Future Infantry Combat Vehicle (FICV)

Anupu

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Seems like there are some issues with the bidding process of FICV, It seems like TATA Motors may have some difficulty although it do claim they have sorted it out? So can someone clarify the picture for me.

Also it seems like OFB has been nominated as a DA, although it seems like there is a confusion whether it is an extra DA or one among the two in already announced. If it is indeed one of the two it seems like government has already given one spot to OFB without any competition, don't you think it's unfair for private players?
 

WolfPack86

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The Indian train manufacturer, Texmaco Rail & Engineering Company, has signed a memorandum of understanding with Rosoboronexport. This document concerns an agreement on the licensed production of Russian armoured vehicles by the Indian company, according to various news reports.

The agreement was signed to facilitate the transfer of Russian technology during implementation of joint projects. This involves the repair and modernization of armoured vehicles, currently being used in the Indian Army, launch of the co-production of the BMP-3 and the “development and production of futuristic models” of armoured technologies.

Russia proposed in 2012 that India purchase the BMP-3, but the Indian side rejected this offer. The new agreement indicates that India has in fact accepted the earlier Russian proposal.

In December 2013, the media reported that India had refused to purchase the infantry combat vehicles being proposed by Russia (this also involved licenced production), having decided to build its own armoured vehicle – the FICV (Futuristic Infantry Combat Vehicle). However, the task of building its own armoured vehicles posed difficulties for Indian industry, with no clear ideas as to when this could be accomplished.

Currently, the Indian armed forces operate Soviet-made BMP-1 and BMP-2 infantry combat vehicles, but Indian military commanders are no longer satisfied with this old technology. Reports have also appeared that India was planning to conduct large-scale modernization of its BMP-2 fleet.
https://www.facebook.com/TeamAMCA/photos?ref=page_internal
 

tharun

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Total FICV project is about 7.5$ billion..
What is the protection level of tata kestrel?
And how many BMP 1& 2's are there in service?
 

Prashant12

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Centre fast-tracks ‘Make in India’ infantry combat vehicle project

NEW DELHI: The Union defence ministry is finally fast-tracking the long-pending mega 'Make in India' project to produce at least 2,610 future infantry combat vehicles (FICVs) for the Army at an estimated cost of about Rs 60,000 crore.

MoD sources said two of the five private contenders in the fray, apart from the Ordnance Factory Board (OFB), "will soon be selected" to design and build prototypes for the FICVs.

The government will fund 80% of the development cost, which could be around Rs 3,000-4,000 crore.

"The best prototype will then be selected for mass production. The ministry's integrated project management team (IPMT) is in the final stage of evaluating the EoI (expression of interest) responses submitted by the OFB and five private vendors," said a source. The private contenders are L&T, Mahindra, Pipavav Defence & Offshore Engineering and two consortiums of Tata Motors-Bharat Forge and Tata Power SED-Titagarh Wagons.

Basically armoured personnel carriers designed to swiftly transport infantry soldiers into the battlefield behind tanks, the FICVs are meant to gradually replace the old Russian-origin BMP-II infantry combat vehicles in the Army. Though not as deadly and well-protected as main-battle tanks, the amphibious troop carriers will have their own anti-tank missiles, cannons and machine guns.

The 1.3-million strong Army, incidentally, has 63 armoured regiments of T-90S, T-72 and Arjun tanks, backed by 44 Mechanised Infantry units with their BMPs, for swift multiple ground offensives into enemy territory.

But the FICV project has so far failed to take off due to glitches and controversies since it was first accorded "acceptance of necessity" under the 'Make (Hi-Tech)' category in October 2009. The previous EoI, issued in May 2010, was cancelled by the MoD after major faults were found in the evaluation process in December 2012.

The MoD hopes similar mistakes with the fresh EoI, which was issued in July last year, will not be repeated. But while the IPMT has sought repeated clarifications from the contenders, it has not visited and inspected their manufacturing facilities for an on-ground assessment till now.
The EoI lays down the contenders will be assessed on four major counts: commercial, technical capability, availability of critical technologies and technical specifications of the FICVs they propose to build. The sheer size of the "lucrative" FICV project has even seen some countries hard-sell their infantry combat vehicles to India.

The US, for instance, has showcased its Stryker armoured vehicles during the joint 'Yudh Abhyas' exercises. But the government is pushing the Make in India project for the Army.

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...mbat-vehicle-project/articleshow/55931200.cms
 

Adioz

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Total FICV project is about 7.5$ billion..
What is the protection level of tata kestrel?
And how many BMP 1& 2's are there in service?
Kestrel's ballistic protection is modular to take care of threat levels, ranging from Stanag 4569 Level I to Level IV depending on the application. The monocoque comprises of welded armour steel hull with applique and inner composite spall liner. The protection modules can be replaced in a short time frame to increase or decrease the protection level. The bottom of the hull is guarded by blast protection up to Stanag 4569 Level III.

