China Tests Midcourse Missile Interception

Armand2REP

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If Chinese tried to do what was mentioned above Russians could just turn of the oil going to them in their pipeline deal that would cripple the Chinese economy, no matter how easy it may seem for the Chinese the Russians still have the upperhand. Most of the weapons sold to China are of Russian origin and Russia still has 5-7,000 tactical nukes which they would not hesitate to use.
Russian tactical nukes are Soviet era stocks of mostly torpedo warheads, mines, some ASM warheads, and many ABM warheads. Only 2,050 remain with 700 for missile defence, 650 Air Force and 700 Navy. The only threat to the PLA would be the 650 VVS nukes, but then they are thirty years old so not likely to work.

Most of the weapons sold to China may be of Russian origin, but it doesn't matter if China knows how to build it themselves.

Oil is what China is going after by invading. They will have sufficient strategic reserves to last out a six month war and China hardly gets much oil from Russia as it is.
 
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Any weakness by Russia against the chinese in regard to their siberian oil could endanger their oil monopolies in other parts like central asia.(back to topic)
 

Armand2REP

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Any weakness by Russia against the chinese in regard to their siberian oil could endanger their oil monopolies in other parts like central asia.(back to topic)
And China is fighting hard for Central Asian influence and resources. As she grows she will need more supply. Russia is the logical expansion. Will CCP get the balls to do it? Only if the missile shield is a success and CCP is backed against the wall from internal pressure. Also it depends on how successful Russia's military modernisation pans out. So far it isn't going so great.

Back to topic, the political consequences of a Chinese missile shield is the greatest threat to Russia more than anyone else.
 

bengalraider

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That was 1995, it hasn't gone anywhere. Kh-101 was non-nuclear anyway. They replaced that programme with Kh-55M.
Read the article i linked from NTI no less! it says
The decision to complete the development and begin production of Kh-101 and Kh-555 appears to have been made in late 1999.
i.e the program was started four odd years after you claim the program was cancelled.
The only reason development of the KH101 and it's nuclear cousin the KH102 was suspended in the mid 90's due to the SALT 2 negotiations between President Yestsin and the americans, there is no reason to suggest the President Putin may not have restarted the program.
You're forgetting the military reforms and troop reduction. There are only 39 combat brigades and 21 artillery brigades in the entire country and most of them are in Europe. There is no such thing as a tank division anymore, tanks have been reduced to 2,000 and put into combined brigades. There are 3 PLA Field Armies directly across the border outnumbering the entire Russian Army, not to mention 7 reserve divisions.
Far Eastern Military District
The Far Eastern Military District, headquartered in Khabarovsk, includes four combined arms armies and one army corps. Among them, those units have three tank divisions and thirteen motorized rifle divisions, of which one tank division and two motorized rifle divisions have headquarters that serve as district training centers. One artillery division and five machine gun-artillery divisions are directly subordinate to the district headquarters
.
The Siberian Military District lies in the center of Asiatic Russia, with its headquarters in Novosibirsk. Its ground forces are organized into one corps of four motorized rifle divisions and one artillery regiment.

The Transbaikal Military District is headquartered in Chita. The district comprises three combined arms armies totaling four tank divisions and six motorized rifle divisions. One tank division and one motorized rifle division are headquartered at district training centers that are believed to be directly subordinate to the district headquarters. One artillery division and two machine gun-artillery divisions deployed on the Chinese border also have district training-center status.
Russian Military Districts

As per global security(a genarally reliable source)the above is the real status of Russian forces in the far east as of now; if you can provide a more reliable source i would love to know,The above does not include naval marines and motor rifle divisions that were transferred to the navy during the reorganisation of the forces. anyhoo the chinese would probably use the forces stationed in the shenyang and beijing military districts for such an assault in all around 550,000Men
the breakup as per wiki (couldn't find it on global sec)
Shenyang military region:
The International Institute for Strategic Studies lists the formation with an estimated 250,000 personnel, three group armies, and two armoured, one mechanised, four motorised, and one artillery division.[1] It also lists two armoured, five motorised, three artillery, four anti-aircraft and one anti-tank brigades with the formation.

Known formations and units include the 16th Group Army, with three divisions, including an armoured division, in Jilin, the 23rd Group Army headquartered at Harbin, and the 39th Group Army in Liaoning.

