BSF shot dead teenagers trying to exfilterate to Pakistan

[smartindian]

"Leave that on India's security forces to decide. Whom we shoot and whom we spare is our concern."

the policy of whom to shoot/ rules of engagement is precisely not what you said above . it was and now being changed -- shoot everything that moves regardless if its even a mother with new born in her hands. SHOOT TO KILL ALL!

then look at a at close up of her here on PAGE 2

http://www.odhikar.org/FF/ff2011/BSF2011/English/FF_report_Felani_Kurigram_Eng.pdf

i can only say sorry for her death, may her soul R.I.P, but for the sake of INDIA , million like her can be killed , to me National interest is supreme. bsf did'nt went went inside BD to kill her , she entered INDIA illegally , and BSF did what it as to do , prevent any illegal persons from entering our country .

one more question , how do you know that she was just a innocent girl, she could had been a messenger to a terrorist organisation, or came to supply drugs , or counterfeit.

 

[JayATL]

i can only say sorry for her death, may her soul R.I.P, but for the sake of INDIA , million like her can be killed , to me National interest is supreme. bsf did'nt went went inside BD to kill her , she entered INDIA illegally , and BSF did what it as to do , prevent any illegal persons from entering our country .

one more question , how do you know that she was just a innocent girl, she could had been a messenger to a terrorist organisation, or came to supply drugs , or counterfeit.

because the autopsy was done by India. one would imagine that all the " fake money, special message that can't be delivered with a simple phone call, would be in the report?

 

[amitkriit]

because the autopsy was done by India. one would imagine that all the " fake money, special message that can't be delivered with simple phone call, would be in the report?

BSF doesn't have the luxury of "fool-proof" intelligence, our men on border have to take decisions based on a set of assumptions and past experiences. BSF's experience says that when our men were trapped in bad situation they were tortured to death, and no mercy was shown to them.

 

[smartindian]

because the autopsy was done by India. one would imagine that all the " fake money, special message that can't be delivered with a simple phone call, would be in the report?

and simple phone call can be tracked and traced surveillance. it one of incident , and is irrelevant for this thread , this is thread please concentrate on two BD boy who illegally entering pakistan for terrorist training

 

[DeletedUser]

I'm surprised at fellow Indians talking like this. Where's your sense of right and wrong guys, what about humanity? Tell me what would your stance be if a more powerful country was killing Indians who may or may not have been terrorists, smugglers etc. were crossing over to said more powerful country and they were being killed by them?

Think about that and don't give me this "my country's national security is the most important thing" kind of BS because there are much better ways tho deal with this situation.

Shoot on sight policy is wrong and undignified, both for the BSF and the Bangladeshis.

 

[amitkriit]

I'm surprised at fellow Indians talking like this. Where's your sense of right and wrong guys, what about humanity? Tell me what would your stance be if a more powerful country was killing Indians who may or may not have been terrorists, smugglers etc. were crossing over to said more powerful country and they were being killed by them?

Think about that and don't give me this "my country's national security is the most important thing" kind of BS because there are much better ways tho deal with this situation.

Shoot on sight policy is wrong and undignified, both for the BSF and the Bangladeshis.

In that case India and Indians must do everything to protect the lives of Indian citizens. Europeans are rich and we are conversing in English because these ethical questions did not come into their mind when they were killing/enslaving/exploiting people in Asia and Africa. Same thing will happen to them if they lower their guards. These seemingly harmless Bangladeshi people might become the reason of another partition of India if their inflow is not kept in check. Shoot at sight policy is a desperate measure and its correct if our neighbor is not ready to do anything to solve our problem, and if there is no effective solution in sight.

 

[smartindian]

I'm surprised at fellow Indians talking like this. Where's your sense of right and wrong guys, what about humanity? Tell me what would your stance be if a more powerful country was killing Indians who may or may not have been terrorists, smugglers etc. were crossing over to said more powerful country and they were being killed by them?

Think about that and don't give me this "my country's national security is the most important thing" kind of BS because there are much better ways tho deal with this situation.

Shoot on sight policy is wrong and undignified, both for the BSF and the Bangladeshis.

deleted user , when it comes to nation and its policy there will be no place for humanity. see you are forgetting a major point that bsf is implementing it in inside india , not in bangladesh. we have warned them number of time . we have taken this issue with bd rangers . but when there is no positive responds from bd side BSF implemented shoot at sight policy .

what army will do if a pakistani enters India. same way bsf have done it duty .

 

[JayATL]

I'm surprised at fellow Indians talking like this. Where's your sense of right and wrong guys, what about humanity? Tell me what would your stance be if a more powerful country was killing Indians who may or may not have been terrorists, smugglers etc. were crossing over to said more powerful country and they were being killed by them?

