Sukhoi PAK FA

[smestarz]

You can check out the US invasion of Iraq to understand how even a low tech opponent can damage highly capable aircraft's intent on Deep penetration missions. You will be surprised at the number of aircrafts the US and its chamchas lost.

Deep penetration against AWACS equipped air force would be suicidal.

Added Later - Oh and forgot to add, till the upgrades Jaguars did not have auto pilot.





P-8I or Su-34 or Tupolevs of various types are all easily detectable.

We can think of Su-34 in anti ship role only because there is no opponent for us in the Indian Ocean who can bring an AWACS along, yet.

But if you really wish to support a P-8I with a single refuel range of something like 8000 km+ then you need at least an aircraft with a range of 4000+6000 km. And since all aircrafts are detectable by AWACS hence only a lo-lo-lo mission will work and that too would be a circuitous route, avoiding the AWACS. Su-34 in such mode would give a combat radius of 500 km with one Brahmos. Off course, such a scenario can only get played out in the far future. But who knows how the Chinese might behave. What if they donate a few J-20s and a bigger AWACS on friendship prices to Pakis.

Probably our people saw the possibility of this and hence there was some talk of equipping Tu142s with Brahmos. Because unless you have a few Tu-142 or Tu22M or Tu160 on call with such weapons as Brahmos, you really cannot make the best use of the P-8I.

Even the Chinese for their own swimming pool use these longer ranged bombers with long ranged cruise missiles. Despite the fact that they too are not short of Su-27 category aircrafts.

Added Later: Jaguars too were equipped with Sea Eagles. You can see how well it worked and judge for yourself how good these smaller fighter bombers are in the maritime role.

Are you trying to imply that Jaguar is way better than Su-34 in strike/naval strike on lo lo lo mission?

 

[Khagesh]

Are you trying to imply that Jaguar is way better than Su-34 in strike/naval strike on lo lo lo mission?

O nahi bhai.

Jaguar IM had its day. That day was yesterday.

Su-34 (actually Su-30MKI) will have its day. That is today. That is why they are converting the Su30MKI that IAF has for Brahmos and these MKIs will work exactly as a Su-34 would. Very little difference only. While ultimately the IAF or SFC (!?) will get these MKIs, still it is easy to believe that these MKIs will be able to do Anti-Ship roles.

I am merely saying that in future, which is in any case being recognized as we speak, only the long range bombers will work these sort of anti ship roles. And further that we should welcome this since this will free up a major part of the flotilla for more important and urgent work. Ultimately cutting down costs.

 

[archie]

O nahi bhai.

That is today. That is why they are converting the Su30MKI that IAF has for Brahmos and these MKIs will work exactly as a Su-34 would. Very little difference only. While ultimately the IAF or SFC (!?) will get these MKIs, still it is easy to believe that these MKIs will be able to do Anti-Ship roles.

Off topic
Wonder if P8-I can be adopted to carry Brahamos in some way..

 

[SajeevJino]

O nahi bhai.

Jaguar IM had its day. That day was yesterday.

Su-34 (actually Su-30MKI) will have its day. That is today. That is why they are converting the Su30MKI that IAF has for Brahmos and these MKIs will work exactly as a Su-34 would. Very little difference only. While ultimately the IAF or SFC (!?) will get these MKIs, still it is easy to believe that these MKIs will be able to do Anti-Ship roles.

I am merely saying that in future, which is in any case being recognized as we speak, only the long range bombers will work these sort of anti ship roles. And further that we should welcome this since this will free up a major part of the flotilla for more important and urgent work. Ultimately cutting down costs.

Jaguar IM will be the best for Maritime strike till the Arrival of AMCA

The Jamnagar base have ten Jaguar IM fighters Armed with two Harpoon AShM, with two Drop Tanks and two ASRAAM missile, they have the Israeli Fire Control Radar too

The Combat radius for the Above Mission Package is more than 800 kilometers even in Very low altitude, that means the radius in lo lo lo mission,

the Su 34 is way too modern more powerful, High Speed, slightly more range even triple size of the above Jags Payload,

 

[SajeevJino]

Off topic
Wonder if P8-I can be adopted to carry Brahamos in some way..

why you need Brahmos on P 8I, it already have 4 Harpoons on it's wing, and unknown numbers of Mines and Torpedo's in it's Internal weapon Bay

 

[Khagesh]

Both Jaguar IM and Harpoons are just plain inadequate. Only way Harpoons make some sense is by mounting them on some really long legged aircrafts. These things touch nothing in the real world.

