Massive Russian Military Movement

[asianobserve]

Just to clear my doubts, which group according to you is currently holding the current govt?

It is the opposition parliament members that are in charge of the Ukrainian government in coalition.

Wikipedia provides some information on the current government:

The Yatsenyuk Government (Ukrainian: Уряд Арсенія Яценюка) was created in Ukraine after the 2014 Ukrainian revolution.

Creation[edit]

Following anti-government Euromaidan protests that began in 2013, and culminated in the 21 February 2014 impeachment of President Viktor Yanukovych in the 2014 Ukrainian revolution.[1] The government was first presented at Kiev's main Euromaidan protest camp at Maidan Nezalezhnosti on 26 February 2014.[2] The government was voted on by Verkhovna Rada on 27 February 2014.[3][4] There were no government posts for the UDAR party; that is led by one of the Euromaidan leaders Vitali Klitschko.[5][6]

On its first day 250 MPs sign up to join coalition including the Batkivshchyna, UDAR, Svoboda factions, the Economic Development and Sovereign European Ukraine groups and other MPs.[7]

Yatsenyuk Government - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And here is a more detained background on how Yanukovych was ousted from power:

KIEV, Ukraine—The whereabouts of President Viktor Yanukovych were unknown Sunday, the day after he left the capital, protesters took control of the city center, and opposition leader and former Prime Minister Yulia Tymoshenko was released from prison.

The center of Kiev was calm the day after parliament voted to remove the president and set new presidential elections for May 25.

Ukraine's parliament voted to formalize the interim transfer of presidential power to the newly elected parliament speaker Oleksandr Turchynov, the first deputy chairman of the Batkivshchyna party.

Parliament will also be voting for a new prime minister, something that may happen today. Three candidates are being considered: Ms. Tymoshenko, Arseniy Yatsenyuk, the leader of Batkivshchyna, and lawmaker and businessman Petro Poroshenko.

xxx

Dozens of legislators defected on Saturday from Mr. Yanukovych's Party of Regions, while a majority of those who remained voted for his ouster in the parliament vote, said Serhiy Tihipko, a senior party member. "We tried for a long time to reach him today but not a single phone worked, none of his aides, not anyone could be reached," Mr. Tihipko told reporters in the parliament. "Members of the party who were in parliament today felt abandoned."

Ukraine President Driven From Power - WSJ.com

Now you know how Yanukovych was ousted from power. You know now why Akim said his ouster was legitimate?

 

[aerokan]

hi Akim IMo Kissinger's prescriptions《How to end the Ukraine crisis》 I posted the other day seem practical to retain an integrated Ukraine - including 1. the right to assciate with EU 2. not join NATO 3. internal reconcilliation (among diff. factions/regions) to pursue a posture comparable to Finland not allowing institutional hostility to Rudsia 4. higher autonomy of Crimea to assure Russia with the Black Sea Naval base status.

A federation sounds an answer. The ball in Ukrainian interim cabinet's court to resolve current dilemma. What do ya think?

Sent from my 5910 using Tapatalk 2

They won't do it!! Because they don't have any intention to do it!! US doesn't want any reasonable solution to the problem. You can't stop a person who is hell bent on shooting himself in the foot.. be it Ukraine or US !! End of story!!

 

[Razor]

Yeah. Not even RT anchors and reporters buy that claim of yours since they are speaking out against RT's "whitewash coverage" of Ukraine.

Western anchors have gotten fired for disagreeing with the official US govt stories on Iraq war.
Meanwhile Abby Martin still has her job at RT and is still criticizing Russia's stance while the other anchor quit on her own (so not much can be done there.)
I wouldn't say RT is run by saints, but RT is much more reliable than any mainstream Western media outlet.

 

[asianobserve]

The Global Research, or many of the irregular news sources tend to be more reliable than the "agenda" news channels.

So are you saying that you believe more RT, Global Research and their comrades than Akim?

 

[Akim]

Go to Russia and find out how many refugee applications are coming in for the last few months and the sudden increase in the last few days after this issue started. I guess you already knew Russian!!

This tales. We have no closed borders nor refugees. There, are groups of people who go to relatives in Russia, and Poland. My acquainted, sent the son to the relatives in Moscow. But it is not massively.

 

[pmaitra]

I do not know.

You like in Ukraine. I was hoping you would know. Anyway, there are a lot of narratives, from "mainstream" western sources.

[HR][/HR]

Notice, how the truth eventually comes out.

