China mocks India's democratic system

[nimo_cn]

Mock is a word of strong sensation and cant accurately describe what is happening, but it makes good headline.

Just like Indians believe that India is taking the right course, Chinese feel the same about China.

whatever political freedoms the system grants the people, it's designed to make the system deliver, like food, houses, education, medical care, etc.

it's a good thing that people have the right to cast their votes, but that is not the end of story. what people really need are better life coming with food, houses, education, medical care, etc and political freedom doesnt necessarily bring that.

Sent from my HUAWEI P7-L07 using Tapatalk 2

 

[sgarg]

What is printed in the Chinese newspapers is either government propaganda or analysis of events. China is not yet used to opinion polls and democracy.

Democracy is not a unique Indian concept. India should be called originator of the concept in post-Vedic period (around 2000BC) but this system was adopted in ancient Greece and Rome.

Democracy allows a weak king to function properly as most of the power is exercised by a senate or a council.

China has very vertical lines of authority. The Chinese system either works very well or fails catastrophically.

China has traditionally preferred strong leaders.

The Chinese system CANNOT work in India and vice-versa.

 

[pmaitra]

@sgarg, I largely agree with your comment regarding Greece and Rome, and about a senate or council. I think there is a subtle difference between democracy and a republic. Both are very closely related, but not exactly the same thing. We can say that a republic is one, but not the only one, practical way of having a functional democracy. Democracy in the truest sense would be mob rule, or anarchy. Anarchy is not the same thing as chaos or lawlessness.

 

[sorcerer]

The whole dance about democracy in Chinese News media is in response to Modis visit in IOR.
Should not read much into it.

Indians who has adapted to democracy knows that our democracy can take in any poison ..try it...adapt to it or discard it or change it. A collective Psych is formed in the mindset of diaspora about choices made and knows how to avoid FUBAR.
Ofcourse it has its side effects

With the free world and people bringing in new ideas of freedom to the mainland..Average Chinese making more money..having access to "other side of info" ..lets see how long china can hold up its cadre system .

 

[sorcerer]

@sgarg. Democracy in the truest sense would be mob rule, or anarchy. Anarchy is not the same thing as chaos or lawlessness.

Sorry to barge in.
Its not mob rule..its the rule of majority idea.and Democracy is controlled chaos.
If there is chaos means the particpants of the democracy..including you and me are exercising our right of freedom to highlight our idea.

 

[Sameet Pattnaik]

What about Phillipine, why its not rich after 30 years of democracy?
What about Chili?
What about Argentina?
What about Mexico?
And what about India?

excuse me sir mexico , argentina and chile have more per capita income than your country !

 

[pmaitra]

Sorry to barge in.
Its not mob rule..its the rule of majority idea.and Democracy is controlled chaos.
If there is chaos means the particpants of the democracy..including you and me are exercising our right of freedom to highlight our idea.

Hey, no problem. You are welcome to interrupt.

1. The rule of majority is the decision of the senate or council, as stated by @sgarg, or as per definition, the legislature:

   Majority rule is a decision rule that selects alternatives which have a majority, that is, more than half the votes. It is the binary decision rule used most often in influential decision-making bodies, including the legislatures of democratic nations.

2. Democracy is rule of the people (this is what I meant by mob rule, not a scene where everyone is tossing pots and pans at each other. ).
3. Now, if we look at the definition of a republic, we see, it actually takes us to the legislature mentioned in point 1 above.

You see, these three terms are closely related, but there are subtle differences. One is a theory, and the other one is the practise.

 

[pmaitra]

excuse me sir mexico , argentina and chile have more per capita income than your country !

Argentina is at the verge of sovereign default.

 

[sgarg]

@sgarg, I largely agree with your comment regarding Greece and Rome, and about a senate or council. I think there is a subtle difference between democracy and a republic. Both are very closely related, but not exactly the same thing. We can say that a republic is one, but not the only one, practical way of having a functional democracy. Democracy in the truest sense would be mob rule, or anarchy. Anarchy is not the same thing as chaos or lawlessness.