Here's why:

Indian Strategic Studies: Germany Needs a Permanent Naval Presence in the Indian Ocean


Had we had a proper strategic asset with our navy most of these people would not have tried what they are trying.

Oh and that 800 km circle above. The pilot won't be coming back if you attempt it full low level mission. Would become a one way journey. Unless off course you are on a sight seeing picnic tour [Had forgot to add ]

 

[SajeevJino]

.
@Khagesh

then take P 8I with Harpoon Missile, which easily fit your Needs

Oh and that 800 km circle above. The pilot won't be coming back if you attempt it full low level mission. Would become a one way journey. Unless off course you are on a sight seeing picnic tour [Had forgot to add ]

Sir I clearly mentioned it's the Combat radius in lo lo lo mission, not the Ferry Range as you mentioned above

 

[Khagesh]

Dekh @sanjivJino bhai. I agree you are a stubborn man. You win, I lose.

@Rest of the people-Just google. The 800/900 km radius comes only with external fuel, which is also the time you just want to do a sight seeing tour after flying 800/900 km.

 

[SajeevJino]

@Rest of the people-Just google. The 800/900 km radius comes only with external fuel, which is also the time you just want to do a sight seeing tour after flying 800/900 km.

Do even read my last post. what I said about 800km combat radius

Two drop Tanks , Two Harpoon AShM , Two ASRAAM, - Combat Radius 800 km in lo lo lo Mission Profile


I make sure again Drop Tanks means External fuel

 

[Khagesh]

See I had told you. You are ziddi .

Arre bhai both Harpoons and Jaguar are just not going to cut it for ocean duty where the targets move around by the time you fly for more than an hour to deliver two piddly missiles and get hunted by the other guys aircrafts. With the load out you are suggesting there will be a speed penalty which will make the Jaguar a prize target while it flies out of Jamnagar.

See there is no free lunch. Looks good on paper - this many missiles, fuel too. But lousy performance. You want to plan a mission, dhinchak performance with good loadout and good chances of not getting killed you go bigger. Jaguar too small.

 

[archie]

why you need Brahmos on P 8I, it already have 4 Harpoons on it's wing, and unknown numbers of Mines and Torpedo's in it's Internal weapon Bay

For Range of attack and potency of attack speed.. 300Kms and sure kill even against CIWS.

 

[akshay m]

a bit of news here

a reputed international journalist who goes by the name deino in many forums told me this

First of all one good news: '055' will indeed be rebuild (by canibalising T-50-6) and more not really good news:

Here's an interesting overview of the so far achieved flight hours + flights for the individual T50s

T-50-1 - is being revised in OKB "Sukhoi", operating time 219 hours 197 landings.
T-50-2 - located in Zhukovsky, operating time of 123 hours, 141 landings.
T-50-3 - in LIiDB Akhtubinsk, operating time of 181 hours, 92 landings.
T-50-4 - in LIiDB Akhtubinsk, operating time of 74 hours, 49 landings.
T-50-5R - is in the final assembly shop KnAAZ. 5P - a project to restore the machine T-50-5 with elements of T-50-6, stopped in production.
...
Finally, so good clarity in future T-50's designations;
- T-50-5 became T-50-5R, will cannibalize T-50-6.
- T-50-6 is what we referred to as T-50-6-1 as before; IE a flying frame of "phase 1".
- T-50-6-1 is in fact a static frame of "phase 2", now known as T-50-7.
- T-50-6-2 is flying phase 2 frame, so we always had that right.
And for future frames;
...
50-6 was stopped, as it was decided to proceed with the construction of "2nd phase" aircraft. T50-6-1 - is a static testing frame, which turned into a T50-7 and now its fuselage [the most basic translation] is in Zhukovsky, wings (basically) and stabilizers are still here [at KnAAZ]. T50-6-2 - transitioning frame to the 2nd phase, has its fuselage now docket and handed over to the final assembly shop. Also this year will be put T50-8 (now there is a dock fuselage) and T50-9 (year-end). T-50-9 promise with the new engines [Izd 30 or whatever they are now testing on "710"?]. In 2016, the planned are 50-10, 50-11 and static testing frame 50-12.
Deino

 

[akshay m]

 

[akshay m]

things seem to be moving??????????

Demonstrator of a new engine for the fighter T-50 will be in 2015

The technical design of the engine of the second stage for the fifth-generation fighter T-50 made in 2015 will be made the first engine demonstrator. This was stated in an interview with "Lente.ru" CEO "United Engine Building Corporation" (UEC) Vladislav Masalov.