Think about that and don't give me this "my country's national security is the most important thing" kind of BS because there are much better ways tho deal with this situation.

Shoot on sight policy is wrong and undignified, both for the BSF and the Bangladeshis.

first , I'm glad that the indian politico is smarter than the " kill baby kill" folks here. second, as I've always said many of these internet warriors sound awfully close to BUSH and his cowboy neo-cons and their policy think. Really, these are same guys ironically who curse bush but have the same mind set like him. shoot first ask questions later

WHAT IS FUNNY though, is they( these kill baby kill everyone posse ) has not yet picked up on the fact that the indian govt agrees with our thinking and is making changes to the rules of engagement on the bangla border.

Trivia Time !
which Other country had the same policy? East Germany.

which developed country in the world does this - NONE.

what does even a rogue country like N Korea do? they arrest...

 

[smartindian]

first , I'm glad that the indian politico is smarter than the " kill baby kill" folks here. second, as I've always said many of these internet warriors sound awfully close to BUSH and his cowboy neo-cons and their policy think. Really, these are same guys ironically who curse bush but have the same mind set like him. shoot first ask questions later

WHAT IS FUNNY though, is they( these kill baby kill everyone posse ) has not yet picked up on the fact that the indian govt agrees with our thinking and is making changes to the rule of engagement.

No for your kind information , we liked MR. bush , and we like him today also, he was/will be the most popular us president in India , he will remain so

 

[maomao]

I'm surprised at fellow Indians talking like this. Where's your sense of right and wrong guys, what about humanity? Tell me what would your stance be if a more powerful country was killing Indians who may or may not have been terrorists, smugglers etc. were crossing over to said more powerful country and they were being killed by them?

Think about that and don't give me this "my country's national security is the most important thing" kind of BS because there are much better ways tho deal with this situation.

Shoot on sight policy is wrong and undignified, both for the BSF and the Bangladeshis.

Plzzzzzzzzzzzzz Quit this BS.....This is a Defense Forum and not a "World Peace Forum" for peace-nicks!!

However, BSF has to shoot anyone who tries to cross over, it does not matter who that fool is....be it a Vice President of a Sham Company earning Crores

 

[civfanatic]

Good job BSF, keep it up. This should be placed in every newspaper in India, and broadcast by the media, to show all Pak/Bangla/terrorist immigrants in India the dangers of illegal border crossing.

As for the dead Bangla girl, did you hear what she tried to do? She tried to use a ladder to climb across a barbed wire fence, while there were armed guards nearby.

I mean, how stupid can you get?

 

[maomao]

first , I'm glad that the indian politico is smarter than the " kill baby kill" folks here. second, as I've always said many of these internet warriors sound awfully close to BUSH and his cowboy neo-cons and their policy think. Really, these are same guys ironically who curse bush but have the same mind set like him. shoot first ask questions later

WHAT IS FUNNY though, is they( these kill baby kill everyone posse ) has not yet picked up on the fact that the indian govt agrees with our thinking and is making changes to the rules of engagement on the bangla border.

Trivia Time !
which Other country had the same policy? East Germany.

which developed country in the world does this - NONE.

what does even a rogue country like N Korea do? they arrest...

Its strange and astonishing to find Hypocrisy at its heights with Hypocrites ranting without looking inside.

I found you rejoicing and drooling head over heals, praising your dear American friend (Blackwater agent - David), who shot two teenage pakistanis, inside pakistan, in broad-daylight, with illegal weapons, other American did not feel like pulling the trigger so he just mowed down another teen.......this incident was perfectly alright for an esteemed intellectual like you.

However, if BSF shoots illegal aliens entering India,the whole incident is to be condemned according to your rants, and Indians who support this BSF move are Bullshited and ridiculed upon by a person who does not display a dime of consistency in his posts!

Read your own comments and decide who is - "kill baby kill everyone posse"

good shooting David. clearly they were attempting to rob you, the embassy car also had bullet holes in them. I'd advise all the same to get out of Pakistan. Let Pakistan protest and burn itself and damage more of its economy- as I know the protest will get violent at some point.

http://defenceforumindia.com/showthread.php?t=18620&p=229357&viewfull=1#post229357

Preliminarily investigation suggested that as the motorcyclists wanted to mug the foreigner, he killed them in self-defence, the SP said,

good shooting David...

http://defenceforumindia.com/showthread.php?t=18630&p=229052#post229052


I think you require lods of Trivia Time or at-least some sanity to be placed into your thick head!