20 Feb 2014

Ukraine crisis: snipers filmed 'shooting at protesters' in Kiev
Footage emerges purporting to show snipers from the Ukrainian security forces shooting at protesters in Kiev

Link: Video: Ukraine crisis: snipers filmed 'shooting at protesters' in Kiev - Telegraph

20 February 2014

Harrowing footage emerges of UNARMED protesters being cut down by sniper fire on a day of violence in Kiev that has brought today's death toll to at least 70

Link: Harrowing footage emerges of UNARMED protesters being cut down by sniper fire on a day of violence in Kiev that has brought today's death toll to at least 70 | Mail Online

5 March 2014

Estonian Foreign Ministry confirms authenticity of leaked phone call discussing how Kiev snipers who shot protesters were possibly hired by Ukraine's new leaders

Link: Estonian Foreign Ministry confirms authenticity of leaked phone call discussing how Kiev snipers who shot protesters were possibly hired by Ukraine's new leaders | Mail Online

March 06, 2014 13:03

Kiev snipers hired by Maidan leaders - leaked EU's Ashton phone tape

Link: Kiev snipers hired by Maidan leaders - leaked EU's Ashton phone tape — RT News

[HR][/HR]

Now, here is what those that have an agenda do to spread lies, by subtly priming the minds of the people, with concocted stories.

Western government Lies:
February 26, 2014

Elite riot police disbanded

Earlier Wednesday, acting Interior Minister Arsen Avakov announced that a riot police force used against anti-government protesters in Ukraine had been disbanded.

Demonstrators accused the elite Berkut force, deployed by the government of Yanukovych to quell recent protests, of using excessive force.

Avakov said on his Facebook page that he'd signed the order disbanding the force Tuesday.

The great US government mouthpiece CNN: http://www.cnn.com/2014/02/26/world/europe/ukraine-politics/

More western lies:
4 March 2014

Five fibs from Vladimir: how Putin distorted the facts about Ukraine
. . .
Protesters in Ukraine were killed by former opposition snipers
. . .

Even left-wing Guardian fell for it, so much is the propaganda of lies: http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/mar/04/vladimir-putin-interview-five-untruths

Looking at the last quote, the Guardian accuses Putin of "distorting" facts when Putin claimed that the protesters were killed by the former opposition snipers. Eventually, the truth came out.

[HR][/HR]
So, we see that the west has been falling over each other to brand Putin a liar, but he always turns out to be the most honest politician. Of course, I would expect resident trolls like @asianobserve to continue with their rants, but from you @Akim, I had better expectation, since you live in Ukraine, and you should know better than I.

 

[asianobserve]

I wish people would stop using label "troll" against somebody who is supporting opinions that they don't agree with. I don't use that term against people who do not agree with me. This is I think the basest form of ad hominem designed to discredit opinion.

 

[sunny_10]

It is rather interesting that Obama, the first black President of the USA is bending over backwards trying to help the anti-Semitic neo-Nazis of Ukraine.

Barack Obama as a black president followed 2008 recession. and since then, whether Libya war, Syria war, any type of political conflicts/ economic conflicts etc, all can be done while keeping a black president on the front..........

he is nothing but for the purpose to defend those who are worried for this changing world, and its religious/racial/identity/cultural/language aspects etc. and keeping a black president, with keep doing a publicity that he is in fact a Muslim too, all are intended to legalize any wrong done on his name.......

before the world may get completely changed, they want to get something done/agreed, and i found mainly Commonwealth nations/UK, along with a good support from the whole west too to an extent,.......... all the mentalities are being gathered for this purpose, while keeping his face on the front......

 

[Akim]

hi Akim IMo Kissinger's prescriptions《How to end the Ukraine crisis》 I posted the other day seem practical to retain an integrated Ukraine - including 1. the right to assciate with EU 2. not join NATO 3. internal reconcilliation (among diff. factions/regions) to pursue a posture comparable to Finland not allowing institutional hostility to Rudsia 4. higher autonomy of Crimea to assure Russia with the Black Sea Naval base status.

A federation sounds an answer. The ball in Ukrainian interim cabinet's court to resolve current dilemma. What do ya think?

Sent from my 5910 using Tapatalk 2

I am also FOR Ukraine into a Federation. But today this is not a solution. It must be a long process: a year or two.

 

[Akim]

So, we see that the west has been falling over each other to brand Putin a liar, but he always turns out to be the most honest politician. Of course, I would expect resident trolls like @asianobserve to continue with their rants, but from you @Akim, I had better expectation, since you live in Ukraine, and you should know better than I.

Now, is going information war. Black trying to make white. And trust only mass media - thankless job. This is a must see. I haven't seen, so I do not know.

 

[pmaitra]

Now, is going information war. Black trying to make white. And trust only mass media - thankless job. This is a must see. I haven't seen, so I do not know.

Right, so eventually, what matters is what we believe, not what happened. Of course, we can always argue that I wasn't there, so I don't know. Technically correct, so let's follow the heart.

I wish people would stop using label "troll" against somebody who is supporting opinions that they don't agree with. I don't use that term against people who do not agree with me. This is I think the basest form of ad hominem designed to discredit opinion.

I wish you would stop trolling.