"The technical design of the second stage engine for the PAK FA is made, and is currently being developed design documentation for the production of prototypes of the engine," said Masalov, noting that the work on the engine are conducted in full accordance with the schedule determined by state contract.



Masalov said that the first demonstrator engine of the second stage will be made in 2015. Earlier Masalov already stated the press that the first flight of the T-50 with the new engines will be held in 2017.

Currently fifth generation fighter T-50, produced by the Sukhoi Design Bureau under the program PAK FA, flies on the so-called "engines of the first stage of" AL-41F1 ("Article 117"). When mass production is planned to replace them on the "engines of the second stage" (in the press, they were called "article 30"), which have improved characteristics. It was reported that these motors are superior to the AL-41F1 on the basic parameters of 15-25 percent, and may provide a supersonic cruising speed.

there seems to be another article but i cannot make head or tail of these

PD for the PAK FA (article 30). Developer - JSC "Ufa Engine Industrial Association" (represented by the branch "OKB. Lyul'ko").
Successfully carried out the protection of the technical project for the AP on the PAK FA Commission considered part of the object T-50 technical articles 30 project . It is confirmed that the submissions final technical solutions for the product, giving a complete picture of the product design process and fundamental decisions on its manufacture in an industrial environment and basically meet the requirements of the Terms of Reference. The Commission recommended to proceed with the ROC to build the product.placed an order for 12 additional products 117 objects PAK FA T-50 2 stages . That is, in the near 7-10 years of the second stage engine will not now exist in the main only those. documentation of the engine (30 products) do not exist even in poster form. The consequence of that for the first 6 PAK-FA ordered 12 of the second stage engine of the first stage (article 117) .http://www.umpo.ru/Files/godovoy_otchet_2013_ot_05. 06.14.pdf

 

[sorcerer]

New Robotic Russian T-50 Fighter Jet Fit for Star Wars

Read more: http://sputniknews.com/russia/20150525/1022530075.html#ixzz3bDOOrEM6

Russia's new fifth-generation T-50 fighter jet, currently in the testing phase, incorporates elements of automation which make it more like a robot than a fighter plane, explains a representative from the Rostech corporation.

The Sukhoi PAK FA fighter jet, also known as T-50, is ready to go into production next year, and boasts innovative technology which renders the pilot one part of the plane's whole control system.

"The PAK FA is already to some degree a flying robot, where the aviator fulfils the function not only of pilot, but is actually one of the constituent parts of the flying apparatus," explained deputy head of the Concern Radioelectronic Technologies [KRET] unit of Rostech, Vladimir Mikheyev. "That is, the reaction of the aviator is a part of the control loop."

Mikheyev explains that "smart paneling" is another of the jet's smart features. "If we take the wingtip, from one perspective it functions as a wing, but from another it's also a part of the Himalaya active defense system."

In October KRET stated it had delivered the first batch of Himalayas for the aircraft, which were developed by a KRET subsidiary in Kaluga and constructed at the Stavropol Radioplant Signal.

"The unique system of active and passive radars and optical rangefinders is integrated into the aircraft body and acts as a 'smart skin'. Its use not only enhances the aircraft’s protection against jamming and its survivability, but also counters, to a great extent, the effects of low-observability [stealth] technology of enemy aircraft," explained KRET.

In January KRET lifted the lid on a number of the T-50's stealth capabilities, announcing that "the aircraft company Sukhoi managed to greatly reduce the effective surface scattering of the PAK FA, which is the basic element for visibility on aircraft radars."

"In order to achieve this level of stealth, designers moved all weapons to the inside of the plane and also changed the shape of the air intake channel, also lining its walls with a material that absorbs radio waves."

"Thanks to these new design solutions, the T-50 is now ahead of not only all other fighters of the Russian Army, but also foreign models. For example, the visibility of the American fifth-generation F-22 fighter is 0.3-0.4 square meters," said KRET, while the value of this indicator for the T-50 fighter is between 0.1 and 1 square meters.

"The T-50 is the first Russian combat aircraft made from a high proportion of composite materials, making up 25% of the mass of the aircraft and covering 70% of its surface," explained KRET.


The T-50 is set to replace the Sukhoi Su-27 fourth generation fighter jet, known also by its NATO name Flanker B, which entered service with the Soviet Air Forces in 1985, and the Mig-29, known by NATO as Fulcrum which entered service in 1983.