Beijing Military region
The International Institute for Strategic Studies attributes the command with 300,000 personnel, consisting of three group armies (the 27th Army, 38th Army, and the 65th Army), two armoured divisions, one mechanised infantry division, five motorised divisions, one artillery division, three armoured, seven motorised infantry, four artillery, a total of five various anti-aircraft brigades, and one anti-tank regiment. The command is also augmented by the Capital Garrison, which consists of the 1st and 3rd Capital Garrison Divisions (Police), and is also home to the PLA Navy (PLAN) North Sea Fleet and the PLA Air Force (PLAAF) 10th Air Force Corps.
In all the Russians as per global security have around 7 tank divisions and 19 motorized rifle divisions in siberia i.e assuming 12,000 men in each division we have 26x12000=312000men, may look vastly inferior compared to the PLA's 550,000 but remember that most russain armored divisons will be fighting with the T-72/T-80 and it's analogoues while the PLA for the most part will use T-69's.Couple that with the fact that much of siberia is impassable and you could lure the PLA into a deathtrap.




Weren't you saying they are filled with 5 decoys and 1 actual warhead? That only equals 65 bombs. What CCP is willing to risk depends on their political situation.
What i am saying is that it has the capability to carry 6 MIRV's how many of them are real bombs and how many are decoys is a matter known only to the men with top level security clearances among the Russians.
as for the Topol here's the latest on the upgrade to Topol-M at the Teykovo 4 base from FAS



As for the political situation of the CCP they are comfortable enough as it is they do not need to risk anything by starting a war with a potentially stronger adversary.


Russian boomers are rarely ever on patrol. An attack on Vladivostok will wipe most of them out. The old RS-29s, which are most of them, carry 4 warheads.
While nothing like the massive numbers on patrol in 1984/85 as per FAS the "Bear Boomers" went out on patrol 10 times in 2008 ie assuming a normal patrol time of 36-40 days for each Boomer the russians had a Boomer at sea every month in 2008.not a bad patrol time at all.see the list.

http://www.fas.org/programs/ssp/nukes/images/ruspat.jpg
As far as most of the RS-29 force carrying only 4 warheads is concerned you are right but remember at least 7 delta IV subs have been deployed with this missile with each sub carrying 16 missiles thats still 64 potential warheads to each sub.

No airbourne assualt is needed, the sheer lack of depth in the Far Eastern defence prevents that as a necessity. China can just attrite them by sheer numbers. By sea they will find the SSNs stuck in port generating power off their reactors to run the naval base since they can't afford their electric bill. The only real threat would be the Varyag CG but that can be attrited too, PLAN has the numbers.
A war of attrition would hardly be the "Blitzkreig" that would be required for a theoratical chinese attempt to take over Siberia before the Russians could get their act in order . Russia has one of the largest conscript reserve forces in the worldi.e these men fight for free and hence do not come into cost cutting for the Russian military. Give the russians a few days and you could see millions of conscripts marching into Siberia in defence of the fatherland, couple that with the fact that the russian forces maintain roughly 20,000 tanks9mostly T-64's) in reserve that could be reactivated fast in the case of a national emergency.couple that with the immense CAS capability of the RuAF and the incredible air defence capability the S series and the Tor's provide and the picture dosen't look rosy for the chinese at all.

Also the chinese will have to deal with diplomatic pressure, oil supplies could be cut off money in banks could be stopped and repatriated(even if the chinese do hold an immense amount of cash almost all of the moeny is electronic in nature and can be withdrawn in a jiffy).
Also the Indians and the Vietnamese both have joint security arrangements with the russains and both also have territory dispites with china .China could end up having to fight on three fronts at one, not counting any CIS intervention in china's far northwest as well.

Kobalt M and Don are canister droppers, worthless for real time intel.



Doesn't matter how many canister droppers they have up, they ony have 8 rolls of film.
Kobalt and Don are the satellites the russians have declared to the world , my question was what have they not declared.


If China moves off their base to attack, what difference does it make if they hit the base? Mobile command posts don't make for a good Tochka-U target.
So you assume the russians will not move as well, anyways the Topchka was designed to take out battlefield bases particularly.

