Discussion in 'Military History' started by Adux, Sep 15, 2011.
The Centre for Land Warfare Studies (CLAWS)
No Wonder after this, the Chinese went completely quiet. They dont have the balls, which is why they need their terrorist dog Pakistan. If we didnt have Nehru and V K Krishna Menon, both closest commie's and pacifist. Today either Tibet would have been Indian or a protectorate of India.
Good read! Thanks, I wasn't sure what exactly had happened. Any idea what the Chinese say happened (if anything at all)?
good to know we did a comeback...but that that doesn't mean China is not capable to attack India directly.. it has got a better and low risk option through Pakistan.
jelep la was given away in cowardly act.
but good nathu la remained in Indian possession.
Here are some pics:
Compare to 1962 pic:
Shows how isolated and ill-equipped they were
Compare this to the Indian peak still held by Pakistan 10yrs after Kargil.
Compare 1971 to the IPKF disaster.
You think that Indira did something horrible to the Indian Army?
Free yes, Indian protectorate, well debatable.
China isn't scared of India in the least. All they remember is 1962 and look at the poor infrastructure on the Indian side. They don't even know what Nathu La is so you can't quit with the chest thumping.
Most Chinese don't know what they're not allowed to know Armand. Nathu La is the pass that is in the northern part of my home state Sikkim. It is one of the renowned battle zones between us and the Chinese. The pass is one of the most difficult battlefields on earth and not many forces around the world can survive it. Most previous generation people in my city know the incident off by heart.
Chinese aren't scared of us; but losses to them means they're not willing to fight for something that would incur them terrible losses. That is what happened in this location. Though there were no wars and only numerous small skirmishes, we refused to back down. The Reds have this characteristic that you might not know (from an enemy perspective); they usually shut up only after getting thrashed back. 62 was a wake-up call for us after what that @$$h_le Nehru had done. While these news would be considered "small and insignificant" in China to avoid embarrassment to the ruling party, you must also know that the war in 1962 wasn't even a third the size of the war in 1971 against Pakistan. I'd say Pakistan has more courage to actually hold a fight against us than the cowardly Reds.
If you are seriously thinking that the PLA "gave us back" our territory as a sign of "goodwill and peace", I am sure you've been reading too many CCP or Cold War-era NATO publications. I say this not just because of being an Indian, but because of the region where I stay. The PLA came marching inside our territory in style; But that is where they came across the same mess they saw much later in Vietnam; dense thickets, harsh cold, thin air and light humidity abruptly in the impenetrable forests of northeastern region. That became their Achilles' heel.
PLA supply lines were collapsing so badly that they could sustain their hold no more. If they had tried to stay back, their then-recently won "revolutionary war" would have collapsed as people in Tibet and Xingjiang weren't pleased of Red occupation then and all their newly won rule would have bitten the dust. Another factor that the world doesn't know about this conflict is that the locals in the interiors of NEFA(then named territory of entire northeast) were not pleased to see Chinese. While rest of India might have a hot and cold attitude towards China, we in the northeastern India don't like Chinese at all. Call it knowledgeable hatred but it is kind of ingrained. What the world doesn't know is the deaths of many soldiers being killed or maimed badly by locals including people of my state (then a kingdom protectorate).
The reason 1962 was a disaster was because of indecision by that schmuck Nehru and his committee of stupid ministers who had suicidally refused to buy and stockpile new weapons. We were virtually using WW2 arsenal to fight a USSR-armed fully automated PLA. The entire war was fought in 7 sectors out of which 4 the Chinese won and 3 we won. So how close it is to the "OH THE MAJOR EMBARRASSMENT" nonsense, you measure it yourself.
As for your ignorance on the incidents, I don't blame you since you're not of our region and obviously might not be familiar with things here, just as we aren't familiar with every tom,dick and harry conflict Europe has or had.
It is renowned in India, it isn't even a footnote in China. If you think China cares about loses look at history, half a million just to save a tin-pot dictator whose country is a thorn in their side. Several tens of thousands to gain nothing. China hasn't shut up about it, they talk about beating your ass in 62 until the cows come home. They feel superior and there is no chest thumping and denial from the Indian side that changes the reality of what they feel. It isn't a debate about how significant it is to India or world history... the Chinese have forgotten it and they certainly aeren't scared of what they characterise as their poor little backwards neighbour to the South that they stomped in 62'.
Did you even read what Tshering just said ?
Obviously the chinese govt wont mention it....they'd be massive idiots if they started publicizing there failures. Its not like they have a free media. Even the word jasmine is censored ffs.
I love it when the frogs talk about chest thumping and victories. PLA is not the same as Chinese civilian! You are a complete idiot if you think otherwise, Those who knows, knows quite well, India has their terrritory as well as their number one enemy , and houses a government in exile which calls for the dis-integration of China, yet those awesome 'chicoms', dont diddly sqwat, ever wondered why? Welcome to Indian Armed Forces, unlike you - we usually win stuff.
So they are delusional, all the better for us.
In addition to the others here who have responded, let me tell you - I was not even aware of Nathu La skirmish till I started visiting defence forums on the internet (around 2009-2010). Most people in India aren't even aware of this, even those who know the 62' defeat very well.
It is hardly "renowned" in India. And if the Chinese feel superior due to the 62' victory - well, as long as that doesn't lead them into anything foolhardy, it hardly matters. And if it does - all the better for us if they enter the war in a delusional state.
That's fine, we have the battle record, you do not.
You are a complete idiot if you think otherwise. They are brainwashed from cradle to grave with false history. It doesn't matter if they are a civilian or in the PLA, they read the same crap.
You are talking about a people whose vast majority doesn't even know what happened at Tienanmen Square much less care what is going on with the DL and LoC. They don't think outside of their town much less province or international affairs. They only care about what affects them today. The only Chinese that know about Nathu La are the ones that read it here and they won't believe it anyway.
Welcome to ignorance of your neighbour's perceptions... ignorance always loses.
Now I'm convinced u work for Fool-Ya Bureau to pass out impressions that Chinese live in delusion or ignorance about southern neighbors
What record? Indo-China?
You think we dont know that. The PLA leadership is quite aware, there is a reason they havent attacked even after we have been extremely provocative, they have gone to wars for lesser reasons. We dont care whether they know it or not. We do.
Again, we are aware of that, what is your point?
The decision makers know, that matters to us. Nobody has ever claimed, the Chicoms trolls knows anyways. Who is ignornant over here, just 2 people, 1. You, who is not aware that we dont give a damn. 2. Chicoms, who dont know what we can do to them, and have in the past.
1.Guys, you know where we're going to fight the Chinese?
In the mountains, We had our fingers burned in the last war in the mountains because we had no artillery.
2.Take a look at the infrastructure on the Chinese side and compare with our own.
3.Something horrible happened to the Indian Army in the 1970s, it's not the professional force it once was in the 1970s, even our own senior officers rate our infantry 3 out of 10.
Just keep this in mind before we go chest thumping.
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