Work on the conception of fifth generation fighter jets began in the late 1980s in the USA and USSR; though there is no universally agreed set of features for the title of fifth-generation fighter jet, many hold that the only combat-ready fifth-generation fighter is the US Air Force's Lockheed F-22 Raptor, introduced in 2005.

In December Russia's United Aircraft Corporation announced that production of the fighter is ready to begin in 2016, following the completion of the testing phase. According to spokesman Vladislav Goncharenko, 55 PAK FA jets will be delivered to the Russian Air Force by 2020.



Read more: http://sputniknews.com/russia/20150525/1022530075.html#ixzz3bDOXO4yh
==
ooh baby baby!

 

[Pulkit]

New Robotic Russian T-50 Fighter Jet Fit for Star Wars

Read more: http://sputniknews.com/russia/20150525/1022530075.html#ixzz3bDOOrEM6

Russia's new fifth-generation T-50 fighter jet, currently in the testing phase, incorporates elements of automation which make it more like a robot than a fighter plane, explains a representative from the Rostech corporation.

The Sukhoi PAK FA fighter jet, also known as T-50, is ready to go into production next year, and boasts innovative technology which renders the pilot one part of the plane's whole control system.

"The PAK FA is already to some degree a flying robot, where the aviator fulfils the function not only of pilot, but is actually one of the constituent parts of the flying apparatus," explained deputy head of the Concern Radioelectronic Technologies [KRET] unit of Rostech, Vladimir Mikheyev. "That is, the reaction of the aviator is a part of the control loop."

Mikheyev explains that "smart paneling" is another of the jet's smart features. "If we take the wingtip, from one perspective it functions as a wing, but from another it's also a part of the Himalaya active defense system."

In October KRET stated it had delivered the first batch of Himalayas for the aircraft, which were developed by a KRET subsidiary in Kaluga and constructed at the Stavropol Radioplant Signal.

"The unique system of active and passive radars and optical rangefinders is integrated into the aircraft body and acts as a 'smart skin'. Its use not only enhances the aircraft’s protection against jamming and its survivability, but also counters, to a great extent, the effects of low-observability [stealth] technology of enemy aircraft," explained KRET.

In January KRET lifted the lid on a number of the T-50's stealth capabilities, announcing that "the aircraft company Sukhoi managed to greatly reduce the effective surface scattering of the PAK FA, which is the basic element for visibility on aircraft radars."

"In order to achieve this level of stealth, designers moved all weapons to the inside of the plane and also changed the shape of the air intake channel, also lining its walls with a material that absorbs radio waves."

"Thanks to these new design solutions, the T-50 is now ahead of not only all other fighters of the Russian Army, but also foreign models. For example, the visibility of the American fifth-generation F-22 fighter is 0.3-0.4 square meters," said KRET, while the value of this indicator for the T-50 fighter is between 0.1 and 1 square meters.

"The T-50 is the first Russian combat aircraft made from a high proportion of composite materials, making up 25% of the mass of the aircraft and covering 70% of its surface," explained KRET.


The T-50 is set to replace the Sukhoi Su-27 fourth generation fighter jet, known also by its NATO name Flanker B, which entered service with the Soviet Air Forces in 1985, and the Mig-29, known by NATO as Fulcrum which entered service in 1983.

Work on the conception of fifth generation fighter jets began in the late 1980s in the USA and USSR; though there is no universally agreed set of features for the title of fifth-generation fighter jet, many hold that the only combat-ready fifth-generation fighter is the US Air Force's Lockheed F-22 Raptor, introduced in 2005.

In December Russia's United Aircraft Corporation announced that production of the fighter is ready to begin in 2016, following the completion of the testing phase. According to spokesman Vladislav Goncharenko, 55 PAK FA jets will be delivered to the Russian Air Force by 2020.



Read more: http://sputniknews.com/russia/20150525/1022530075.html#ixzz3bDOXO4yh
==
ooh baby baby!

Will we be getting some T-50 Till FGFA is ready just like the Su 30?

 

[sorcerer]

^^

Is this the reason why Rafale is stuck at 36?
PM is visiting Russia in July!

 

[Anikastha]

^^

Is this the reason why Rafale is stuck at 36?
PM is visiting Russia in July!

We are getting only 36 rafales???WTF!!

 

[Bangalibaba]

http://nationalinterest.org/blog/th...pak-fa-fighter-stealthier-americas-f-22-12972

 

[Bangalibaba]

sorry wrong details provided..