Down, not Out

Discussion in 'China' started by mehwish92, Dec 7, 2010.

  1. mehwish92

    mehwish92 Founding Member

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    Down, not out
    HORIZONS
    THE CRISIS THOUGH ARE DEEPENING ON THE HOME FRONT FOR PAKISTAN, BUT THE COUNTRY RETAINS A STRATEGIC EDGE IN THE GEO-POLITICAL SCENARIO OF THE SUB-CONTINENT,

    INAM UL REHMAN


    Pakistan, as the events speak loud, is almost a failed State. At least in matters internal. Not a day passes when at least 10 to 20 people get killed. The situation there looks chaotic. Moreover Pakistan is accused of producing world wide terrorists. It is also accused of giving safe haven to Al Qaeda and Taliban. Everything, it seems, has gone wrong with Pakistan.
    Yet the country is a strategic partner not only to the US for the past 63 years but as the President Barrack Obama said in India, to the whole world. What is it that makes this nearly failed State a strategic partner? There must be something which makes it ally to all emerging and emerged powers of the world!
    Pakistan is a close friend of China who is considered the next world power. It is also friends with a declining power—America. It is developing sound relationship with Turkey—who is again gaining sound holding in Asian continent. Ties with Russia are improving while as its trusted ally in the past is going on extreme limits to charm USA.
    Obama’s visit to India was a victory for Pakistan. For the first time Pakistan didn’t ask USA president to come for a customary visit. They quite enjoyed de-hyphening of their country with India from the visits of the American President. India got ballistic on the visit of Obama forgetting that China would not take it kindly. Whatever Obama said in India was in the interest of USA. He in the process succeeded in having his fellow countrymen’s job secured and promising to give India the outdated seat in the UN Security Council. Indians clapped as if there was no tomorrow. Getting seat in UNSC is no reward. India is an economic power and as such deserves it. And if it gets the seat India alone would not be entered (Although why would five permanent members share their power is not answered conclusively). Already Japan, Brazil and South Africa, Nigeria are touted next permanent members.
    India, since the end of the cold war, is busy in making its relationship stronger with waning powers. Post the breakaway of erstwhile Soviet Russia India went the whole hog to America and left Russians in cold. Pakistan meanwhile didn’t abandon China. It made its relations with it stronger while also keeping US in good humour.
    How is it so that Pakistan despite being associated with everything bad is still holding world powers in control? There must be some centrifugal forces working for Pakistan that it keeps extreme powers in its control and in good humour at the same time.
    Geopolitics is driven by hard calculations of national interest not merely by rhetoric of rising power. India may be a risen power but in globalised world is it really a risen power? Pakistan is a Muslim country and there are 58 independent Muslim countries in the world map. India is a Hindu country and there is only one tiny country—Nepal that has significant Hindu population. You cannot live in isolation. Economic progress alone cannot make you heavyweight. Japan has much stronger economy than India. So have many other countries. World is like a family. The more you have relatives the more chances of your survival and throbbing are there. Mongols sweeping through the Asian continent was as swift as their downfall. They didn’t survive even for 100 years. Because they had a religion which no other country prophesied during their time. Christian and Muslims kingdoms survived because of their co religionists living in many parts of the world. It is these coreligionists that become collaborators during war or occupation. Pakistan has a major say in Muslim world if not in the world affairs. Pakistan understands it and uses its cards deftly.
    India’s dilemma
