A Punjab seat where Christians are important

Discussion in 'Religion & Culture' started by Sikh_warrior, Jun 3, 2011.

  1. Sikh_warrior

    Sikh_warrior Defence Professionals Defence Professionals

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    Reservation in state government jobs, a state minorities commission and safeguarding churches. With 150,000 Christians in this constituency and a high stakes poll game under way, the community's demands are being backed by the Congress and being "considered" by the Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP).

    The Lok Sabha seat of Gurdaspur, bordering Pakistan and Jammu and Kashmir, is not only known for being one of the most backward constituencies in Punjab and its incumbent actor-MP Vinod Khanna of the BJP, but also for being home to a sizeable Christian population.

    "In Punjab, there are around 900,000 Christian voters and the largest chunk, 17 per cent, reside in Gurdaspur district. Here their number is over 150,000. After Gurdaspur, maximum Christian voters are in Amritsar, Ferozepur and Ludhiana districts," Kanwal Bakshi, state president of Punjab's United Christian Front (UCF), told IANS.

    "This time we want a change in Punjab and Christians are not going to vote for the BJP or the Akali Dal. We are all fed up of their anti-Christian policies and moreover their leaders are never accessible to us," Bakshi declared when asked about the way the community was inclined to vote.

    The UCF extended support to the Congress following a call given by senior Congress leader and former chief minister Amarinder Singh.

    Talking about the Christian community's demands, Bakshi said: "We want two per cent reservation in state government jobs for Christians, as it is available in Kerala. Despite the fact that Christians are in such large numbers in Kerala, they still have reservation. Then why can't we have it in Punjab?"

    He said there should be a state minorities commission on the lines of the National Commission for Minorities and the government should prevent encroachment on Christian property in the state.

    "There are around 60 churches in Punjab, constructed by the British, which are nearly 150 to 200 years old. They are in a dilapidated condition and nobody is bothered about their preservation. We want the government to declare them heritage property and do the needful to safeguard them for future generations," stated Bakshi.

    Partap Singh Bajwa, Congress candidate for the Gurdaspur parliamentary seat, agreed.

    "We support the reservation of jobs for Christians as most of them are from Dalit families who later embraced Christianity," Bajwa told IANS.

    "Their condition in Punjab is really bad and they are forced to suffer as there are no schemes for their upliftment. We have promised to get their demands fulfilled," said Bajwa, a former public works department (PWD) minister in Punjab and a legislator from the Kahnuwan assembly constituency.

    He is pitted against BJP candidate and actor Vinod Khanna who had won this seat three times in 1998, 1999 and 2004 but faces a tough contest this time.

    A senior BJP leader of Punjab told IANS: "The Congress is trying to blow the issue of Christian reservation out of proportion to avail of undue advantage in the polls. We are also considering it, but it is a long process and certainly takes some time."

    State BJP leaders admit they want the Christian vote in Punjab but have a lot of explaining to do to the community about incidents against the community in Kandhamal, Orissa.

    Gurdaspur, one of Punjab's 13 Lok Sabha seats, goes to the polls on May 13 -- the last day of polling for the parliamentary election. Punjab conducted its election over two phases on May 7 and May 13.


    A Punjab seat where Christians are important : Election News: India Today
     
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  3. Zoravar

    Zoravar Regular Member

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    Reservation on the basis of religion is unconstitutional IN My Opinion.But muslims/christains are currently not covered as SC/ST which is kinda the same.
     
  4. bhramos

    bhramos Elite Member Elite Member

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    Christians are covered in both sc and st reservations in southern India, muslims are come under bc in AP... i dont know about other states, as they form largest vote bank in AP for Congress govt...
     
  5. Zoravar

    Zoravar Regular Member

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    I'm pretty sure they aren't accomodated by SC/ST up here.And behenji has recently been shooting off leters to Manmohan Singh asking for muslim reservations,if it happens India will burn because then even we sikhs and christains can lay an equal claim to it.
     
  6. The Messiah

    The Messiah Bow Before Me! Elite Member

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    No they are not the same.

    Reservation should be done on the basis of ones financial situation rather than lumping whole groups. Some sc and st's are crorepatis so should they also be given reservation ?
     
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  7. Yusuf

    Yusuf GUARDIAN Administrator

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    Are these Christians local punjabis or immigrants?
     
  8. Blackwater

    Blackwater Veteran Member Veteran Member

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    They are not immigrants. Most of them are SC/ST converted Christian from hindus...
     
  9. Shaitan

    Shaitan Zandu balm all day Senior Member

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    Wait, wait, they want reserved jobs for themselves because of their religion?Dumb.
     
  10. KS

    KS Bye bye DFI Veteran Member

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    Sikhs already have reservation. So do Jains and Buddists.
     
  11. Tronic

    Tronic Stars and Ambassadors Stars and Ambassadors

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    Sikhs have reservations? Where?
     
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2011
  12. KS

    KS Bye bye DFI Veteran Member

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    I meant SCs/STs in Sikhism can claim caste based reservation while the same is not extended to their counterparts in Islam and Chritianity as the word "Hindu" in the Indian constitution refers to all the Indic/Dharmic religions (Hinduism,Jainism,Buddhism and Sikhism) and not just Hinduism,
     
  13. Tronic

    Tronic Stars and Ambassadors Stars and Ambassadors

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    Ah, yes, I forget that little irony.
     
  14. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    Most of the Punjabi Christians I have met, have the name Masih or Massey!

    I found many Masih around Tarn Taran.

    Same, I believe, is the case in Pakistan Punjab.