Stanag 4569 levels:-


AFAIK, BMP-1 has been retired. There are about 2,500 BMP-2 in service, the latest order being the one for 362 more BMP-2 that was placed in 2014. However, this means that the number of Mechanised Infantry battalion in Indian Army has now risen beyond 40. They must be converting more divisions into RAPIDs. Last I heard, an Infantry Division from XI corps was slated for conversion to RAPID.
 

tharun

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Kestrel's ballistic protection is modular to take care of threat levels, ranging from Stanag 4569 Level I to Level IV depending on the application. The monocoque comprises of welded armour steel hull with applique and inner composite spall liner. The protection modules can be replaced in a short time frame to increase or decrease the protection level. The bottom of the hull is guarded by blast protection up to Stanag 4569 Level III.

Stanag 4569 levels:-


AFAIK, BMP-1 has been retired. There are about 2,500 BMP-2 in service, the latest order being the one for 362 more BMP-2 that was placed in 2014. However, this means that the number of Mechanised Infantry battalion in Indian Army has now risen beyond 40. They must be converting more divisions into RAPIDs. Last I heard, an Infantry Division from XI corps was slated for conversion to RAPID.
Level IV is waste we need better protection minimum level 5
 

SajeevJino

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Total FICV project is about 7.5$ billion..
What is the protection level of tata kestrel?
And how many BMP 1& 2's are there in service?
Kestral is not for FICV, yes FICV will replace all BMP from Army service, bot now, maybe after 2025

please don't confuse yourself about FICV and Kestral
 

Adioz

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Kestral is not for FICV, yes FICV will replace all BMP from Army service, bot now, maybe after 2025

please don't confuse yourself about FICV and Kestral
Then Kestrel is for?:confused1:

And the units that get Kestrel, will they be considered as Mech. infantry?
How many wheeled ICVs do we plan to have?
 

SajeevJino

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Then Kestrel is for?:confused1:

And the units that get Kestrel, will they be considered as Mech. infantry?
How many wheeled ICVs do we plan to have?
It's a wheeled IFV , as you already said

As I think, It's more of armored carrier, can be used in urban and COIN operations
 

Chinmoy

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MoD sources said two of the five private contenders in the fray, apart from the Ordnance Factory Board (OFB), "will soon be selected" to design and build prototypes for the FICVs.

The government will fund 80% of the development cost, which could be around Rs 3,000-4,000 crore.

"The best prototype will then be selected for mass production.
The EoI lays down the contenders will be assessed on four major counts: commercial, technical capability, availability of critical technologies and technical specifications of the FICVs they propose to build.
Now these two are the most important and striking point in the whole article. Seems finally MoD is turning over a new leaf and seriously thinking of competition and product over here. Although OFB is there in fray by default, but inclusion of Pvt players with JV would make the competition much more tough for them.
Hope now we could see some real technical designs coming out of the stable.
 

tharun

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It's a wheeled IFV , as you already said

As I think, It's more of armored carrier, can be used in urban and COIN operations
It's highest armor rating says it can stop only upto 14.5mm...If you go to war attack helios have 25mm then what?
 

Kunal Biswas

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Original FICV program included both wheeled and tracked vehicles ..
 

SilentKiller

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It's highest armor rating says it can stop only upto 14.5mm...If you go to war attack helios have 25mm then what?
Protect it with SAM's cover, indian attach heli's etc.
Too much armor, APC becomes heavy...transportation becomes an issue. Also both FICV or Kestrel are not supposed to take on MBT's, they are supposed to support Armor columns, Kestrel to transport troops, COIN operation, cover to troops and RAPID deployments etc.
FICV - Tracked version, will have 30mm or greater auto cannon, will have at least 14mm protection suits (which should be standard) and uparmored kits for 25mm protection. Also 25mm armor kit will make FICV too heavy to be able to float or used in amphibous operations. its a BMP replacement and BMP2 cannot withstand a 14mm fire.
Kestrel - Wheeled, more troop carrying capacity, 14mm to 30mm Auto cannon...armor protection till Stanag Lvl 3, upgraded to Lvl 4 atmost.
Note protection lvls discussed are overall, usually frontal armor for FICV or APC (Kestral) will be able to withstand 30mm direct hits inpike on overall protection limited to only 7.62mm
 

sthf

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Then Kestrel is for?:confused1:

And the units that get Kestrel, will they be considered as Mech. infantry?
How many wheeled ICVs do we plan to have?
Primary role of Kestrel as far as I can see is recon. Secondary roles could be troop transport, air defence, anti armour etc. According to Tata, Nag module can be fitted onto Kestrel. Probably same goes for the upcoming QRSAM/SRSAM.

As a troop transport, it carries 10, has pretty decent armour and good firepower. I don't think it is lacking anything.

It's highest armor rating says it can stop only upto 14.5mm...If you go to war attack helios have 25mm then what?
If you mean attack helis, then most of them carry 30mm cannons and most if none of the wheeled IFVs out there are protected from the top hit 30mm sabot rounds.

Secondly, defending armour from aerial threats is the responsibility of Army Air Defence and IAF.
 

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