Alleged Indian Involvement in Terrorist Attacks in Pakistan

Discussion in 'Pakistan' started by Flint, Oct 23, 2009.

  1. Flint

    Flint Senior Member Senior Member

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    India behind most terror attacks, says Malik

    Thursday, 22 Oct, 2009


    ISLAMABAD: Interior Minister Rehman Malik on Wednesday accused India of sponsoring terrorism in Pakistan, saying Delhi itself would be responsible for any terrorist attack if carried out in future on its soil. We have solid evidence that not only in Balochistan but India is involved in almost every terrorist activity in Pakistan,’ the minister said after attending a meeting on security of educational institutions.

    The interior minister’s statement that India was patronising terrorism in Pakistan raises a question why the interior minister had remained silent in the past and why the evidence of Indian involvement was not made public in the beginning.

    Mr Malik asked his Indian counterpart Chadambharam (Sic!!) to stop blaming Pakistan for terrorism in India, saying: ‘Mr Chadambharam (Sic!!) should first take care of his own country and then blame Pakistan. Don’t threaten us. We can give better ones to you.’

    APP adds: He said that the Indian interior minister should arrest culprits of Samjhota Express bombing, killers of Rajiv Gandhi and many more such incidents instead of blaming Pakistan for being incapable of coping with terrorists.

    ‘If we talk about composite dialogue, they (India) should not consider it our weakness at all,’ he added.

    He said India had made it a practice to threaten Pakistan every three months, adding: ‘We are a nuclear state and not so weak. We better know how to retaliate.’


    The minister referred to the Indian prime minister’s statement that more Mumbai-like attacks could take place in India and said: ‘I ask the Indian prime minister that if they have any information about more Mumbai-like attacks they should share these with Pakistan and we will look into them, but if India does not share anything with us then they would be responsible for any incident,’ he said.

    ‘I have time and again said there was Indian involvement in Balochistan and we have evidence, which could be shared with India, if they agree to come and sit with us,’ he claimed.

    About Mumbai attack, Mr Malik said: ‘We have yet not received the seventh dossier, but we have arrested all seven accused of Mumbai attacks.’

    Pakistan would definitely take action against Hafiz Saeed if he was found guilty, but the government could not take action against any citizen of the country without solid proof against him, the minister said.

    In reply to a question, the minister said that Pakistan had earlier handed over 18 accomplices of Abdul Malik Rigi, including his brother, to Iran.

    He, however, said that Rigi was not in Pakistan and said he was in Afghanistan and ‘we can even point out his exact location in Afghanistan’.

    To a question about installation of biometric system at the Pak-Afghan border, he said around 50,000 people crossed the border daily.

    ‘We have installed a biometric system on the Pak-Afghan border to check the movement of the people and the matter has also been taken up with the Afghan government and they have also agreed to install a similar system at their side of the border.’
     
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  3. Flint

    Flint Senior Member Senior Member

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    Mr. Malik seems to be under a lot of stress. Perhaps he should take a vacation and let someone marginally more competent take over.
     
  4. sob

    sob Moderator Moderator

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    He just flew over the Cuckoos nest.

    Must be high on grass...
     
  5. Arun thevar

    Arun thevar Regular Member

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    he is surely having problems with his speach nowadays,so a great advice every indian can give is,"VICKS KE GOLI LO KHICH K.HICH DOOR KARO..
     
  6. thakur_ritesh

    thakur_ritesh Administrator Administrator

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    A loud mouth without any substance, and nothing unusual there. He, his PM and their armed forces have accused India “n” number of times only to back track later, so where does the credibility come from in all that is being said now.

    Pakistan has done this repeatedly since hate India campaign sells like hot cakes in that country.

    To muster the support, and to justify their war on terror on the same people they fed till recent past to their awaam and to their armed forces who till then were deserting the ranks as if the world was heading towards no tomorrow, they had put India in the spotlight by saying all the funding and training of those terrorists happened from Indian consulates in a’stan which helped them turn the tide against those terrorists, a claim denied by the US which has the highest stakes in making afpak a peaceful region.

