Dell Dumping China, Moving Likely to India

badguy2000

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BG,

You are mixing up things aren’t you?

Who says dell will in one go leave the PRC as was done by google, it’s a slow process and if true then rest assured they will be out quietly with in a year’s time or so, the motive of our PM to have this go public was simple and that was to set the cat amongst the pigeons, lets see the impact, it will be out in the next few days.

They will not loose out on the billion dollar sales which is growing each years as the figures show for the mainland china. The manufacturing, sourcing and supplying markets will be changed and they will export their product line to the PRC from that host country so the sales will happen and will keep growing, mind you a brand like dell doesnot sell as much on the cost factor but more on the brand image it carries and the customization they bring about to their products for that extra price.

Sourcing of business to the tune of 25b usd is minuscule as per industry standards of the PRC and that wont be the impact, the real impact will be when more and more companies follow the suite and take public stands on either the PRC bow down to them or they are out of it and if the PRC then will not be ready to listen to them then my friend rest assured you will have a chain reaction as we call in hindi – “bher chal”, and that is when the panic will set in and the real impact felt. New for you since you guys are not exposed to such things in a country where state controls everything but mind you people and companies coming from free world think much freely and hate being controlled endlessly by the state, and have the balls of taking on the system even if it means taking on the PRC and rest assured if it is a mass call in the end your very own government will go down on its keens and listen and do all that these companies want and hell you will request google to come back.

As for godaddy, ohimalaya they host domain names and “.cn” is hosted by them which is huge. Think of it, what would you like your site as .com or .cn?
Frankly speaking, CHina now needn't foreign fund at all ,because the only that China is not short of now is fund.
Instead, what CHina is worried about mostly is how to invest its own thick checkbooks effectively.

the harsh fall of international trade also proved that Chinese economy growth is not as reliable on trade with west as many guys thought.
 

badguy2000

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Dell doesn't have to quit selling in China unless CCP bans it. That would bring all kinds of trade disputes if China went that route. Dell buys the components in China that lets you have a thriving IT industry with their contribution of $25 billion per year. That is no small number to any country, much less a poor country like China. The move is going to put hundreds of thousands of Chinese labourers and engineers out of work. Dell can outsource to India, Malayasia of wherever and prepare themselves for the pop of Chinese bubbles.
CCP needn't ban Dell at all. Dell now is already disreputable for it bad after-sale service in CHina.

the ranking list of computer sales in Sunin-Links, China's biggest electric household appliance malls (20090408-20090424)

1. HP;2,Lenovo;3,ASUS;4,Shenzhou;5,Dell;



http://www.cheaa.com/News/Chanpin/DianNao/2009-4/291409.html
 

Armand2REP

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but why CHinese economy still grew 8.7% in spite of such 40% cut of orders from West countries?

can you explain it?
It has been explained to you 50 times already. When China spends $550 billion in stumulus and $1.4 trillion in banque lending, you hope you see 40% growth. But you only got 8.7%. China used to spend $1.5 per $1 of GDP growth, now it costs $7 for 1.
 

badguy2000

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It would be interesting to see if this trend gains momentum.We have been discussing in the forum for ages about China's lack of respect to intellectual and propreitery rights.Seems like companies are feeling the sting now.It would be nice, if we can dig deeper into the real problems the companies are facing in China.
China should realise that they can't control everything all the time.
Our Chinese brothers are saying that these foreign companies are not able to face the competetion and local companies will fill the void.
But, without competition where will the innovation,growth,lower prices e.tc.come from ?

Is this a kind of paradigm shift ? We have to wait and see.
guy, once China used to give foreign companies "Super-national treatment" and lots of privileges ,when CHina was hungery for foreign fund and its domestic market was quite small at that time.


Now, CHina is not short of fund any more and its domestic market is big enough to attract foreign investors, so CHina gradually abolishs "Super-national treatment" and lots of privileges given to foreign enterprises once.

it is just a return to normalization.

If foreign enterprises can not accept such a normalizaiton ,just go away. China needn't such foreign investment.
 
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tarunraju

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pls check you PC first,then tell me where the components inside it are made....ok?
Checked:

Intel Core i5 750: Made in Malaysia

Biostar TPower I55 motherboard: Made in Taiwan

Corsair Dominator memory :uses Elpida memory chips, made in Japan, assembled in Taiwan

ATI Radeon HD 5870: Uses GPU made at TSMC Taiwan, memory chips by Samsung, Korea, and most other components from Thailand, Malaysia, and Taiwan

Hard Drives made in Singapore

Sound Blaster X-Fi sound card made in Singapore

That leaves a case, a Corsair PSU, and monitor made in China. That's like 30% of my PC, and those aren't complex parts, can be easily made here.
 

badguy2000

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It would be interesting to see if this trend gains momentum.We have been discussing in the forum for ages about China's lack of respect to intellectual and propreitery rights.Seems like companies are feeling the sting now.It would be nice, if we can dig deeper into the real problems the companies are facing in China.
China should realise that they can't control everything all the time.
Our Chinese brothers are saying that these foreign companies are not able to face the competetion and local companies will fill the void.
But, without competition where will the innovation,growth,lower prices e.tc.come from ?

