BrahMos Cruise Missile

To know if Brahmos like missile is interceptable or not, it'll have to take Real World test involving Brahmos like target & similar terminal phase while supposed to be intercepted by very well developed precise interceptor missile.

Armand claims 100km, the Erieye fact sheet claims at an altitude of 10,000 a low flying subsonic cruise missile is detected at 200km in a post launch sea skimming profile, read post #424 if you haven't already. Remember a subsonic cruise missile like the TomaHawk has a much longer range than the Brahmos and the launch will likely occur beyond the detection capability of the air borne radar (over the horizon).

Gentlemen, we are talking about a super hot, MACH 2.8 screaming, hot gas spewing missile not a low observable subsonic cruise missile.

Read the Italian research paper link I provided, today researchers are able to identify the species of migratory birds using high resolution long range iSAR.
The Brahmos is much larger than a bird - no?

Has Brahmos Aerospace tested their missile against interceptors like ASTER, Barak 8,SM-2 or ESSM? Isn't it premature to claim invincibility until such tests are performed scientifically to asses the effectiveness of the Brahmos against intercept missiles? At least the ESSM, SM-2 and ASTER has been tested against missiles that mimic the Brahmos in threat scenario A,B and C - has the Brahmos been similarly tested against a missile as capable as the ESSM, SM-2 or ASTER?

Don't see anying about it...

http://www.saabgroup.com/Global/Docu...EN%20Print.pdf

It is a Ramjet engine, quite a bit different than spewing a bunch of hot gas. Radars do not detect heat, only the plume and a ramjet in supersonic flight has very little.

Wrong! Ramjet ejects pressurized hot gas as a result of imperfect combustion of pressurized air and fuel.
Radar does not detect heat but it is sensitive to thermal gradients produced by the hot emission and aerodynamically heated skin.
Even a humble weather radar is able to detect thermal gradients.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SR-71_Blackbird

Finally, look at graphic on the top left corner of the Erieye brochure it clearly shows a cruise missile between 180-200 km.
Subsonic cruise missiles are a lot harder to detect for the following reasons:

1. Launch occurs at distances greater than the detection range of radars protecting the target.
2. In comparison to supersonic ASCM, subsonic missiles are capable of lower altitude terrain hugging or sea skimming profile.

Brahmos is attack missile program. India's Interception program will try Bramhos. Don't worry PDV or future BMD tests will involve Brahmos soon.

IMO Interception tests involving Brahmos like target are not performed by India /Russia or by any country. So till such successful test arises nothing is premature but is absolute.


Again where are the real interception tests ??

At 10m altitude the Brahmos will be able to do less than 120km. The 300km range is for a different flight regime.

Nevertheless the Brahmos is detectable and can be engaged. The only drawback is there is not a single defence system that exists today that can stop it as of now. If the Brahmos is fired in a salvo, then even systems like the ESSM or Aster can be overwhelmed. The logic is simple; 1 ship, 1 MKI, 3 Brahmos.

SM-2 cannot stop the Brahmos, it is way too outdated and is meant for slower targets.

Do you believe a USN carrier fleet will allow an MKI wielding three Brahmos to get anywhere close to launch range?



DO NOT ADVERTISE ANYMORE CORPORATE BROCHURES

You don't need to launch Brahmos from a sukhoi, a sub launch or ship launch would do the trick, the
Brahmos is unstoppable people like to take comfort in a false sense of security,but that is the truth. Not just
Brahmos but any missile flying above MACH 2 fired in a salvo would achieve the same results. ESSM is uproven,
Sea sparrow unproven and ineffective beyond MACH 2.5.Phalanx ineffective did not save the HMH sheffield from
Arganetine exocet. AWACS would not pick up a missile flying 30 feet above sea level. LRCS and ECCM deception
tactics unproven and would not fool the missiles guidance system. Forget dreaming about intercepting
Brahmos someone explain how it would be detected first?? By the time it is detected one minute later would be the end.
Remember in 2005 a Chinese sub appeared undetected within 25 miles of a US carrier easy striking distance, even with all this
hype of technology,radar,AWACS etc .. could not pick up the sub until it surfaced and revealed itself. If a sub was undetected
I am 100% sure BRAHMOS will never be detected until it's too late and when it is still will be uninterceptable.


http://www.sinodaily.com/reports/Chi...ected_999.html

Chinese Sub Approached US Aircraft Carrier Undetected

A Chinese submarine came within a few miles (kilometers) of a US aircraft carrier in international waters near Okinawa last month without being detected, a Pentagon spokesman confirmed Tuesday. Spokesman Bryan Whitman played down the security breach, saying he did not believe the Chinese Song-class submarine was considered a threat.

