Design and Develop in India

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The great news. I like this sorts of news very much. As shree kalam sir had said, we need a series of small steps to become a great power. we do not giat steps only. If these sort of plants are build in big numbers, farmers can get a lot more money and we can save a huge amount of foreign exchange. Environmental protection is an additional benefits. I am excited to read this news. However I am disappointing because this is not happening in big scale. Government should make a policy to purchase this bio fuel at some rate for a long period of time. That will encourage industrialist to put their plant.
This is an insurance for future, a more developed and richer, but a warmer, more polluted and an India with a dangerous environment for own people is coming ahead.
India will be producing most of it's e energy needs by non conventional sources by 2030.
Around 25% from nuclear, 30% from Solar(I guess it's too ambitious for Solar) and a notable portion from wind.
Other thing is electrifying cars.
India wants to become a 100% Electric Vehicle Nation by 2030
Arabs will die of money if all countries do so. :biggrin2:
40% of world's drinkable water will be used by 2030.
Things are more challenging for China who would have used entire drinking water by then.
So, next big achievement must be purifying Sea Water to nanolevel to make it drinkable.
In terms of development, per capita income etc., China will be same as that of Portugal and Spain today, India will be same as that of China and Brazil today.

Obviously, high population and income will give a humongous economy but there's no meaning of income if you can't get basic requirements like water.
Things for our neighbors like Pakistan will be worse.
But things can change if India starts buying Shale Gas from Pak. :party:
So, need to do something about water very soon. :)

@no smoking India is reducing it's Carbon emissions by 41.5% by 2030. What about China?
 

Indx TechStyle

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Now, more info from that 2G plant. :)
This New Tech Could Convert India’s 300 Million Tonnes Farm Waste to 100 Billion Tonnes Fuel
In Uttarakhand, a new biofuel conversion plant piloted in Kashipur can convert all kinds of agricultural waste into bioethanol. This unique technology has many benefits over other biofuel plants that convert sugarcane or corn into biofuel.

Agricultural waste is a by-product that is used in some places as fodder for animals. But a majority of farmers do not realize its potential — the waste is thrown into ditches and fire set to it. This practice only adds to air pollution and is harmful for the environment in general.

But a recent development, spearheaded by scientists from the Department of Biotechnology in India, could turn this waste into treasure. Science Minister Harsh Vardhan inaugurated a new kind of biofuel plant on April 22.

At this plant, agricultural waste is converted into a form of alcohol – ethyl alcohol or bioethanol – which can be used as biofuel, to replace imported fuel.

Fuel is used mainly for transportation in India.

Source: pixabay.com
The demonstration plant was piloted in Kashipur, Uttarakhand, in the premises of India Glycols Limited, a petrochemical company that aims at being green and clean.

The Institute of Chemical Technology (ICT) worked in tandem with DBT to build the technology for this plant at Rs 35 crores, according to the Economic Times.

Ethanol production from natural materials isn’t a novel concept in itself. Before this, technology to convert sugarcane and corn maize into ethanol existed. This kind of ethanol is called first generation ethanol (1G ethanol). But converting agricultural waste into ethanol is a fairly new technology – and this ethanol is called second generation or 2G ethanol.

Why 2G Wins Over 1G
Currently, the total capacity of 1G ethanol plants installed in the country comes up to only 2.5 billion litres of fuel production. Oil-based industries, on the other hand, have a demand of 5 billion litres annually. But the answer isn’t to build more 1G ethanol plants. Ultimately, such an increase to meet the demand would impact the sugar market, livestock that depend on bagasse (the leftovers after extracting sugarcane juice) for food, and land used for sugarcane production.

But 2G ethanol comes from agricultural waste – which is available in plenty and is a natural byproduct that does not need to be specially produced.

Farm waste

Source: Left, right
This the best example of recycling and reusing, and there’s no need to burn away more waste.

The numbers say it loud and clear: India’s farms end up producing about 100 million tonnes of agricultural waste. If all of this is put into a 2G ethanol biofuel plant, we would have a 100 billion litres of ethanol.

This bioethanol can be used as a substitute for petrol and diesel, or even blended with fuel to improve mileage and reduce pollution.