Is this a kind of paradigm shift ? We have to wait and see.
guy, have you been to China?

the competition in CHina market is mostly fierce in the world ,whether foreign companies take part in the competition here or not.

If one companies can survive in the fierce competiton in CHina market, it can survive in any other country.
 

badguy2000

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Checked:

Intel Core i5 750: Made in Malaysia

Biostar TPower I55 motherboard: Made in Taiwan

Corsair Dominator memory :uses Elpida memory chips, made in Japan, assembled in Taiwan

ATI Radeon HD 5870: Uses GPU made at TSMC Taiwan, memory chips by Samsung, Korea, and most other components from Thailand, Malaysia, and Taiwan

Hard Drives made in Singapore

Sound Blaster X-Fi sound card made in Singapore

That leaves a case, a Corsair PSU, and monitor made in China. That's like 30% of my PC, and those aren't complex parts, can be easily made here.
Taiwan? Come on, guy , don't be serious to the tage of "made in Taiwan" too much.

most PC components of "Made in Taiwan" just can prove the label was tagged in Taiwan for a vacation of quota ,although they were produced in mainland China.

60% of global personal computers are "Made in China".

here are Chinese industry output and its shares of global outputs.
http://www.defenceforum.in/forum/showthread.php?9052-why-USA-fear-China-China-s-industry-output-2009
Crude Steel: 568 million tons, 46.6% of the global crude steel output;
Steel products : 696 million tons,50%+ of global output;
cement 1630 M tons, 50% of global output;
electrolytic Aluminum: 12.85 M tons,60% of global output;
Refined copper: 4.13 M tons, 25% of global's ;
Coal: 3050 M tons, 45% of global output;
Crude oil: 189 M tons,5% of global output;
Ethene: 10.66 M tons, global second biggest producter only behind USA;
Chemical Fertilizer: 66 M tons, 35% of global output;
Plastic: 44.793 M tons



Electricity-generation Installed capacity: 860M KW,global second biggest only a bit behind USA ;
Expressway: 65 K KM,global second longest and only a bit behind USA;
Railway: 86K KM, only behind USA.



Auto: 13.79M , 35% of global output, world biggest auto producter;
Shipbuilding:42.43 M Deadweight tons,34.8% of global output;
Personal computer: 182M, 60% of global output;
Colour TV: 98.99M ,48% of global output;
Refrigerator:59.3 M, 60% of global output;
Air conditioner: 80.78M, 70% of global output;
Washing Machines: 49.35M,40% of global output;
Microwave Oven: 60.38M, 70% of global output;
Mobile Phone: 619M, 50% of global output;


Yarn: 23.935 M tons,46% of global output;
Fabric: 74 trilion Square Meters,global biggest producter;
Chemical Fifer: 27.3 M tons, 57% of global output
 
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tarunraju

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Taiwan? Come on, guy , don't be serious to the tage of "made in Taiwan" too much.

most PC components of "Made in Taiwan" just can prove the label was tagged in Taiwan for a vacation of quota ,although they were produced in mainland China.
Biostar has its motherboard sourced from Foxconn, which has its facility well within Taiwan (it also makes boards for ASUS and Gigabyte). TSMC is well within Taiwan.
 

tharikiran

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guy, once China used to give foreign companies "Super-national treatment" and lots of privileges ,when CHina was hungery for foreign fund and its domestic market was quite small at that time.


Now, CHina is not short of fund any more and its domestic market is big enough to attract foreign investors, so CHina gradually abolishs "Super-national treatment" and lots of privileges given to foreign enterprises once.

it is just a return to normalization.

If foreign enterprises can not accept such a normalizaiton ,just go away. China needn't such foreign investment.
you are just sounding patriotic. Nothing else.Just having a big domestic market is not going to attract foreign investment.
The political climate is important too_Once, you remove all the benefits you are giving to attract foreign companies, all these companies will leave
to countries like India or Brazil.
Just like yours India has a big enough domestic market.

Your posts sound like,"I have the money now. So, I am gonna be cocky".

All these foreign investors will stop investing in China, if this trend continues.
With more people like you in China who are very patriotic; who refuse to use Google because it decided to change operations to Hong kong.

All this is not going to help and will only scare away the investors.I don't know where all this is going...
 

tarunraju

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60% of global personal computers are "Made in China".
Don't sweat it. 60% of my computer wasn't made in mainland China. The 30% that was is a stupid case (chassis), which is just a frame of steel, can be easily made here, PSU is more electricals than electronics, can be made here too, as for monitors, Samsung has an LCD plant in India which makes LCD TVs. So the resources are there to make LCD monitors. Dell sources its LCD panels from Samsung.
 

badguy2000

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Biostar has its motherboard sourced from Foxconn, which has its facility well within Taiwan (it also makes boards for ASUS and Gigabyte). TSMC is well within Taiwan.
guy, do you know that 90% +of Foxconn's staff,plants and industry output are in Shenzhen city, mainland CHina?