They won't care about Western Siberia, just that close to their border with all the untapped oil. Wipe out the Far East and entrench in Eastern Siberia would be their goal. , not going too far from their supply lines is the only way to sustain it since logistics are so poor. Russia has made that easy for them by not backing up their defences.
Will the Russians simply give up and stop trying to retake their land after & if the chinese take over siberia is the real question here.
 

tony4562

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The entire course of sino-russo border has been demarcated. I don't see any scenario where china would launch a land-grabing invasion into russia short of a apocalyptic event (like a richter scalar 12 earther quake hitting Moskaw) happenning inside russia.
 

bengalraider

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The entire course of sino-russo border has been demarcated. I don't see any scenario where china would launch a land-grabing invasion into russia short of a apocalyptic event (like a richter scalar 12 earther quake hitting Moskaw) happenning inside russia.
going off-topic here but:
A richter scale 12 earthquake :noo1::noo1:do you know what that means

Richter TNT for Seismic Example
Magnitude Energy Yield (approximate)


-1.5 6 ounces Breaking a rock on a lab table
1.0 30 pounds Large Blast at a Construction Site
1.5 320 pounds
2.0 1 ton Large Quarry or Mine Blast
2.5 4.6 tons
3.0 29 tons
3.5 73 tons
4.0 1,000 tons Small Nuclear Weapon
4.5 5,100 tons Average Tornado (total energy)
5.0 32,000 tons
5.5 80,000 tons Little Skull Mtn., NV Quake, 1992
6.0 1 million tons Double Spring Flat, NV Quake, 1994
6.5 5 million tons Northridge, CA Quake, 1994
7.0 32 million tons Hyogo-Ken Nanbu, Japan Quake, 1995; Largest Thermonuclear Weapon
7.5 160 million tons Landers, CA Quake, 1992
8.0 1 billion tons San Francisco, CA Quake, 1906
8.5 5 billion tons Anchorage, AK Quake, 1964
9.0 32 billion tons Chilean Quake, 1960
10.0 1 trillion tons (San-Andreas type fault circling Earth)
12.0 160 trillion tons (Fault Earth in half through center,
OR Earth's daily receipt of solar energy)


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Richter Magnitude
Apart from totally leveling the whole of Russia it would pretty much destroy everything in china and the rest of eurasia as well.
 

badguy2000

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And China is fighting hard for Central Asian influence and resources. As she grows she will need more supply. Russia is the logical expansion. Will CCP get the balls to do it? Only if the missile shield is a success and CCP is backed against the wall from internal pressure. Also it depends on how successful Russia's military modernisation pans out. So far it isn't going so great.

Back to topic, the political consequences of a Chinese missile shield is the greatest threat to Russia more than anyone else.
that won't happen in two decades,because with 2 decades, any missle interception tech can not hold up the missle attack from Russia.

in forseeable future, what Chinese missile shield can do is to disable limited nuke force such as India, Pakistan,N.korea and Iran.
 

sayareakd

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in forseeable future, what Chinese missile shield can do is to disable limited nuke force such as India, Pakistan,N.korea and Iran.
I dont know about the Pak NK and Iran, but your interceptor wont be intercepting A2 missile, that is for sure.
 
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that won't happen in two decades,because with 2 decades, any missle interception tech can not hold up the missle attack from Russia.

in forseeable future, what Chinese missile shield can do is to disable limited nuke force such as India, Pakistan,N.korea and Iran.
what it will do is have India make the right missiles instead of ordinary missiles India will focus on MIRV and SLBM MIRV's and other nations will also help India in this task.
 

sayareakd

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LF no need to have MIRVs our A2 is enough to get through that chines interceptor



ever wonder what those fins at the upper stage is for, those are to guide the missile in midcourse and at the terminal stage.

first target will be that radar station in china.......
 

Armand2REP

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Read the article i linked from NTI no less! it says

i.e the program was started four odd years after you claim the program was cancelled.
The only reason development of the KH101 and it's nuclear cousin the KH102 was suspended in the mid 90's due to the SALT 2 negotiations between President Yestsin and the americans, there is no reason to suggest the President Putin may not have restarted the program.
The article doesn't mention anything about the start of the programme and I never mentioned a date of it ending. I said it hasn't gone anywhere and it hasn't. The only cruise missile they have been actively testing is Kh-555. It would be nice to have a smaller missile like 101, but it really isn't necessary ending to its cancellation.

