Armored Personnel Carriers & Infantry Fighting Vehicles

Discussion in 'Land Forces' started by plugwater, Jun 26, 2010.

  1. plugwater

    plugwater Elite Member Elite Member

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    Since there are lot of talks about APC and IFV these days I'd like to ask some questions regarding this.

    What is the difference between Armored Personal Carrier(APC) and Infantry Fighting Vehicle(IFV) ?
    In my understand thanks to singhji and Kinal sir that the primary role of APC is carrying troops and IFV is fighting alongside with troops. Am I right, and what other differences are there?

    We have been using BMP-2 for many years but i think now is the time to replace those APCs
    So the possible future replacements are
    Abhay IFV by DRDO
    Polish/Indo IFV
    also heard Army is interested in stryker IFV.
    Which one should we go for and which is the best suited IFV for Indian Army?
     
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2010
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  3. Kunal Biswas

    Kunal Biswas Member of the Year 2011 Moderator

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    @manc,
    Its nice to see u made a dedicated thread for APC/IFV..

    1> A normal APC can be easily converted to IFV by just adding weapon stations for example Russian MT-LB!

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    Therefore just adding of weapon station on a normal armored vehicle can be classified as IFV..


    2> Abhay APC/IFV is the best chose for IA to replace BMP-2!

    3> IA is interested in Striker MGS not normal striker APC/IFV..

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    IA is interested in Stryker MGS coz of its requirement of 200+ wheelbase Gun system..
     
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  4. Agantrope

    Agantrope Senior Member Senior Member

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    Stryker is Wheeled one so it will be very handy than a tracked one for deployment in the NE Region
     
  5. Kunal Biswas

    Kunal Biswas Member of the Year 2011 Moderator

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    Comparison between Abhay APC/IFV and BMP-2..

    [​IMG]

    BMP-2
    1 x 30mm cannon
    1 x 30 AGL
    1 X 7.62x51mm MG
    1 X ATGM

    Its very inconvenient to travel inside a bmp coz passenger compartment is small where 8 guys somehow stuffed inside..
    It cannot take 50cal rounds from side..
    It can be destroyed by 80mm to 120mm motar round from above..

    [​IMG]
    The doors are fuel reserves, in case of 50cal impact it will burst into flames and killing the crew also the passenger inside..


    [​IMG]
    Abhay APC/IFV

    1 x 40mm cannon
    1 x 7.62x51mm MG
    2 X ATGM

    Recent test are good indication that it can survive 50cal from all sides..
    Passenger compartment is better than BMP-2

    More info will be available on further research..


    Presently as per my view Abhay is better than BMP-2..
     
  6. Kunal Biswas

    Kunal Biswas Member of the Year 2011 Moderator

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    Correct also the maintenance cost is less compare to tracked once..
    Stryker MGS can be used in J&K with GR8 success..
     
  7. plugwater

    plugwater Elite Member Elite Member

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    USA already have plans to replace Stryker with BCT Ground Combat Vehicle Program. So imo we should go for our indigenous program.

    Army is interested in stryker IFV. It is looking to increase its amphibious capability by buying stryker IFV. Here is the link there is no mention of MGS

    http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...d-personnel-carriers-/articleshow/5216524.cms
     
  8. Agantrope

    Agantrope Senior Member Senior Member

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    We dont have the technology base to go for indigenous
     
  9. Singh

    Singh Phat Cat Administrator

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    @manc Stryker is not indigenous
    @agantrope why not ?
     
  10. plugwater

    plugwater Elite Member Elite Member

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    If we had thought like this in past we would not be having a tracked one too. So every project has to start at some point, i think its time to start our own indigenous wheeled carrier.
     
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2010
  11. Singh

    Singh Phat Cat Administrator

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    1. APC/IFV are not defined in terms of their firepower but by their role.

    APC is used to deploy combat troops to the battlefied, it can also be used for surveillance, patrolling, towing etc. It is not used to directly engage the enemy but can provide support if need be. Some APCs with a lot of firepower whilst some don't.

    Many armies use IFVs in conjuction with MBTs to protect MBTs or as an armor cover for infantry troops, allowing them to advance while they engage lightly armoured and aerial targets.

    2. That depends on the other choices as well.

    3. From what I read previously US showed off the Strykers but the Army hasn't expressed any sincere interest ? And the US troops aren't too happy with the Strykers
     
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  12. Kunal Biswas

    Kunal Biswas Member of the Year 2011 Moderator

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    @Mr Singh
    A armored vehicle for IFV role is selected by its firepower, but since 70s most APC are able to do the duel role..