Foxccons leaves its headquarter in taiwan ,just for a special "supernational treatment" and other privileges for Taiwanese enterprises.

Foxconn in fact is a companies in Shenzhen,instead of Taiwan.

guy, do you really don't know that Foxccon is in SHenzhen.....I feel it very funny.

here are several famous enterprises in Shenzhen city: Huawei, Foxconn, ZTE,China merchants banks,Tecent...
 
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tharikiran

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guy, have you been to China?

the competition in CHina market is mostly fierce in the world ,whether foreign companies take part in the competition here or not.

If one companies can survive in the fierce competiton in CHina market, it can survive in any other country.
You are the one who's saying China market was small. It's because of these foreign companies there is competetion in China.
It's because of the positive economic environment in China it has grown so fast. Once, you remove that. The growth will come down.

As you say, 60% of global personal computers are "Made in China".It will change to "Made in India" in a wink, if these companies move out of China to India.We got the people and the brains to do the job.
 

tarunraju

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guy, do you know that 90% +of Foxconn's staff,plants and industry output are in Shenzhen city, mainland CHina?

Foxccons leaves its headquarter in taiwan ,just for a special "supernational treatment" and other privileges for Taiwanese enterprises.

Foxconn in fact is a companies in Shenzhen,instead of Taiwan.
Foxconn makes plastic-based components in Shenzhen (like connectors, sockets, cases, plugs, etc.,) not PCBs. Since it specializes with those components more than with PCBs, it looks as if most of its manufacturing is done in PRC.
 

badguy2000

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you are just sounding patriotic. Nothing else.Just having a big domestic market is not going to attract foreign investment.
The political climate is important too_Once, you remove all the benefits you are giving to attract foreign companies, all these companies will leave
to countries like India or Brazil.
Just like yours India has a big enough domestic market.

Your posts sound like,"I have the money now. So, I am gonna be cocky".

All these foreign investors will stop investing in China, if this trend continues.
With more people like you in China who are very patriotic; who refuse to use Google because it decided to change operations to Hong kong.

All this is not going to help and will only scare away the investors.I don't know where all this is going...
guy, you get it.

CHina now is a banker while west is the guy with lot of IOUs.

west guys obvously are not used to accept the fact....that is why west guys rants now.
 

badguy2000

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Foxconn makes plastic-based components in Shenzhen (like connectors, sockets, cases, plugs, etc.,) not PCBs. Since it specializes with those components more than with PCBs, it looks as if most of its manufacturing is done in PRC.
guy, here is the website of Foxconn. you can read it by yourself.

Foxconn's export from Mainland China was 55.6 billion USD(2008). Most of them were exported from Shenzhen city. many components of your PC are a part of the "55.6 billion dollars"
Foxconn is one of biggest enterprises in Shenzhen city and biggest exporter in mainland CHina.


凭借扎根科技、专业制造和前瞻决策,自1974年在台湾肇基,特别是1988年在深圳地区建厂以来,富士康迅速发展壮大,拥有60余万员工及全球顶尖IT客户群,为全球最大的电子产业专业制造商。2008年富士康依然保持强劲发展、逆势成长,出口总额达556亿美元,占中国大陆出口总额的3.9%,连续7年雄居大陆出口200强榜首;跃居《财富》2009年全球企业500强第109位。
http://www.foxconn.com.cn/GroupProfile.html
 
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nimo_cn

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I am a little confused, why do Indian friends become so excited about this?
Last time i check, some Indians laughed at China for this low-end manufacturing.
 

tharikiran

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guy, you get it.

CHina now is a banker while west is the guy with lot of IOUs.

west guys obvously are not used to accept the fact....that is why west guys rants now.
You have the money now. But for how long.Unless you have the kind of R&D that the US has it will be difficult for China in the long run.
It's the new world. You can't grow in isolation.
 

tharikiran

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I am a little confused, why do Indian friends become so excited about this?
Last time i check, some Indians laughed at China for this low-end manufacturing.
That's what we are saying too. Dell has got nothing to lose by shifting operations.This low-end manufacturing can be done in most countries of the world.
 

badguy2000

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That's what we are saying too. Dell has got nothing to lose by shifting operations.This low-end manufacturing can be done in most countries of the world.
Dell has nothing to lose,because Dell indeed has nothing but low-end manufacturing.

do you reall think CHina would care a guy leaves China, that has nothing but low-end manufacturing ?
 

nimo_cn

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That's what we are saying too. Dell has got nothing to lose by shifting operations.This low-end manufacturing can be done in most countries of the world.
Then i don't think China has anything to lose either. There are plenty of PC companies want to stay in China, such as Lenevo, HP, Acer, ASUS, ....

And i don't believe Dell will "dump" China like someone said in a near future. China has one of the largest PC markets in the world, which is still growing fast. It is said, within 2-3 years, the population of Chinese netizens will reach 500 million( now it is 380 million), you can imagine how many computers will be sold in China in the next several years.

But I think it is understandable for Dell to shift part of its operation to other countries, say India, which as well as China has cheap labor, and a growing personal computer market.

BTW, i am surprised this news sourced from the PM of India.
 

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