Russian Military Districts

As per global security(a genarally reliable source)the above is the real status of Russian forces in the far east as of now; if you can provide a more reliable source i would love to know,The above does not include naval marines and motor rifle divisions that were transferred to the navy during the reorganisation of the forces. anyhoo the chinese would probably use the forces stationed in the shenyang and beijing military districts for such an assault in all around 550,000Men
the breakup as per wiki (couldn't find it on global sec)


In all the Russians as per global security have around 7 tank divisions and 19 motorized rifle divisions in siberia i.e assuming 12,000 men in each division we have 26x12000=312000men, may look vastly inferior compared to the PLA's 550,000 but remember that most russain armored divisons will be fighting with the T-72/T-80 and it's analogoues while the PLA for the most part will use T-69's.Couple that with the fact that much of siberia is impassable and you could lure the PLA into a deathtrap.
There is so much outdated information there I don't even know where to begin. There are hardly 312,000 men left in the Russian Ground Forces much less Far East, it is 395,000 for the whole country, add 45,000 to Airbourne. That military district map is pre-1998 before Trans-Bakail was merged with Siberian MD so Global Security is really outdated. Russia has done away with the Field Army and division leadership (except VDV) and made it straight MD/Brigade/ Battalion level. The problem of multiple commands slowing operations in Georgia decided that fate. There are now 39 permanent readiness combat brigades, 21 missile/artillery brigades, 7 AD brigades, 12 comm brigades, and 2 ELINT brigades. The reduction includes dropping away the tank division and dispersing the 2000 tanks into the combat brigade structure. Each brigade gets 5 tank regiments per battalion for 50 tanks. T-64s and T-80s are being scrapped so only upgraded T-72 and T-90s will remain. Since the Omsk factory is closed, Uralvagonzavod will be the only one servicing and building tanks. The purpose of these reforms was to get rid of the Soviet paper armies where divisions had a bunch of officers, a bunch of equipment and no men to man it. Also to be able to afford modern equipment, training, pay increases, and military housing for everyone in service. They also did away with warrant officers and replaced them with professional contract sergeants. These are Russia's attempts to attain a modern Army within a relatively small defence budget.

If you want to read more about this issue, I would suggest you read this piece.

À íà âñå ïðî âñå – âñåãî 85 áðèãàä ïîñòîÿííîé áîåâîé ãîòîâíîñòè -

If you want a quick breakdown of the PLA and their force reduction, this map is a good one.



What i am saying is that it has the capability to carry 6 MIRV's how many of them are real bombs and how many are decoys is a matter known only to the men with top level security clearances among the Russians.
as for the Topol here's the latest on the upgrade to Topol-M at the Teykovo 4 base from FAS

Only 15?

As for the political situation of the CCP they are comfortable enough as it is they do not need to risk anything by starting a war with a potentially stronger adversary.
I would agree if China wasn't so intent on flexing their muscles. We are starting to see a serious change in the "Peaceful Rise" strategy. Building carriers, shooting down satellites, ABM tests, White papers on destabalising India, blocking development loans for AP, PLA constantly crossing the border... ect.


While nothing like the massive numbers on patrol in 1984/85 as per FAS the "Bear Boomers" went out on patrol 10 times in 2008 ie assuming a normal patrol time of 36-40 days for each Boomer the russians had a Boomer at sea every month in 2008.not a bad patrol time at all.see the list.

http://www.fas.org/programs/ssp/nukes/images/ruspat.jpg
For having 11 boomers, it is a very low patrol pattern, although far better than the past. The longer Bulava is delayed, the worse those patterns will be.

As far as most of the RS-29 force carrying only 4 warheads is concerned you are right but remember at least 7 delta IV subs have been deployed with this missile with each sub carrying 16 missiles thats still 64 potential warheads to each sub.
As I mentioned earlier, Delta IVs are getting refurbished Sinevas and a life extension which is going to drop their availability. Three are in refit right now.