"I think you're generating more concern than perhaps is warranted," he told reporters.

But submarines of the type involved in the incident carry weapons capable of striking a carrier from a distance of more than 25 miles (40 km), an expert on the Chinese military said.

"Any time a potentially hostile submare operates in such proximity to critical naval assets like an aircraft carrier should be of concern to American military leaders," said Richard Fisher.

The Washington
Times, which first reported the encounter, said the navy was reviewing its anti-submarine defenses and that China analysts at the Pentagon were surprised that a Chinese submarine was operating so far from the mainland.

Whitman said a US naval strike group led by the aircraft carrier USS Kitty Hawk was conducting routine training operations in the East China sea near Okinawa in October when the incident occurred.

"During these operations a Chinese Navy Song-class submarine was sighted near the strike group by US Navy aircraft," he said.

"My understanding is that this was several miles away," he said.

The Kitty Hawk was not actively engaged in anti-submarine warfare operations during the exercise, Whitman said, explaining why it did not detect the Chinese submarine sooner.

The Pentagon spokesman said he was not aware that any complaints had been lodged with the Chinese.

News of the incident came as commander of the US Pacific Fleed, Admiral Gary Roughead, was in Beijing for talks with Chinese military leaders ahead of a joint search and rescue exercise in the South China Sea.

"I really would like to know what the intent is in some of the developments that I see in the PLA navy," Roughead told reporters Monday.

He said these included the expansion of China's submarine fleet and procurement of ships.

"I look foward to having discussions about what the vision is and perhaps what some of the operating doctrine might be," Roughead said.

Fisher said incidents at sea between the two navies are likely to increase as China's ocean-going naval operations expand in the years ahead.

"It is my opinion the Chinese are going to be posturing against US military forces in Asia increasingly in the coming years," he told AFP.

"They are building a blue water navy. They have made clear in the past, a bit more subtly but consistently, that they are not at all accepting of the American military presence in what they see as their sphere of influence," he said.

He said China appears to be building a base on the tip of Hainan Island
from which to deploy ballistic missile submarines and possibly future aircraft carriers across the South China Sea between China and Philippines.

"As a consequence I expect there may be many opportunities for naval incidents as the Chinese take exception to the presence of American navy ships transiting between northeast Asia and the Persian Gulf," he said.

Hainan Island was where a US Navy EP-3 surveillance plane collided with a Chinese fighter on April 1, 2001 in the last major US-Chinese military confrontation.

The latest incident occurred near Okinawa where the bulk of US forces in Japan are based.

"In the event of a general, out-of-the-blue Chinese attack against Taiwan, in my opinion they will also attack all American forces in Japan," Fisher said.

"Making sure their submarine commanders are familiar with operating around Okinawa or close to Japan is a competency the Chinese want to develop," he said.

If you say so - disbelief is your prerogative, you claim the Brahmos will go undetected because a submarine got close to an aircraft carrier during DEFCON 5 peace time protocol =omg=.
In any case I'm done talking about the Brahmos, folks here are too emotional to present rationale plausible arguments.

Not wrong, ramjets have nozzles to regulate air flow and the combustion is much more efficient than rocket motors. The "plume" is several times less.

How much of a thermal gradient do you think a sea-skimming missile is going to create? This isn't a storm front.

Don't waste my time reading wiki

Brahmos is 3m off the ocean's surface. Erieye is only capable of detecting cruise missiles at 180km max and that isn't for the extreme sea skimmers. It falls considerably closer when talking about Brahmos, 180km is for something that flies at a higher approach like Sandbox, Shipwrecker, Sea Eagle... ect. Not all AWACs are as advanced as Erieye either.

appearing during a training exercise where the best technology is present to detect subs,and still remaining undetected?? No explanation except it was peace time?? how many nations interfere in another nations exercise ??

It needs to realized that as the projectile delivery technology has progressed rapidly & still developing vigorously, to counter them parallel defense systems are not achieved. It requires entire new generation perspective to obtain reliable defense against present/ upcoming Hypersonic missiles. These missiles will beat conventional defense system; if not individually, definitely in saturation scenario.

If WW2 era SCUDS are a problem for the latest high tech systems, Supersonic and hypersonic missiles will remain uninterceptable for a long time, even if a 10 missiles are used costing 3 million dollars each to bring down a carrier worth 10 billion or more the cost is relatively low. I still don't understand how a missile flying at MACH 2.5 can chase down
an intercept a missile flying MACH 3 or how the seeker on this missile would be better than a seeker on a beyond visual range missile which cost 10 times more??

Exactly. Even if these missiles cost little high, their Salvo attack will pull down any active setup. It was rightly said by author i posted earlier -