Better Than the Rest
The demonstration plant currently is capable of converting and processing 10 tonnes of waste daily.

Mumbai-based Arvind Lalli currently heads the Centre for Energy Biosciences, set up by ICT and DBT.

He says this new technology developed indigenously is more efficient than other similar 2G ethanol converters developed around the world.

Biofuel plants in the US and Brazil.

Source: Wikimedia Commons
For one, a range of agricultural waste can be converted – and isn’t restricted to just bagasse, rice or wheat straw. Cotton stalk, bamboo and wood chips can also be included.

He then explains to The Telegraph, “It yields bioethanol in less than 24 hours, whereas others take four to five days. Besides, it is capable of recycling 90% of enzymes and water used by the plant. Enzymes – specialty chemical compounds that help convert cellulose in these residues to sugars and subsequently to ethanol – are costly and form a major part of the running expense. Therefore, their recycling brings down the operational cost significantly.”

The Process of Recycling
A series of huge bioreactors are set up at the Kashipur plant. Wheat- and bagasse-based agricultural waste was used in its pilot operation round. The dry waste is put into the plant and is converted into slurry when it is exposed to chemicals. This slurry is then pumped around in the processing area. Here, an imported cellulose enzyme converts the cellulose present in the biomass into sugars. These sugars are then added to yeast, which finally turns into ethanol.

The engineers at the bioplant say that the enzyme is then recovered and is recycled back into the plant, ready for the new batch.

Towards a Greener Future
Lalli and his team are working on building higher capacity plants, which can process 250 to 500 tonnes of waste daily.

According to him, a litre of 2G bioethanol can be sold at Rs 25 per litre. As of 2014, 1G ethanol cost up to Rs 50.

A cheaper source of fuel is finally a possibility.

Source: Wikimedia Commons, pixabay.com
When the National Green Tribunal banned the burning of waste, it also suggested that state government should set up platforms where farmers can sell their agricultural waste for money. Now, with this 2G ethanol development plant, the chain of sustainable, eco-friendly practices is further extended.

In India, about 70 million tonnes of fuel is being utilised for public transport alone. The national policy for biofuel and diesel mandates that at least 5% biofuel must be blended with diesel. The government plans to increase this to 20% by 2020. With 1G biofuel plants, India can only feed up to 3% of this demand. But an increase in the 2G ethanol production could feed furher demand, if such biofuel plants are set up everywhere around the country.

Thanks for information to TheBetterIndia.com.
 

raja696

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I completely agree with you, it's really an astounding achievement. But automobiles are not made compatible readily for bio ethanol fuels . The combustion chamber of vehicles required right ignition pressures and temperatures wrt its fuel octane content. In bio ethanol after production its octane has to be adjusted to conventional automobiles, so for that some more price is added.

So Mostly it can replace petrol but cannot compete diesel fuel. To that degree it should be mass produced to dominate over petrol.

It's quiet a challenge to promote... If we can just do it. we are successful eliminating terrorism :) .
 

Indx TechStyle

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I completely agree with you, it's really an astounding achievement. But automobiles are not made compatible readily for bio ethanol fuels . The combustion chamber of vehicles required right ignition pressures and temperatures wrt its fuel octane content. In bio ethanol after production its octane has to be adjusted to conventional automobiles, so for that some more price is added.

So Mostly it can replace petrol but cannot compete diesel fuel. To that degree it should be mass produced to dominate over petrol.

It's quiet a challenge to promote... If we can just do it. we are successful eliminating terrorism :) .
Plan B.
Vipe Out the Cars based on Petrol Diesel.
India Wants 100% of Vehicles to Be Electric by 2030
:biggrin2::biggrin2::biggrin2::biggrin2::biggrin2:
In fact, after 2017-22 program to cut out the template of "poor country" from name of InIndia and being middle income economy, government has long term plans to change India into a high income country and so keeping an eye on environmental challenges at that time too.
Our GDP per capita will be double of our neighbors, around 2.5-3 times of today by 2030, so such steps for "bigrael", rich and lavish people are needed to complete pollution in control.
 