    Pakistan has only done talk, rather than come up and show the evidence to the world and to the Indians, and one highly suspects they have any such evidence for baluchistan leave aside the rest of Pakistan.

    This statement comes as a direct retaliation to the recent statement of the PM that India faces imminent terror attacks originating from Pakistan soil yet again which pushes Pakistan and the GoP increasingly on the back foot under tremendous pressure and all this is happening when the present government has already been pushed to the corner on the K-L bill issue which sidelined the pak armed forces which has made them very belligerent and the NRO issue.

    Mr Malik, diversionary tactics wont help you any longer, you have done it for way too long which has taken your country to the brink and if you continue doing the same, you and your country face a very uncertain future with possibly no such country called Pakistan in times to come, until and unless you and your armed forces believe only Punjab forms Pakistan.

    Your plot is weak for the bluff has been called at the world stage, and your country is heading towards a brink, so better will be if you focus on real issues and address them than beat around the bush!
     
  7. Energon

    Energon DFI stars Stars and Ambassadors

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    First let's identify what exactly it is that Rehman Malik has done: he is bending the truth to deflect blame upon an external adversary in order to pacify the beleaguered masses who do not have an effective governmental unit to look up to.

    Now let's put this into perspective:
    Populism and demagoguery at the expense of ground reality has historical precedence in the politics of underdeveloped nations, particularly that of South Asia and especially Pakistan. So in many ways there is nothing unique about this particular incident.

    What is extremely shocking about this event is the timing and the context of the statement.
    Pakistan is seeking mass international assistance on the context of having finally "woken up" to the reality of internal radicalization and militancy. However the government's (considering Malik is the interior minister) perpetuation of the policy of misleading the masses is a horrifying contradiction to what he was stating to the US congress and the UN just a few days ago as the designated representative of Pakistan.

    It is clear that the fundamental premise of Pakistan's current relationship with it's rescuers providing copious resuscitative aid is fallacious.

    The evidence does not get any more clear than this.
     
  8. p2prada

    p2prada Stars and Ambassadors Stars and Ambassadors

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    Nothing new in that. Let me know if he says he has been misquoted.
     
  9. qsaark

    qsaark Regular Member

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    Absolutely, this nonsense should be stopped. If he or the GoP has some concrete evidence of Indian involvement, that evidence must be brought out; and if there exists no such evidence, than there is no use of making baseless comments only so that others make fun of you.
     
  10. tarunraju

    tarunraju Moderator Moderator

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    [​IMG]: We has terror attacks, you are resposible!
    [​IMG]: Give us proof
    [​IMG]: *gives proof*
    [​IMG]: Oh I see. There's the waiting room, over there. We've got a TV, and a fridge with some refreshments.
    [​IMG]: Gee thanks.
    Later...
    [​IMG]: I can has Action?
    ======
    [​IMG]: Give us more proof™
    [​IMG]: You must take action™
    ======
    Repeat till the Indian elections are smoothly over
    [​IMG]: We has terror attacks, you are resposible!
    [​IMG]: OK?
    TBC.
     
  11. Flint

    Flint Senior Member Senior Member

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    I think these statements simply highlight the sheer clueless-ness of the Pakistani establishment. Today we saw 3 terrorist attacks in one day. They are being hit from all sides and have absolutely no idea how to stop the nightmare.
     
  12. amitkriit

    amitkriit Senior Member Senior Member

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    Terrorists are sending a clear message: "They can now hit Pakistani establishment at their whims, anywhere/anytime", Pakistan is going deeper into "Civil War" state. A volatile Pakistan is not in India's interest where terrorists run the state affairs, so the alligation is absurd. Instead Pakistan must spend more time in sanitizing it's security apparatus which has been breached/overwhelmed by taliban sympathizers.
     