    It may be wild assumption that Pakistan wants India’s presence in Afghanistan. But Pakistan lays bear trap for others. Having India’s presence in Afghanistan would benefit Pakistan not India. It gives Pakistan leverage that they cannot go all out against Taliban and Al Qaeda when India is trying to destabilise them in the region. Secondly the war in Afghanistan has helped Pakistan to better relations with Russia and Iran. Particularly with the former who are well aware the devastating role Pakistan played in their defeat at the hands of irregulars in the 80s.
    Over the years India has betrayed its trusted partners. Iraq backed India on Kashmir yet it was betrayed. Russia was trusted ally only to be ditched by India when it crumbled in the early 90s. Of late Pakistan is making its ties with Russia stronger. There billion dollar business deal has not send alarm bells in India. The latter believes that it can always come back to Russia.
    So is the case with Iran. Already Iran, who has supported Indian claims on tenuous Kashmir issue in the past, has signalled its new unofficial policy on India with regard to the long standing dispute in the world. It is a just single example of how much influence Pakistan is wielding. India’s think tank on Foreign Policy, C Rajamohan, keeping this thing in mind had warned that fluidity in Afghanistan means that India must keep “open mind, maintaining flexibility, and seizing the moments of opportunity”. Sadly for India, Iran didn’t view Obama’s speech kindly. The dent given by Ayotollah Ali Khamenei speech on Kashmir is damaging for India’s chance of getting strong foothold in Afghanistan as well.
    India doesn’t enjoy good relations with its immediate neighbour Bangladesh. Although it was India that helped Bangladesh financially, morally and then militarily to gain independence from Pakistan. Yet today Bangladesh enjoys very good relations with Pakistan despite genocide committed by the latter than with India. Sri Lanka has no love relation with India and China with the aide of Pakistan is making military establishments there.
    In Pakistan China finds an all weather friend. And Pakistan is smart enough to use China against India—staple visa to Kashmiris is one such example. China even refused to grant visa to Indian trooper who coined the word ‘agitational terrorism’ for Kashmiris. So India falling in the lap of USA is a good for the Pakistan in terms of geopolitical relations.
    This policy may not be without reason. Who knows if Pakistan and China have come on some agreement on Kashmir? May be China may push US to solve Kashmir issue before it can announce itself on the world affairs more aggressively. It will serve two purposes for China: one to have good ties with Pakistan flourish and second not to lose the business industry of India. China wants to capitalise this mandi for its own goods.
    Historically Afghans have considered India as their mistress and a land of unbelievers. No matter how hard Indians try to have their footing in Afghanistan the results are doomed.
    It is no secret that Pakistan in the 80’s used money meant for Afghan militants to foment trouble in Kashmir and Punjab. Now in new millennium with Kashmir movement becoming indigenous it is interesting to see where would they spend billions of dollars. Who is their next target? Are they going to make more nuclear bombs and then export them to other Muslim countries? You never know with Pakistan until they themselves tell what they are up to.
    Pakistan believes in give and take policy. India only in take. That is why decisions are taken by Pakistan not by India. It was Pakistan that give away China a small tract of land and extracted huge in return from them. Same they did in 2001 when it went against Afghanistan. You cannot expect such things from India. They believe in taking no decision is decision itself (former PM Narishama Roa) to taking no action is action itself (current Home Minister P Chidambaram).
    Pakistan may be an internally failed State but their clout on world affairs is better than India. Post Obama trip India must reassess how many friends it lost at the cost of one visit.

