Amazing debate between TTP and Pakistan Army

Discussion in 'Pakistan' started by Bangalorean, Mar 30, 2014.

  1. Bangalorean

    Bangalorean Stars and Ambassadors Stars and Ambassadors

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2010
    Messages:
    6,207
    Likes Received:
    6,497
    This is awesome stuff. It is a long debate between a TTP scholar and a Pakistan Army scholar. There are English subtitles also, for those who don't understand Urdu well. I strongly recommend everyone should listen to the whole thing. It is 100% worth it.

    The TTP guy wins the debate, hands down. That is the conclusion. Others can put their own conclusions.

     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 10, 2015
    The Messiah and Kunal Biswas like this.
  2.  
  3. Bhadra

    Bhadra Defence Professionals Defence Professionals Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2011
    Messages:
    6,687
    Likes Received:
    2,357
    Absolutely mesmerizing debate? It is amazing to see that there are people of tribal middle age thinking and there is an Army of middle age thinking.

    The question of Jihad and purity of Muslims and the question who is a Muslim is very old in the subcontinent.

    watch this which may make one understand what is this all about.

     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 10, 2015
  4. Bangalorean

    Bangalorean Stars and Ambassadors Stars and Ambassadors

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2010
    Messages:
    6,207
    Likes Received:
    6,497
    A person on this thread has been kind enough to provide a summary of the debate for those who can't hear the full thing:

    Bharat Rakshak • View topic - Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Jan 04, 2014

     
    chase, LurkerBaba, Neil and 2 others like this.
  5. Bangalorean

    Bangalorean Stars and Ambassadors Stars and Ambassadors

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2010
    Messages:
    6,207
    Likes Received:
    6,497
    It is funny and very fascinating to see how both parties - the TTP and the Pak Army - constantly try to find examples from the Prophet's life, Quran and Hadiths, to justify what they are doing. The concept of universal rights, human rights, right or wrong, basic ingrained morality - all these concepts are totally lost on these fellows. If it can be proven that the Prophet endorsed something 1400 years back, you can do it. Period.

    One more very noteworthy thing is that both parties in this debate strongly agree that it is ok if Kaffirs are killed or attacked or destroyed. It is only the safety, security and prosperity of Muslims that ought to be taken care of. This is almost axiomatic in their debate. There is no disagreement upon this point. The Paki armyman only keeps questioning the TTP about why they attack Muslims. The TTP man keeps saying that supporters of America are as good as Kaffirs, so they deserve death.
     
  6. Razor

    Razor CIDs from Tamilnadu Senior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2011
    Messages:
    5,365
    Likes Received:
    4,511
    Location:
    ഭരതം (Bharatham)
    Correct me if I'm wrong, the YT channel must belong to a terrorist or a terrorist sympathizer, right ?
    So watching the video, liking it, sharing it etc will generate money for them ? :shocked:

    PS: I've already clicked it, but watched only like 15 min, coz I couldn't bear listening to cave men arguing 7th century desert musings.
     
    skumar7777 and Peter like this.
  7. Bangalorean

    Bangalorean Stars and Ambassadors Stars and Ambassadors

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2010
    Messages:
    6,207
    Likes Received:
    6,497
    The real interesting parts come later in the video. It is worth watching in full. It is fun to see these Paki Army chaps, who constantly beat their chests calling themselves "warriors of Islam", getting bashed up by TTP men who are even greener than they are. Now the Paki Army fellows are wondering whether they are really "Islamic".

    As far as the generating money part is concerned - the amounts are minimal in the overall context of their funds and finances. The amount of money that this entire video will generate for them is sufficient to purchase Diesel for one trip from Karachi to Peshawar. :lol:

    Let us not worry too much about the money generation part - we need to watch such videos to know how the enemy thinks. At this point, the official Paki establishment is our declared enemy. TTP is an enemy of our enemy. We need not help the TTP or sympathize with them, but we need to know about them.
     
    Razor likes this.
  8. Bhadra

    Bhadra Defence Professionals Defence Professionals Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2011
    Messages:
    6,687
    Likes Received:
    2,357
    The observation is that the way the very idea of Pakistan based on Islam took roots and got fructified had to degenerate into search for who is Muslim, the true Muslim and the pure Muslim?

    That led them straight to Macca and Madina, declaring themselves to be Ashraffs. Mirzas and Sayeeds ; claim Turkish, Mugal, Mangol or Arabic titles and names. That led to discrimination between the pure Muslims and convert Muslims whom they left back in India. It was this phenomenon that led second generation convert Iqbal to ask them " Muslman bhi ho ? "

    This dilemma further led them to have a divide between Sia and Sunnis, hate the Shias, Ismailies, Dawoodies and first of all the Ahmadies. In due course of time that further led them be Wahhabis, fundamentalists and strait away put them in Saudi lap due to doble lure of money and purity.

    Listen to the tirade the Maulavi expressed against MA Jinha implying that he was a Hindu converted to Ismali Shia (which he was). He also suggested and claimed with contempt that he was a purer and better Muslim than the Pakistanis. As a whole, he, forgetting his past when he would also been a Hindu or Buddhist. This question was asked by the Pakistani officer but the Mullah gave him better answer. The age old fault line between the Tribal Muslims of the frontier and ( supposedly converted) plains man of Punjab was so revealing.

    No doubt, it is because of this that the Punjabis and Sindhies of Pakistan are so scared of these frontier Pashtuns and Pathans who define their own idea of Islam independent of the rest of Pakistan. It is also hard to imagine that these people by and large were more secular and independent of the bigotries of Pakistan under Khan Abdul Gaffar Khan (sarhadi Gandhi) and ANP and that they voted for Congress in the first ever elections held there.