A war of attrition would hardly be the "Blitzkreig" that would be required for a theoratical chinese attempt to take over Siberia before the Russians could get their act in order . Russia has one of the largest conscript reserve forces in the worldi.e these men fight for free and hence do not come into cost cutting for the Russian military. Give the russians a few days and you could see millions of conscripts marching into Siberia in defence of the fatherland, couple that with the fact that the russian forces maintain roughly 20,000 tanks9mostly T-64's) in reserve that could be reactivated fast in the case of a national emergency.couple that with the immense CAS capability of the RuAF and the incredible air defence capability the S series and the Tor's provide and the picture dosen't look rosy for the chinese at all.
Thats what you thought, but thats not what it is. Russia doesn't have the manpower to arm a huge conscript army which is why they are going for the permanent readiness concept. Too many people were defering the draft to meet the quotas which is why people are signing contracts with moderate pay. They still have to draft but the quotas are much lower. All the Soviet paper armies are gone. The Russian forces in the Far East are so few and close to the border, it wouldn't take long to attrite them.

Also the chinese will have to deal with diplomatic pressure, oil supplies could be cut off money in banks could be stopped and repatriated(even if the chinese do hold an immense amount of cash almost all of the moeny is electronic in nature and can be withdrawn in a jiffy).
China holds the US debt and would be attacking the reason NATO was formed. They will invent some reason and there would be little the West would do to stop them. This isn't some Tom Clancy novel where the US will come to the Bear's rescue.

Also the Indians and the Vietnamese both have joint security arrangements with the russains and both also have territory dispites with china .China could end up having to fight on three fronts at one, not counting any CIS intervention in china's far northwest as well.
India had a security arrangement with the USSR, not the Russian Federation, same goes for Vietnam. CIS members wouldn't do jack squat when they can't even get half of them to form a rapid reaction force. You might get a Kazakh brigade if they are lucky, it wouldn't make any difference.

Kobalt and Don are the satellites the russians have declared to the world , my question was what have they not declared.
Russians declare everything whether it is real or not, ie plasma stealth. :sarcastic:

So you assume the russians will not move as well, anyways the Topchka was designed to take out battlefield bases particularly.
If China is launching a surprise attack, Russia will not move until after the bombardment has begun.

Will the Russians simply give up and stop trying to retake their land after & if the chinese take over siberia is the real question here.
One has to look at European Russians perceptions of the Far East and Eastern Siberia. Most of them have never been there, never will go and know little about it. It is like a foreign country it is so far away. People transferred there in the military hate it as it is underfunded and a cesspool of crime, abuse and poor discipline. Many people couldn't care less if Russia sold it to the Chinese, they think they are going to colonise it anyway. Russians are pretty patriotic so there is no way they would let it go without some kind of indemnity from China. A humiliating defeat in the Far East with a few million Chinese soldiers occupying it would dissuade most people from trying. The population base of Russia is just too low to compete.
 

bengalraider

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The article doesn't mention anything about the start of the programme and I never mentioned a date of it ending. I said it hasn't gone anywhere and it hasn't. The only cruise missile they have been actively testing is Kh-555. It would be nice to have a smaller missile like 101, but it really isn't necessary ending to its cancellation.
There is no confirmation of the cancellation of the KH 101 however the report i pasted earlier says that the go ahead for both the KH101 and the KH555 was given in 1999 only.


There is so much outdated information there I don't even know where to begin. There are hardly 312,000 men left in the Russian Ground Forces much less Far East, it is 395,000 for the whole country, add 45,000 to Airbourne. That military district map is pre-1998 before Trans-Bakail was merged with Siberian MD so Global Security is really outdated. Russia has done away with the Field Army and division leadership (except VDV) and made it straight MD/Brigade/ Battalion level. The problem of multiple commands slowing operations in Georgia decided that fate. There are now 39 permanent readiness combat brigades, 21 missile/artillery brigades, 7 AD brigades, 12 comm brigades, and 2 ELINT brigades. The reduction includes dropping away the tank division and dispersing the 2000 tanks into the combat brigade structure. Each brigade gets 5 tank regiments per battalion for 50 tanks. T-64s and T-80s are being scrapped so only upgraded T-72 and T-90s will remain. Since the Omsk factory is closed, Uralvagonzavod will be the only one servicing and building tanks. The purpose of these reforms was to get rid of the Soviet paper armies where divisions had a bunch of officers, a bunch of equipment and no men to man it. Also to be able to afford modern equipment, training, pay increases, and military housing for everyone in service. They also did away with warrant officers and replaced them with professional contract sergeants. These are Russia's attempts to attain a modern Army within a relatively small defence budget.