Chinmoy

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Plan B.
Vipe Out the Cars based on Petrol Diesel.
India Wants 100% of Vehicles to Be Electric by 2030
:biggrin2::biggrin2::biggrin2::biggrin2::biggrin2:
In fact, after 2017-22 program to cut out the template of "poor country" from name of InIndia and being middle income economy, government has long term plans to change India into a high income country and so keeping an eye on environmental challenges at that time too.
Our GDP per capita will be double of our neighbors, around 2.5-3 times of today by 2030, so such steps for "bigrael", rich and lavish people are needed to complete pollution in control.
Actually few days back, the day before when our SEZ depot of bio diesel in Vizag caught fire, I was reading an article about it. As per the article it would be mandatory to use a mixture of conventional plus bio fuel from 2017 onwards. Although even today it is been done, but the percentage of bio fuel is that of 2%, whereas from 2017 onwards it would be increased to 5% and so on gradually.

But you have to keep out the oil mafia and the politburo in cahoots with them to make it a success.
 

ezsasa

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This bio-fuel adoption programme will go much faster when the current oil companies are made party to the program.


Ultimately oil companies are here to do business, they will be much happy if their losses are at least partly recovered from their own bio fuel program. If oil companies are not coming onboard, make ITC part of the program. ITC had robust network with Agri farmers across the states, adoption across states will be much faster.
 

Zebra

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Plan B.
Vipe Out the Cars based on Petrol Diesel.
India Wants 100% of Vehicles to Be Electric by 2030
:biggrin2::biggrin2::biggrin2::biggrin2::biggrin2:
In fact, after 2017-22 program to cut out the template of "poor country" from name of InIndia and being middle income economy, government has long term plans to change India into a high income country and so keeping an eye on environmental challenges at that time too.
Our GDP per capita will be double of our neighbors, around 2.5-3 times of today by 2030, so such steps for "bigrael", rich and lavish people are needed to complete pollution in control.
Sir, go through it..................


Published on Oct 23, 2015 , by Tesla Turk
 

no smoking

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Can you tell us those questions is Kaveri Engine thread?
Some high profile Indians involved in projects visit our forum as guest. They may get some help.
Any source for 100 questions?
I mean which 100 questions and which two has been answered? :p
Oh, Mr Indx Techstyle, if these high profile Indians need me to tell these common sense, you better ask your government to fire them since they are not qualified for the job.

If they are telling you that they can fix Kaveri Engine by one TOT, you better get rid of them immediately since they are dreaming or lying.

Japanese has been receiving TOT from Americans on jet engine, today they are still nowhere close to produce their own.
 

no smoking

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@no smoking India is reducing it's Carbon emissions by 41.5% by 2030. What about China?
Well, India is not reducing it's carbon emissions by 41.5% by 2030, India is planning to reduce its carbon emission INTENSITY by 41.5% by 2030. There is a huge difference.
But still, it is quite impressive target for any country, not to mention India as a country trying to increase her industrial base in next 2-3 decades. Whether or not India can achieve that, we don't know. After all, it is not the first time, India lays down some ambitious great plan.
 

Indx TechStyle

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Oh, Mr Indx Techstyle, if these high profile Indians need me to tell these common sense, you better ask your government to fire them since they are not qualified for the job.

If they are telling you that they can fix Kaveri Engine by one TOT, you better get rid of them immediately since they are dreaming or lying.

Japanese has been receiving TOT from Americans on jet engine, today they are still nowhere close to produce their own.
Don't bring Japan here. They have screwed up their weapons.
For Kaveri,
  1. Not a single out of us said it will fix all problems. Yet it can make us cross a hurdle. Then, we'll see how long it gonna take to cross further hurdles.
  2. There's a new parallel engine project called CVRDE MANIK,(yet it's off topic).
  3. This is a defense forum with a bunch of few hundred enthusiasts. Me and you don't know who's expert but as you said 100 questions, I'm thinking you must be making engines for Australian Government (facilities probably implemented by Americans). :lol:
Well, India is not reducing it's carbon emissions by 41.5% by 2030, India is planning to reduce its carbon emission INTENSITY by 41.5% by 2030. There is a huge difference.
Okay, whatever. :rolleyes:
But still, it is quite impressive target for any country, not to mention India as a country trying to increase her industrial base in next 2-3 decades. Whether or not India can achieve that, we don't know. After all, it is not the first time, India lays down some ambitious great plan.
Plan is feasible because of changes in energy sources.
1. All cars go electric.
2. Producing 25% of energy by Nuclear Means.
3. India is increasing solar power output by many folds in short intervals of time every year. Being a warm place, :hot:
It can produce a significant amount of energy from Sun easily.
http://www.climatechangenews.com/2014/11/18/india-targets-500-increase-in-solar-power-generation/
Other renewable energy sources are being expanded as well.