  13. Energon

    Energon DFI stars Stars and Ambassadors

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    I have to disagree, and that is the crux of my argument on this issue. This is not a matter of clueless-ness. There is ample evidence suggesting that the terrorist attacks in question came from the various extremist groups within Pakistan. On the other hand there is no reliable evidence of any sort suggesting that India had any part to play in this (Christine Fair's statement during a group discussion which was immediately countered by other equally placed experts does not count as conclusive evidence or even suggestive evidence for that matter).

    To state that there is conclusive evidence when there is none (nothing has been presented AFAIK) in an official capacity means that the government is misleading its own people for political purposes. This practice has a strong precedent and can be categorized as the state's policy.

    The consistent factual discrepancies between statements issued for internal consumption and those issued externally is a well documented and established fact. Steve Coll, Ahmad Rashid, Ayesha Siddiqa, Mary Anne Weaver, Arif Jamal (Shadow War: The Untold Story of Jihad in Kashmir) to name a few have written extensively about it as have authors and analysts from a vast array of credible policy groups and academic institutions (most of these publications are commercially available).

    This event was by no means a result of ignorance or ineptitude. It was a very deliberate act of misguiding the masses to obtain a predetermined political objective. There is an Orwellian world of difference between the two.
     
  14. Flint

    Flint Senior Member Senior Member

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    Energon, I completely agree. By "cluelessness", I didn't mean to say that Mr. Malik here has no idea who is responsible, but rather, he has no idea how the handle the political situation. As a result, he is finding it easiest to blame India rather than admit that the domestic situation has gone wildly out of control.

    Also, this might possibly be a ploy to garner domestic support against the TTP by branding them "Indian Agents", since the other position of "fighting for Islam" seems to have been cornered by the TTP themselves.
     
  15. Energon

    Energon DFI stars Stars and Ambassadors

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    This is undoubtedly a ploy, but in this case there is a specific context to this issue. Falsely blaming India for one of Pakistan's greatest human tragedies to date is more than just shifting blame for short term political purposes. It is in fact the energy source fueling the diseased concept of the good taliban vs bad taliban which forms the very foundation of this conflict. By formulating rhetoric around India's involvement, the GoP is perpetuating a publicly supported low intensity war aimed at India. It's not just a timing issue, but rather the deliberate inculcation of a link between India and this horrible catastrophe which has permeated all of Pakistani society like no other in recent times.

    For the last 8 months delegation after delegation from Pakistan have been briefed about this very issue by an assortment of government officials in the US. I have attended some of these discussion where the problem of the philosophical dichotomy vis a vis terrorism has been addressed. Populism and indoctrination of the masses through obfuscation has also been discussed in detail as being one of the sources of propagation of this state policy. And each time the Pakistani officials promise that they will no longer allow this to go on. The recent spate of articles you saw in the media about Pakistan's diversion of funding to shore up against India were preceded and followed up with intense briefing sessions about the topic I'm referring to.

    I'm fairly certain Rehman Malik was at these meetings. What he has done now is by no means an impromptu decision and certainly not because he didn't know what else to do. This is a highly premeditated and deliberate act which directly defies Pakistan's supposed stance for an ulterior motive. Also, I don't know if you noticed, but Dawn, the most widely distributed Pakistani news paper issued a special editorial on the 23rd of October where they endorsed Malik's obviously nonsensical claim. This is a concerted national movement as far as I'm concerned.
     
  16. Ashoka

    Ashoka New Member

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    Thank you for the insightful post.

    In addition to your contentions of this being a deliberate act from Pakistan, I may add that Pakistan has also used 'Denial' as a very efficient & highly effective tool to get away. Denial, though provided temporary relief, has brought upon this curse to Pakistan today. Denial accompanied by Diversion has served in the best interest of short sighted Pakistani strategies & the strategy makers.

    In all this fray, one feels sorry about the Pakistani people. The top brass of their establishment who formulates such policies has always gotten away, will always get away, leaving common Pakistani populace to suffer the consequences of their deeds. And at least I don't see an end to this, unless some miracle happens.
     
  17. Known_Unknown

    Known_Unknown Devil's Advocate Stars and Ambassadors

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    It is stupidity on part of policy makers anywhere, especially in the US, to think that they can overnight change the attitudes or ideology of a nation that has raised two generations of indoctrinated people who believed that the US is at best a golden goose and India and Israel are their existential enemies.