If you want to read more about this issue, I would suggest you read this piece.

À íà âñå ïðî âñå – âñåãî 85 áðèãàä ïîñòîÿííîé áîåâîé ãîòîâíîñòè -

If you want a quick breakdown of the PLA and their force reduction, this map is a good one.

You are partially correct the Russian army is downsizing however it is not going to become only a 395000 man force what they are doing however is modernizing part of the army and creating well armed modern rapid reaction brigades that will be on permanent alert these are the forces you speak of, the entire army shall still number around 1.1 million. The bulk of the rest of the forces shall be defensive units designed to hold key areas in case of conflict.
from the caucasian defence review 2008n :pDF of the entire article attached.
In particular, armed units of permanent combat readiness and well equipped soldiers numbering in total about 200,000 will coexist within a bigger low-combat readiness army that will still consume the vast share of the budget.

in only one Base
I would agree if China wasn't so intent on flexing their muscles. We are starting to see a serious change in the "Peaceful Rise" strategy. Building carriers, shooting down satellites, ABM tests, White papers on destabalising India, blocking development loans for AP, PLA constantly crossing the border... ect.
Maybe you are right maybe you're wrong. The Chinese have become more assertive these days on this one lets both wait and see.

For having 11 boomers, it is a very low patrol pattern, although far better than the past. The longer Bulava is delayed, the worse those patterns will be. As I mentioned earlier, Delta IVs are getting refurbished Sinevas and a life extension which is going to drop their availability. Three are in refit right now./QUOTE]

The patrols have increased under Putin ;if he comes back as president in 2012 he will further improve capacity , The patrols in 2008 occurred while at least two of the three were in refit . i do not see a significant dent in capability if another boomer goes into refit. about the need for the Bulava i agree they need to get that missile operational as fast as they can.



Thats what you thought, but thats not what it is. Russia doesn't have the manpower to arm a huge conscript army which is why they are going for the permanent readiness concept. Too many people were defering the draft to meet the quotas which is why people are signing contracts with moderate pay. They still have to draft but the quotas are much lower. All the Soviet paper armies are gone. The Russian forces in the Far East are so few and close to the border, it wouldn't take long to attrite them.
Again read the PDF 1.1 mil is not a small number.

China holds the US debt and would be attacking the reason NATO was formed. They will invent some reason and there would be little the West would do to stop them. This isn't some Tom Clancy novel where the US will come to the Bear's rescue.
The Americans are also looking for an excuse to stem china's rise, a surprise assault on Russia may well just give them one.

India had a security arrangement with the USSR, not the Russian Federation, same goes for Vietnam. CIS members wouldn't do jack squat when they can't even get half of them to form a rapid reaction force. You might get a Kazakh brigade if they are lucky, it wouldn't make any difference.
Nevertheless India and Vietnam both have close mutual security relation with Russia the real depth of these is unknown; the Russians still have the "enterprise" favor to cash in.The CIS has significant Russian populations not to take notice.


Russians declare everything whether it is real or not, ie plasma stealth. :sarcastic:
That's what you think, i do not agree.

If China is launching a surprise attack, Russia will not move until after the bombardment has begun.
The moment a chinese plane crosses the Russo-sino frontier it will be picked up by S400 or S300 systems.

One has to look at European Russians perceptions of the Far East and Eastern Siberia. Most of them have never been there, never will go and know little about it. It is like a foreign country it is so far away. People transferred there in the military hate it as it is underfunded and a cesspool of crime, abuse and poor discipline. Many people couldn't care less if Russia sold it to the Chinese, they think they are going to colonise it anyway. Russians are pretty patriotic so there is no way they would let it go without some kind of indemnity from China. A humiliating defeat in the Far East with a few million Chinese soldiers occupying it would dissuade most people from trying. The population base of Russia is just too low to compete.
You underestimate the patriotism war can inspire in people, the Chinese might hope for a "Sudetenland" and end up with a "Danzig".
 
