia have much to do with Ukraine.

The only thing worse than being blind is having sight but no vision.
 
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jouni

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Regarding Russians in Finland, big issue is the language barrier, Estonians got an edge in the labour market because their language in close to Finland. Russian minority will not cause any problem in Finland, the idea is very far fetched, sorry. Regarding "buffer zones" Germany needed buffer zones around her 70 years ago, not anymore. in that sense Russia is lagging 50 years behind in strategic thinking. The discussion in Finland has lately turned European, we see us as a part of EU more than ever before, European identity is getting stronger, maybe some day we will have United States of Europe.
 

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