Air force gets US planes minus security net

Discussion in 'Indian Air Force' started by EagleOne, Aug 3, 2010.

  1. EagleOne

    EagleOne Regular Member

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    New Delhi, Aug. 2: The Indian Air Force has contracted six aircraft for the special forces for $1 billion without military-grade secure equipment because Washington denied the technology after New Delhi refused to sign a communications secrecy pact.

    The air force is now in the process of contracting another 10 very heavy strategic airlifters under the same technology-denial regime for an estimated $3 billion.

    India contracted six C-130J Super Hercules in 2007 and the first of these aircraft is likely to be delivered by January 2010 ahead of schedule by its maker, Lockheed Martin, under a government-to-government foreign military sales programme.

    One of the scenarios in which the Hercules (“Hercs” for short) is to be used involves inserting special airborne troops (paratroopers) by flying into hostile territory where an adversary can try to intercept and/or jam electronic communication.

    "We are aware that some of the equipment we desire may not be available. But it is up to us to use the platform the way we want to with modifications once we have it,” a senior air force officer told The Telegraph.

    A US defence official told this newspaper “anything that requires encryption, which includes military-grade global positioning systems (GPS)” will not be mounted on the C-130J or the C-17 Globemaster III (made by Boeing) because India has not yet signed the Communications Inter-Operability and Security Memorandum of Agreement (CISMOA).

    The CISMOA was proposed by the Pentagon to the Indian defence ministry in 2006. A standard text for another crucial agreement, the End-User Monitoring Arrangement, was agreed last year after more than three years of negotiations.

    A secure GPS is indispensable for mobile military platforms that are designed to track targets in all-weather and all-time circumstances.

    “The military GPS system is encrypted and thus not available without a communications agreement,” the US defence official said. He claimed that “US military equipment is designed utilising the best systems available, such as military-grade GPS, which is more accurate and less likely to be spoofed (intercepted) than civilian GPS”.

    Asked if there was any way India could access the equipment without signing the CISMOA, he replied “there is no way around this”. He said the CISMOA would apply to the proposed sale of the C-17 also. Trials for the aircraft were completed last month and the Indian Air Force has decided to buy it.

    The four-engine turbo-prop Hercs — a workhorse for the US military — is a “tactical airlifter” with a payload capacity of 20 tonnes or about 120 fully-equipped airborne troops capable of landing on dirt strips and with short take-off and landing capability.

    The giant C-17 jet is also rugged but capable of flying much longer distances with much heavier payloads. The Indian Air Force has projected a dire need for these two different classes of aircraft because its Russian/Soviet-origin aircraft are outdated.

    The air force is set to order six more Hercs in addition to the six already contracted. The Coast Guard and the Border Security Force are also in line to acquire two Hercs each.

    The Hercs are to be based at Hindon, just east of Delhi, where the Indian Air Force base is being refurbished. The Hercs for India have been modified for special missions and are equipped with an infrared detection set for low-level flying in adverse conditions.

    Although the communications systems would not have the desired level of security for the Indian Air Force, an official said that India was getting the Hercs with the configuration it wants. They will have self-protection and mid-air refuelling ability. The Hercs is in service in 10 countries.

    http://www.telegraphindia.com/1100803/jsp/nation/story_12763774.jsp

    :emot112::happy_2:
     
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2010
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  3. prateikf

    prateikf Regular Member

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    at least the air force is getting some much needed equipment unlike our army whose every RFI has been cancelled or issued again
     
  4. JBH22

    JBH22 Senior Member Senior Member

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    iNDIAN army top brass is becoming a joke and shame with constant scam
     
  5. luckyy

    luckyy Regular Member

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    which are the other military-grade secure equipments that can't be given to india without signing Communications Inter-Operability and Security Memorandum of Agreement (CISMOA).?
     
  6. Rahul Singh

    Rahul Singh Senior Member Senior Member

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    " End-User Monitoring Arrangement " Signing this one is more shameful than CISMOA. I mean what so tactical US offers that will require us to bow down to this level that one which is our's is still not ours. It is far more better to pay more but have complete control on acquired hardware. One can justify proposed acquisition of C-17s on payload capacity but how we will one justify acquisition of C-130? A modernized An-32 offers everything what C-130 can; be it landing on unprepared muddy air fields or any.
     
  7. arps

    arps Regular Member

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    It was bad to sign that agreement..but in practical India don't have the capability to upgrade them better than what original manufacturer made.We cant even make close to that.So why to cry for that? While upgrading we can ask them to change it accordingly.
     
  8. neo29

    neo29 Senior Member Senior Member

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    This wont be the case for mmrca ... India needs complete ToT for fighters which US wont give. Wonder if they will make such an arrangement or discard US fighters. If no ToT on AESA and engine then surely US fighters are a good bye.
     
  9. arya

    arya Senior Member Senior Member

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    why we are taking from usa while we can take from uk france isreal german russia
     
  10. arps

    arps Regular Member

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    Kiddish comment.US will give TOT at the level IAF wanted.TOT is a misguided term for lot of kids. Anyway we have TOT for sukhoiMKI RADAR.Where did we use it?DRDO is asking for foreign partner to make EASA antena.And I would like a limitted TOT for the best RADAR available than more TOT for an inferior RADAR.
     
  11. SHASH2K2

    SHASH2K2 New Member

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    We donot have better technology now but a plane will not be used only for 5-6 years . In coming years we will definitely have better technology than what it is now . so we need to consider possible future upgrades as well. SO I completely agree with Rahul in this regard. USA will not allow any one to upgrade the systems without their approval .
     
  12. anoop_mig25

    anoop_mig25 Senior Member Senior Member

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    what does this statement imply is INDIAN AIR FORCE is going to do some modifications once it has been acquired . i do not think US allows any of its client to do some modifications on its toys
     
  13. arps

    arps Regular Member

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    wats the big deal.Get the approval.If israil can upgrade than in future we may also. Or better ask for the up gradation more advance systems from US itself.
     
  14. SHASH2K2

    SHASH2K2 New Member

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    There is no big deal . Only deal is money. USA wil try to push its own product and at much inflated price and will block other products which are of same quality but are cheaper . Donot compare India with Israel when it comes to dealings with USA. We donot have balls.
     
  15. arps

    arps Regular Member

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    @luckky

    F16 didnt have EASA radar,which only recently got through the investment of UAE. But US had easa for other fighters.Thats why I told, they r masters in RADAR and and they play around it for 15 years..F18 has the best RADAR of all the MMRCA
     
  16. arps

    arps Regular Member

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    I mentioned "in future"..The world is changing so fast.I was talking about the scenario after 20-30 years....Think little more...
     
  17. SHASH2K2

    SHASH2K2 New Member

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    I am thinking thats why I am supporting it . you need to take things as it comes. Why would USA allow India to upgrade the weapons using its own or third party subsystems. Once we buy any system we will be fully depenedent on USA for any small modification and will be charged a lot. It should not be legally binding on us . We should be free to choose our upgrades .
     
  18. luckyy

    luckyy Regular Member

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    then US has to offer us F-16/18 at around $40ml.......not posible..but lets see..
     
  19. BunBunCake

    BunBunCake Regular Member

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    That's bull crap, why don't we make our own? This here is begging like Pakistan (only they do for money, we do for equipment). One day when our government changes (and their policies), there's no surety that the US won't impost sanctions on India AGAIN.

    What're we going to do then?
     
  20. SHASH2K2

    SHASH2K2 New Member

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    did you really understood what i was talking about?
     
  21. SHASH2K2

    SHASH2K2 New Member

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