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Indiadaily.com - India secretly counters Chinese successful Anti Ballistsic Missile test


India secretly counters Chinese successful Anti Ballistsic Missile test


Indian defense research organizations are smiling with ease as Pravda announces that Americans are now scared of recent Chinese ABM test. Pakistan wants Chinese missile defense by 2012. But Islamabad does not know what waits its fate.

According to Pravda, China performed a successful launch of an ABM interceptor missile. The test became an important link in the creation of the nation’s missile defense system, news agencies reported January 11. Pravda further says, it was a Chinese act to scare the Americans and the Government of Taiwan.

Interestingly, according to souurces close to Indian military defense reserach institute (it is no longer DRDO at Pune, the secret advanced organization is fully classified), India is ahead of Chinese missile technologies in stealth, target precision management, and algorithmic evasion.

The recent ABM test in China was closely followed by Indian top military space scientists. It actually exposed China's weakness and vulnerability. It also brought smiles among the Indian scientists and engineers because if this is what Chinese could perform to scare the Americans, then China has really to worry about Indian capabilities. India has two sets of program. One is open and the other is secret. The open specs are far behind the real specs. The open program boasts Prithvi Air Defense anti-ballistic missile interceptor. Last year, India showed the world how Prithvi Air Defense anti-ballistic missile interceptor achieved all the mission objectives. The two-stage interceptor missile fitted with advanced systems hit the target enemy missile at 75 kilometers (47 miles) altitude. But India does not talk about its secret program that far exceeds Prthvi's capabilities.
 

Armand2REP

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There is no confirmation of the cancellation of the KH 101 however the report i pasted earlier says that the go ahead for both the KH101 and the KH555 was given in 1999 only.
The confirmation is, we haven't heard about it in nearly a decade which is as old as your source. On the other hand, we have video of a recent Kh-555 test. Russians aren't shy about announcing their operational capabilities when they get them.


You are partially correct the Russian army is downsizing however it is not going to become only a 395000 man force what they are doing however is modernizing part of the army and creating well armed modern rapid reaction brigades that will be on permanent alert these are the forces you speak of, the entire army shall still number around 1.1 million. The bulk of the rest of the forces shall be defensive units designed to hold key areas in case of conflict.
from the caucasian defence review 2008n :pDF of the entire article attached.
No PDF... whatever it is, you are looking at it wrong. The entire MILITARY will number 1.1 million. That includes, Navy, Air Force, Marines, Rocket/Space Forces, Ground Forces, MVD, VDV, GRU Spetsnaz. The whole thing...

in only one Base
They only have two bases, Tatishchevo is supposed to have 50 missiles... Teykovo with 15.

Maybe you are right maybe you're wrong. The Chinese have become more assertive these days on this one lets both wait and see.
Chinese determination to become a global power are well known and reaffirmed every week on this forum. When the pressure is on the CCP to use it, they will. They aren't spending $100 billion a year to play hopscotch.

Again read the PDF 1.1 mil is not a small number.
Again, no PDF there. Doesn't matter, 1.1 million is the TOTAL armed forces.

The Americans are also looking for an excuse to stem china's rise, a surprise assault on Russia may well just give them one.
The Americans are fueling China's rise. They hope they will have a big consumer market to sell to. They have no interest in destroying that prospect. Business in Russia is small potatoes compared to China.

Nevertheless India and Vietnam both have close mutual security relation with Russia the real depth of these is unknown; the Russians still have the "enterprise" favor to cash in.The CIS has significant Russian populations not to take notice.
Real question is, would India and Vietnam do anything to attack China? I doubt they would face getting nuked to save Russia. If they did attack it might make a difference, but not before PLA has the Far East in there possession.

Russian diaspora in the CIS number 10 million and can't expect them to do anything. Compared to a pop base of 1.3 billion, it means little.

That's what you think, i do not agree.
Clearly if you think Kh-101 is in operation when we haven't heard anything about it, you would not.