 

[gogbot]

Second half of your post. re: Bangladesh. you do you have a deportation policy in place. regardless, India killing all people in that border, where illegal immigration of the poor seems to be the majority vs India/pak border, because of a lack of deportation facilities or perceived lack of deportation/immigration policy, will not fly in a civil community, and is apparently being changed now.

This is like when people said why waste our money on a judicatory process and afford rights to the sole gunmen from 26/11 . why , because you are a civil democracy and even the most vile have rights to a judicial process. beside, the longer he lives the more the world is reminded of him/ pak -which benefits India.

like i said
This border conditions are an unfortunate reality , due to the current political conditions.

You should not forget that only recently when the Awami league came to power in Bangladesh. Did political ties with India improve , prior to this we have had a Bangladesh government turned a blind eye and actively condoned terrorist actives , Smuggling and all sorts of nasty business with respect to India.
Groups like the ALF based in Bangladesh conducted operation across the border in India , this was on top of criminal smuggling , counterfeiting and human trafficking.

Given the success of our policies with our border with Pakistan , it was most likely decided to apply the same such policy with the India Bangladesh border.
Fencing the border was just the first part.

but then AL came to power and the situation has changed somewhat , but BSF , BDR relations are still low. And the AL power base is uncertain.
If AL was to loose power , the situation would revert back to normal.

For that reason try to understand , the complex political conditions are what is dictating the border shooting.
Even now political pressure to minimize bloodshed is only due to improving India BD relations.

This is not a simple matter of holding up ideals.

 

[JayATL]

I found you rejoicing and drooling head over heals, praising your dear American friend (Blackwater agent - David), who shot two teenage pakistanis, inside pakistan, in broad-daylight, with illegal weapons, other American did not feel like pulling the trigger so he just mowed down another teen.......this incident was perfectly alright for an esteemed intellectual like you.

If shot at you shoot back in self defense, you don't wear mickey mouse ears and squeal like one . how do you know he was a black water guy and what difference does that make. and would you advice any American not have a weapon in lawless pakistan? the case has not even been investigated and you are pushing all the Pakistani meme here. wow- you become a Pakistani fanboy now? the only part of an official statement from the police says , he was being shot at and the embassy cars had bullet holes . If it was indian who shot back I would have had teh same reaction. If it was British same again...

where is the obfuscation on that vs illegal immigration? --- how does that one analogy play into this one. Oh, I get it, your doing your famous apples to oranges analogies ! carry one...

 

[JayATL]

like i said
This border conditions are an unfortunate reality , due to the current political conditions.

You should not forget that only recently when the Awami league came to power in Bangladesh. Did political ties with India improve , prior to this we have had a Bangladesh government turned a blind eye and actively condoned terrorist actives , Smuggling and all sorts of nasty business with respect to India.
Groups like the ALF based in Bangladesh conducted operation across the border in India , this was on top of criminal smuggling , counterfeiting and human trafficking.

Given the success of our policies with our border with Pakistan , it was most likely decided to apply the same such policy with the India Bangladesh border.
Fencing the border was just the first part.

but then AL came to power and the situation has changed somewhat , but BSF , BDR relations are still low. And the AL power base is uncertain.
If AL was to loose power , the situation would revert back to normal.

For that reason try to understand , the complex political conditions are what is dictating the border shooting.
Even now political pressure to minimize bloodshed is only due to improving India BD relations.

This is not a simple matter of holding up ideals.

I hear you, and I see the sensitivities in there. But here is an another political reality- these incidents don't help the Awami league change attitudes in BD towards India and stay in power. if you like the awami party, then all the more you have to take precautions - As it has been now acknowledged by India's politico . I feel we ( you and I) are not far off from eachother. Shooting someone who is a threat yes, shooting obvious poor folks crossing over in hopes of better life= no good. arrest , detain, deport.


Check this video. even with all that comes across-- the great evil US won't shoot to kill ALL on sight. period. keep in mind that's different than shooting when threatened / identified weapons( even then they try to get that person to give it up).

 

[DeletedUser]

Plzzzzzzzzzzzzz Quit this BS.....This is a Defense Forum and not a "World Peace Forum" for peace-nicks!!

However, BSF has to shoot anyone who tries to cross over, it does not matter who that fool is....be it a Vice President of a Sham Company earning Crores

Yeah, this is a defence forum. What's your point?

 

[maomao]

If shot at you shot back in self defense, you don't wear mickey mouse ears and squeal like one .

where is the obfuscation on that ? --- how does that one analogy play into this one. Oh, I get it, your doing your famous apples to oranges analogies ! carry one...

I know it will be hard for a sham Vice President of an MNC, who earns more than 6 Crores (according to him) to understand and measure his own words.

