Anti-China Riots in Vietnam Scare Taiwan

Discussion in 'China' started by 4nh13, May 23, 2014.

  1. 4nh13

    4nh13 Regular Member

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    In the territorial dispute between Vietnam and China, the Taiwanese are collateral damage. Since Vietnamese protests against a Chinese oil rig in disputed waters turned ugly on May 13, officials in Hanoi have been trying to reassure foreign factory owners that the country is still a safe place to invest. In Binh Duong province just north of Ho Chi Minh City, the local government chairman on May 20 met with representatives from almost 100 foreign companies to apologize and promise to help with the recovery effort. The next day, the central government announced a series of tax breaks and other measures for companies damaged by the attacks.

    But the Taiwanese may need more than kind words and pledges. Vietnamese protesters set fire to 16 Taiwan-owned factories, possibly because of their Chinese names, and at least 500 Taiwanese-owned plants were damaged, according to a preliminary estimate by the Council of Taiwanese Chambers of Commerce in Vietnam. “Many factories will need completely new construction and new equipment,” says Serena Liu, the council’s chairwoman. “All the damage is still being assessed.” James Liu, chairman of the Taiwan Business Association in Binh Duong, told the Nguoi Lao Dong newspaper, “Whenever I meet companies, they all ask me if it is secure enough to keep their investments in Vietnam.”

    The attacks came even though for years the Taiwanese government has encouraged businesses to set up shop in Vietnam rather than China. Vietnam was part of Taiwan’s Go South strategy of securing markets in Southeast Asia and lessening its dependence on the mainland. Taiwan is one of the largest sources of foreign direct investment in Vietnam, having poured in $28 billion over the past two decades. In 2012, the most recent year data are available from the General Statistics Office of Vietnam, Taiwanese businesses pledged to invest more than $2.6 billion in the country, making the island—which Beijing considers a breakaway province—the second-largest investor in Vietnam, behind Japan.

    VIDEO: Anti-China Protesters in Vietnam Damage Factories
    Vietnam needs Taiwanese investment. Growth in Vietnam’s gross domestic product averaged well above 7 percent in the years before the country joined the World Trade Organization in 2007 but has been tepid ever since. The global financial crisis, runaway inflation, and overextended banks have seriously hurt the economy. Growth in 2012 was just 5.2 percent, the slowest since 1999, and last year was only slightly better at 5.4 percent. The World Bank expects the economy in 2014 to expand 5.4 percent again, the seventh consecutive year it has grown less than 7 percent. Meanwhile, neighbors such as Indonesia and the Philippines have grabbed the spotlight away from what was supposed to be Asia’s next tiger economy. Around the time of joining the WTO, “there was a lot of excitement about Vietnam as the next China,” says Christian de Guzman, senior analyst in Singapore with Moody’s (MCO). “You sort of don’t hear that anymore.”

    Because of higher costs in China, though, Vietnam has a chance to get back on the fast track. As Chinese provincial and city governments increase minimum wages, manufacturers are looking for alternatives in the region—a key reason Taiwan set its sights on Vietnam. Costs in the Southeast Asian nation can be as much as 50 percent lower than in China, says Arthur Ding, a research fellow at National Chengchi University in Taipei. Taiwanese textile and garment companies invested $1 billion in Vietnam last year, according to the Taiwan Textile Federation. Vietnam has also attracted big money from South Korea: Samsung Electronics (005930:KS) in March opened a $2 billion smartphone factory in Vietnam, and LG Electronics is spending $300 million on a new appliance factory in the country.

    After the riots, however, the Taiwanese will need more than low costs to feel good about Vietnam. Liu of the Taiwanese council remains optimistic. The government has released “a very good document addressing some of the points we asked for,” she says. If the central government doesn’t follow through, some companies from Taiwan have plans to relocate, says Justin Huang, secretary general of the Taiwan Textile Federation. He wants Vietnamese leaders to deliver on their promises of compensation, tax breaks, and other incentives. “That would be helpful in keeping the factories in Vietnam,” he says.
     
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  3. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    They should fly the Taiwanese flag.
     
  4. nimo_cn

    nimo_cn Senior Member Senior Member

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    you think they didnt?