The moment a chinese plane crosses the Russo-sino frontier it will be picked up by S400 or S300 systems.
There are only 32 S-300/400 batteries in the entire country. Divided by six military districts and two in Kaliningrad, PLAAF will never see more than a half dozen. They can either hit them with the Kh-31 they copied from Russia, or just attrite them. With only a 60 degree engagment envelop, they can do it rather fast with a multiple vector attack. They will still have to deal with the VVS that they haven't destroyed, never said they wouldn't lose alot but you have to give to gain. PLA has never been concerned with casualties.

You underestimate the patriotism war can inspire in people, the Chinese might hope for a "Sudetenland" and end up with a "Danzig".
Or they could end up with another Russian Civil War. When the Muslims see the Chinese coming, you can bet there are going to be some revolts.
 

Jagdpanther

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I don't want to go off topic anymore than i have , i just want to know why the Muslims in Russia would view the Chinese invaders as their saviors??

"The Muslims in Rassia" also has nothing to do with the topic(China Tests Midcourse Missile Interception). Could the admin delete this post?

Let's focus on the "China Tests Midcourse Missile Interception" topic.
 

FKA3

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Indiadaily.com - India secretly counters Chinese successful Anti Ballistsic Missile test


India secretly counters Chinese successful Anti Ballistsic Missile test


Indian defense research organizations are smiling with ease as Pravda announces that Americans are now scared of recent Chinese ABM test. Pakistan wants Chinese missile defense by 2012. But Islamabad does not know what waits its fate.

According to Pravda, China performed a successful launch of an ABM interceptor missile. The test became an important link in the creation of the nation’s missile defense system, news agencies reported January 11. Pravda further says, it was a Chinese act to scare the Americans and the Government of Taiwan.

Interestingly, according to souurces close to Indian military defense reserach institute (it is no longer DRDO at Pune, the secret advanced organization is fully classified), India is ahead of Chinese missile technologies in stealth, target precision management, and algorithmic evasion.

The recent ABM test in China was closely followed by Indian top military space scientists. It actually exposed China's weakness and vulnerability. It also brought smiles among the Indian scientists and engineers because if this is what Chinese could perform to scare the Americans, then China has really to worry about Indian capabilities. India has two sets of program. One is open and the other is secret. The open specs are far behind the real specs. The open program boasts Prithvi Air Defense anti-ballistic missile interceptor. Last year, India showed the world how Prithvi Air Defense anti-ballistic missile interceptor achieved all the mission objectives. The two-stage interceptor missile fitted with advanced systems hit the target enemy missile at 75 kilometers (47 miles) altitude. But India does not talk about its secret program that far exceeds Prthvi's capabilities.
I am shocked by this news, seems the all mighty Indian "Secret" missile system is much much much better than the Chinese one, :india:
 

Quickgun Murugan

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Indiadaily.com - India secretly counters Chinese successful Anti Ballistsic Missile test


India secretly counters Chinese successful Anti Ballistsic Missile test


Indian defense research organizations are smiling with ease as Pravda announces that Americans are now scared of recent Chinese ABM test. Pakistan wants Chinese missile defense by 2012. But Islamabad does not know what waits its fate.

According to Pravda, China performed a successful launch of an ABM interceptor missile. The test became an important link in the creation of the nation’s missile defense system, news agencies reported January 11. Pravda further says, it was a Chinese act to scare the Americans and the Government of Taiwan.

Interestingly, according to souurces close to Indian military defense reserach institute (it is no longer DRDO at Pune, the secret advanced organization is fully classified), India is ahead of Chinese missile technologies in stealth, target precision management, and algorithmic evasion.

The recent ABM test in China was closely followed by Indian top military space scientists. It actually exposed China's weakness and vulnerability. It also brought smiles among the Indian scientists and engineers because if this is what Chinese could perform to scare the Americans, then China has really to worry about Indian capabilities. India has two sets of program. One is open and the other is secret. The open specs are far behind the real specs. The open program boasts Prithvi Air Defense anti-ballistic missile interceptor. Last year, India showed the world how Prithvi Air Defense anti-ballistic missile interceptor achieved all the mission objectives. The two-stage interceptor missile fitted with advanced systems hit the target enemy missile at 75 kilometers (47 miles) altitude. But India does not talk about its secret program that far exceeds Prthvi's capabilities.

Hmmm.. So finally DRDO has a secret side. :twizt:

So all these missile test failures are just to fool the enemies.
 

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