    That is typical case of dilemma of a convert seeking more and more purity and stressing that he is actually purer than the original by escaping from his past as forcefully as he can. Both the debaters, specially that Army officer , were trying that in their arguments. However, the Mullaha emerges a clear winner in the debate due to clarity of his thoughts (whatever they may be) diction and deliberation. The Army officer was fumbling and trying to prove his points more by force and less by conviction. Lesson _ the Army man should focus more on putting one bullet into Maulana's head rather than proving himself a better Mullaha. Ha Ha Ha...

    It is this phenomenon and psyche of rise of Islam and spread of fundamentalism post 1974 that led all communities in Pakistan to prove themselves purer Muslims - ultimately leading to the victory of Fundamentalist Wahabi Sunnies, elimination of Shias and declaring Ahmadies , Dawoodi Bohras as non Muslims.

    Look at the fate ... and Karma... The people who were in the forefront of creation of Pakistan, namely Shias, Ahmadies and Mohajirs have got the results of their karmas and sins. They snatched a homeland for themselves from Hindus but the pure Wahhabi Sunni Muslims have declared them Kafirs and second class citizens in Pakistan. Hona Hi Tha...

    Strange are the ways of Karma and Maya.....

    A thought - is not it also a matter for India to interfere into whatever happens in Pakistan? Does selling Gwadar not effect India? Was that part of India once upon a time. Should India keep quite on all these stupidities that occur in our neighbourhood and whatever those pseudo Nawabs of Mogul India do ?. Or is it because of India that they do all that? Second part of the ponderings being just a wild thought.

    The third wild thought being is that India must keep as much aloof from them as possible and not allow them to unite in the name of enemy India. Let them kill each other and watch the fun... occasionally say Sabhash Sabash !!
     
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2014
    Bangalorean likes this.
  9. Bangalorean

    Bangalorean Stars and Ambassadors Stars and Ambassadors

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2010
    Messages:
    6,207
    Likes Received:
    6,497
    @Bhadra, good post. The Pakis are stewing in their juice because they started a competition to see who is the greenest of them all. Everyone thumps his chest to show his "pious Islamic credentials", until the next person comes along and shows how he is an even better Muslim, and goes to even greater lengths to loudly proclaim his faith and commitment to Islam, and to Kaffir-eradication.

    That is why I don't feel sorry for the Ahmadis and Shias of Pakistan. Not one bit. They were at the forefront of the "we are pure Muslims and Hindus are dirty Kaffirs, we want to leave these Kaffirs aside", movement. Now they are reaping the fruits of what they had sown.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 10, 2015
    Pratap and The Messiah like this.
  10. Bhadra

    Bhadra Defence Professionals Defence Professionals Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2011
    Messages:
    6,687
    Likes Received:
    2,357
    I do feel sad for them and wish to pray along the celebrated Faiz ... also himself in the forefront of partition movement but then most of the times jailed in Pakistan..

    Khudaa wo waqt na laaye
    Faiz Ahmed Faiz








    Khudaa wo waqt na laaye ki soGawaar ho tuu
    sukuu.N kii nii.nd tujhe bhii haraam ho jaaye
    terii masarrat-e-paiham tamaam ho jaaye
    terii hayaat tujhe talKh jaam ho jaaye


    Gamo.n se aaiinaa-e-dil gudaaz ho teraa
    Hujuum-e-yaas se betaab hoke rah jaaye
    wafuur-e-dard se siimaab ho ke rah jaaye
    teraa shabaab faqat Khwaab ho ke rah jaaye


    Guruur-e-husn saraapaa niyaaz ho teraa
    tawiil raato.n me.n tuu bhii qaraar ko tarase
    terii nigaah kisii Gam_gusaar ko tarase
    Khizaa.N_rasiidaa tamannaa bahaar ko tarase


    koii jabii.n na tere sang-e-aastaa.N pe jhuke
    ki jins-e-ijz-o-aqiidat se tujh ko shaad kare
    fareb-e-waadaa-e-farda pe aetamaad kare
    Khudaa wo waqt na laaye ki tujh ko yaad aaye


    wo dil ki tere liye be-qaraar ab bhii hai
    wo aa.Nkh jis ko teraa intazaar ab bhii hai

    Faiz Ahmed Faiz
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 10, 2015
  11. shinoj

    shinoj Tihar Jail Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2014
    Messages:
    201
    Likes Received:
    85
    Location:
    Mumbai
    I know these talib Bastards are eventually an enemy of India but there were some funny things they said about Jinnah..

    Not Quaid-e-Azam but Kaddu-e-Azam..:rofl:
     
  12. jus

    jus Senior Member Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2014
    Messages:
    1,848
    Likes Received:
    1,208
    Location:
    Universe
    Its interesting TTP Mulla has more clarity than paki army .............

    This is our way we will kill u if u are not agree with me.... it's all written in a Book :rofl:

    PA&Jinna now become KAFIR :rofl:
     
  13. Pratap

    Pratap Tihar Jail Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2014
    Messages:
    1,260
    Likes Received:
    508
    Location:
    India
    PA and Jinnah were always kaffirs. Jinnah was a man who was known for his pork eating and weakness for wine.
     
  14. jus

    jus Senior Member Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2014
    Messages:
    1,848
    Likes Received:
    1,208
    Location:
    Universe
    yeah i agree with u

    but these facts put under BURKA and the state Propaganda is quaid a azam (Great leader) and PA as a MOGUL army(WARRIORS OF ISLAM) but TTP openly announce Jihad against them :laugh:
     

Share This Page