Thyssen-Krupp seeking a buyer for its naval business group

[Zebra]

Thyssenkrupp seeking a buyer for its naval business group | Defense Update:

Nov 24, 2014

According to media reports, ThyssenKrupp had started approaching potential buyers for its submarine unit, including French peer DCNS and German group Rheinmetall, whose main product is submarines......

 

[Zebra]

^^

Companies like L&T, RIL must contact PMO and try to get it.

What say....?

 

[pmaitra]

After two recessions, EuroZone is headed for a third recession.

GoI should buy up their facilities, and ship all their ship building instruments to India, and then auction them off to Indian private companies or keep it under MoD. A new submarine building facility in India would help. Buying strategic assets in a foreign country is not a good idea, especially in a region that can be easily arm-twisted.

 

[Zebra]

@Yusuf @thakur_ritesh @Singh @LETHALFORCE @Ray @Kunal Biswas @pmaitra @bengalraider @Pandora @NSG_Blackcats
@sob @Twinblade @arnabmit @sayareakd @sasi @sorcerer @SajeevJino @hitesh @Neil @DingDong

And @ all other DFI members.

What say...!

 

[Zebra]

After two recessions, EuroZone is headed for a third recession.

GoI should buy up their facilities, and ship all their ship building instruments to India, and then auction them off to Indian private companies or keep it under MoD. A new submarine building facility in India would help. Buying strategic assets in a foreign country is not a good idea, especially in a region that can be easily arm-twisted.

Sir, few of them will come in India, then why we can't go their?

 

[pmaitra]

Sir, few of them are coming in India, then why we can't go their?

We can go there. I just fear that if India purchases a submarine facility that is physically located in a foreign country, then that facility will be at the mercy of local laws and international arm-twisting.

My opinion is that India's strategic assets must be physically located in Indian territory.

Buying a submarine facility is very different from buying a truck factory in South Korea.

 

[Zebra]

We can go there. I just fear that if India purchases a submarine facility that is physically located in a foreign country, then that facility will be at the mercy of local laws and international arm-twisting.

My opinion is that India's strategic assets must be physically located in Indian territory.

Buying a submarine facility is very different from buying a truck factory in South Korea.

Sir, why you see it as a strategic assets?

Think it in terms of technology, it will be a great boost for Indian company, if it happens.

 

[Zebra]

^^

Take an example of Mahindra Aero.

 

[pmaitra]

Sir, why you see it as a strategic assets?

Think it in terms of technology, it will be a great boost for Indian company, if it happens.

Why do I see a submarine building facility as a strategic asset? I don't have an answer.

^^

Take an example of Mahindra Aero.

Don't care what a private company does - it can invest in that facility if it so wishes. I would like to focus on the areas where we are lagging, and plug the holes.

Can Mahindra Aero supply a fully Indian built no strings attached jet turbine for the HAL ALH or HAL LCA? I would like to see private Indian companies participate in these extremely high-tech areas, but the reality is, it isn't going to happen anytime soon.

 

[Zebra]

Why do I see a submarine building facility as a strategic asset? I don't have an answer.

Don't care what a private company does - it can invest in that facility if it so wishes. I would like to focus on the areas where we are lagging, and plug the holes.

Can Mahindra Aero supply a fully Indian built no strings attached jet turbine for the HAL ALH or HAL LCA? I would like to see private Indian companies participate in these extremely high-tech areas, but the reality is, it isn't going to happen anytime soon.

Sir, how much money India spent on ToT for marine equipments and/or ships!

Now there is a good chance to get them.

But very unfortunate that few people missed to see this opportunity.

On top of it, Aero Industry has many more to offer other than just 'jet turbines'.

At this stage we got a chance to get few of those 'many more' things.

Let me tell you even one of the US giant was also interested in it. It is very good for India that Mahindra manage to get it.

When ever time will come then we may try to get that 'jet turbine' thing also.

But it doesn't make sense at all that if we can't get 'jet turbine' tech then say no to all other part of Aero industry.

 

[Zebra]

https://www.thyssenkrupp-marinesystems.com/en/home.html

https://www.thyssenkrupp-marinesystems.com/en/submarines.html

https://www.thyssenkrupp-marinesystems.com/en/naval-surface-vessels.html

 

[pmaitra]

Sir, how much money India spent on ToT for marine equipments and/or ships!