There is a provision of voting in the selection of a king in Manusmiti. However the voting was restricted to "snatak" or graduates from Gurukuls.
Several city states existed at the time Ramayan story happened which practiced a form of government elected by voting.
The rule of law or not is dependent on people. If people are good, any system of governance can work. India has always emphasized on education.

 

[sgarg]

excuse me sir mexico , argentina and chile have more per capita income than your country !

The per capita income is rising in India in a steady manner. Steady but small rise is better for social stability.

 

[pmaitra]

There is a provision of voting in the selection of a king in Manusmiti. However the voting was restricted to "snatak" or graduates from Gurukuls.
Several city states existed at the time Ramayan story happened which practiced a form of government elected by voting.
The rule of law or not is dependent on people. If people are good, any system of governance can work. India has always emphasized on education.

Thanks for the information. I learnt something.

"I know no safe depositary of the ultimate powers of the society but the people themselves; and if we think them not enlightened enough to exercise their control with a wholesome discretion, the remedy is not to take it from them, but to inform their discretion by education. This is the true corrective of abuses of constitutional power." — Thomas Jefferson to William C. Jarvis, 1820.​

 

[pmaitra]

excuse me sir mexico , argentina and chile have more per capita income than your country !

The per capita income is rising in India in a steady manner. Steady but small rise is better for social stability.

A country with high per capita income but very higher sovereign debt means the country is very poor.

It is true that the per capita income of Argentina is higher than the per capita income of PRC. It is also true that Argentina is very (emphasis added) poor compared to PRC.

 

[Ray]

It is true that if China was not a dictatorship, then it would not have reached where it has.

A leashed dog is more ferocious than an unleashed dogs.

Leash-reactive behavior does not discriminate by breed or background. This behavior appears in dogs purebred and mixed who were acquired as puppies from breeders and adopted from rescues.

In spite of all the lunging, snarling, growling and barking, some of these dogs are actually quite friendly to other dogs when off-leash. Yet, when they are on-leash and on a walk, they become the canine equivalent of Mr. Hyde. This is why the behavior is more accurately referred to as leash-reactivity; the dog is reacting (or over-reacting) to something in the environment.
On-Leash Aggression, Leash Reactivity, Dog Aggression

 

[Mad Indian]

No, you have not answered my fifth point. You just erected another strawman. Instead of North Korea, your brought in WB.

WB and PRC have more differences than similarities. WB has suffered because the government had to rely on votes to continue to get elected, and thus could not take action against militant trade unionism, out of fear of losing votes. When the government finally took an unpopular step (TATA Nano), it lost the elections. This is a wonderful quality of democracy. Blame democracy, not communism.

Now, try to answer my question.

You can talk whatever nonsense you want. I answered his point in the first sentence on mine - nothing could have stopped China from becoming another NoKo. My rest of the post is on the notion that democracy is better than dictatorship. But you would continue to argue on nonsense, so I will leave you to it

 

[Mad Indian]

There is a provision of voting in the selection of a king in Manusmiti. However the voting was restricted to "snatak" or graduates from Gurukuls.
Several city states existed at the time Ramayan story happened which practiced a form of government elected by voting.
The rule of law or not is dependent on people. If people are good, any system of governance can work. India has always emphasized on education.

Maybe, but people are not angels.

 

[Mad Indian]

Of course it is a strawman.

Related to the discussion? Yes.
Related to the position held by @no smoking? No.

Actually, the reason I posted that point is because the discussion was about Democracy vs Dictatorship - not "just" the effect of dictatorship on economy. The NoKo example was just an example on how the dictatorship could have gone as easily as their current success. There is no correlation to Democracy=bad for growth and Dictatorship = good for business. Reason is, Democracy =/= Bad economic growth, just as Dictatorship =/= Good economic growth

And Stop being a hypocrite to complain about democracy when living in USA/India

So, you have no answer as to why democratic countries such as Chile, Argentina, Mexico, and India, are not even remotely as developed as PRC. It is evident you have no answer, nor will you have anytime in the foreseeable future.