Especially, your tendency to do this:

A Red Herring is a fallacy in which an irrelevant topic is presented in order to divert attention from the original issue. The basic idea is to "win" an argument by leading attention away from the argument and to another topic. This sort of "reasoning" has the following form:

Topic A is under discussion.
Topic B is introduced under the guise of being relevant to topic A (when topic B is actually not relevant to topic A).
Topic A is abandoned.

 

[asianobserve]

BTW, can you return my edit button? I'm having a hard time posting.

 

[asianobserve]

Right, so eventually, what matters is what we believe, not what happened. Of course, we can always argue that I wasn't there, so I don't know. Technically correct, so let's follow the heart.



I wish you would stop trolling.

Especially, your tendency to do this:

Where is my red herring? When you see me ignoring a post directed at me it is not so much to deviate the topic it is simply to ignore because either (1) the post is designed to incite personal attack (I do not want to get entangled anymore in personal confrontations because I am always turned into a sacrificial lamb and gets suspended) or (2) it is absolutely outlandish that I do not have to respond to it.

 

[Akim]

Right, so eventually, what matters is what we believe, not what happened. Of course, we can always argue that I wasn't there, so I don't know. Technically correct, so let's follow the heart.



I wish you would stop trolling.

Especially, your tendency to do this:

The heart is a bad counselor. Here's Putin says that in Crimea there are no Russian troops, and only Crimean militiamen, heart, want to believe. But, I am a professional military and can distinguishes a soldier from the militia.

 

[pmaitra]

BTW, can you return my edit button? I'm having a hard time posting.

When posting, click on [Go Advanced], write your post, click [Preview Post], and if satisfied, click [Submit Reply]. Edit button is a privilege. You may get it back later.

 

[asianobserve]

The heart is a bad counselor. Here's Putin says that in Crimea there are no Russian troops, and only Crimean militiamen, heart, want to believe. But, I am a professional military and distinguishes a soldier from the militia.

Actually, even if you're not a soldier, the sight alone of those well disciplined, well uniformed, well armed (complete with individual headset radios), with heavy military vehicles, stationed on key civilian and military infrastructures (airports, major roads and military bases), will tell you that they are not ordinary militias. They are professional Russian soldiers. I don't know why some people here cannot see that?

Russian troops surround Ukrainian military base in Crimea – video | World news | theguardian.com

 

[pmaitra]

The heart is a bad counselor. Here's Putin says that in Crimea there are no Russian troops, and only Crimean militiamen, heart, want to believe. But, I am a professional military and can distinguishes a soldier from the militia.

I agree. There are Russian troops. As a matter of fact, there are elite Russian troops. Putin denies that, but why does it matter? Whether he speaks the truth, or lies, he is always a liar. The end justifies the means. Since the new regime came to power after signing an agreement and violating it, and using violence, Putin must be excused for no longer following the "ethical" rules.

 

[aerokan]

The heart is a bad counselor. Here's Putin says that in Crimea there are no Russian troops, and only Crimean militiamen, heart, want to believe. But, I am a professional military and can distinguishes a soldier from the militia.

Nobody has any questions whether they are Russian soldiers or militia. But as long as there are claims of 'peaceful' Euromaidan protestors, there will be 'peaceful' Self-defence forces in Crimea. I guess a professional military man can distinguish a peaceful protester from a 'peaceful' protester. :thumb:

 

[asianobserve]

I agree. There are Russian troops. As a matter of fact, there are elite Russian troops. Putin denies that, but why does it matter? Whether he speaks the truth, or lies, he is always a liar.

I matters because it means that if he has so brazenly lied on that otherwise very obvious matter then you know that he is lying on other matters that are not so obvious.

The end justifies the means. Since the new regime came to power after signing an agreement and violating it, and using violence, Putin must be excused for no longer following the "ethical" rules.

Akim already explained that Yanukovych was ousted from power legitimately. Here's a snapshot of how he was ousted:

Dozens of legislators defected on Saturday from Mr. Yanukovych's Party of Regions, while a majority of those who remained voted for his ouster in the parliament vote, said Serhiy Tihipko, a senior party member. "We tried for a long time to reach him today but not a single phone worked, none of his aides, not anyone could be reached," Mr. Tihipko told reporters in the parliament. "Members of the party who were in parliament today felt abandoned."

Ukraine President Driven From Power - WSJ.com

 

[Akim]

Nobody has any questions whether they are Russian soldiers or militia. But as long as there are claims of 'peaceful' Euromaidan protestors, there will be 'peaceful' Self-defence forces in Crimea. I guess a professional military man can distinguish a peaceful protester from a 'peaceful' protester. :thumb:

'Peaceful' Euromaidan this confrontation between the opposition and the authorities. I spoke with one of the fighters of Odessa "Berkut". Would be the order would destroy it in an hour. But now, in fact, is the confrontation between the two countries, with powerful armies.