Now there is a good chance to get them.

But very unfortunate that few people missed to see this opportunity.

On top of it, Aero Industry has many more to offer other than just 'jet turbines'.

At this stage we got a chance to get few of those 'many more' things.

Let me tell you even one of the US giant was also interested in it. It is very good for India that Mahindra manage to get it.

When ever time will come then we may try to get that 'jet turbine' thing also.

But it doesn't make sense at all that if we can't get 'jet turbine' tech then say no to all other part of Aero industry.

@Casper, if a facility is physically located within EU, then it will come under EU laws. India will not be able to get sensitive technologies or relocate their manufacturing to India, if prohibited by EU laws. Do not forget India was not able to export the HAL ALH to Myanmar because it uses an engine with French technology. Moreover, EU countries have a sanctions itch. They will promise a lot of things, but will not hesitate to break those promises, or carry out an "asset freeze," thus holding up our investment, under flimsy excuses. India does not have the military might to protect its investment so far away.

I think GoI investing in such a facility at the heart of Europe is a very risky idea.

Either dismantle all that can be dismantled and relocate to India, or stay out of it. That is my opinion.

 

[Zebra]

ATLAS ELEKTRONIK GROUP:ATLAS ELEKTRONIK

 

[Zebra]

@Casper, if a facility is physically located within EU, then it will come under EU laws. India will not be able to get sensitive technologies or relocate their manufacturing to India, if prohibited by EU laws. Do not forget India was not able to export the HAL ALH to Myanmar because it uses an engine with French technology. Moreover, EU countries have a sanctions itch. They will promise a lot of things, but will not hesitate to break those promises, or carry out an "asset freeze," thus holding up our investment, under flimsy excuses. India does not have the military might to protects its investment so far away.

I think GoI investing in such a facility at the heart of Europe is a very risky idea.

Either dismantle all that can be dismantled and relocate to India, or stay out of it. That is my opinion.

Sir, things are getting change very fast in India. IMO.

If (for example) L&T gets it, then they simply can start their another branch in India also.

And Burma is not that friendly nation to west, may be that's why they refused it.

Then don't sell it to those nations. Keep it to our self only. We also desperately need it, even after paying for it we are not getting it.

It is not good idea to refuse such nice chance for little thing like we can't sell it to 'few' nations.

Eventually, we are loosing it for our self also.

 

[Zebra]

(self deleted)

 

[pmaitra]

If (for example) L&T gets it, then they simply can start their another branch in India also.

No, they can't. They just cannot "simply" start another branch in India. It is not that simple.

non-listed items may also be controlled under the so-called catch-all clause, under certain conditions, when there is reason to believe such items are intended for use in connection with a biological, chemical, nuclear weapons or ballistic missile weapons programme, or for use in violation of an arms embargo;

EU Member States may exceptionally impose additional controls on non-listed dual-use items for reasons of public security or human rights consideration.

Individual licenses are granted by national authorities to one exporter and cover exports of one or more dual-use items to one end-user or consignee in a third country.

The EU Dual Use Export Control Regime

Eventually, we are loosing it for our self also.

We cannot lose something that we cannot get in the first place. There is no difference in getting a submarine made in a facility in EU owned by India vs getting a submarine made in a facility in EU owned by XYZ country.

 

[blueblood]

I don't think that private players are ready for that kind of investment. Despite a new government at helm, things are changing at snail's pace in MOD. No radical reforms have taken place so far.

 

[Zebra]

No, they can't. They just cannot "simply" start another branch in India. It is not that simple.

They can start in Pakistan, but they can't start a branch in India. Yeah?

We cannot lose something that we cannot get in the first place. There is no difference in getting a submarine made in a facility in EU owned by India vs getting a submarine made in a facility in EU owned by XYZ country.

I think we can get it, if GoI try for it.

But if we can get it and then also GoI won't try for it, then it will be a loss.

As it was available but they let it go.

 

[Zebra]

I don't think that private players are ready for that kind of investment. Despite a new government at helm, things are changing at snail's pace in MOD. No radical reforms have taken place so far.

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[pmaitra]

They can start in Pakistan, but they can't start a branch in India. Yeah?

Please refer to the last paragraph of Post #12.