    Pakistan will dance on one foot to receive the billions of dollars in aid that the US provides it, and then go back to its old ways after encashing the cheque.

    What the US fails to realise that Pakistan's whole raison d'être is eternal opposition and enmity towards India.

    Pakistan's creation itself was due to its leaders' belief that a secular India in which Hindus and Muslims co-existed was impossible. However, India has since prospered, while Pakistan broke into two countries, and has gone downhill ever since. If they accept peace with India, they would be negating the very reason of their existence as a separate country-then they might as well merge with India.

    Hence, it is important for the US to realize that a strong Pakistan will always be detrimental to the cause of peace and stability in the region. Whenever Pakistan has perceived itself as strong, it has attacked India and started a war.

    So stop gifting billions of dollars in aid or at the very least, distribute the money through American or other foreign NGOs working in Pakistan. Do not give away the money to the government. Put pressure on them to change their educational syllabus which is nothing but a vehicle for state authorised Islamic propaganda-that's the only way to instill the values of freedom and liberalism in their future generations. Encourage land reforms to undermine the power of the landlords, who are one of the biggest sponsors of fundamentalism and the ones most interested in maintaining the status quo. Secure their nukes and make sure that they do not produce or proliferate any more-a country such as Pakistan with a dysfunctional polity and irrational military leadership should never be allowed to maintain a nuclear force. Ask that the 25,000 madarasas be closed down and instead of them, secular government schools be opened up, and provide funds directly to contractors engaged in that project.

    And last but not the least, keep a presence in Afghanistan for at least the next decade and turn it around into a functioning state that is able to guard its borders and prevent movement between Af-Pak.
     
  18. Flint

    Flint Senior Member Senior Member

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    Energon, the way you have put it, it does seem like a very alarming development.

    P.S. Can someone provide a link to said Dawn editorial? I am finding it hard to believe that this newspaper, arguably one of the better ones from Pakistan, has published something of this sort?

    Infact, today's Dawn editorial doesn't say a word about India at all:

    http://www.dawn.com/wps/wcm/connect.../pakistan/04-new-face-of-talibanisation-qs-01
     
  19. Daredevil

    Daredevil On Vacation! Administrator

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    This is from yesterday's Dawn editorial.

     
  20. Flint

    Flint Senior Member Senior Member

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    Hmm...The "gist" is correct eh? Looks like Dawn's own standards are falling with each new terrorist attack.
     
  21. qsaark

    qsaark Regular Member

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    Dawn is still a Pakistani newspaper hence reserves the right to present pro-Pakistani view point. Besides I do not find anything wrong with the article except that it is not totally favoring the Indian point of view.

    It is neither uncommon nor unanticipated that rival countries try to out do each other. The 2nd World War, Communist Russian expansion in Europe, Korean, Vietnam, Afghan, and Gulf wars are such examples where the two or multiple of the countries tried to play their games. During the forty or so odd years of the cold war, that is exactly what the two rivals and their respective blocks did to each other. Now we can always debate on who was morally wrong and who was right, though this would largely be a theoretical debate as morals are generally set by those who have an upper hand. As it is said that the “victors write the history”.

    The Indian government is not being run by the army of the angels and not everybody sitting in Islamabad is an evil. There is no doubt in my mind that both the countries actively and passively interfere in each others matter in order to secure a better bargaining position. It would be hard to believe that Indians or other regional players are not trying to benefit from the prevailing situation in Pakistan and in Afghanistan. And I for one have no problem if it is happening as that is exactly what the international politics is all about.

    My problem with Malik and others like him is when they talk without fortifying their claims with hard evidence and deliberately try to divert the attention of the general public from prevailing problems to the so called Indian hand. Foreign powers are playing games in Pakistan is nothing new, it happens everywhere and in every country. However, problem arises when the Governments and the responsible institutions are failed to counter such activities and situation goes out of control as it is happening in Pakistan.
     

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