Altay Tank - The New Beast on the block!

Discussion in 'Land Forces' started by bengalraider, Nov 17, 2012.

  1. bengalraider

    bengalraider DFI Technocrat Stars and Ambassadors

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    Ladies and Gentlemen i give you the monster from Turkey, the Anatolian gladiator , the First Middle eastern Modern heavy Armor.
    ALTAY





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    Coming back to the real world the tank looks good and is pretty much a Turkish analogue to the 2A6 Leo , my fears rest around the close cooperation between the Turks and the Pakistanis. This beast may soon enter our theatre as well.
     
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  3. W.G.Ewald

    W.G.Ewald Defence Professionals/ DFI member of 2 Defence Professionals

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    The table at this link has links to Turkish tanks from Renault FT-17 to US M-60. Very Interesting.

    Historical Weapons of Turkish Armed Forces - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
     
  4. JBH22

    JBH22 Senior Member Senior Member

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    Even Turks can build tanks these days :scared2:

    If only we could see the Arjun tank becoming a success that would have been great, we should rope in more external designers to weed out all trouble.
     
  5. bengalraider

    bengalraider DFI Technocrat Stars and Ambassadors

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    Most interesting to note that the Turks have used both Nazi and Allied armor. The ALTAY has the potential to change power dynamics in the Mideast if the Turks sell it to their neighbours and build a block against Israeli armor superiority in the region. the ALTAY is probably one of the few tanks there that can stand up to a Merkava!
     
  6. Kunal Biswas

    Kunal Biswas Member of the Year 2011 Moderator

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    There is no trouble with external its all internal..

     
  7. Kunal Biswas

    Kunal Biswas Member of the Year 2011 Moderator

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    Yeah nice, tank..

    And in future is at top list in Pakistan Army..
     
  8. Apollyon

    Apollyon Führer Senior Member

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    The turret is fake :creepy: and first prototype is for mobility testing only (?) :work:
     
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  9. Defcon 1

    Defcon 1 Senior Member Senior Member

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    Sorry I am a noob. How did you know that the turret is fake?
     
  10. asianobserve

    asianobserve Elite Member Elite Member

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    The Turks did not build this tank from scratch. They borrowed a lot from the South Koreans' K2 MBT.
     
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  11. drkrn

    drkrn Senior Member Senior Member

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    why doesn't drdo make such presentations for its products:sad:
    at least they should out-source the advertising to experienced ones

    off topic: can tanks fire laser guided shells?
     
  12. JBH22

    JBH22 Senior Member Senior Member

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    Its functioning I rest my case.
     
  13. bengalraider

    bengalraider DFI Technocrat Stars and Ambassadors

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    Yes the Turks have longstanding defence cooperation with the Koreans the ALTAY team has gained valuable input from the K2 teams experience but the design is completely new and not based on the K2 except for the basics , as for Turkish -korena cooperation even the Firtina SPG is based on the Korean K9 Thunder
     
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2012
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  14. Damian

    Damian Defence Professionals Defence Professionals

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    Altay use some of technology designed for K2, however it's design is inspired by Leopard 2 and M60 mostly with some other modern tanks being inspiration also.
     
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  15. LurkerBaba

    LurkerBaba Staff Administrator

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    Yeah, the production quality of the promo videos is extremely high ! Can't expect something of that level from DRDO
     
  16. asianobserve

    asianobserve Elite Member Elite Member

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    I think the chassis, suspension of Altay is K2, the turret is not.
     
  17. Damian

    Damian Defence Professionals Defence Professionals

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    Some components of Altay are from K2, like suspension, hull and turret structures are completely new.

    Hull is modeled more after M60 and in very limited way after M1, and turret is modeled after Leopard 2.

    So Altay can be called in humorous way a bastard child of K2, Leopard 2, M60 and M1. ;)
     
  18. Akim

    Akim Defence Professionals Defence Professionals

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    Its export potential depends on the price. Nobody of you, will not buy a car Renault, assembled in Turkey, at a cost of the original.
     
  19. methos

    methos Regular Member

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    I think that's pretty much it. The Altay seems from capabilites etc. pretty much to be a Turkish Leopard 2A6 pendant... that's all. The Altay production will however start more than a dozen years after the Leopard 2A6 entered service. What's the reason behind the Altay except doing something on their own (which increases costs)? How should the Altay stand a chance on export market (if it does only offer capabilities already introduced in other tanks years ago)?
    I don't want to say "The Altay is a bad tank", because that wouldn't be true. But the Altay is not better than other already existing tanks which are proven and less expensive.
    One could argue that the Altay is better because it has increased roof armour - but that can be found also in other tanks (like Strv 122, Merkava IV, T-84 & T-90, etc.) already existing/in service. One could argue that the Altay is better because it has a laser warner, IFF, etc. - but again everything can be found in other tanks already in existance/service. And that makes the Altay project a bad programme.
    The FCS is made by Aselsan, who also developed an upgraded FCS for the Leopard 2 which isn't better than that of the 2A5... since the new upgrade was proposed parallel to the Altay development it could be that the Altay has the same level of FCS as NATO tanks had beginning in 1995.

    I don't think that the existence of this tank is really "justified". For example look at the four "biggest" NATO countries - USA, Germany, France and the UK - all have tanks designed differently. The Challenger 2 was designed around the L30 tank gun (which was ironically fielded to have commonality in armament with the Challenger 1, which never was upgunned). Because of the gun, it was designed with different ammunition storage and thus a completely different internal layout than the other tanks and it is incompatible with other designs (you cannot put a 120 mm smoothbore gun into it). The Leclerc's design is "dominated" by the autoloader, the M1's design is "dominated" by the idea of putting nearly all rounds into the turret rear. The Altay however doesn't have anything unique in it's design (at least as far as the images and videos show). Considering the fact that the Turkey evaluated numerous tanks - including all of the above - but still doesn't design something different, it seems that the main reason for creating the Altay is to make a tank on their own. And since we are here in Defenceforumindia.com: That's also the only reason why the Arjun was made.

    One thing is also that in other forums and one various websites people claim that the Turkish armed forces want to have 1,000 or even 1,200 Altay tanks - which is realistically far above the Turkish needs! With just 700 modern tanks the Turkey would be capable to beat each of it's neighbours... considering that the Turkey has 350 Leopard 2s (and plans to upgrade these) and 170 relatively modern M60T (from 2007, but they suffer from being based upon an outdated design) that would leave the need for 180 modern MBTs (assumed that all older models will be phased out). The Turkish armed forces are (like the Greece) stuck in a Cold War mentality which was abandoned by most other countries.
     
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  20. Akim

    Akim Defence Professionals Defence Professionals

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    Turkey has a lot of restless neighbors. Besides her conflict with Greek Union. And Greece, most militaristic country, is in a region, to that has quite good tank forces. If Americans them will pass to 400 М1, a disbalance will turn out. Turkey will not be able by means of the imported tanks to provide an equilibrium. "Altay" good tank for this region.
     
  21. methos

    methos Regular Member

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    Greece is not interested in the 400 M1A1 according to Greek news websites (would be very contra-productive, thinking of their finances). They have 170 Leopard 2A6HEL and 183 Leopard 2A4, the rest of their tanks is outdated and/or obsolete. Turkey has 170 M60T and 348 Leopard 2A4 (with proposed modernization)... the Turkish armoured forces are in the better situation, especially if they modernize the Leopard 2s. The introduction of a single batch of Altays (250 tanks according to wiki) would be more than enough for their needs.
     

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