    http://www.greaterkashmir.com/news/2010/Dec/6/down-not-out-30.asp
     
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  3. ganesh177

    ganesh177 Regular Member

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    Very immature article, which is hell bent to prove that all cards india playing are wrong, and pakistan always comes up with all winning cards.

    Friends in world politics are not found on the basis of religions, but on the basis of economic/strategic interests. With his logic writter will fail to explain how did islamic republic of pakistan managed to be allies of US (secular) and china (buddhist). And how did one islamic country finds there interests served in supporting western powers in raging war on another islamic country ? If you know what i mean.

    Writter is trying to paint the imaginary picture that world has turned upside down after one obama visit to india. Please open your eye, everything is in its placed, except for few minor hiccups here and there.
     
  4. maomao

    maomao Veteran Hunter of Maleecha Senior Member

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    LOL these pakistanis suffice the saying "Grapes are sour, when you can't have them".....However, one thing which comes out positive from the article is the admission by pakistanis that pakistan is "almost" (not yet but almost LOL) a Failed State (we all know it is already!!).

    During my read of this article, I could feel the pain and the anguish of the author, he must be in tears while writing this claptrap BS for is innuendo pakistani ultra-islamic awam. Cry me a river loser pakistanis, as you beggars gasp for last breath of air, for survival :happy_2::happy_2:
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2010
  5. utubekhiladi

    utubekhiladi The Preacher Elite Member

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    while the author was busy publishing his comic article; 60 people were killed in Pakistan by suicide bombers; 5 were killed by USA drone; India-French signs usd $20 billion dollar deals; all this happened in the same day.

    so i ask the author of this article to worry about his own backyard rather than becoming so obsessed with India.
     
  6. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    The angst of the columnist is so obvious.

    He is seething with pathos that Pakistan is no patch when compared to India, and while Pakistan is rolling over and playing dead to the orders from its masters, the US and China, they (the US and China) are not showing quite the backing that Pakistan expects for all its loyalty as their vassal.

    That Pakistan is a failed state is for all to see. It requires no endorsement. It has failed in the external front and the internal situation borders on a near civil war between the fundamentalists, the Army and the ISI combine and the civil govt.

    The columnist wonders why Pakistan is considered a failed state and yet is a strategic ally of the US and China. He obviously is not well versed in the realm of geostrategy and geopolitics. The geographic location of Pakistan contributes to this state. China requires Pakistan since India is the only challenger to China’s hegemonic aspiration. Therefore, China wants, as one of my Chinese origin friend had said in a loaded statement – China will fight India to the Last Pakistani!! Therefore, should Pakistan not be taken by China as a natural and a strategic ally? After all, it is God’s own truth that Pakistan is slaving and doing the dirty work for China!

    The US is fighting the Taliban in Afghanistan. The only economic logistic supply route is through Pakistan. It is cheaper for the US to give financial and military aid than airlift all logistic requirement, since other routes, through CAR or Iran are not viable for geopolitical reasons wherein the US is not well disposed with either Iran or with Russia and Russia wields great clout amongst its erstwhile, now independent territories, in CAR. Hence, sops like ‘non NATO ally’ and ‘strategic ally’ has to be bandied to shore up the ego of a country that is only in terms of physiognomy, a country and beyond that is but an unbridled political, financial, economic and social chaos!

    The columnist day dreams that China is the next world power. Indeed, it will be one day. However, it is a moot point, if Pakistan will survive as a nation to celebrate that day!

    If the purpose of Obama’s visit to India was solely to boost the US job market, then what he has got out of India is but a drop in the ocean in relations to job losses the US is currently experiencing. If what Obama said in India i.e. that Pakistan is the womb of worldwide terrorism, closes Pakistani and Chinese ranks, then China would be Janus, in that it states that it is against terrorism and yet endorses it. Obviously, that is not the case.

    Another bit of kiteflying is to assume that Turkey is gaining a hold in the Asian Continent! How? Or is it another of the morale boost the columnist is pathetically yearning for? Turkey’s sights are solely towards Europe and not Asia. She is desperate to join the EU. Turkey is no long lost brother in the Middle East either. The memory is not short in the Middle East. The Arab nations cannot quite forget the atrocities of the Ottoman Empire and their treating the Arab as the lowest form of existence.


    Russia cosying up with Pakistan? That will be the day! The humiliating defeat in Afghanistan (which the columnists gloats about!) by the Pakistan engineered Mujahideens will not be easy to forget. The Russians are a proud race. Putin’s return to the Soviet form of authoritarianism is an indicator that Russians still yearn to be in the realm of world’s fate decider and are aware that only an iron hand to steer the State is the call of the hour rejecting Gorbachev’s wishy washy abdication to the US altar! Therefore, to believe that they will be hand in glove with Pakistan is farfetched. To substantiate the same is the fact that Russians have assisted the US Forces in Afghanistan and carried out raids against the Pakistan backed Taliban, much to the chagrin of Karzai This is an indicator of the Russian love for Pakistan which shatters the columnist’s drug assisted euphoria! Russians want their pound of flesh against the Pakistan!