If India wants to be industrial nation, it needs to increase renewable output because next few decades will make Global Warming More critical issue.
Industries can also be implemented without creating pollution mindlessly. :D
Nor we want to die in heat as even today our country is much hot.

You told 100% correct, India puts too ambitious plans.
In many cases, they are implemented as well.
Like
From starting a 468.3 MW plant in 2011 to 6762.85 MW in 2016.
To be double by 2017

http://www.google.co.in/url?q=http:...ggaMAI&usg=AFQjCNFtfT6iw0g4DTQ3XvRlFek8yGCDrg
and 100000 by 2020.
http://www.business-standard.com/ar...00-mw-solar-power-by-2022-114111701373_1.html

Just because of delay in few plans, direction isn't determined.

We took a decade for A1, A5 ICBM was ready in 3 years only.
Longer time in a simple Heli Dhruv to new LCH and further, shipbuilding industry and further. It's like climibing a ladder.
Yes, we took 30 years for LCA but MCA won't be delayed much.
Kaveri was a failure and changed into dry Variant UAV engine ghatak, MANIK will be more successful.
Don't worry about us.
 

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Well it doesn't work that way.
If you have 100 questions about this engine, this TOT will only answer you 2 questions.
Thats a true statement. Metallurgy know how esp, for materials used in nice tech areas like Jet Engines is well guarded secret. The experience in them is gained more known from trial and error and continous R&D investment. There is no magic book or tech manual which will be readily given to you by other countries who posses know-how, which one reads will give you a Engine.
_-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Kaveri is step in right direction and is not dead project. It has given enough leanings for team to start a spin off project for Ghatak.

China is too struggling with JET Engine tech, but what they are doing right is the efforts they are putting in maturing their engines, by limited introduction in the some of aircraft.

GTE needs its own flying Jet Engine test laboratory.
 

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ezsasa

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A case for design and develop in india.

We all have seen those long Indian army truck convoys in the hilly regions on jagged roads, doesn't it make sense for MoD to invest in minimising the stress on those truck drivers by experimenting on driver less technology. I believe this is not impossible.

I feel that the total R&D effort for achieving this will not cost more than couple of hundred crores, returns will be a lot as the same can be easily extended to civilian applications as well.
 

AnantS

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A case for design and develop in india.

We all have seen those long Indian army truck convoys in the hilly regions on jagged roads, doesn't it make sense for MoD to invest in minimising the stress on those truck drivers by experimenting on driver less technology. I believe this is not impossible.

I feel that the total R&D effort for achieving this will not cost more than couple of hundred crores, returns will be a lot as the same can be easily extended to civilian applications as well.
Man! Driver-less on Hilly regions? I am not sure if you have ever driven a car in upper Himalayas. The Traffic, unstable mountains and really-REALLY narrow roads, is nightmare.
 

ezsasa

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Man! Driver-less on Hilly regions? I am not sure if you have ever driven a car in upper Himalayas. The Traffic, unstable mountains and really-REALLY narrow roads, is nightmare.
Don't mind me saying, but if we don't attempt it now then in 15 years time we will be cribbing about how some German company is not giving favourable ToT on the driverless technology.

Our choice.

Personally I believe in philosophy that I'd rather try and fail rather than sit and pass judgements.
 

Indx TechStyle

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Don't mind me saying, but if we don't attempt it now then in 15 years time we will be cribbing about how some German company is not giving favourable ToT on the driverless technology.

Our choice.

Personally I believe in philosophy that I'd rather try and fail rather than sit and pass judgements.
Go thorough first page if thread. One step is done, we made driverless shuttles. :p
We will deploy unmanned trucks also but later. :D
 

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