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  5. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    Did they?

    I must have missed that.

    Can you indicate so?

    I would be surprised if the Viets hate Hans that much to not differentiate.

    Do they hate Hans and find them detestable that much?
     
  6. nimo_cn

    nimo_cn Senior Member Senior Member

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    Vietnamese hate Chinese, doesnt matter where they come from.

    Taiwanese are free to fly ROC flag anywhere outside China mainland, including HK and Macau. And ROC flag is also flying in many Chinese communities overseas.

    During the Olympic torch relay in 2008.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
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    Last edited: May 24, 2014
  7. jon88

    jon88 Regular Member

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    Yup ...exactly how I understand it. Hatred towards the Chinese extend beyond the country of China. Yes, the investors might be from Malaysia, Singapore, Thailand, Indonesia or even the Philippines, they almost always share the same common trait, they are all ethnic Chinese. Ethnic Chinese practically owns all of Southeast Asia economically.

    Chinese immigrants practically dominate the economy of the region that they went to, be it Southeast Asia, or British Colombia, Canada or even parts of Australia or New Zealand.

    Vietnam, even before the coming of the foreign investors, were economically dominated by ethnic Chinese Vietnamese.
     
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  8. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    I thought you said that the Taiwanese was flying their flag on the factories attacked. That was the issue and that was what made me ask.

    Taiwanese people fly their flag in their overseas communities is a generalised comment and it does not in anyway indicate that the Taiwanese were having their flag flying on the factories/ establishments attacked in Vietnam.

    What has my query to do with Taiwan people and Olympics?



    That is true that something I observed during my visit to SE Asian countries, is that the Chinese dominate business there.

    That is one of the reasons why in Malaysia Tunku Abdul Rahman coined the concept of Bhoomiputra to safeguard the Malay or Asli Orang (meaning Muslim Malay) and indigenous natives of Sabah and Sarawak.

    I think it was Mahatir Mohammed, who was more ''active" on this Bhoomiputra and he was virulently anti Chinese and dubbed the People's Action Party "pro-Chinese" and "anti-Malay" and called it leader, Lee Kuan Yew, "arrogant" leading to building grounds for Singapore's expulsion from Malaysia in Mahathir's first full year in parliament.

    Anyway, it was Malaysia's loss since the Chinese are hardworking and very entrepreneurial.

    Yet, sad part of the Asli Orangs, because the Chinese control the economy, they have not been able to Islamise Malaysia completely and so they have to be liberal in outlook.

    Yes, people are very averse to the ethnic stock of those who control the economy or are entrepreneurial, but 'hate' is too strong a word.
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2014
  9. nimo_cn

    nimo_cn Senior Member Senior Member

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    If they are free to fly ROC flag in America, what makes you think they are not in Vietnam?

    If they are not flying ROC flag, then may i ask what flag do you think they are flying?

    Are you playing the game of how dumb one could be?

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  10. jon88

    jon88 Regular Member

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    My wife, who is Chinese Malaysian, told me the Vietnamese riot attacks are very much a racial thing. Even in the Malaysian & Singaporean news media, the riots in Vietnam is called "pai hua" meaning it is against Chinese(not China).

    This is actually the sort of reality ethnic Chinese immigrants have to put up with living in Southeast Asian countries. Chinese immigrants are generally very competitive and represent a formidable threat to the original population. Other foreign immigrants often threaten to takeover only the job market, but Chinese immigrants can potentially takeover an economy. All of Southeast Asia's economy is in the hands of ethnic Chinese. This can cause a lot of friction when most Chinese citizens are rich and local indigenous citizens are poor.
     
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  11. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    What makes you so authoritatively state that they were flying the Taiwanese flag on the areas attacked? Were you there? Have you got some report to that effect? If so, please share.

    And why should anyone fly flags for the sake of flying flags? There is a protocol on the procedure of flying national flags.

    To be frank you are the dumb one because you don't even know that in some countries you cannot fly national flags just for the lark of it.

    In America, they go in for symbolism to show patriotism and so it is not unusual to see most of the houses flying flags and wearing lapel pin having the flag. They are not the index for other countries.
     