    To Pakistan, the UN seat to India is earth shattering news – not because Pakistan is delighted, but because it sends shivers down its spine! The UN seat will come India’s way one day or the other and India can wait since patience is but a badge of Indians. Obama’s pronouncement, while appreciated, does not mean that it is Instant Coffee. Hence there is no euphoria per se. One is not euphoric about what is axiomatic!

    Another of the sub par delusion of the columnist is that India ‘betrayed’ a trusted ally, Russia, by seeking closer relationship with the US. The columnist forgets that after the end of the Cold War, it was Russia which cooled off relationships and treated India at par with others. Axiomatically, India played by the new rules of the game. Notwithstanding, India continued its close relations by helping Russia where it matters – assisting a cash strapped Russia. If one calculates the money behind the defence deals with Russia, one would see what lies at the end of the rainbow, rather than delving in wishful thinking to boost one’s sagging morale! Russians were not left out in the cold, and instead were helped where it counts – ensuring that the Russian fires burnt bright and warm in their hearth and home!

    It is amusing the columnist goes into ecstasy over a billion dollar deal of Pakistan with Russia as ‘stronger relationship’! India does billion dollars deals with all and sundry and yet it does not do cartwheels or somersaults over such deals. Why? Because India’s economic health is so robust and growing that such deals are but only a routine event. However, to be fair, to a nation that moving with a beggar’s bowl like Pakistan and which survives to exist on the munificence of the US, Saudi Arabia and China, any deal will be as miraculous as the Second Coming of Christ!!

    The analogy of religion is important in global matters is false. It maybe true that there are 58 Muslim countries and many Christian countries as against the only one “Hindu” country (actually India is a Hindu majority, but secular country, unlike Pakistan and so the angst to label India as a Hindu country) with one tiny Nepal to keep company. However, in world politics, it is not religion which matters, but national interests. Therefore, all nations agree to disagree.

    If the columnist finds comfort that there are 58 Muslim countries and they will all bat for Pakistan, then he is mistaken. It is no secret that the Arab League, which was formed basically to help Palestine, is in tatters through disagreements. While columnist wishes to find solace that co religionist will come to their rescue because Pakistan panders to the idea that they are the scions of Arabs and as thoroughbred as the Arab steed, they are mistaken in this belief. The Arabs don’t reciprocate this delusion. Instead, feel that they are of non Arab vintage and instead are of Asian lineage and genetically quite distinct. Further, Arab nations are but stooges of the US. They will all veer with undiluted alacrity towards the US dictates. It is only Iran which may go against the stream, but then they are no friends of Pakistan either! Those who find solace in the delusion that religion will unite, forget that while religion maybe a binder in some ways, it is no glue, when national interest matters. Ayotollah Ali Khamenei’s personal opinion seems to elevate the columnist into raptures. It would not be misplaced to state that Shia Iran is least amused at the daily massacre of the Shias in Pakistan and the lack of firm hand of Pakistan to curb the sectarian violence. Iran would also not be delighted to know the disparity in compensation paid to the Sunni dead and the Shia dead!

    India’s rise as an economic heavyweight seems to have burnt with envy the columnist. He opines that economy does not play a role in a Nation’s recognition for its worth. The fact that all of the Big 5, including their old friend China, is coming visiting India, is an indicator of the columnist’s baloney.