You dont understand how debt works. You "think" those countries are underdeveloped than China. Best combination ever.

BTW Why dont you try and explain why PRC is not as remotely developed as Singapore, So Ko, USA, Japan etc?

Reason is, Democracy =/= Bad economic growth, just as Dictatorship =/= Good economic growth. Economic growth is related to economic policies and not form of government. Sure the the of govt can sometimes help, but it is mroe related to type of economic policies than with the type of government

But socialist dumb bots have managed to make laws that "take from Peter and give to Paul" in America. If people are not enlightened enough, which plebs can never be expected to be, it results in policies and laws that are disastrous in the long term. Any nation (not city state), will almost always have a large supply of plebs.

Still their decision to make, not that of the bureaucrats or you. The key thing being "who" is making the decision.

It is not funny. It makes complete sense. Rather have fewer children with quality upbringing than breed like maggots. Lenin was right - what will you do with the right to breed like vermin if you cannot feed them? I say three cheers to the Communist Party of China. (No, I am not confusing USSR with PRC. Just letting you know before you go off with yet another obtuse narrative.)

Thats people's decision to make and not yours.

"No amount of political freedom will satisfy the hungry masses." — Vladimir Lenin.​

Again, its people's decision to make, not yours

And, I repeat:

"No amount of political freedom will satisfy the hungry masses." — Vladimir Lenin.​

Again, its people's decision to make, not yours on which is better - hunger or freedom. People of India could have chose Shit anytime they wanted in the election over freedom, .ie they could have voted in Communist party into power. But they dint., because they know it was shit

 

[Mad Indian]

Mock is a word of strong sensation and cant accurately describe what is happening, but it makes good headline.

Just like Indians believe that India is taking the right course, Chinese feel the same about China.

whatever political freedoms the system grants the people, it's designed to make the system deliver, like food, houses, education, medical care, etc.

it's a good thing that people have the right to cast their votes, but that is not the end of story. what people really need are better life coming with food, houses, education, medical care, etc and political freedom doesnt necessarily bring that.

Sent from my HUAWEI P7-L07 using Tapatalk 2

Really, so how do you feel about the Great Leap forward? Was it good? Was it the right course?

Interesting what Propaganda can do to people's brains.

PS : I am guessing you are not allowed to criticize your govt's even the most "obvious" past mistakes on the internet?

 

[Mad Indian]

The whole dance about democracy in Chinese News media is in response to Modis visit in IOR.
Should not read much into it.

Indians who has adapted to democracy knows that our democracy can take in any poison ..try it...adapt to it or discard it or change it. A collective Psych is formed in the mindset of diaspora about choices made and knows how to avoid FUBAR.
Ofcourse it has its side effects

With the free world and people bringing in new ideas of freedom to the mainland..Average Chinese making more money..having access to "other side of info" ..lets see how long china can hold up its cadre system .

The best part of this episode is how the CCP is panicking when India is only half developed as China. I just cant imagine the panic they will throw when there is no difference in living standards between India and China which is how it will be in a decade or two. I cant wait to see how they try to justify keeping their masses brainwashed into dictatorship

 

[sorcerer]

The best part of this episode is how the CCP is panicking when India is only half developed as China. I just cant imagine the panic they will throw when there is no difference in living standards between India and China which is how it will be in a decade or two. I cant wait to see how they try to justify keeping their masses brainwashed into dictatorship

Absolutely my thoughts..
As I always say...if the chinese is soo..confident about their technology...then this reaction is too much.

 

[shekhar]

Bandar kya jaane adrak ka swaad!

Well..they are not 100% incorrect...china's sys is still far better than ours...in tamilnadu pepoles voted for free jucier grinder....UP & BIHAR votes on caste bases...most indisipline people