However, your peaceful Americans shot 2 pakistani civilian teens, americans were carrying illegal arms inside pakistan, inside pakistani border, killed teens in broad-daylight, other american mowed a bystander. Further, your friend Mr. David was caught in 2009 near a cantonment area carrying automatic weapons etc etc.

If all this is praise worthy according to you, then how-come shooting of illegal aliens who are a blot and a burden on our safety, economy and sovereignty is a condemnable act?

I certainly believe that growing mickey mouse ears is zillion times better than being a Hypocrite and a bad lier!

 

[RAM]

If shot at you shot back in self defense, you don't wear mickey mouse ears and squeal like one .

where is the obfuscation on that ? --- how does that one analogy play into this one. Oh, I get it, your doing your famous apples to oranges analogies ! carry one...

We Have enough Anti India Elements traversing International Borders to INDIA by any crook methods,And I believe if its an Unauthorised entry,theres no harm in using Firearms to incapacitate these elements.WE dont need anymore AJMAL kasabs entries to reinforce this policy.If we go by the redtape methods to stop these elements,the BSF would be helpless in doing so.The illegal tresspassing was so high that the National policy of fencing got intiated in late 1990s west and east borders.

These people are deliberately doing so to achive their objectives.The Guarding force in the border has every right to exercis their availabe options to restrain them.I hv read 3 months ago - a pakistan teenager was also been apprehended by BSF And sent back to PAK authorities after verifying the identity and his plans.Howvere it may not happen or expected to happen evry time as ,differentiating these elemnt's objectives is not Guarding force's primary motto.

 

[JayATL]

I know it will be hard for a sham Vice President of an MNC, who earns more than 6 Crores (according to him) to understand and measure his own words.

However, your peaceful Americans shot 2 pakistani civilian teens, americans were carrying illegal arms inside pakistan, inside pakistani border, killed teens in broad-daylight, other american mowed a bystander. Further, your friend Mr. David was caught in 2009 near a cantonment area carrying automatic weapons etc etc.

If all this is praise worthy according to you, then how-come shooting of illegal aliens who are a blot and a burden on our safety, economy and sovereignty is a condemnable act?

I certainly believe that growing mickey mouse ears is zillion times better than being a Hypocrite and a bad lier!

wow- you become a Pakistani fanboy now? just choosing to lie about it, using that the same reaction and excuse from the Pakistanis on their forums.

did you even read the article you took my quote from??? the only part of an official statement from the police says , he was being shot at and the embassy cars had bullet holes . If it was indian who shot back I would have had the same reaction. If it was British same again... how do you know he was a black water guy and what difference does that make. and would you advice any American not have a weapon in lawless Pakistan?

Paki fan boy in mickey mouse drab! lol

you now earned a / ignore for obvious trolling here. you blatantly lied about that facts on the ground.


LATEST TIT BIT of one of the guys who was shot...

police claimed to have traced criminal record of one of the two youths killed by Davis. SP Umar Virk said that two cellphones recovered from Faizan Haider's pocket had been snatched in a street crime.

An armed robbery case registered against him with Faisal Town police and another with Gulshan-i-Ravi police had also been traced, he said, adding in the police record Faizan was also known as Umer alias Sanni.

http://www.dawn.com/2011/01/29/us-official-expected-to-appear-in-court-over-lahore-shooting.html

 

[maomao]

wow- you become a Pakistani fanboy now? just choosing to lie about it, that the same reaction and excuse from the Pakistanis on their forums.

did you even read the article you took my quote from??? the only part of an official statement from the police says , he was being shot at and the embassy cars had bullet holes . If it was indian who shot back I would have had the same reaction. If it was British same again... how do you know he was a black water guy and what difference does that make. and would you advice any American not have a weapon in lawless Pakistan?

Paki fan boy in mickey mouse drab! lol

you now earned a / ignore for obvious trolling here. you blatantly lied about that facts on the ground.

I only showed you the mirror, and when you looked, you saw the reality, and lost your cool.

I have been here longer than the time you have spent trolling, and I think everyone knows who is a fan boy and who is a hypocrite! I clearly proved that you supported illigal American operations in pakistan involving killing of civilians, however, according to an esteemed intellectual like yourself (pun-intended) BSF killing illegal aliens who are a danger to this nation is a condemnable act!! And this makes me a pakistani fan-boy......Beat that!

Read my last few posts, I have clearly proved you being a troll and a big time Hypocrite without any consistency!

I know its hard for a VP of a shame MNC in US, who spends 8-9 hours trolling on net to accept the fact, that he has been caught pants down!!

However, you can rant as much as you wish, but it only proves that you are a wannabe american Hypocrite (of Indian origin), who lacks basic sanity!

By arguing with double standards, you only display frustration and anguish online, trust me you are only hurting yourself, and no one feels sorry for you!