    It is another fallacious argument that Bangladesh is head over heels with Pakistan. Hardly! A thaw with Pakistan appeared during Madam Zia’s time. It is possibly that this was because of financial and organisational assistance given to promote terrorism for export and within. However, the things are different now. The manner Bangladesh has gone hammer and tongs against fundamentalists and terrorists within, including hanging of the Bangla Bandhu or whatever, the handing over of ULFA terrorists and the Supreme Court returning Bangladesh to its Secular status is hardly indicative of any bonhomie with Pakistan or with fundamentalists. This puts paid to both theories – that of warmth with Pakistan and that religion is the leveller to all inter nation relationship! The derogative tone exhibited by the columnist towards Bangladesh as if they have been treacherous to India, speaks of the fact that he is aware that he is writing balderdash.

    The columnist is quite unintelligent in his assumption that China will come to an understanding with Pakistan over Kashmir. And even if it does, the US will join hands. China is well aware that such understandings are not worth the paper it is written on. She is also aware that the booming Indian market is not worth losing over issues that really does not concern her overall national perspectives. While China may not hesitate to give pinpricks to India, it will stop short of alienating India or push India into the US and Russian sphere of total dependence. It will be counterproductive to her hegemonic aspirations. And China is wise and crafty! As it is, India engine-ing her ‘Look East’ initiative once again, has raised hackles in China! She is aware of the dangers of a India slighted and activated thus, to put a spanner in China’s hegemonic influence in Asia.

    Enough said. Let us shed a tear for this desperate columnist’s gasping for air like a landed fish!
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2010
  7. sob

    sob Moderator Moderator

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    The article is indeed full of half truths and wild imaginative bursts. One statement really makes me laugh

    What deals is he talking about and that too a country which does not have money to tackle rehabilitation of it;s flood victims leave alone repayment of loans.
     
  8. chex3009

    chex3009 Regular Member

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    This is utter BS. Till the very day President Obama landed in India. Pakistanis and their lobby tried very hard to convince the U.S to have a small visit to Pakistan, but in vain.

    Getting some infra development help doesn't mean that relations are on the improvement.

    Thats why the Pakistanis are more worried and taking a stance against it rather than welcoming the move. And what the author terms "outdated" seat, pakistan can get it only in their dreams.

    Because India is not a rogue state having in possession of deadly nuclear weapons and some mullahs and terrorists running down the country like anything.

    I think this author would be in a hangover state while writing this piece. What journalists they got!!!!
     
  9. Yusuf

    Yusuf GUARDIAN Administrator

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    I am reminded about a prose book we had in school. It was called Flights of Fantasies.
     
  10. SHASH2K2

    SHASH2K2 New Member

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    Looks like all Pakistani reporters and Journalists are high on Opium smuggled from Afghanistan while writing their articles.
     
  11. Virendra

    Virendra Moderator Moderator

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    If I'm not mistaken, recent Wikileaks had reports of Russians denying many arms and technologies to Pakistan because of their perception towards Pakistan as them being a risky enough rouge state. Russians are not fools. They aren't compelled to hire Pakistan as a gun like the US have.

    I read it somewhere - There were times when Politics would dictate Economics, now are the times when Economics dictate the Politics

    Regards,
    Virendra
     
  12. sayareakd

    sayareakd Moderator Moderator

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    Pakistan cannot shed its obsession and inferiority complex with India.
     
  13. lodaxstax

    lodaxstax Regular Member

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    do we need a thread for every piece of gibberish that is uttered in pakistan?? 10th grader could have written a better article.
     
  14. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    No a thread is not required.

    However, in this case it is possibly justified.

    Greater Kashmir is an Indian newspaper published in Srinagar. Hence, it gives the attitude of some of the sections of Kashmir society.

    The editor is Fayaz Ahmad Kaloo and Online Editor is Javaid Malik.

    Therefore, what is written in this newspaper is worth knowing because such articles help us to understand how the Kashmiris are being incited and by who!
     
  15. Vikramaditya

    Vikramaditya Regular Member

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    Typical paki dream..Pakistan is nothing more than a reusable condom
     

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