    Technically, there is no caste system in Sikhism. However, it is practised wherein you have the Jats, Bhappas/Khatris, Ramgarhias, Ramdasias. I am not too sure as to what the Ahluwalias are, but they had this Missil and if I am not wrong, the Misl captured Lahore.
     
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2011
  15. KS

    KS Bye bye DFI Veteran Member

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    A beneficial irony, if you may !
     
  16. xXX-Nair:::Saab-XXx

    xXX-Nair:::Saab-XXx Regular Member

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    NO reservations... & Kerala argument... Kerala is Already Fuckedddd up ...Soon Hindus in kerala will a Minority...Already Hindu Population is about 52%...
     
  17. Tronic

    Tronic Stars and Ambassadors Stars and Ambassadors

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    By promoting casteism even among religions which officially denounce it? I don't think its beneficial at all. There is no way that India will ever be free from casteism with policies such as these.
     
  18. Tronic

    Tronic Stars and Ambassadors Stars and Ambassadors

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    Sir, Ahluwalias are Kalals. "Kalal" was dropped by Jassa Singh, the famous misaldar, in accordance with the Sikh religious laws, which denounce casteism, and "Ahluwalia" (the people from the village Ahlu) was adopted as the clan name instead. Similarly, the "Thoka" misaldars renamed themselves to shed their casteist identity and became today's Ramgharia clan. Ironical how the Ahluwalias and Ramgharias are today treated as a caste themselves! Being a Jatt myself, I can say that Sikhism has been corrupted by none others than the Jatt clans, aswell as the smaller clans which have aligned with the Jatts, such as the Tarkhans.

    Casteism in Sikhism and by extension in Punjab, is nothing but a pissing contest between all the various clans. It has very little relevance when comparing it with the Hindu varna system. The bulk of all the Sikh "castes" would all be classified the one and the same under the Hindu varna system; i.e. Kshatriyas. The brahmans in Punjab have been depreciated in their status on the local "caste" scale, while the Jatts have placed themselves on the top. It is a hierarchy created merely by the order of who has held the bigger guns. All the castes/clans mentioned above, the Jats, Khatris, Ramgharias, Ahluwalias, are all Kshatriyas under the Hindu varna system. Ramdasis are called Julahas in Punjab and are mostly Hindus, only a very tiny minority of them are Sikh. The Mazhabis are the dalit converts to Sikhism and they have been held in very high esteem and have a long and brave history in Sikhism. They form the core of the elite Sikh Nihang armies and to this day they staunchly follow their Nihang practices and are deeply respected. They have played very important roles in all the Sikh armies to date, and the Nihangs were called Guru Gobind Singh's laadli fauj. It were the Jatts which started discrimination against the Mazhabis, and it was mostly due to the Jatts enjoying status as zameendars while the Mazhabis were reduced to mere serfs. That has been the main cause of discontent, the Jatt-Mazhabi clash. So yes, technically there is no casteism in Sikhism, and technically, all the clans who do fight the pissing caste contests in Punjab are one and the same under the Hindu system, and the 'Brahmans' who are supposed to be the top dogs of the caste system have been depreciated and reduced in status in Punjab. The "caste" system in Punjab is nothing but a pointless clash of egos.
     
  19. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    The Sikh 'caste' system is not one of recent making.

    It manifest itself even in the Regt of the IA.

    The Sikh Light Infantry was known in earlier times as the Mazabhi and Ramdasia Sikh Regiment. In 1944, it became the Sikh Light Infantry.

    It traces its origin to the middle of the nineteenth century when the first Mazhabi soldiers were recruited into the British Indian Army.
     
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2011
  20. Tronic

    Tronic Stars and Ambassadors Stars and Ambassadors

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    Sir, "Caste" in Punjab is muddled up as it is a misnomer to start off with. The history of Punjab has been divided up in various clans which had their own armies, own villages and territories. The word "caste" is inaccurately used to describe the various 'clans' in Punjab. Guru Gobind Singh himself mentions the Jatt Brar clan in his Zafarnama; "Na zarra dar een rah khatreh turast hameh kaum-e-Brard hukam-e-marast" (telling Aurangzeb that, "you can come to me to talk and no one will harm you along the way since the Brar clan is under my command and will not attack you). Even "Khatris" are not exactly known as one group but are divided up into various clans with their own history. The Sodhi clan which is classified as "Khatri" is given the due respect for being one of the eight original clans to lay the foundations of the Khalsa armies. The "Thatt Khalsa" faction which was led by the Trehan clan, is actually the one which conceived and made famous the war cry, "Jo Bole So Nihal Sat Sri Akal!" The Mazhabis have always been considered the bravest and most fierce warriors of the Khalsa. Infact, the Mazhabis made the backbone of the Nihangs, which are known as Guru Gobind Singh's 'laadli fauj'. All these clans/castes have fought shoulder to shoulder under the Sikh banner, each one of them has contributed immensely and has played a large part in Sikh history.

    The discrimination has been due to the empowered Jatt clans, and it is totally abnormal to the Sikh religion.
     
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2011
  21. anoop_mig25

    anoop_mig25 Senior Member Senior Member

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    ^^^^ IS this jats are same as those demanding reservations in up/Delhi/haryan as on obc . if yes then i do not think they deserve any reservation of any kind.first i do not think they were discriminated and second i think they are financially well sound so they can acquire best education. am i right

    off-topic but why hasn`t congress unable to provide reservation to Muslims . are they paying with emotions of Muslims because i do not see they lack support in parliament. most of parties except bjp-shivshena would support it. so why hasn`t congrees passed such bill?
     

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