    Correct, but as far as i know APCs like BMP-1/2 use in direct assault on dug in position infantry position, their are very few who don't have even a single MG!
    Almost all operational main APC in the world have 20mm-40mm for IFV role..

    Right, but let me correct this APC/IFV work with armored thrusts to provide anti-Infantry support also to provide long range AT capability ( In case of Russian )..

    Other may not provide the amount of firepower also the price per unit..

    Well its true but our need are different tahn US, We need lighter wheel based Gun system and styker provides it well..

    I am sure media made error while reporting, IA interested in 200+ wheel based gun system ( MGS )
     
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2010
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  13. Rahul Singh

    Rahul Singh Senior Member Senior Member

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    How can 8 infantry men be adjusted in those broke space? Hell, they will be exhausted even without reaching place of action. Army needs to think towards soldiers comfort. If they hate DRDO, then let it be, don't buy Abhay but for god shake please discontinue BMP-2s.
     
  14. Yatharth Singh

    Yatharth Singh Regular Member

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    This is not a BMW that its manufacturers or the will think for the comfort( I know here you mean the proper seating arrangements). By the way this is a design introduced in 1980, so taking the technology of that period into account, what better do you expect rather than what is shown here.
    At least it is a far good design compared to other APC/IFV of its time. It is the fault of the IA that they are still using BMP-2, no matter whether it is an upgraded Sarath or anything else `cause the basic design is the same. At least Sri Lanka also uses BMP-3 which is somehow better than BMP-2.
     
  15. Agantrope

    Agantrope Senior Member Senior Member

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    They are not going travel from Hyderabad to chennai in this; a short say 20-30mins in the battlefield for that comfort is not in high priority.Its duty is to protect the soldiers from the incoming fire.
     
  16. Kunal Biswas

    Kunal Biswas Member of the Year 2011 Moderator

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    Presently their is no info on the vehicle..
    though their was a detailed information on abhay back in 2009..

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

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    [​IMG]


    Btw, Kanchan is Indian Chobham armour and it is sandwich type, for more knowladge:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chobham_armour
     
  17. ppgj

    ppgj Senior Member Senior Member

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    Kunal Biswas likes this.
  18. the IA is interested in everythindg with a foreign label(previously russian and recently the us ones). i remember way back in 1995-96 when general roychoudhury was the coas he propsed a mgs based on arjun chassis.succesive military leaders have not even bothered to consider that proposal-and what is expected of them is now that they have 124 arjuns (and ordered 124 more),keeping with their long tradition the have opted for foreign junks like t90, and now stryker mgs.
     
  19. Agantrope

    Agantrope Senior Member Senior Member

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    Kunal Sir,
    Can you post more details on the DRDO and OFB (105mm Canon) Light tank with tracked option.
     
  20. Kunal Biswas

    Kunal Biswas Member of the Year 2011 Moderator

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    105 mm Light Tank by DRDO

    105 mm Light Tank
    [​IMG]
    DRDO has developed a light tank based on BMP-II chassis with 105 mm turret (GIAT industries, France). This
    vehicle is aimed to carry high caliber weapons without sacrificing the strategic or tactical mobility. Mechanical
    integration of turret with chassis, stability during firing, and compatibility of 105 mm Indian Armour Piercing Fin
    Stabilised Discarding Sabot (APFSDS) ammunition with turret have been established during the trials.

    Salient Features

    * Crew : 3 men for turret
    * main Gun : 105 mm semi-automatic with muzzle brake
    * Turret: Al alloy with 12.7 AP protection level
    * Ammunition : APFSDS, APDS, HESH
    * Fire Control System (FCS) : COTAC semi-automatic
    * Stowing capability: Main gun–42 rounds (turret–10 rounds; ammunition compartment–32 rounds)
    * Accurate ranging by Laser Range Finder (LRF)
    * Low-light level TV for commander and gunner
    * Panoramic sight for Commander
    * Amphibian capabilities


    http://www.drdo.com/pub/techfocus/2009/aug09.pdf
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DRDO_light_tank
    http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?89961-Indian-Armed-Forces&p=4532505&viewfull=1

    http://www.defenceforum.in/forum/showthread.php/3294-105-mm-Light-Tank-by-DRDO
     
  21. Agantrope

    Agantrope Senior Member Senior Member

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    Any idea why this one is rejected without any trails?
     

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