  12. nimo_cn

    nimo_cn Senior Member Senior Member

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    Flying national flag outside the factory is a common thing in Asia.

    We have seen Singapore flag being burned by violent Vietnamese protesters, it's EASY to figure out that it's allowed to fly a foreign national flag in Vietnam.

    You are not playing a dumb game, you are simply dumb.

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  13. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    So, Flying national flag outside the factory is a common thing in Asia?

    Tell that to the Marines.

    Justifying the unjustifiable and acting a Sir Oracle know all to cover your impetuous brash contention.

    You have seen the Singapore Flag flown in Vietnam and burnt down?



    You are rather ill read and your logic is astounding.

    Now, if the Taiwanese were flying their National Flag, then how come this was done as Reuters report:
    If the Taiwan flag was flying it was obvious it was not a Red China company. Vietnam has no problems with Taiwan. If they were flying the Taiwan Flag, that would be the statement enough to indicate that they have no truck with Communist China.



    And if the Taiwanese, Chinese and foreign companies were flying their national flags where was the need to drape their national flag on their building when their flags were already flying?
    Why drape your national flag, when as you claim, the national flag was already flying high?

    So, the contention that national flags are flown in foreign companies is bogus.



    Further, the Singapore companies were a Joint venture and I would be surprised if Vietnam would allow the Singapore flag being the only one flying!
    It is just your vanity and impertinence to call me dumb because it is your self assumed vanity that make you dumb to your dull perceptions,comprehension and logic.
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2014
  14. nimo_cn

    nimo_cn Senior Member Senior Member

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    Your lack of common sense is astounding.

    [​IMG]

    that Singapore flag must be carried there by the Vietnamese protesters if it was not flown outside the Singapore factory before it was burnt. So take your pick.

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  15. Compersion

    Compersion Senior Member Senior Member

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    The repercussion and also the byproduct of the oil rig undertaking done by PRC has impacted the Chinese people. Did the PRC think there would be no "significant" aftershocks (the fact that many ships accompanied the undertaking from PRC there was anticipation of a response by Vietnam and Vietnamese) ...

    what do the Chinese people think about the "contribution" of PRC to their sufferings in Vietnam. It might not be 100% but it is contributory. Remember the PRC knows that Chinese business people do not play such politics since business is business. They prefer to be pragmatic and want people to focus on their own hard-work and entrepreneurial skills and not what PRC is doing. Did the PRC cross the red line with the Chinese people in representation and also performance.

    Definitions:

    symptom:
    an indication of the existence of something, especially of an undesirable situation.


    problem:
    a matter or situation regarded as unwelcome or harmful and needing to be dealt with and overcome.
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2014
  16. 4nh13

    4nh13 Regular Member

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    We Vietnamese hate the Chinese. But comparing to them, we are weak so we need some advanced tactics and strategies.
     
  17. no smoking

    no smoking Senior Member Senior Member

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    So, your advanced tactics are burning Taiwanese, Japanese and Korean factories in Vietnam?
     
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  18. t_co

    t_co Senior Member Senior Member

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    Don't you get it? Burning their factories and beating up their citizens will make them understand and sympathize with Vietnam's position.

    [​IMG]
     
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  19. 4nh13

    4nh13 Regular Member

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    A big no. That incidents were caused by extremists. Many workers said that they are paid by strangers to do such things. So I think the "Good Chinese comrades" are behind the plot.

    We don't like wars. Wars are the final decisions (if must) for us to protect our country. We're weak but we're not afraid of China.
     
  20. no smoking

    no smoking Senior Member Senior Member

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    That is very good excuse!
    With your logic, the problem is the number is far too big! We are not talking about 80 or even 900 people here. There are more than ten thousands of Vietnamese involved in this criminal. If you are suggesting that Chinese has the ability to control such a large scale riot within Vietnam, either your countrymen are all idiots or your government is full of idiots.

    No, my friend, Vietnam has a better chance to win in a war than a money-burning game.
     
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  21. t_co

    t_co Senior Member Senior Member

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    What is the likeliest scenario is a case of political schizophrenia, with the Vietnamese Communist Party stuck between mass civil disturbances and their personal profit re mainland Chinese business. Time will tell if the political tension turns violent.
     

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